#1786 Best of Juicebox: Five Ways to Boost Insulin Sensitivity

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Jordan Wagner shares five practical strategies—stress management, movement, sleep, nutrition, sunshine—to sharpen insulin sensitivity in diabetes.

Key Takeaways

• The Impact of Stress: Chronic stress elevates hormones like cortisol and adrenaline, which promote glucose release and desensitize cells to insulin, essentially acting like "rust on a lock."
• Consistent Activity: Even simple exercises can significantly improve insulin sensitivity by helping muscles utilize glucose without requiring excess insulin, an effect that can last for up to 72 hours.
• Prioritizing Sleep: Poor sleep disrupts hormones, increasing ghrelin (hunger) while decreasing leptin (satiety), which compounds insulin resistance and drives cravings for junk food.
• Nutrition Choices: Avoiding ultra-processed foods and refined seed oils is crucial, as they often contain trans fats and unbalanced omega ratios known to cause insulin resistance.
• Sunlight Exposure: Getting outside helps the body produce Vitamin D—which is linked to better insulin sensitivity—and provides full-spectrum light to balance your circadian rhythm for improved sleep.

Resources Mentioned

• • Eversense 365: eversensecgm.com/juicebox
• • Omnipod 5: omnipod.com/juicebox
• • Touched by Type One: touchedbytype1.org
• • Wrong Way Recording: wrongwayrecording.com
• • Jordan Wagner on Instagram: The Diabetic Nurse

FULL EPISODE TRANSCRIPT

Scott Benner (0:00)

Welcome back, friends. You are listening to the Juice Box podcast. Jordan Wagner is back. He is, of course, a nurse, a certified diabetes educator, and a person living with type one diabetes. And today, Jordan's gonna go over his top five tips for improving your insulin sensitivity. If you're looking for community around type one diabetes, check out the Juice Box Podcast private Facebook group. Juice Box Podcast, type one diabetes. But everybody is welcome. Type one, type two, gestational, loved ones, it doesn't matter to me. If you're impacted by diabetes and you're looking for support, comfort, or community, check out Juice Box podcast, type one diabetes on Facebook. Please don't forget that nothing you hear on the Juice Box podcast should be considered advice, medical or otherwise. Always consult a physician before making any changes to your health care plan or becoming bold with insulin. The show you're about to listen to is sponsored by the Eversense three sixty five. The Eversense three sixty five has exceptional accuracy over one year and is the most accurate CGM in the low range that you can get. Eversensecgm.com/juicebox. This episode of the Juice Box podcast is sponsored by the Omnipod five. And at my link, omnipod.com/juicebox, you can get yourself a free what'd I just say? A free Omnipod five starter kit. Free? Get out of here. Go click on that link. Omnipod.com/juicebox. Check it out. Terms and conditions apply. Eligibility may vary. Full terms and conditions can be found at omnipod.com/juicebox. Links in the show notes. Links at juiceboxpodcast.com. The episode you're about to listen to was sponsored by Touched by Type One. Go check them out right now on Facebook, Instagram, and, of course, at touchedbytype1.org. Check out that programs tab when you get to the website to see all the great things that they're doing for people living with type one diabetes. Touchedbytype1.org.

Jordan Wagner (2:26)

Hey, Scott. Good to be back with you here. So I'm excited for this, you know, third episode here. But in case you guys missed the the first two episodes, you wanna go check those out. In the first episode, we had a pretty detailed discussion on diabetes management in the hospital setting, so more of the inpatient setting, what to do, what not to do, how to be successful with that. And then we, looked at pump training success and CGM success. So you've been diagnosed with diabetes, and you wanna get an insulin pump. There's definitely some things you should know before you get the pump so that when you do get to that training, you're prepared and ready to go with all that. Mhmm. And I'm really excited about this third episode here. This is a topic that probably doesn't get as much attention as it should with, especially the type one diabetes community, and that is insulin sensitivity. And I think part of that is because, you know, we're all insulin dependent with type one. So thinking about insulin sensitivity is not necessarily something we often do. It's just I I have to get the insulin. It doesn't matter. I have to have it. But there are there are certainly things that will improve your insulin sensitivity with all types of diabetes. But even with type one diabetes, improving that insulin sensitivity could mean that you're using less insulin, which overall could be a good thing for you perhaps. So I wanna go ahead and dive into that here today.

Scott Benner (3:44)

Tell people before you start, why might it be a good thing to use less insulin?

Jordan Wagner (3:49)

Yeah. So that's a good question. So there's there's a multiple multitude of reasons here, but one of them could just be that I often see a lot of people scared of low blood sugars.

Scott Benner (3:59)

Mhmm.

Jordan Wagner (3:59)

And so naturally, if you're using less insulin, there's going to be a lower risk of hypoglycemia, so low blood sugars there. Two would be, insulin in and of itself doesn't make you gain weight. But if you have a bunch of insulin floating around in your system and you have excess calories in your system, that will make you gain weight. You know, using less insulin, having a little lower calorie intake, that could also help with, weight loss goals, not, you know, having a lot of excess of, weight gain, things like that. Mhmm. You know, I have heard from some people that there's a stigma behind it as well too. So let's let's say that you're taking a shot. Right? Maybe you're able to reduce your needs down to, let's say, 10 at this meal, right, versus, like, 20. You know? Maybe you're out with friends and people look at the syringe and go, oh, wow. Look how much you're taking. And so I've heard that from some people even in the hospital setting that by getting a little bit more sensitive to insulin, they could take less, and they felt less, stigma about taking insulin.

Scott Benner (5:00)

Interesting. Yeah.

Jordan Wagner (5:01)

So there's there's different different things that could pop up for for different people. I mean, not everyone's gonna share the same sentiment, but it's, something that No. It should be considered.

Scott Benner (5:11)

Yeah. It's funny because I as you're going over those things, I I'm I'm almost playing devil's advocate in my head on some things. Like, I spend a fair amount of time telling people you need the amount of insulin you need.

Jordan Wagner (5:23)

Correct. Yeah.

Scott Benner (5:23)

And I don't want people running around with high blood sugars because they think, oh, that's a big number, or I'm definitely gonna gain weight if I do that. Because there's there's a cascading effect that comes off of all of that. Right? Like, you know, if you can't figure out a way to use less insulin and you don't want the big number, it it could be an eating disorder at some point. You could stop eating correctly or you could stop bolusing correctly. Some people do that. Some people under bolus for their food because they think the bolus, like, sounds better at a number or or, you know, somehow impacts the thing you're talking about. Right. And I don't want that. And No.

Jordan Wagner (5:57)

And I don't want that either. I mean,

Scott Benner (5:58)

that's Right.

Jordan Wagner (5:59)

Hear me when I say I'm not I'm not telling you to take less insulin so that your sugars run higher. Like, what I want good control blood sugars for everybody, but the the point, I'm making is, like, you can get to a spot where your body is more sensitive to insulin and doesn't require the same amount.

Scott Benner (6:16)

Exactly. So let's talk about the five things you have listed here that can Right. Can do that.

Jordan Wagner (6:20)

So I'll go

Scott Benner (6:20)

ahead and just

Jordan Wagner (6:21)

Yeah. List off what we have, and then we can go ahead and dive in.

Scott Benner (6:23)

Jump in.

