#1865 Bolus 4 Mexican Food

Scott and Jenny talk about bolusing 4 Mexican food favorites.

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Key Takeaways

• Factor in Fat and Protein: When bolusing for complex restaurant meals like Mexican food, counting carbohydrates alone is insufficient. High fat and protein content delay digestion and cause extended blood sugar rises that require extended insulin coverage.
• Pre-Bolusing is Essential: Fast-acting items such as chips and sugary margaritas can cause immediate blood sugar spikes, making dynamic pre-bolusing strategies critical before the main course arrives.
• Account for Hidden Fats: Restaurant cooking heavily features unseen fats from frying chips or sautéing vegetables with heavy oils, adding significant fat grams that aren't typical in home-cooked versions.
• Leverage AI with Specificity: When using AI models like Gemini or ChatGPT to analyze food macros, provide specific instructions (e.g., requesting standard USDA references) to secure the most precise data and counter model variances.
• Understand Individual Insulin Timing: Successfully managing complex meals relies on continuous real-world tracking, using personal historical experience and data trends rather than a single static calculation.

Resources Mentioned

• Omnipod: Explore the Omnipod 5 and check eligibility for a free starter kit at omnipod.com/juicebox
• US Med: Get your diabetes testing supplies and free benefit check at usmed.com/juicebox or call (888) 721-1514
• Juicebox Podcast: Listen to the Diabetes Pro Tip Series (Episodes 1000–1025) and explore the menu at juiceboxpodcast.com
• Wrong Way Recording: Make your podcast sound fantastic at wrongwayrecording.com

FULL EPISODE TRANSCRIPT

Introduction and Community Engagement

Scott Benner (0:00)

Hello, friends, and welcome back to another episode of the Juice Box podcast.

My diabetes pro tip series is about cutting through the clutter of diabetes management to give you the straightforward practical insights that truly make a difference.

This series is all about mastering the fundamentals, whether it's the basics of insulin, dosing adjustments, or everyday management strategies that will empower you to take control.

I'm joined by Jenny Smith, who is a diabetes educator with over thirty five years of personal experience, and we break down complex concepts into simple actionable tips.

The diabetes pro tip series runs between episode one thousand and one thousand twenty five in your podcast player, or you can listen to it at juiceboxpodcast.com by going up into the menu.

Scott Benner (0:54)

If you're looking for community around type one diabetes, check out the Juice Box Podcast private Facebook group.

Juice Box Podcast, type one diabetes. But everybody is welcome.

Type one, type two, gestational, loved ones, it doesn't matter to me.

If you're impacted by diabetes and you're looking for support, comfort, or community, check out Juice Box podcast, type one diabetes on Facebook.

Scott Benner (1:19)

Nothing you hear on the Juice Box podcast should be considered advice, medical or otherwise.

Always consult a physician before making any changes to your health care plan.

This episode of the Juice Box podcast is sponsored by US Med, usmed.com/juicebox, or call (888) 721-1514.

US Med is where my daughter gets her diabetes supplies from, and you could too.

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Scott Benner (1:55)

A huge thanks to my longest sponsor, Omnipod.

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Scott Benner (2:15)

Terms and conditions apply.

Full terms and conditions can be found at omnipod.com/juicebox.

Jenny, we're gonna start in a second with bolusing for a Mexican meal that someone has sent in. But I found myself getting ready to ask you right before I hit record. Is this getting boring for you?

Are you enjoying this? You're okay?

Jenny Smith (2:35)

I always like talking about food.

Scott Benner (2:37)

Okay.

Jenny Smith (2:38)

I say that as if, like, I eat hoards and not like I kinda feel like I just said, gosh. Jenny eats a lot of food. I I really enjoy the science of food and understanding how to explain it and break it down.

Speaker 3 (2:52)

Break it down.

Jenny Smith (2:53)

It's very interesting to me. So, no, I'm not bored.

Scott Benner (2:56)

Okay. I'm glad. Because I am finding a ton of value in this, and I think the listeners are as well.

I don't imagine there won't be a day where we might just say, like, we can't do this anymore.

There's just we've covered everything.

But at the moment, I'm I'm very happy with it.

So I'm gonna keep going. Unless I hear otherwise from people and not just three looky loos, but, like, it would have to be like a you know?

Jenny Smith (3:21)

I had a thought the other day actually about this whole series of bolusing for a specific kind of food.

And I was curious because I feel like a lot of the foods that we've actually gone through have been very, I guess, more like Americanized.

Yeah. Right? They're more US based, and I'm curious how many because I know you have so many listeners, and they're all over the world, which is awesome.

But I'm curious how many people from other countries have questions about their typical cuisine.

Scott Benner (3:53)

Maybe something will come

Jenny Smith (3:54)

be super awesome to just try to do something that's more atypical for

Scott Benner (3:59)

Yeah. We could do bolusing for wallaby and bolusing for elk because that's all people in Canada eat, I would imagine, is grizzly bear and elk something like that.

