#1860 ER Match

Scott and Erika explore the psychology of wasted time, identity, and the real-world reach of diabetes advocacy.

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Key Takeaways

• Niche Diagnostic Limitations in the ER: Emergency departments are structured as stabilization nets for acute crises ("sick vs. not sick") rather than definitive management zones for chronic diseases. Specialized diagnostic tests—such as GAD antibody panels to distinguish Type 1 from Type 2 diabetes—often take over a week to process and are unavailable as rapid, in-house ER labs.
• Navigating Chronic Endocrinology Shortages: A severe systemic shortage of endocrinologists complicates immediate care for newly symptomatic patients. Navigating extensive insurance verifications can delay crucial specialized appointments unless professional peer networks or alternative clinical channels are utilized.
• Educational Gaps in Standard Medical Curriculums: Traditional nursing schools and general medical tracks focus heavily on acute, short-term stabilization of metabolic emergencies (e.g., fluid and electrolyte replacement in DKA) rather than teaching the detailed, intensive management skills required to safely navigate daily insulin therapy.
• Mitigating Clinical Cognitive Bias with AI: Medical professionals are susceptible to cognitive biases, such as attributing demographic patterns to common clinical conclusions (e.g., assuming an older patient has standard Type 2 diabetes or a recurring UTI). Advanced large language models present a valuable opportunity to handle the cognitive load and provide structured differential analysis.
• The Invisible Mental Burden of Adult Type 1 Diabetes: Managing an adult Type 1 diagnosis demands an immense, constant cognitive load. The chronic anxiety surrounding severe hypoglycemia highlights the profound impact of partner support systems, peer-led education, and targeted community outreach.

Resources Mentioned

• Juicebox Podcast Support Site: juiceboxpodcast.com
• Eversense 365 CGM: eversensecgm.com/juicebox
• US Med Supply Distribution: usmed.com/juicebox (Or call 888-721-1514)
• Tandem Diabetes Care (Tandem Mobi System): tandemdiabetes.com/juicebox
• Audio Production Platform: wrongwayrecording.com

FULL EPISODE TRANSCRIPT

Introduction and On-Site Support Tools

Scott Benner (0:00)

Welcome back, friends. You are listening to the Juice Box podcast.

Matt (0:13)

My name is Matt. Been diagnosed as a type one diabetic for just over one year, and I'm here with my beautiful wife, Chassis.

Scott Benner (0:22)

Hey. Do you need support? I have some stuff for you. It's all free. Juiceboxpodcast.com. Click on support in the menu. Let's see what you get there. A one c and blood glucose calculator. People love that. That's actually, I think, the most popular page on the website some months.

Scott Benner (0:36)

A list of great endocrinologists from listeners. That's from all over the country. There's a link to the private Facebook group, to the Circle community, and we have a a fantastic thing there, American Sign Language. There's a great sign language interpreter who did the entire bold beginning series in ASL. So if you know anybody who would benefit from that, please send them that way.

Scott Benner (0:58)

Just go to juiceboxpodcast.com and click on support. While you're there, check out the guides like the prebolising guide, fat and protein insulin calculator, oh gosh, thyroid, GLP, caregiver burnout. You should go to the website. Click around a little bit on those menus. It really there's a lot more there than you think.

Scott Benner (1:17)

Nothing you hear on the juice box podcast should be considered advice, medical or otherwise. Always consult a physician before making any changes to your health care plan. I'm having an on body vibe alert. This episode of the Juice Box podcast is sponsored by Eversense three sixty five, the only one year wear CGM. That's one insertion and one CGM a year.

Scott Benner (1:43)

One CGM, one year. Not every ten or fourteen days. Ever since cgm.com/juicebox. Today's episode is also sponsored by US Med, usmed.com/juicebox. You can get your diabetes supplies from the same place that we do, and I'm talking about Dexcom, Libre, Omnipod, Tandem, and so much more.

Scott Benner (2:07)

Usmed.com/juicebox or call (888) 721-1514. The podcast is also sponsored today by the Tandem MOBI system, which is powered by Tandem's newest algorithm, Control IQ Plus Technology. Tandem Mobi has a predictive algorithm that helps prevent highs and lows and is now available for ages two and up. Learn more and get started today at tandemdiabetes.com/juicebox.

ER Medical Careers and a Shocking Discovery

Matt (2:35)

My name is Matt. Been diagnosed as a type one diabetic for just over one year, and I'm here with my beautiful wife, Cassie.

Scott Benner (2:43)

Hey, Cassie. How are you?

Cassie (2:45)

Hi, Scott. I'm doing great. Thank you. I'm Cassie. I'm the wife of a type one diabetic. I'm an ER doctor, and he's an ER nurse.

Scott Benner (2:55)

No kidding. How long have you been married?

Matt (2:58)

I'll give you this one.

Scott Benner (3:01)

Do neither of you know, or are you just trying not to talk over each other?

Matt (3:06)

September '22?

Scott Benner (3:11)

That's not that many years ago, Matt. You should not be saying that like you're not a 100% sure.

Matt (3:16)

We travel a lot. We work nights. Our schedule is crazy, so it takes a lot to just remember the day of the week.

Scott Benner (3:21)

Yeah. Well, listen. Watch this. 30 pro. 08/03/1996. Boom. See that?

Matt (3:26)

Yep. Yep. I've been there and done that, and this life is much better now.

Scott Benner (3:32)

Okay. So you guys meet at work?