Jordan Wagner (6:23)

One of the biggest things I see that kills insulin sensitivity is stress. Stress is gonna just the stress hormones, there's a lot that goes into that there. I see also that people are not active enough. Doesn't mean you need to be out running a marathon or doing crazy workouts, but just having activity in your life. Improving your sleep quality. So sleep is a huge time where where we repair and build back up. And if you're not sleeping well, that's gonna definitely impact your sensitivity. Your nutrition, that's a huge thing that's gonna impact sensitivity. Depending on what types of foods you're eating, you could definitely be hurting your insulin sensitivity. In today's world, a lot of us have, you know, maybe a corporate job or a desk job, and we're not getting outside. Getting natural sunlight on your skin is really beneficial, and it does help with your insulin sensitivity. There's many studies to back that. So those are the five topics just to kinda dive into there.

Scott Benner (7:18)

Yeah. Yeah. No. So everybody gets super excited. Jordan's your mom now. She's like, get outside. Move around a little bit. Yeah. But there's a reason people have been saying stuff like that forever and ever. But let's talk about how it actually impacts your insulin sensitivity. So we'll we'll just start at the top. Like, you the first thing you mentioned was stress. Right? So Right. Hey, everybody. Be less stressed. There. Next thing. No. Exactly. Yeah. Explain to them how the stress is actually impacting them.

Jordan Wagner (7:44)

For sure. The first thing I like to tell people is when it comes to stress, it's stress hormones. Those are the big things we talk about. So cortisol, epinephrine, that's adrenaline, norepinephrine, things like that. Leukagon can play a role in that as well. But those same hormones will be high in your blood if you are getting chased by a bear in the woods or if you're chronically stressed out driving home from work. Those are two different situations, but your body's gonna respond in a similar response with stress hormones. Mhmm. Why do we want those stress hormones? Well, we do want some stress hormones because it's promoting glycogen breakdown and gluconeogenesis, which basically means creating glucose from a non glucose source. That is important in times that you need energy. So, again, with that bear example, if you're in the woods trying to run away, you need extra energy to either run away or to fight that thing off. That's that fight or flight response. Right. But if you have type one diabetes or you have type two diabetes or some form of diabetes where there's some sort of dysregulation going on through your insulin, you're not gonna be able to to respond to that those excess stress hormones and increase the glucose there.

Scott Benner (8:56)

You won't actually use the glucose either. Right? Like, in the You won't. No. Exactly. The bear, you're gonna burn it off really quickly running away from the bear.

Jordan Wagner (9:04)

But Correct.

Scott Benner (9:04)

Yeah. Sitting around worrying about something, it raises all this up, but then your body doesn't use it.

Jordan Wagner (9:11)

Correct. And then you have a high blood sugar. Okay. Right. And so, you know, insulin's like the key. It's the key that unlocks the cells, gets the glucose inside, lets you use it for energy. But if you're, you know, chronically chronically having these high stress hormones here, it, like, desensitizes the cells, the insulin. Oh. So if you if you take example of someone with, like, type two diabetes, that's primarily insulin resistance. The response to that situation of that chronic stress is that the pancreas is going to make more insulin. So oftentimes with type two diabetes, we see people have very high insulin levels, very high C peptide levels because it's trying everything it can to get those glucose levels to come down. But, again, over time, your cells just keep getting more and more desensitized.

Scott Benner (9:56)

Yeah. In all of these things, like, in each of these five examples, the problems build on themselves.

Jordan Wagner (10:03)

Big time.

Scott Benner (10:03)

Like yeah. Like, you start off, like, healthy, and then you have, like, one moment where you're in the car and you're like, uh-uh, everything sucks. And then all the things that are happening behind the scenes are happening. It's not like you then eventually it's gonna happen again tomorrow and the next day. So your body doesn't even have time to go backwards and, like, repair what's happened. And then it becomes incrementally more concerning. And then I'm guessing here too it also like, if you're stressed, maybe you're also not sleeping well. So you start getting compounding. Right?

Jordan Wagner (10:35)

It compounds. Right. So, like, if you, just take a look at improving your sleep quality there, it's interesting because oftentimes we don't sleep well at night. And what do we all do in the morning? We go and get a big cup of coffee or an energy drink or something like that. Mhmm. But it's interesting because caffeine will bind to those adenosine receptors in your brain. And adenosine basically is building up during the daytime. And by nighttime, it it's almost aiding you to feel tired and helping you fall asleep. And so, like, I'm guilty of a big time, but, you drink coffee too late in the day because you're not sleeping well or you're stressed and you feel like it helps, well, then you get to bedtime and you're not super tired or you're tossing and turning. And so just improving the sleep quality, that's the time where your body's healing itself. It's repairing itself. Naturally, you're gonna see cortisol levels decrease during sleep and getting good rest.

Scott Benner (11:28)

Okay.

Jordan Wagner (11:29)

You know, there's there's other hormones like ghrelin and leptin. Right? So ghrelin is gonna be one of the the hunger signaling hormones. You often see, say say you, are up late at night, right, and you get really hungry all of a sudden. What's that's ghrelin right there. That's telling you go get a snack. Right? Leptin's that satiety or I'm full hormone. Now if you're getting poor sleep quality, ghrelin tends to increase because you're so tired your body needs energy. So it's it's prompting you to want food, prompting you to want perhaps even junk food because that's a quick energy source. It's gonna decrease that leptin level, the I'm full hormone. And so you can see how, you know, the stress and the poor sleep quality, it starts to dysregulate your hormones. And as we know, like, with type one diabetes, right, it's a big thing with insulin and, glucagon. Right? Those are two big things there. But our bodies aren't it's not just that. Right? Our our bodies it's got so many mechanisms happening all the time in the background. When all of your hormones start getting dysregulated, that's when we start seeing this cascade effect of problems showing up.

Scott Benner (12:36)

Yeah. Okay. Alright. I'm sorry. I think I cut you off before you were done with stress though. Did I?

Jordan Wagner (12:41)

Oh, yeah. We can definitely talk about a few things there, but,

Scott Benner (12:44)

I wanted to lay into people's minds that this stuff's gonna start stacking up and that these things impact each other as well. You know, you might be more stressed out because, yeah, you can flip it around. You could be stressed out because you're not sleeping.

Jordan Wagner (12:56)

Big time. Yeah. Absolutely.

Scott Benner (12:57)

Yeah. And you could be not sleeping because you're stressed out and etcetera and so on. And maybe you're not dealing with stress as well because your nutrition is wonky or, you know, you're not exhausted at the end of the night and sleeping when you should because you're not getting enough activity and getting your body moving. Like, this all stuff this all fits together, honestly.

Jordan Wagner (13:14)

It does. Everything here is, compounding, like you said, there. And there's there's so many angles to to look at and talk about, you know. So, like, I'll I'll I'll try to stay focused right now on

Scott Benner (13:25)

this It's my fault. My fault. Go back to go back and finish up on your ideas about stress. Today's episode is brought to you by Omnipod. Did you know that the majority of Omnipod five users pay less than $30 per month at the pharmacy? That's less than $1 a day for tube free automated insulin delivery. And a third of Omnipod five users pay $0 per month. You heard that right. 0. That's less than your daily coffee for all of the benefits of tubeless, waterproof, automated insulin delivery. My daughter has been wearing an Omnipod every day since she was four years old, and she's about to be 21. My family relies on Omnipod, and I think you'll love it. And you can try it for free right now by requesting your free starter kit today at my link, omnipod.com/juicebox. Omnipod has been an advertiser for a decade. But even if they weren't, I would tell you proudly, my daughter wears an omnipod. Omnipod.com/juicebox. Terms and conditions apply. Eligibility may vary. Why don't you get yourself that free starter kit? Full terms and conditions can be found at omnipod.com/juicebox. When you think of a CGM and all the good that it brings in your life, is the first thing you think about, I love that I have to change it all the time? I love the warm up period every time I have to change it? I love that when I bump into a door frame, sometimes it gets ripped off. I love that the adhesive kinda gets mushy sometimes when I sweat and falls off. No. These are not the things that you love about a CGM. Today's episode of the Juice Box podcast is sponsored by the Eversense three sixty five, the only CGM that you only have to put on once a year, and the only CGM that won't give you any of those problems. The Eversense three sixty five is the only one year CGM designed to minimize device frustration. It has exceptional accuracy for one year with almost no false alarms from compression lows while you're sleeping. You can manage your diabetes instead of your CGM with the Eversense three sixty five. Learn more and get started today at eversensecgm.com/juicebox. One year, one CGM.