I don't know exactly what they do.

Jenny Smith (4:10)

That's not really true.

Scott Benner (4:11)

I don't know anything about that. You don't and by the way, don't either.

So, like, you're just guessing, much like me.

Jenny Smith (4:17)

Have you ever been to Canada?

Scott Benner (4:18)

No. No. No.

Jenny Smith (4:19)

Not ever?

Scott Benner (4:21)

I don't do anything that requires a plane transfer.

Transfer. I one flight, I get on and I get off, and that I'm okay with.

I actually am heading out to I'll be able to say this here because by the time it's done, I'm heading out to San Diego to be part of a a commercial shoot for Omnipod.

Jenny Smith (4:37)

Awesome.

Scott Benner (4:38)

And well, it's awesome except in a forty eight hour window, I'm gonna fly to San Diego and fly back again.

Yeah. So I'm gonna do twelve I think I'm doing, like, twelve hours in the air over forty eight hours.

So I I fly in, go to sleep, wake up, work all day, leave the set, get on a plane, and fly home overnight.

Like, that's how I'm doing it.

Nevertheless, when they asked me to do it, I was like, look. I only have a couple of asks. I need an aisle or a window, and I am not getting on and off of a plane.

I was like, I get on at my house, and I get off in San Diego, or I'm not doing this.

I was like, I'm Scotty doesn't do a transfer.

I'm a bit of a princess. Okay?

Jenny Smith (5:13)

Do do you not like transfers just because of the navigation of that?

Speaker 3 (5:18)

Or No. I don't care about any that. Curious.

Scott Benner (5:20)

I don't like to be put out. I'm a bit of a princess.

Jenny Smith (5:23)

Okay. That's interesting.

Scott Benner (5:26)

Like, they said to me, you can take an Uber to the airport, and I went I was I was like, because I have to go to Newark.

And it is a pain in the it's a pain to, like, you have to drive to Newark.

Usually, you park off-site, then you get on, like, some, like, little, like, rattly bus that takes you from the parking lot to to the Newark Airport, and it's a bit of a it's a bit of a harangue.

Right?

Jenny Smith (5:46)

Right.

Scott Benner (5:46)

And they were like, oh, but just feel free to take an Uber. I'm not taking an Uber. I was, like, an hour long ride on a highway and, like, I'm like, I don't like and then I found myself stopping myself.

Jenny Smith (5:56)

In the car with somebody that I don't know and right.

Scott Benner (5:59)

And what if their car is not great?

And then I when mean, when they get there, I can't go, oh, no. Thank you.

There's where I'm a a, like, a a little bit of a princess. I'm like, have a car.

I'm comfortable in my car. I'll drive. Don't worry about it.

Anyway, I'm not I'm not a pain in ass. Not a pain in the ass on big things.

Analyzing Appetizers: Chips, Guacamole, and Salsa

Scott Benner (6:15)

Nevertheless, let's talk about someone sent in a Mexican meal.

It says tortilla chips with guacamole, sour cream and salsa, steak, peppers, onion fajitas, side of rice and refried beans, and what would happen if I put a margarita with all this?

And then also, could you talk about tacos and enchiladas?

So I think this is gonna be a lot more maybe art than science in this one.

So I'm interested to hear how you pick through all this.

But you wanna start with tortilla chips with guacamole, sour cream, and salsa?

Jenny Smith (6:49)

Sure.

Scott Benner (6:50)

Can we, like, break them down separately and then lump them together?

Speaker 3 (6:53)

Yes. Would that work?

Jenny Smith (6:54)

Because usually, for this type of a meal, you're going to start with I mean, they would consider an appetizer as the tortilla chips and probably guacamole yummier if they make it at your table.

Mhmm. And you can see them making it.

Scott Benner (7:12)

They do it right there? They squish it up?

Jenny Smith (7:13)

Some really good places make it, like, table side, and it's super yum then.

Scott Benner (7:18)

Yes. Well, as you know from a previous bolus for, I've only ever had salsa once.

Jenny Smith (7:22)

So Oh, that's right. Yes. Yes. Because I made you have some.

Scott Benner (7:24)

You made me eat salsa.

Jenny Smith (7:27)

Sour cream and salsa, you said.

So guac, sour cream, salsa, and the tortilla chips. Right?

Scott Benner (7:32)

What are we gonna do here?

So chips, I mean, the breakdown I have here is that two ounces of chips is about 20 chips.

This has it broken out as four protein, 36 carbs, 14 fat.

Does that seem right to you or close?

Jenny Smith (7:49)

Say the carbs again? Thirty twenty chips.

Scott Benner (7:52)

Yeah. 20 chips, 36 carbs.

Jenny Smith (7:54)

It's a I usually tell people as an estimation tool for tortilla chips, they're about two grams of carb a chip.