Jordan Wagner (15:37)

For sure. For sure. Really, so one thing to think about with stress here's the deal. Picture your body as a bucket. Okay? Inside that bucket is gonna be water. Water is like the mineral balance inside your body. Every time you're stressed out, it's like poking a small hole in that bucket. So if you're chronically stressed, you've got a bunch of little holes. And as you can imagine, that water starts to pour out the sides of the bucket there. Well, as your mineral balance gets out of whack, your insulin sensitivity also majorly gets out of whack. So not only do we have hormones raising your glucose levels, the minerals in your body that would naturally be there to kind of help with that insulin sensitivity, making those cells receptive to insulin are now out of whack. So now these cells are not as receptive. So think of that almost like rust building up on a lock. And if insulin's that key, that key is gonna have a harder time fitting in a rusty lock compared to a lock that's completely cleaned and and nice looking. Right?

Scott Benner (16:37)

Yeah. Yeah.

Jordan Wagner (16:38)

So there's there's big things there that that stress can really impact.

Scott Benner (16:43)

You know, in your professional life, when you talk to somebody about this, do you find that explaining it to them like, because saying to somebody be less stressed is

Jordan Wagner (16:53)

Yeah.

Scott Benner (16:54)

You know, I'm married. That's not a thing I would say out loud. The reason is because it's not a feeling of, like, oh, you're you're right. I'll just be less stressed. Thanks. Do you get to talk to people about ways to do that, or do you find that your idea is, like, let me just give them this idea, hopefully, they'll go back into the world and figure out how to accomplish this on their own?

Jordan Wagner (17:14)

Yeah. So it depends on the consult and depends on the patient I'm talking with. And the reality of being working on the inpatient side of medicine, you're often seeing someone and you have thirty minutes to an hour. Basically, unload as much information as you can without overwhelming them and hoping that they take some of what you have as they as they're leaving the hospital, essentially.

Scott Benner (17:35)

Yeah.

Jordan Wagner (17:36)

Some people are open. Right? They'll they'll talk about things in their life like stress. And for example, maybe they have no community. Right? So then I'll say, okay. Maybe you need to find a church community. Maybe you need to go out to a place to where you can go dancing and make some friends. Right? Get some community in your life. You know, maybe it's they're struggling with their bills. Right? And maybe we can talk briefly about, like, hey. This is how a financial planner could help you with your bills and, in turn, start lowering your stress. So there are definitely times where, like, I'm able to dive into it a little bit, but this is definitely something that needs to be ongoing. And so I think if your only conversation you're having is with me in the hospital, it's gonna be unlikely that you actually start lowering your stress levels.

Scott Benner (18:18)

Yeah. It's funny. I find that people like you and Jenny and Erica who like coming on the podcast, I feel like it's because you always you guys always feel like it's just so difficult to get your message out, and you're just always looking for a way to reach other people, which I love. I think it's awesome.

Jordan Wagner (18:34)

Yeah. Without a doubt. I mean, because I I tell people all the time, like, I probably get sixty, seventy percent of my consults of people who actually don't wanna talk to me. Yeah. They don't they don't care.

Scott Benner (18:47)

You're like, come on, man. Like, just this guy need the insulin.

Jordan Wagner (18:50)

Yeah. Or like, hey. I've had diabetes for forty years. I I'm not gonna learn anything from you. Just give me your spiels. I can get out of here.

Scott Benner (18:56)

Jordan told me to go dancing. Yeah. But what you're really saying is identify your stressors and ways to try to alleviate them.

Jordan Wagner (19:05)

And Without a doubt.

Scott Benner (19:06)

Yeah. Because this has look, the truth is these five things have impacts on people who don't have diabetes.

Jordan Wagner (19:12)

Without a doubt. Yeah. I mean and that that's it. Like, we get so fixated on a number. Right? Whether it's an insulin dose or our glucose level. But I've always said my whole life, like, I am more than a number. And that goes for everyone else with that with diabetes. You are more than a number. Right? Your health is not just a glucose number. You have to look at it holistically and look at everything else going on in your life if you wanna have a a healthy long life.

Scott Benner (19:39)

I try really hard to think about it this way. I wish my daughter didn't have diabetes.

Jordan Wagner (19:43)

Right.

Scott Benner (19:44)

But as long as she does and I'm being made aware of things, things that maybe I would not otherwise be made aware of because the the aging process you know, in a healthy person, you know, a person who doesn't have a chronic illness or, like, you know, other things going on, you age slowly and you'd you know, you deteriorate slowly and you don't see it coming. It's that idea of, like I think the jumping in part is I've always said this. Like, type one diabetes, it's because you can get, like, in trouble so quickly. It forces you to pay attention to it.

Jordan Wagner (20:18)

It does.

Scott Benner (20:18)

And maybe that's valuable for the rest of your life. There's nobody else sitting around talking about like, you know, parents, like, go to sleep. You know? Like, calm down. Like, you you should get out and move around, but they're not talking about the why. Right. And they're not gonna see the impacts of it if they're lucky for so long that they'll think, oh, I just got older.

Jordan Wagner (20:39)

For sure. And, like, there's a benefit too, like, to even my family and friends knowing that I have diabetes because it's taught me to care for my body, and I'm very open about that. And right? So then they start thinking about their own lives of, wow. I need to look at this, or maybe I do need to get a little more exercise. Mhmm. And so you can have this compounding effect of impacting a lot of different people as you take care of yourself.

Scott Benner (21:03)

Yeah. No. A 100%. Okay. Activity. Good. Talk people into being more active. I I dare you.

Jordan Wagner (21:07)

For sure. For sure. So activity is huge. Not only is that gonna make you feel better in the long term, I know, like, if I go out and take a jog, sometimes it doesn't feel the most fun during the jog, but you finish and you go, wow. I I feel great. You got that that rush of endorphins there. But, ultimately, what what's going on is, when you are using glucose for energy with exercise, some of that is able to happen with limited insulin use. Like, your muscles are able to use it without a lot of insulin.

Scott Benner (21:39)

Okay.

Jordan Wagner (21:39)

And so you're naturally going to lower your blood sugars without having to take a lot of insulin. Right? So let's say your blood sugar is 200, and you might be a little afraid of taking a dose to bring that down. Well, it's completely reasonable to say, why don't I go take a little walk? You know? Walk around the block. Right? I guarantee you that if you're doing that, you will likely see that blood sugar starts to drop a little bit. Of course, like, if you just ate a candy bar or something and it's 200, that's different. But, that exercise there, that little activity is gonna help there. But one of the ways I like to think about it is through analogies. Right? And I already have shared a few analogies, but there are these things called GLUT. Right? So g l u t. Those are all capital letters and stands for glucose transporters. And there's a bunch of different type of ones there. Think of those as, like, a taxi cab or like a bus, and they're dropping people off the building. The the people in the bus is the glucose. Right? Mhmm. And as you're moving around, you're getting more of those glute proteins bringing glucose to the muscles. It's dropping more off there. Right? And the different types of glute proteins get to the other destinations. You have the insulin as the key opening the door. So the point being here is that the exercise is making your body work the way it should, and we are supposed to work. Right? That is using the glucose the way it should, and it's making you more sensitive to your natural insulin without having to take excess of amount more. Now there are studies out there that will show that the effects of exercise can last for up to seventy two plus hours. So let's say you did do some exercise today, you could be benefiting this for for days. You might have been benefiting this for days.

Scott Benner (23:24)

I have to tell you that I've been exercising more recently. And in this past few days, I've I've been on a medication. I've been a little sick, I guess, for the past couple of days. And because I had not yet I don't know how to put this. I I had not yet built up a a real habit of doing the exercise, but I was doing Like, I I was a month strong every day doing exactly what I was supposed to be doing. And then I I got up when I slept in a little bit because I didn't feel good. And then I got up and I actually think I thought to myself, I should go do that. And I was like, oh, but the day got messed up and I was like, I'll do it tomorrow. But then I woke up the next day and I didn't feel well. And four or five days later, end of the day, 09:00 at night, I'm standing in my kitchen. I'm like, why am I so tired? Yeah. No lie that during the, like, the month of intent you know, intensively making sure that I was doing the exercise every day, not even that it was intensive exercise because it really wasn't. I would get at the end of the day, and I my thought was like, have so much energy. Like, I hope I can go to sleep. Like, it it it turned on in a week. Like, it it just felt different. And I don't think that's even a thing I would have believed had I not experienced it, I guess.

Jordan Wagner (24:34)

For sure. Yeah. Yeah. And, you know, another huge benefit of consistent exercise, and I I like that you brought it up, the the consistency part there. If you're consistently exercising, having increased activity in your life, it will start to get rid of some of that visceral fat around your organs. Mhmm. That is basically the fat that just lines the organs in the body. And when when you can start getting rid rid of some of that fat there, your insulin sensitivity is going to go up. A way to perhaps think of that and this is not a perfect analogy, but it it kinda paints a picture here a little bit. Picture, a snowstorm blowing through, like, the Midwest or something like that, and you're trying to get into your house. Now before you can even get to your door to unlock it with a key, you're gonna have to get rid of that snow. And so if you're shoveling that snow away, you get to the door, you can unlock it. That's that's an analogy to kinda picture that that visceral fat there. Mhmm. Right? So the it the insulin's gonna have to work harder to get to that lock to unlock it there. There's just so many benefits to exercise. You're gonna feel better. You'll have a better outlook on life. Your glucose levels will be better controlled. It's just a win win truly to exercise. Other parts of your health are gonna thank you for that as well.

Scott Benner (25:48)

Yeah. Yeah. I can't agree more. And I also can absolutely throw in with all the people who hear that and say, like, I don't like exercising. I don't have time for it. Or whatever you're gonna say. I said it all. I've thought it all. I've believed it all. And now, like, it's on me, you know, talking about, like, ways to, like, reduce your stress. It's on me to find a way to actually bring this to bear every day for the rest of my life. Yeah. Because this is the part where, like, it's easy to say I'm stressed. There's nothing I can do about it. Or I would like to exercise, but I don't have time. Or whatever it is you're gonna tell yourself, like, at some point, you know, you just either you have to do it or you have to live with it. You do.

Jordan Wagner (26:29)

And with a lot of these things, you do have to take some self responsibility. I understand, like, it is not ideal that any of us have diabetes, but the reality is we have diabetes.

Scott Benner (26:40)

Mhmm.

Jordan Wagner (26:40)

And so you either come to terms with that and do what you can, or you're gonna be constantly blaming people and and not doing well. And so when it comes to exercise, you have to take some self responsibility. I firmly believe that anyone can get increased activity into in their life in a pretty easy way. Yeah. I mean, that might even just simply be, you know, every hour, you sit down and stand up ten, fifteen times in your office. Right? That's something you could do right there. Maybe it's when you're watching TV at night, you grab some exercise bands and just stretch them back and forth a bit. Use those muscles. You know, I was listening to a podcast with Andrew Huberman a while back, and he mentioned that just taking, like, thirty seconds to just run up and down the stairs at your office building, like, once or twice a day

Scott Benner (27:25)

Would be a big deal.

Jordan Wagner (27:27)

Makes a huge deal for, like, your cardiovascular health in the long term. It's not just, like, you feel good then. It's making long term impact.

Scott Benner (27:34)

Yeah. How about when you're sitting at your desk for a while and you feel tired and just getting up and walking around is valuable?

Jordan Wagner (27:39)

Without a doubt. Yeah. Right. Or even sitting at your desk. I mean, there's honestly, like, you can't make an excuse because they're you could literally be doing those. They're called soleus push ups, where you basically just sit with your legs at a 90 degree angle and raise, your ankles up and down. That soleus muscle, which is right there by the calf muscle in the back, it's like a sponge for glucose. So you

Scott Benner (28:02)

I I gotta tell you. You're you're gonna make me admit to something I don't wanna say out loud. Alright. Go ahead. Hold on a second. How many times am I gonna say this? But, like, don't have a podcast if you don't wanna say stuff like this. Hey. Listen. It's not the healthiest thing in the world. I'm not gonna lie to you one way or the other. But throughout the winter this year, Arden and I have been, like, once a month going to, like, a tanning salon. Like, just to, like I don't well, there's reasons why she wanted to do it that are not frivolous, but never nevertheless, she wanted to do it to try something. She wanted to see if it would help her acne. Okay? And I was like she felt weird about doing it. Was like, I'll go with you. We're signing up, and the woman's like, are you gonna do it to it? I'm like, okay. I'm in. Like, I mean, I'm already getting my eyebrows threaded with art, and I might as well do this as well. Right? So I'm using a stand my god. I'm using a stand up tanning thing.

Jordan Wagner (28:49)

Okay.

Scott Benner (28:50)

And now keep in mind you're in there, and you're not very dressed. But I'm, like, standing there for six minutes, and I'm like, what am I doing? I'm like, I'm just standing here. So I instead, I do body weight squats while I'm

Jordan Wagner (29:02)

doing Nice. Yes. Exactly. Yes.

Scott Benner (29:04)

Yeah. Okay. Sorry. I didn't wanna say that. I really didn't wanna say that.

Jordan Wagner (29:08)

No. I'm telling you, Scott. Like, you you can do whatever you can in life. Like, I've I've told patients. They're like, I don't have time to do this. I'm like, well, do you do you cook dinner for people in your house? They're like, well, yeah. I'm like, well, then dance while you're cooking dinner. You know, do some squats. Turn some music on. Turn it into a little time. Like, I I've done it with my boys before. It's like, we're cooking dinner, but we're having a blast. We're listening to music. We're moving around. It's it's just

Scott Benner (29:31)

Well, you're gonna have to. Jordan, mean, it's easy to say, well, this is the world the way the world works now. There's no time for that. But this is the way the world works now. It's not gonna work differently. You have to find a way to incorporate the things that a human body wants while you're living in the modern world. Absolutely. Absolutely. I don't wanna be like a you know, I'm not an alarmist or anything like that. But at the rate AI is picking up, y'all might be on universal income soon anyway. You'll be like, oh, I got I got much better this and much better that. Have nothing to do. No. Seriously, Jordan. Are you not worried about that? Like, what would Of course. Yeah. When you when you hear somebody say jobs might be eliminated. We might have to start paying people. Right? Like and I don't know that that's crazy that that could end up happening one day. And in your mind, like, I don't know about you, but for me, I think, oh, it's wonderful to give people an opportunity to express themselves or paint or do do the things they've always wanted to do. But I'm afraid that for some people, they're gonna what they're gonna do is nothing. And then and then this is gonna get worse. You you know what mean? Like, for for some people.