Scott Benner (8:01)

Okay.

Jenny Smith (8:02)

Makes it easy to carb count, put on your little side plate.

If you're gonna have another handful, then you carb count more and put them on your side plate.

Scott Benner (8:09)

Mhmm. A little bit of protein. I mean, we'll we'll factor it in because we're gonna do the whole thing, but does 14 grams of fat sound right to you?

Jenny Smith (8:16)

If they are made at the restaurant, they are fried.

Scott Benner (8:20)

Okay.

Jenny Smith (8:20)

And they are fatty. Yes.

Scott Benner (8:22)

And then that's 20 chips.

Now what happens when what happens when I dip them into stuff? How does that change?

Because I'm gonna I'm gonna set the calculator up right now. Excuse me.

Scott Benner (8:32)

The bolus estimator up right now. And so the carb ratio, 10. Insulin sensitivity, 50. I'm gonna put in these 36 carbs.

I'm gonna put in the 14 fat.

Jenny Smith (8:42)

And then is the 36 just for the chips?

Scott Benner (8:45)

Yes. So I'm saying for right now, I just wanna say, if you ate 20 chips with those settings

Jenny Smith (8:50)

With the okay.

Scott Benner (8:51)

3.6 up front, point seven over three hours.

Now let's figure out about the dipping and the and the slurping. There's slurping. Right?

Jenny Smith (9:01)

And the slurry

Scott Benner (9:03)

Yeah. Yeah. But that doesn't sometimes like, the the salsa, I see people, and it starts to fall off the chip, and they go after it.

I know what's happening. Okay.

Jenny Smith (9:08)

So salsa.

I think if when I have chips and salsa

Scott Benner (9:11)

Very happy.

Jenny Smith (9:12)

Chips are just a method of getting like, I would just happily eat the bowl of salsa.

The hotter, the better. Like, I love salsa. It's y'all.

Speaker 3 (9:20)

Don't take Jenny to dinner.

Scott Benner (9:21)

She'll eat out of your salsa bowl with a spoon.

So guacamole is just avocados, or do they put stuff in it?

Jenny Smith (9:27)

There would be usually, depending on the recipe, guacamole is gonna have some type of spicy pepper in it.

Could be jalapeno. Could be other type of pepper.

Again, pretty pretty low carb there in terms of an addition.

Usually, it's gonna have garlic, probably lemon or lime juice, salt.

It's not outside of the avocados.

It wouldn't usually have another carbohydrate source added to it.

So, really, the avocado is the main carb source in the guacamole, and it's also really, really high in fat.

Scott Benner (10:04)

Yeah. This has a quarter of a cup.

It says nine grams of fat, five carbs, one protein.

Let's go with a cool let's all just imagine you had a quarter of a cup.

So now it takes our carbs up to 41.

It takes

Jenny Smith (10:16)

our I think that the person whoever sent this to you is now listening and is like, a quarter cup?

Scott Benner (10:21)

They're like, they are they are ruining Really? Ruining my chips for me. That's okay.

So I'm adding in the protein, the carbs, and everything, recalculating it, takes the 3.6 up to 4.1, and now it's a 1.14, and and it stretched out over four hours instead of three hours as the cover.

So it's gone up now from adding the guacamole.

Now we're gonna also add sour cream.

That sounds like it. It's fatter.

Jenny Smith (10:51)

About the sour. Yeah.

Scott Benner (10:52)

Yeah.

Jenny Smith (10:52)

That's pretty much all fat.

Scott Benner (10:54)

Okay. So it's telling you two tablespoon.

Good luck having two tablespoons of sour cream.

Jenny Smith (10:59)

Right.

It's it's like all of it's the salsa. It's the guacamole.

It's the sour cream that we can look at portions. Mhmm.

Jenny Smith (11:09)

And what we should well, I should should say we can look at serving and what a serving has.

Then you have to consider what's your portion.

Scott Benner (11:16)

Yeah. I don't wanna out Arden, but I've seen her make a baked potato, and I can't find the baked potato under the sour cream.

So

Jenny Smith (11:22)

There you go.

Scott Benner (11:23)

And they make it in a squeeze thing now.

Have you noticed this? You

Jenny Smith (11:26)

don't buy sour cream.

Scott Benner (11:27)

Oh, well, trust me. It comes in a squeezy thing. Sour cream's in my house constantly.

I've never had it in my life. Wouldn't know what it is.

Scott Benner (11:33)

If you put it in my mouth, I would it just I don't know.

Something about the consistency of it I'm not good with.

Nevertheless, I like all the people out there like now are like, hey. He's probably has autism.

So it's one protein, one carb, and six fat.

Scott Benner (11:49)

So we're gonna add that one protein, six fat carb, and that takes us to 42 carbs, 29 fat, five protein.

Didn't change a ton about that. Okay?

So put up the Warsaw wave a little more. It gave us a little more back end insulin.