Jordan Wagner (30:34)

I mean, you'll maybe this is an extreme example, but, you know that movie Wall E?

Scott Benner (30:38)

Yeah. No.

Jordan Wagner (30:39)

Yeah. Exactly. I mean, riding around in chairs and robots do everything for you.

Scott Benner (30:43)

Yeah. And then that and that little robot goes, Wall E. It's awesome. Yeah. And you're like, oh, I love this movie. Yeah. I just I'm saying is my real point is that, you know, technology is changing quickly. Life is changing quickly. We are not running from bears, most of us, anymore. True. But you're still gonna get this stress, and you have to find a way to manage it in the world that we actually live in, and you have to find a way to get activity in the world we actually live in. Now if you're out there listening to this right now and, you know, you're you're cutting a sewer pipe, well, then you're probably okay.

Jordan Wagner (31:15)

Yes.

Scott Benner (31:15)

Yeah. Absolutely. Right. So Yeah. Also, that's another thing. I guess you could you could try to get more work that does things for you that I don't know. Like, it's I I'm saying there's a lot of ways to to to

Jordan Wagner (31:26)

impact this. There's a lot of ways. It it doesn't have to be something it's that's impossible. I

Scott Benner (31:31)

mean Right.

Jordan Wagner (31:32)

Accountability is really big. Like, you know, like, you had mentioned, earlier, like, oh, I wanna exercise, but I'm gonna I'm not gonna do it right now. Like, having accountability is really important too. So, like, in the past, I've done, like, through social media, like, you know, challenges. Right? I did one where it's like a push up challenge, and it was like, okay. I'm gonna do x amount of push ups every day, and then at the end of the month, I gotta post my calendar Mhmm. So everyone can see that I did or did not do it. Right? And so there's almost like a little bit of a motivation when you have some accountability or people like, hey. Are you doing this? Are you not?

Scott Benner (32:06)

A lot of the things that happen on this podcast happen because I'll say them out loud so that I have to do them. Mhmm. That happens to that a lot. Like, a lot of the series you that you might love, that that's me going online going, here's what we're gonna do. Because if I don't say it, then I might not do it. Right. Jenny and I just recorded earlier today the last episode of a short nutrition series that we did together.

Jordan Wagner (32:29)

Awesome.

Scott Benner (32:29)

And at the very yeah. And she's so passionate about it because it's it's her background, it's just something she's actually really passionate about. She related a story at the end, where she just said, like, look, my father died in his mid sixties. Yeah. And, you know, like, basically, what she was saying was, like, I'm taking care of myself because I don't want my kids to grow up as adults without I miss my dad. I don't want my kids to miss me.

Jordan Wagner (32:52)

Right.

Scott Benner (32:52)

Like, you know, like, whatever you can find to get yourself going, like, find something that means enough to you that you're willing to put forth the effort and and be consistent with it.

Jordan Wagner (33:01)

Absolutely. Yeah. Absolutely. Alright. Where are

Scott Benner (33:03)

we at on this? I'm sorry.

Jordan Wagner (33:04)

No. We'll we'll jump into some of the the sleep again here. So I know I before, I mentioned a little bit about, like, the the ghrelin and the leptin and things like that there, but, just let's touch on how to promote sleep before going to bed. Mhmm. Because that, again, is gonna the insulin sensitivity. Right? But I would say one of the biggest things is a routine. Right? If you're going to bed at all different times, like, maybe at Monday night, it's 10:00. Tuesday, it's midnight. Wednesday, it's 08:00. Thursday, you're at 1AM. If you're doing stuff like that, you're naturally gonna have dysregulated sleep patterns. So you gotta have a a routine. Try to go to bed as much as you possible at the same time and wake up at similar times every day. I know that's not always possible.

Scott Benner (33:47)

Mhmm.

Jordan Wagner (33:47)

But if that is becoming a habit in your life, that will, I think, make some impact eventually there. I'm about to say something that's not gonna be feasible for everybody, but if you're able to, getting, like, a biosensing ring or, like, a watch can really help with the sleep. Right? I I myself personally wear an aura ring.

Scott Benner (34:06)

K.

Jordan Wagner (34:06)

And it it tracks your sleep very well. It tells you when you're hitting all the points of your sleep, if you're aligned with your your your sleep type.

Scott Benner (34:14)

What do you do with that information once you have it?

Jordan Wagner (34:17)

So right now, not a whole lot because I'm up with a newborn and a two year old almost every night. So you can't really do a whole lot with that. But in the past, if I could see, like, I'm having these issues here, I would try things like not drinking the caffeine closer to bedtime. I would say, like, okay. I clearly am having an hard time unwinding at night, so maybe I read a book instead of watching TV. Mhmm. I drink some chamomile tea before bed, something like that to to relax me.

Scott Benner (34:44)

Jordan, you have four kids. I think I know how you relax before you go to bed.

Jordan Wagner (34:48)

Yeah. Yeah. There I just honestly hit the sheets sometimes, I'm like, holy cow. Yeah.

Scott Benner (34:53)

But I meant two things there. You laughed about one of them.

Jordan Wagner (34:57)

Yeah. I I know what you mean.

Scott Benner (34:59)

Look how lovely you are. You tried to pivot to, like, yeah. I'm very busy chasing those four kids around. I was like, hey. You're very busy making those four kids. That's what I'm saying.

Jordan Wagner (35:07)

Oh, that's funny.

Scott Benner (35:08)

No. No. Listen. I don't wanna put it on you, but if you listen to, you know, some of the data that's floating around now as a society, apparently, we have sex less now. Yeah. And I don't know. Nothing puts me to sleep better than that. So but I think we're in a situation where the speed of life, I think it just sped up before we could adapt to it. Yeah. Does that make sense? Like, I don't think we're adapting as well as we used to because things are changing so quickly.

Jordan Wagner (35:38)

And so Yeah. And then we're I think everyone's I mean, not to touch on these things too too much, but, like, I believe in, like, gender roles. Right? And so, like, I think we're getting away from that kind of stuff a lot. Right? And so everyone's chasing the bigger, better, next thing. Right? So it's a it's a hookup culture. And, I think that's promoting people not having good marriages, and there there's a cascade effect like we talked about from the very beginning. Right? And so, like, my wife and I have tried really hard to have have a good marriage, you know, have a a a good intimate life and things like that, and that's pay dividends to the way our family is and even things like improving sleep quality.

Scott Benner (36:17)

Yeah. And so you found a way to make a cohesive life together, and it's impacting other things in positive ways. Stuff that you didn't plan at the time. Like, you prob listen. You probably just started off, like, with some, you know, like, either, like, cultural, religious, or family values Yeah. And said to you, like, this is how we're gonna shape our family. Right? And you didn't do that and say, hey. We're gonna get married, and then, you know, we'll have some kids. You'll stay with the kids. I'll go work, and that'll definitely make it so that we sleep better one day. You weren't thinking Right.

Jordan Wagner (36:48)

Absolutely not.

Scott Benner (36:49)

It just in the same way, I believe that someone's not sitting at home thinking like, you know, I work really long and I I still wanna play Call of Duty, so I'm gonna do it at 11:30. Like, they're not thinking, and then I'll ruin my sleep with that, and then my visceral fat will go up, and my insulin sensitivity will get worse. Like, no one's thinking.

Jordan Wagner (37:07)

Right.

Scott Benner (37:08)

Yeah. They're just like, I just wanna play this game, or I just wanna do this. Right? Yeah.

Jordan Wagner (37:11)

People, people most of the time are just trying to find a way to unwind at night, get ready for bed. And so Right. You know, even with that example there of Call of Duty or, like, watching a TV show, there are certainly things you can do to make sure you're not destroying your sleep. Right? Have some maturity. Right? Maybe you play Call of Duty and you you, you know, you Stop yourself. You play it for an hour or so, and then you're like, that's it. I'm done for tonight. I know when I was gaming back in, like, high school and stuff, I had zero self control. Be like, yeah, I'm, like, gonna play a couple games, and then it's like, oh my gosh. It's 4AM.

Scott Benner (37:41)

Yeah. Yeah. And if I just win five more of these games of Madden, I'll be able to draft better next year. And then I'll be like, yeah. Like, no. You listen. It it's another, like you know, look. I I I'm not gonna, like, beat a drum, but, you know, there are a lot of things in your life that are driving up that dopamine for you.

Jordan Wagner (37:58)

Exactly. In a in a modern digital world.

Scott Benner (38:01)

And I feel very strongly about good sleep. Like, I I so important. I harp on it in my family. It's a losing battle. I'm not gonna tell you otherwise. You know? I'm not gonna tell you that last night, I didn't wake up in the middle of the night and see a light on. And I thought, like, oh, let me go shut this light off. But it was Arden. She was still awake. And she was talking to her you know, they're in a spring break at college, talking to her boyfriend, and I'm like I'm like I walked in. Was like, everyone, go to sleep. I was like, talk during the talk when the sun is up. Right. Right. I tried hard to, like, just follow that simple idea of, like, follow the sun. Like, get up with the sun, try to start shutting down when the sun goes down. I'm not

Jordan Wagner (38:40)

All the way. Yeah. I'm not I'm

Scott Benner (38:42)

not Amish. Like, I don't go to sleep when the sun goes down. Like, you know Yeah. But, like, I'm not trying to, like, stay up super late anymore like I used to when I was young and then, like, I was forced to before algorithms existed, and my kid had diabetes. Like, I value sleep. And at the same time, I'll say this, like, because I just shared this with my wife recently. We got in bed, and I was like, I'm so tired. Like, I I want you know, I'm excited to go to sleep. But at the same time, I said to her, like, I'm starting as I get older to get mad at having to sleep. Like and and and she's like, what what are

Jordan Wagner (39:16)

you talk first of all,

Scott Benner (39:17)

she doesn't wanna talk to me when she's tired. Like but she's like, oh, good. Now he's gonna have, like, some existential conversation with me? He just said he was tired. I'm tired. Blah blah blah. I said, like, I don't know. I just I feel like my life is winding down, there are things I wanna do. And that some days, it pisses me off I have to go to sleep. Mhmm. You know? And I I wonder if that's, like, a real feeling I'm having or if it's a feeling I'm getting from, like, some unnatural acceleration that I feel from the work No. I think you're

Jordan Wagner (39:45)

alone in that. Like Yeah. My my wife's grandfather, and, he he ended up passing away a few years ago, but he always said to my wife, if he could have a superpower, it would be that he didn't have to sleep.

Scott Benner (39:57)

Is there so much he wants to do?

Jordan Wagner (39:59)

If you I like dreaming and stuff like that. (40:00) Right? So if you could sleep, but you didn't have to, that would be kinda cool.

Scott Benner (40:07)

Yeah. No. I hear you. I really do. But my point is this, is that if you sleep well when the sun's down, then you can pack more into your life while the sun is up, and you're gonna improve your overall health and everything else. Let let's move on to nutrition because I I'm gonna start sounding like a hippie in a second. Don't I don't like that vibe.

Jordan Wagner (40:24)

Well, Scott, I I am a bit of a hippie, so it's okay. Yeah.

Scott Benner (40:27)

Oh, no. I imagine you living in a yurt, just in case you're wondering.

Jordan Wagner (40:30)

That that's exactly right. No. I'm just kidding. But yeah. Anyways, yeah, nutrition. And, I'll preface this to saying, like, I'm not, like, a nutrition expert, but these are things that I have seen that, have have impacted patients. I'm sure Jenny might be able to speak, better to some of these things here. But the idea that I wanna get across is that somebody can eat literally terribly and still have good blood sugars, but that doesn't mean that, like, you're in a good spot with your health. And that that gets back to what we touched on earlier of you could look at just the blood sugars and think you're doing great. But health is a lot more than just your blood glucose there. So we'll we'll just start with that there. But I think one of the big things to to think about with nutrition and insulin sensitivity is as much as possible avoiding ultra processed foods. Right? So that that's gonna be things like fast food, or that's gonna be things like frozen meals at the grocery store or, like, a lot of packaged goods, things like that. The reason you wanna avoid a lot of those, aside from the fact that a lot of them are really, really high in carbohydrate, there's there's trans fats in a lot of those. Mhmm. And those are those are known to cause insulin resistance.

Scott Benner (41:42)

Yeah. I always tell people if you're looking for a reason not to have some of those oils that are available in so much of our food Yeah. One of them was developed as a a lubricant.

Jordan Wagner (41:53)

And Exactly right.

Scott Benner (41:54)

Yeah. And then they realized, like, yo. You could eat this. And they changed it a little bit, and they took machine grease and turned it into food, and now you make cake with it. So Correct.

Jordan Wagner (42:03)

Correct. And then that those are some of the seed oils that you're referencing there. And that this is a hot topic, so we don't need to dive in this one too too extensively. But the idea just think about this. Okay? If you were to eat, let's say, a peanut, you chew it in your mouth and a little bit of oil comes out of it because you're naturally just chewing it. That is so much different than having, like, a refined peanut oil coming in out out of a plastic bottle. Mhmm. Right? So, like, for example, those oils there, a lot of them are called PUFAs, polyunsaturated fatty acids. They're often touted as the healthier oil choice, which, again, without getting too too much into it, I think there's some problems there. But what you often see is that the the omega six to omega three ratio is, like, completely unbalanced. It should be somewhere along the lines of, like, four to one of omega six to omega three, and these unrefined ones I'm sorry. These refined ones are closer to, like, 20 to one. Yeah. Additionally, they're they're also, like, stripping these things not, like, intentionally, but you go through this processing. It's getting stripped of all that's natural vitamin e. Mhmm. And vitamin e is it's a really powerful antioxidant. And so that's why I think it's healthier to just eat, the nut or the seed, right, compared to having some of these oils. So not to sound like a hippie again, but, like, my wife and I will sometimes carry around little vitamin e capsules. And so if we go eat, like, at In N Out Burger or something like that, you you pop a few vitamin E's before you eat it just to help with the the antioxidant and, all that stuff.

Scott Benner (43:40)

I'm gonna tell you something. Like, if you I I say this all the time. If you guys knew me, like, thirty five years ago, you'd be like, I can't believe that's the guy that's talking to me right now. But I went through a whole renaissance of understanding oils a few years ago. And Jenny and I by the way, Jenny and I like, I mentioned, we made a series on nutrition. It's out now. It's called Smart Bites. I think it's maybe six episodes long. You'll you'll find it. But Jenny is a nutritionist, like, yeah, by trade, like, by by her education, who is also a a CDE. And she's incredibly passionate about this. I told her years ago, I was like, I think I'm gonna stop eating, like, oil. Like, I ate, like, canola oil, which I grew up being told was, like, a healthier oil. But, like, now I think of it as, like, healthier, a healthier oil is, like, saying, like, let me find a better way to punch myself in the face. I'm still not doing a good thing for myself. Like, is it as bad as had I hit myself with two hands? No. But it's still not something I'm looking for. We cut all those out. The only oil that's in the house right now is coconut, and we only use it to make popcorn.