Mhmm. Okay.

Now salsa has gotta be tomatoes. Right?

Jenny Smith (12:12)

It is. It's usually tomatoes, peppers, garlic, onion.

Again, it can be made many it could have pineapple in. It could have mango in. Mhmm.

Jenny Smith (12:21)

If it's just regular, like, spicy salsa Yeah.

Then probably isn't gonna have the fruity stuff in it.

Scott Benner (12:28)

Is it fair here quarter a cup, four carbs?

Jenny Smith (12:31)

About.

Scott Benner (12:32)

About? Okay.

No. And it has four carbs. The listing here, I'm using Gemini today.

Scott Benner (12:38)

Protein one, no fat. So let's see what we're back to now.

Jenny Smith (12:42)

And as a reference, most often, the little dishes or ramekins that these side items or these dipping pieces usually come typically flat topped, not scooped and heaped into it, but flat top.

Usually, those little ramekins are about a half a cup just for visual reference.

Scott Benner (13:01)

The ones that if I was fancy and I made a souffle and are about the size of my fist, maybe two inches high on the side?

Speaker 3 (13:06)

Yep. That's nice. Okay.

Jenny Smith (13:08)

About a half a cup. Exactly.

Scott Benner (13:10)

So now in what world you're gonna eat 20 chips and all this, I don't know.

You know? But maybe that's gonna happen to you.

But keep in mind, 4.6 up front, 1.43, stretch out over four hours. Go ahead and have 80 chip or or 40 chips.

Scott Benner (13:25)

This turns into nine units up front and three over probably more hours because you had more fat. It would probably, right, tack the hours on too. Right. Uh-huh. Okay.

Jenny Smith (13:35)

And this is just let's remember. We are starting at the beginning of sitting down at your table.

This is your appetizer.

Scott Benner (13:42)

If you don't pre bolus this meal coming in the door, I don't see how you catch up unless you really crush it hard, or it takes a while for them to bring the food one or the other.

This episode is brought to you by Omnipod.

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Scott Benner (14:23)

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Jenny Smith (16:18)

Right. You know, and the question there is we've talked through before is really how are you coming in the door?

Mhmm. Are you coming in pretty stable, insulin on board, is just really your basal rate, you're right where you want, then what was the total carbon fat breakdown again?

Scott Benner (16:34)

46 carbs, 29 fat, six protein.

Jenny Smith (16:37)

Right. So you're looking at also something that has a fair amount of initial carbs, not even talking about the meal part of it yet.

Mhmm. But the carbs in this are also thirty thirty grams of fat.

Scott Benner (16:50)

Yep.

Jenny Smith (16:51)

And you're not I mean, most people chat and talk and laugh.

And if this is a meal out at a restaurant, you're grabbing your chips and salsa.

You're grabbing your chips and guac. You might be maybe you're making a slurry of this on your plate. I don't know what you're doing, and dipping.

But this is also something that you're I don't say grazing, but grazing in a shorter amount of time before you actually order and put your food for the total entree in. Right.

Jenny Smith (17:18)

And so my expectation from experience is that while it has a fair amount of carb, you're also looking at the fat behind it.

Scott Benner (17:29)

Yeah. So you're That's You're probably come I, by the way, set it up as a stable line, but we can look at it another way before we move on.

But to your point, you're gonna come in, probably hort this down pretty quickly in the beginning, and then that fat's gonna just slow your digestion down.

And then you're just going to literally shovel carbs on top of it later in the form of wraps and tortilla shells and rice.

Jenny Smith (17:50)

And maybe rice.

Scott Benner (17:51)

Yeah. Okay. I'm writing down the chips, 46, 29, and six.

But before we move on to the next step, let me just show you.

I don't have a current BG set into the estimator right now. There's none there, but it says there's a stable line.

But try to imagine you walked in the door one forty four arrow up or or rising slow. Let's give it a diagonal arrow. Right? When you resimulate that strategy, now suddenly the initial is 5.6.

Scott Benner (18:14)

The Warsaw is still 1.43. But it's now asking you for, like, a fifteen minute pre bolus with a stable line and the number.

It's still asking for for that pre bolus. But if you take if you take the this the current BG and take it to 90, the pre bolus goes down by, like, five minutes maybe.

Like, it not that it I'm I'm guessing with this food, you could pre ball us as far out as you wanted to and you you know, as long as you catch it, you're gonna be good.

Scott Benner (18:40)

But the point is is that I don't know how many people are, like, wandering into a restaurant thinking about, am I one forty diagonal up? Am I 90 and I'm stable? Like, it's you know what I mean? It's

Jenny Smith (18:51)

I think it does depend on the person.

Scott Benner (18:54)

Sure.

Jenny Smith (18:54)

It really does. Right? In Jenny's brain?

Scott Benner (18:57)

You'd be thinking about it.

Jenny Smith (18:59)

I'd be thinking about it.

Scott Benner (18:59)

Yeah.

Jenny Smith (19:00)

Because we don't eat out very often.

It always, in my mind, a little more consideration about where am I. Do I need to make an adjustment already, or am I pretty good?

Just that I can be ready for that order and what I expect I'm going to need to do once I figure out what I'm actually going to eat. Yeah. Right?

The Impact of Alcohol: Bolusing for a Margarita

Jenny Smith (19:21)

What I think is honestly next fair to consider almost along with this appetizer type of food Mhmm Is the drink. Because we don't typically wait to drink our fancy drink when the meal comes.

Scott Benner (19:38)

The margarita comes in right away.

Jenny Smith (19:40)

It comes along with your appetizer unless you've said no. Right?

Scott Benner (19:46)

Okay. A margarita so I don't drink, so I had to look this up.

One classic on the rocks, eight ounces, margarita, 24 carbs, you know, no fat, no protein. Yeah.

Is that about fair? That's fair? Mhmm.

So and that's gonna hit fast, like sugary fast. Right?

Jenny Smith (20:03)

It is.

Scott Benner (20:03)

Yeah. So okay. So so now the pre now now you I mean, listen. Arden's older now. I I'm not in charge of how she lives her life.

Scott Benner (20:14)

But if this was us walking into a restaurant when she was nine years old, I would have probably just, like, blindly thrown I would have looked at her blood sugar and then blindly just thrown some insulin in and then worked the rest of it out when we got in and started sitting down and figuring out what was going on just to get get the insulin on my side.

We can tack it on real quick just to say the chips with the margarita. So if we're gonna That'd be great. Yeah. If we're gonna say margarita 24, we had 46 already.

Scott Benner (20:40)

That's seven that takes our carbs to 70. The fat stays 29, and the protein six.

By the way, this is juiceboxpodcast.com/bolusfour, bolusfour. Simulate the strategy. Wow. Okay.

So now it goes to seven up front, 1.4, stretched over four, and and the pre bolus, of course, is now down to nine minutes.

But, I mean, honestly, you could you could quite easily say to yourself, there's an like, I'm gonna eat 30 chips. You know? Like or I don't know how many chips I'm gonna have.

Scott Benner (21:16)

And what if I get going and I'm talking and I love what if I get going and I'm talking and I don't eat? Like, you know what I mean? Like, I take people's other side of the conversation.

Jenny Smith (21:23)

A 100%. And so that's where you have to know you have to know yourself pretty well Mhmm Or you have

Jenny Smith (21:28)

to know your child, right, or be directional to your teen who might be doing this, and you're just trying to give them some adjustment while they're half listening. Right?

Scott Benner (21:39)

While they're half listening. While while they're ignoring you and making you sad you had a baby. Okay.

Jenny Smith (21:44)

My yeah.

The Main Course: Breakdown of Fajitas, Rice, and Beans

When you sit down then, a meal like this, many people do have in mind what their what their taste buds usually like.

Scott Benner (21:55)

Mhmm.

Jenny Smith (21:55)

Right? Unless you're truly coming in blind to this type of cuisine and you've never ever had it before, you likely know what you like about what your portion is, and this is where that it's not a blind estimate that you throw in.

But you sit down at the table, and you may throw in 30 grams.

Scott Benner (22:13)

Yeah.

Jenny Smith (22:14)

And maybe you do that because that's your pre bolus. You have no idea even what the chips look like at this place, but you have had a margarita before. Mhmm. You know the hit impact of it. So you put in, and then once you can see, then you can always go back and you can add more even before your entree comes.

Jenny Smith (22:31)

But you've gotten that ahead of time kick that you're going to need.

Scott Benner (22:36)

The delightful part about these conversations to me is that I think it just if you're gonna listen, then it's you're gonna realize, like, oh, there's way more protein in steak than I think about. I don't even bolus for protein. Like, you know, like, that kind of thing. Like so let's look at the rest of this because the breakdown I have in front of me is six ounces of skirt flank, 40 protein, and 20 fat.

Peppers have carbs, 15 carbs in a cup of peppers, two proteins, seven fat in the peppers because they're sauteed. Mhmm. Flour tortilla, three fajita size, 45 grams of carbs, eight protein, seven fat.

Mexican rice, half a cup, 28 grams of carbs, three protein, three fat.

Refried beans, 20 grams of carbs, seven protein, four grams of fat.

Scott Benner (23:33)

So everything that we've just talked about here, it totals up to a 154 carbs, 67 protein, and 70 fat. I'm just gonna put in a 154 carbs. Okay? Same settings, nothing else.

154 carbs, stable blood sugar. I'll even make the current BG 99. 15.58 units, wait ten minutes to pre bolus.

That's just the carbs. Now I'll put in the protein and the carbs. 67 protein, resimulate. Now you're 15.58 up front, 1.3 over four hours.