Jordan Wagner (44:45)

Okay.

Scott Benner (44:45)

And other than that, there's a olive oil, but it's used really sparingly and only cold pressed olive oil because, like Good. Yeah. Because the way Jordan's talked about it, the way they process it sometimes either strips it of the only nutrients you were gonna get out of it or, believe it or not, heating up olive oil to process it is actually making it processed food. And processing it cold without heat takes longer, so you have to pay more money for

Jordan Wagner (45:14)

it. Correct. Yeah. And not to mention even with with olive oil, it has a lower smoke point. Right? So using olive oil as a primary cooking oil, you could actually make that olive oil go rancid from overcooking it. Mhmm. And so yeah. It's a it's I I love what you said, the cold press. That's a very that's a very important thing with, you know, with oils, but especially with olive oil.

Scott Benner (45:35)

I have to tell you, cold pressed olive oil might be the only reason I have a Costco card.

Jordan Wagner (45:39)

So That's hilarious.

Scott Benner (45:40)

Yeah. Because they make really great cold pressed olive oil.

Jordan Wagner (45:43)

Yeah. Yeah.

Scott Benner (45:44)

So that kind of stuff, like, you know, taking vitamins, like, this is the thing I've added to my life. Like, they're right here. Like, I'm not lying. Like, they're on my desk so that I don't forget to take them every day.

Jordan Wagner (45:55)

Yep. Yep.

Scott Benner (45:56)

I found that if I put them in the kitchen or somewhere near food, eventually somebody puts them away and takes it out of my mind. And so instead, it's just it's in front of me on my desk. And every day, I'd and by the way, it's not one of them. You have to read the label. You're supposed to take more than that of of the one I have. Like, so I make sure to take more. You know?

Jordan Wagner (46:13)

Right. Right. Ugh. Yeah. That's funny.

Scott Benner (46:16)

If you really want somebody who understands nutrition, who isn't gonna talk down to you, but is going to be honest with you, I say go check out the Smart Bites series with Jenny.

Jordan Wagner (46:26)

That's awesome.

Scott Benner (46:27)

She did such a great job of putting together these different modules to speak about, and we just literally just literally finished recording it today.

Jordan Wagner (46:34)

So That's so cool. And, like, I I truly believe that if people wanna eat Twinkies and hot dogs and hamburgers all day long, they should be able to. But they should also have the information to kinda know what potential consequences could be coming their way.

Scott Benner (46:49)

Well, that's where I'm at, Jordan. Let me let me I'll finish nutrition, and we can move on to getting outside and and get out of here. But, like, everything's a process. Right? Like, everything starts one place with one idea, and and if you get to keep it going long enough, you watch it grow and it morph. When I started making this podcast, I was in a place where I said, I know how to use insulin, which was revolutionary to me at that time because I spent so many years with my daughter not understanding how to use it.

Jordan Wagner (47:16)

Right.

Scott Benner (47:16)

Right? I said to my wife, I'm gonna start a podcast and tell people about how we do things because I think they might find it valuable. And that's come to pass. Like, the Pro Tip series and the Bull Beginnings and and those things are I think they're seminal in this space. And people know about them far and wide, and they've helped a lot of people understand how to use their insulin. So when I start talking about that, I am immediately met with the idea that some people are are going to eat really poorly, and I can can't stop them from doing that.

Jordan Wagner (47:48)

Right.

Scott Benner (47:48)

And if I say, here's the ideas I have about how to use insulin. By the way, eat right. And, like and start scolding them because that's how it's gonna feel to them. This information is not gonna get anywhere. So I started with a very basic idea of you need as much insulin as you need, and you need it where you need it, and you should use it.

Jordan Wagner (48:04)

Yep.

Scott Benner (48:04)

And it took a a long time and a lot of years to build up a following that can be disseminated, and people share it. And to the point where, like, you know, I mean, you see the a Facebook group is huge.

Jordan Wagner (48:18)

Right.

Scott Benner (48:18)

And people come in, and most of what they say is my doctor told me about this.

Jordan Wagner (48:22)

Yep. Exactly.

Scott Benner (48:23)

Mostly how people get into the group. So now, like, we've, you know, we've got this reach. We've taught people how to use their insulin, and there's a a resource there for new people to learn how to use it. And I'm saying in all of it, bolus what you need. But at some point, I'm not saying go live unhealthily.

Jordan Wagner (48:43)

Right.

Scott Benner (48:44)

My concern was if people don't use the amount of insulin they're supposed to use, it's either going to, like I said earlier, lead to some sort of an eating disorder, or it's gonna lead to elevated blood sugars.

Jordan Wagner (48:55)

Exactly.

Scott Benner (48:56)

I thought, let's eliminate those two things first. Right? Teach them how to use insulin so that they feel free to eat, so that they don't get involved in an eating disorder. Teach them how to use insulin so they're not running around with nine and ten and eleven a one c's and eight a one c's and seven. That they can put their a one c where they want it to be, that they can have a variability that they choose. Right? Like, let's give them those tools.

Jordan Wagner (49:18)

Exactly.

Scott Benner (49:19)

But the next thing to say after that has to be, this would all be easier if you didn't eat some of these things or if you limited the amount of times you ate those things. But if I start with that, then I'm just everybody else online telling you what to do, and you're not gonna listen. And then you never know how to use your insulin, and you run around with a 10 a one c. And it it seemed to me to do it in this order was

Jordan Wagner (49:42)

Yeah. And I agree. That that is the appropriate order to do it. Mhmm. And that's that's how I approach it too. Like, I have some of these conversations, a little bit deeper with some of the patients, but a lot of the patients that I am doing this with, they had to come back to the hospital for another reason. So we've already established rapport in in the past Yes. Of how to get them going. And now it's like, alright. You know how to use insulin for the most part. Let's start adding on top of that.

Scott Benner (50:07)

Yep. Yes. It's just super duper important. And it's not me it's not a bait and switch for me. I still think, like, I would rather you be in a world where you have two choices about your health, your blood sugars and your variability and your nutrition. I would rather one of them be good than neither of them be good.

Jordan Wagner (50:26)

Yeah. Without a doubt.

Scott Benner (50:27)

At least let's give you that. Like, if you're gonna eat a ding dong, then by the way, that sounds so wrong. I'm gonna pick something else. If you're gonna eat a ho ho, then eat a ho ho and don't have a blood sugar spike from it. But for the other people who eat differently, you know how to use your insulin for an avocado and toast

Jordan Wagner (50:44)

thing. Exactly.

Scott Benner (50:45)

Great. Like, it works for everybody.

Jordan Wagner (50:48)

It does.

Scott Benner (50:48)

Anyway, I'm and I'm not talking down to anybody. I am totally gonna have a Dorito this weekend. I just want everyone to know And Dorito is the food I use in the nutrition episode where I'm telling people, like, you know what sucks for you? Doritos. But if if I see one, I just wanna be clear, Jordan. I'm gonna eat it.

Jordan Wagner (51:06)

Without a doubt. I mean, like, and that's the thing too. There's there's a balance in in all of this, like, we've been talking about the whole time. Like, I think, personally, my quality of life would be a little lower if I was like, yeah. I'm never gonna eat pizza again. I eat pizza every Friday night. Yeah. You know? And I've learned how to dose for it. I know that eating that pizza and the quantity that I eat is probably not the healthiest thing in the world, but I enjoy eating it. I enjoy spending time with my family and doing that. And so to me, that's worth it. Right? So there's there's that balance there.