Now you put in the fat. Get ready. So 70 grams here we go. 70 grams of fat. Boom.

Scott Benner (24:09)

This now 15.58 up front, four and a half over now eight hour window, and this whole bolus goes to 20 units.

But my point would be, again, if I just take out the fat and the protein, it goes from 20 with all these things considered down to 15 without the other things considered.

This is, I think, how it happens. Like, it's some, you know, mixture of I didn't pre bolus long enough. It got ahead of me, and I didn't consider the fat and protein. So I'm five units of insulin or by the way Sure.

Five, ten, fifteen, twenty five percent of the insulin I needed, I didn't use. Correct. You know?

And then you're never gonna have the nerve to do more than, a unit when you see, oh my god. Am I two eighty? Like, here's a unit. Let's see what happens. Like, even if you're on an AID system, if you don't tell it about that impact, it's just gonna push it's push slowly, but it's never gonna get ahead of anything.

Jenny Smith (25:04)

And then you're gonna end up maybe after this one meal despite the recommendation being to follow a trend before you make a setting adjustment. Mhmm. You may go in and be like, something's clearly wrong. I I must have but, really, it it does. It boils down to our our eyes always or our brains kind of calculate less than is truly there.

Scott Benner (25:28)

Yeah.

Jenny Smith (25:29)

We always boil it down a little bit compared to their true count, and that then gets us in trouble.

And despite us talking about fat and protein for quite a long time already in many of the things that we've recorded, right, Fat and protein still gets forgotten.

Scott Benner (25:49)

Yeah. Well, I think it also leads to this more, like, kinda, like, plain language conversations where people say, like, I don't know. Like, I I don't know how to bowl this for Mexican food. Or every time I go out, it goes wrong. Or that because by the way, Mexican food, any restaurant really worth its, you know, worth its salt is gonna fill your food up with salt and fat.

Scott Benner (26:09)

You know, like, so you're gonna have way more fat. No one's counting the fat. Like and and this is I mean, look. I'm not always gonna be right, and and there's gonna be times where it doesn't go this way or maybe it doesn't work for some people the way it works for others. God bless you. Like, you know, do your own, you know, do your own personal research and everything.

Jenny Smith (26:26)

But

Scott Benner (26:27)

if you're not thinking about the fat and the protein in these high, like, meat, like, situations, you are not using enough insulin very likely.

And all that comes after it that turns into that, like, I don't understand that diabetes is so unpredictable. I do the same thing every day, and then something different happens. Well, no. Yesterday, you actually had a 154 carbs. It didn't have any fat in it. Like, today, there's fat in it. You're saying, I don't know what happened. Diabetes. You you know what I mean? So Right.

Jenny Smith (26:54)

I think it's good to just know this stuff. It's it's absolutely fair, and I think another piece of this meal, which is a little bit of a lengthier intake over time than a lot of the other meals that we've actually put together. Right? This is more of a sit down restaurant. This comes, then this comes, then this comes. And if you think about that appetizer, it's just like bread that comes to the table at something like an Italian restaurant.

Jenny Smith (27:24)

Right? Comes to the table. You didn't even order it. They just plop it down. They're like, here's your loaf of bread and butter. Right?

Scott Benner (27:31)

And you're like, oh, thank

Speaker 3 (27:32)

you. Right.

Jenny Smith (27:33)

You thank you. And maybe maybe it's like the meal of the day that you're, like, looking forward to. So you'll be really lean in the other parts of or meals of the day. Mhmm. And so the bread comes to the table and the chips come to the table, you're like, man, I am hungry.

Jenny Smith (27:47)

And down it goes, and then you were planning on this lovely steak fajita vegetable kind of meal. And you had planned ahead. You counted the carbs. You knew. And then you got to the meal, and you're like, I can make one fajita. Maybe. Yeah. Because that's what happens. Mhmm. Right?

Scott Benner (28:14)

And so then you have to backtrack in your plan for what you're going to do because now all the nutrients that are there, those macros, they're now different. Yeah. No. I've and by the way, now with GLP in my life, they bring the bread out. I go, plea please take the bread away, or I might as well just eat the bread and leave you a tip and go because I'm not gonna be able to I'm not gonna be able to eat what I order.

Hey. Just for you know, because it was brought up, and then I wanna say something. Beef tacos, two hard shells, beef cheese lettuce, 28 carbs, 18 protein, 22 fat seem reasonable. How many tortillas?

Two hard shelled beef cheese lettuce tacos.

Jenny Smith (28:41)

Yeah.

Scott Benner (28:42)

That seem light?

Jenny Smith (28:43)

So the shells are usually depending package to package, each hard shell is usually about eight or nine grams of carb per shell.

Comparison of AI Macronutrient Estimations

Scott Benner (28:52)

Okay.

Jenny Smith (28:53)

And depending on it doesn't sound like there are other car there's no rice in this. Right?

Scott Benner (28:58)

No. Not not in the way it's set up right here.

Jenny Smith (29:01)

Okay. So it might be a little heavy in carbohydrate.

Scott Benner (29:04)

Okay.

Jenny Smith (29:04)

If it's 28 grams, I'd say two is more probably closer to maybe 18 to 20.

Scott Benner (29:10)

Okay. I that's another reason I think the conversation is important because more and more people are gonna do what I just did, which is Mhmm Like, I don't know. I just I I use Gemini. I could've used ChatGPT. Sure.

It's very possible, and maybe we should do that before we go, that if we just use a different model, we might have got back a different answer. You know?

Jenny Smith (29:28)

We might have. And that is I mean, it brings in I think we talked about it, and the last time we talked about food is really using AI can be a good starting place, but you have to give it as much direction as you possibly can, or possibly, hey. Can you give me the macro breakdown and use the USDA information to source this data? Right? It more direction. You can give it more direction and get more specific and precise details about those macros.

Scott Benner (29:58)

Yeah. Let me do this just because it's interesting. So the the first time we did the big meal, it was with Gemini, Google Gemini, and now I'm doing it with ChatGPT. And let's just see, like, what comes up different.

Jenny Smith (30:10)

The difference?

Scott Benner (30:11)

Yeah. So okay. So tortilla chips, it used the same measurements, two ounces, 20 chips. It got the calories the same, the protein the same, the carbs were too heavier on ChatGPT than they were on Gemini. The fat, it got the same. Guacamole, one carb heavier on ChatGPT than than on Gemini. The fat was the same. The protein was off by one, and off's the wrong word. Like, they disagree by one. Steak steak fajitas.

In ChatGPT says 420 calories, 45 protein, 25 fat. In Gemini, it says 350 calories, 40 protein, 20 fat. So it's interesting. They they disagree, but it's possible that bolus wise, taking five off the fat and adding it to this or the protein or it might kinda balance out. Balance out. Yeah. To some degree.

Also, listening to you talk about it is where the real value is because you're like, yeah. That's about right. Also, when you use that language, when I tell people how to estimate it, that's you saying, you don't know how much is in that. And we're not gonna find out. Like, so Right. Like, about this.

Jenny Smith (31:41)

About the and especially for the fat content in a restaurant meal that's not a chain that truly has all of the nutrition facts figured out because their recipes are standardized. Mhmm. Right? When you have a restaurant from mom and pop Mexican restaurant or the bistro or whatever it is Yeah. You don't mind. Homemade. Right. Right. I mean, when I cook food and I know what I usually use, like, the olive oil goes in. I'm like, it could be a teaspoon today. It could be a teaspoon and a half or two tomorrow, and I, like, throw it. I mean, I eyeball. Right? Yep.

And so that eyeballing in these type of meals gives a little bit of shuffle, so to speak, to the amount of especially fat.

Scott Benner (32:23)

Well, I'm comforted by this actually because Gemini total for that meal, 70 fat, ChatGPT total 74.

Jenny Smith (32:30)

Nice.

Historical Perspectives and Closing Remarks

Scott Benner (32:31)

Carbs, Gemini, one fifty four. ChatGPT, one sixty six. Protein, Gemini, 67. Protein, ChatGPT, 74. I honestly don't think this would change the bolus by more than maybe, like, a quarter or half a unit maybe. Like, it's so They're very similar enough. And people are gonna be using this stuff more and

Speaker 3 (32:52)

Mhmm.

Scott Benner (32:53)

more you know, like, to figure this stuff out. Anyway, to kinda, like, dovetail back around again, chicken enchilada, 42 grams of carbs for two rolls, sauce and cheese, protein 26, fat 24, and, of course, the margarita. So if you just did the two two hard shell tacos, two enchiladas, the margarita, it's 94 carbs, 44 protein, 46 fat. I would bet you this is the thing I wanted to say at the end, that the person who sent in this request did not get the answer back they were expecting. Because I think people think there's like a I I say this to Jenny, like, when we're done sometimes.

I'm like, I wonder how much longer we can do this because all we're really telling you is count the fat, the carbs, the protein, and understand the timing of the insulin to have your settings right.

Jenny Smith (33:40)

It is.

Scott Benner (33:41)

It's not lost on you and I that we are just finding different ways to explain the pro tip series. Right?

Jenny Smith (33:46)

That's correct. Yeah. And it's also what does it boil down to? It boils down to the standard of understanding how insulin works for you. Mhmm. And because you usually, as I said earlier, you come into a meal like this with some historical experience of what you like, you're gonna pick similar. If you don't like chicken, you're gonna and you like steak, you're gonna choose steak something. Yeah. Right? If you like a fajita because you can pick and add rather than the gooey insides of, you know, something that's baked or fried or whatever, great. So you have something based on your previous preference for a similar kind of meal. You always can you can also then gauge how much you're gonna eat. Yeah. Now I Which helps.