Scott Benner (51:37)

And in fairness, the next series that Jenny and I do is gonna be called what am I calling it? BOLUS four. Probably the number four. I don't know why the number. We're gonna go out to the community and say, tell us all the food you can't bowl us for. And Jenny and I are gonna do short episodes where we talk through making a bolus for each one of those items. And I guarantee you most of them are gonna be Lucky Charms and stuff like that. Yeah. You know? And fair enough. No one's perfect. Life's not perfect. We can all sit here and say, don't eat the seed oil or don't do this or don't do that. But we also just said it's hard to sleep because of technology and the way life is. It's also hard to eat because of, you know, how populated the planet is and the way that we have to make food so that everybody can eat. Like, it's not a set you it's not just you're out there making a bad decision. You're out there trying to live in the you know, you're swimming in the pool somebody threw you in, basically.

Jordan Wagner (52:24)

So Yeah. It it's I mean, just and and here's the thing I learned in nursing school, and you see it if you just look around, is especially in The United States, it's, like, one of the the few countries in the world where a lot of, like, lower income people have access to food, but it's, like, very low quality food. Yeah. Whereas, like, the rest of the world, they might not have access to any food at all.

Scott Benner (52:46)

Right. No. There's a lot of problems in the world. Like, they're really I mean, I'm not trying to say they don't exist. Also, my income is not challenged, but I grew up that way and so did my wife. Yeah. And we fight the things that were, like, bred into us as far as the way to eat. Like, my I I know my wife wouldn't like me to say this, but the my my wife will eat like a garbage person sometime. I'm like, you know, we have money. I'm like, we're not poor anymore. Like, we're not, like you know what I mean? Like, I'm I can't have a cook come in Sure. Slaughter the cow in front of me or anything like that. But, like, but we can afford it a reasonable meal, but she just grew up a different way. And, like and the things that occur to her, like, I watch her have to, like, say to herself, like and my wife's she eats well, and she no. But her first thought is always the thing from when she was a kid. Mhmm. You know? And then in she stops herself most of the times, but there's also times she doesn't. You know? So holidays are a great example. Like, my wife equates holidays and certain, like, candy, or she almost can't stop herself from going to a movie and not buying popcorn.

Jordan Wagner (53:53)

Yes. It's at that tradition, that built in tradition almost. Yeah.

Scott Benner (53:56)

But then once she buys it, I see her take a couple bites of it, and she's like, I don't want this. Like, I actually said to her at the last movie we saw, I I it was Thunderbolts, case you're all wondering. Like, she took two handfuls of popcorn, and she's like, I don't want this. And I said, hey. Next time. I was really like, I I think it was very sweet. I said, next time, let's buy a smaller one because you don't want this. And she goes, no. You're right. And I was like, okay. So, like, let's see what happens. Like, when I go see, hopefully, Mission Impossible part two, which I'm very excited to see.

Jordan Wagner (54:24)

Yeah. Those are great movies.

Scott Benner (54:25)

Oh my god. The last one was awesome. Like, hopefully, she'll say, like, give me a small popcorn because, like, to, you know, help the little girl and her feel like she's at the movies and, you know, cover for the fact that the adult doesn't want this popcorn at all. It's it's super interesting. Anyway, I'm sorry. And by the way, go outside. Tell them about the sun.

Jordan Wagner (54:46)

Yes. Well, yeah, just just get outside. I mean, if you're getting outside consistently, there's a high likelihood you're also increasing your activity. So that's a huge part of it there. But one of the big things is, you know, vitamin D. Right? So vitamin D in low levels has been associated with insulin resistance, and there's even, some some theories, of diabetes diagnosis for type ones that point to the fact that vitamin D is low in a lot of type one diabetics. Mhmm. Getting outside, the sun hitting your skin helps our body to be able to make its own vitamin D. And so you don't need to go outside all day long, but, like, again, speaking to the person who, you know, works in the office, maybe you take your your lunch break and you go outside. And I I know that's not always possible, but to the best of your ability, it's just getting outside at some point during the day is gonna be it's gonna be really helpful for you.

Scott Benner (55:41)

Right.

Jordan Wagner (55:41)

The other thing tying it all into sleep here is that when you're getting that full spectrum light coming from the sun, that helps balance your circadian rhythm, so your natural sleeping patterns. Things like blue lights, so that's gonna be lights coming from screens or, like, the the overhead lights in the office or perhaps at home. Those things can actually really mess up your, your circadian rhythm there. And the sun is a natural way to be able to balance that there. Just just as a side note, like, they do have those blue blocking glasses, that you that you can wear and block out some of the lights. You know, there's different colors. Yellow is gonna be approximately 50% or so. The the orange is gonna block out closer to a 100%. So depending on what when you're wanting to do it, those are good options too if you're stuck inside. But it is just truly best just to get outside, get get a little sun. If you're not in a sunny state, that's okay. But, like, just getting outside, you're still gonna get the benefits to an extent. It might not be as much as, like, where I'm at in Arizona. You're gonna get some benefit for sure. So

Scott Benner (56:45)

You're probably avoiding the sun and still getting it.

Jordan Wagner (56:47)

Yeah. I mean, I am in the sun all the time. If you'd ever drove past my house, you'd be like, oh, there's Jordan. He's not wearing a shirt again because I I just I always have my shirt off doing yard work and things like that.

Scott Benner (56:58)

Yeah. Awesome. Well, Jordan, I can't I can't thank you enough for for coming on and and putting together these few episodes for me. If you have more you wanna talk about, you let me know. You could always come back.

Jordan Wagner (57:08)

Absolutely. Sounds good, Scott.

Scott Benner (57:09)

Awesome. Thank you.

Jordan Wagner (57:10)

Yeah. Of course.

Scott Benner (57:19)

Thanks so much to Jordan for spending his time with us. If you're enjoying Jordan on the podcast and you'd like him to come back, go find him on Instagram, the diabetic merce, and let him know how much you enjoyed him on the show. This episode was sponsored by Touched by Type one. I want you to go find them on Facebook, Instagram, and give them a follow, and then head to touchedbytype1.org where you're gonna learn all about their programs and resources for people with type one diabetes. Are you tired of getting a rash from your CGM adhesive? Give the Eversense three sixty five a try. Eversense cgm.com/juicebox. Beautiful silicone that they use. It changes every day. Keeps it fresh. Not only that, you only have to change the sensor once a year. So, I mean, that's better. This episode of the Juice Box podcast is sponsored by the Omnipod five. And at my link, omnipod.com/juicebox, you can get yourself a free what'd I just say? A free Omnipod five starter kit. Free? Get out of here. Go click on that link. Omnipod.com/juicebox. Check it out. Terms and conditions apply. Eligibility may vary. Full terms and conditions can be found at omnipod.com/juicebox. Links in the show notes. Links at juiceboxpodcast.com. Hey. Thanks for listening all the way to the end. I really appreciate your loyalty and listenership. Thank you so much for listening. I'll be back very soon with another episode of the Juice Box podcast. When I created the defining diabetes series, I pictured a dictionary in my mind to help you understand key terms that shape type one diabetes management, Along with Jenny Smith, who, of course, is an experienced diabetes educator, we break down concepts like basal, time and range, insulin on board, and much more. This series must have 70 short episodes in it. We have to take the jargon out of the jargon so that you can focus on what really matters, living confidently and staying healthy. You can't do these things if you don't know what they mean. Go get your diabetes defined. Juiceboxpodcast.com. Go up in the menu and click on series. Hey. What's up, everybody? If you've noticed that the podcast sounds better and you're thinking, like, how does that happen? What you're hearing is Rob at Wrong Way Recording doing his magic to these files. So if you want him to do his magic to you, wrongwayrecording.com. You got a podcast? You want somebody to edit it? You want Rob.

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