Scott Benner (34:32)

There is there is a part of me that realizes that 1,800 episodes into the podcast, it really only needs to be about 25 episodes long. But to reexplain it or find ways to get into different ways that people learn or even just to say it one way where you're like, oh, that makes sense. Like, basically, this is just, again, seriously, this is just what we talked about in the pro tip series, like, from a slightly different perspective. And there'll be another series after this,

Speaker 3 (34:59)

but we'll shift it around again and find a different way to say it to

Scott Benner (35:02)

you so that it covers as many people as possible. But in the end, it's timing and amount. That's it. It used the right amount of insulin at the right time.

Jenny Smith (35:10)

I wish I had had I mean, my first experience well, historical Jenny story. My historical, purse I guess, experience with a Mexican kind of dish eaten out was in high school.

Scott Benner (35:26)

Okay. By yourself?

Jenny Smith (35:27)

You know? No. Oh, no. This was, like, a dance. Right? So a dance experience where you go out either with your date or with, like, a group of other people. Right? And it was twerp, so that you know what twerp is? It's where the girl asks the guy to the dance.

Scott Benner (35:40)

That's never happened to me. So, no, I don't know about that. But go ahead.

Jenny Smith (35:42)

Well, that's that's that's what this was.

Scott Benner (35:44)

I have what they call a face for podcasting. Go ahead.

Jenny Smith (35:50)

Anyway, we went out, and I ordered a a taco salad. Mhmm. Because I thought from my perspective that that at that age, right, I was like, a salad. I know how to do a salad. And I didn't have any of these fancy tools. None of them. I took two mixed injections per day Yeah. Still. Right? That was what I got, and I had a blood glucose meter. Yeah. And so I order it only do you know what a taco salad is in that kind of restaurant? So It's not a lovely salad.

Scott Benner (36:21)

There's probably a lot of sour cream and sauce and stuff. Like, it's like it's the reason why I don't order that stuff when I get it because it looks soupy to me. Sorry.

Jenny Smith (36:32)

And it it wasn't soupy, but what does a taco salad usually come in?

Scott Benner (36:38)

Like A big tortilla shell. Right?

Jenny Smith (36:40)

A gigantic. I was mortified when they brought me my plate at the table with, like, eight others of my friends, including, like, their write their dates. My meal was the largest on the entire table.

Scott Benner (36:56)

And he's like, I asked this boy out, and now I'm like, give me all the food. And this and so it comes in a bowl that's actually made out of, like, a tortilla. Right?

Jenny Smith (37:04)

A tortilla shell. Yeah. Exactly.

Scott Benner (37:05)

And then there's let I mean, there's shredded lettuce, but then there's sour cream, probably beef. Right? Like

Jenny Smith (37:12)

Well, I don't eat meat, so it was beans.

Scott Benner (37:14)

I ordered a a bean one. Yeah. Yeah. It was probably it was probably a 150 grams of carbs.

Jenny Smith (37:18)

Oh, I'm and I was so like I said, I was so mortified. And at that point, I still only had dosing based on a a sliding scale. It was this amount of insulin based on your blood sugar and what your meal would cover. And I mean, my appetite was pretty well controlled, so I knew I wasn't gonna eat this gigantic, like Clamshell salad. So I kinda picked at through the meal. Right?

Scott Benner (37:47)

Trying to be dainty with your giant sloppy salad.

Jenny Smith (37:49)

And then what follows a meal like this as a high school dance? You're you're gonna go and you're gonna move your body. Yeah. Right? So, like, I had all of this. I am still alive after my taco salad.

Scott Benner (38:02)

You made it. You guys get Jenny's like, look. With a CGM and all these algorithms, you'll be okay.

Jenny Smith (38:07)

You will be okay. That's the base of the story. Yes. Yeah. Well, I listen. For me, it's always the same. Like, don't ignore the fat and protein. Don't ignore the timing. Get your settings right. You know? Right. And, you should be okay. Well, thank you very much. I do appreciate you doing this with me.

Jenny Smith (38:21)

No. It's always fun.

Scott Benner (38:22)

Thanks.

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Scott Benner (39:10)

Get started today and get your supplies from US Med. Okay. Well, here we are at the end of the episode. You're still with me? Thank you. I really do appreciate that. What else could you do for me? Why don't you tell a friend about the show or leave a five star review? Maybe you could make sure you're following or subscribed in your podcast app, go to YouTube and follow me or Instagram, TikTok. Oh, gosh. Here's one. Make sure you're following the podcast in the private Facebook group as well as the public Facebook page. You don't wanna miss please, do you not know about the private group? You have to join the private group. As of this recording, it has 74,000 members.

Scott Benner (39:52)

They're active talking about diabetes. Whatever you need to know, there's a conversation happening in there right now. And I'm there all the time. Tag me. I'll say hi. Have a podcast? Want it to sound fantastic? Wrongwayrecording.com.

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