Matt (3:35)

We actually did. We worked in a different city years ago, and it it's a funny story. Actually, I'll let Chassie tell it. She's a better storyteller.

Scott Benner (3:45)

Go ahead, Chassie. I'll hear

Chassie (3:47)

We did, actually. We worked together for several years, and Matt was extremely shy. But we worked together for years in the same hospital and, honestly, never really spoke. I'm pretty friendly and outgoing, so for him to not speak to me tells you just how shy he was and how much he's come out of his shell. But, yeah, we worked together for years and and never really spoke for a very long time. And then now once he finally approached me and we started talking, now he doesn't really stop. So we we've been together for a while now.

Scott Benner (4:24)

You gotta be careful what you wish for, I guess. Matt, were you married at the time and you weren't talking cause you didn't want to do something inappropriate, or is that not the case? Were you not married when you guys started talking?

Matt (4:37)

I was married, previously for, we just talked about time. That was twenty years. Wasn't happy. It was in my head. It was in a tough space. So I kept to myself, kept my head down, just did my job, and just kept trucking on.

Scott Benner (4:49)

Yeah. I think he didn't wanna talk to you because he's afraid, you know, he's gonna hit on you while he was married. That's what I'm thinking. But, we'll go with he was quiet. And so when you get married, do you have any health issues at that point?

Matt (5:02)

When we got married us, I actually had, just been diagnosed with bladder cancer. And, it was at work, and Chassie was actually the one that found it.

Scott Benner (5:13)

No kidding. Okay. Well, tell me about that first.

Matt (5:16)

I had a few years with a little, hematuria, a little blood in the urine. Didn't really think anything of it. Talked to a couple other people because us in the medical field, we don't like to go get seen by other people.

Scott Benner (5:33)

You know how bad they are at their jobs. You've met them in person. So

Matt (5:36)

Oh, absolutely.

Scott Benner (5:38)

But, Matt, I gotta stop you before you even get into this story. Did you say you had blood in your urine for a couple of years?

Matt (5:44)

Not it wasn't, consistent. Maybe three times.

Scott Benner (5:49)

You still married this guy even though that happened? What what's going on?

Chassie (5:53)

I know. This imagine this kind of stubbornness, and now throw on some type one. Spoiler alert. You already know he's type one. Yeah. That kind of personality, and now with type one, it's a it's a fun roller coaster. It's marriage building skills.

Scott Benner (6:05)

I bet you. Okay. I'm sorry. So you noticed as you finally go see somebody, what happens then?

Matt (6:11)

Yeah. Well, I changed my diaper on my own, so she didn't have to help me with that.

Scott Benner (6:14)

Jesus.

Matt (6:15)

So

Scott Benner (6:16)

Look at you doing your part.

Matt (6:19)

Yep. So, yeah, it was it was sporadic just a couple times over a few years. Didn't think anything of it. Thought it may have been something else minor. We were at work one day, and she was like, you know what? Let me just go ahead and ultrasound you. Not looking for anything specific, just going over, you know, the body system with ultrasound. And, she got down to my bladder, and her eyes just got wide. And, which I was like, what? What? And she was quiet, and she's not a quiet person, which you'll learn. And she just showed me the video, and it was like this softball sized mask in my bladder. The only one thing really comes into your mind when you see something like that. Yeah. I think we had just started dating at that time. We weren't living together. It was just it was still new, so that's kind of an awkward start. So Yeah. I've heard I've heard

Scott Benner (7:09)

Tinder dates have gone wrong for much less than this. People will bail on anything.

Matt (7:15)

Yeah. I wouldn't know. I I never went that route, but, yeah, I couldn't see that being easy one to say, see you. But she had to work with me. So, you know, she made some calls. We got into, urology, went and did blood work, urine, had a CT scan, and all that stuff actually came back negative.

Scott Benner (7:32)

Okay.

Matt (7:33)

But we have a video of this mass and an ultrasound. And, her being the doctor and and knowing these other specialists, they were like, you know, come on in. We'll do a biopsy. I'm not trusting the other results. And, went in for a biopsy that ended up being a complete removal at the time. So I come out from anesthesia, and the doc's like, yeah. It was it was cancer.

Scott Benner (8:01)

And what did they take out? I'm sorry. What's a complete removal mean?

Matt (8:05)

Terminology wise, Chassie, do you have a term in the neoplasm?

Chassie (8:09)

Yeah. So he ended up all of Matt's blood work and lab work, even the CT scan was normal. So I sent my images to a colleague that's urology surgeon, and so he kinda knew what he was looking for when he went in and came out while Matt was still in anesthesia and said, oh, yeah. It's definitely cancer. I've I've got to remove all of this. So, yeah, came out, said it was definitely cancerous, but it was able to be resected at that time, and then we ended up getting pathology back that it was a transitional cell.

Scott Benner (8:43)

So What's that mean, transitional?

Chassie (8:46)

It's a type of bladder cancer. Basically, for us, it was not malignant, meaning it had not spread to other organs, but we know that this type of cancer has a thirty percent chance of recurrence in life. So Matt has to be under, obviously, ongoing surveillance.

Scott Benner (9:08)

Yeah. I know. So scrutiny.

Chassie (9:09)

With thirty percent recurrence, that's pretty high. And especially for a guy with no medical problems, no medications, yeah, that was a fun way to start dating.

Scott Benner (9:17)

Yeah. I imagine you thought I've either gotta marry this guy or leave and change jobs. Right? You can't you couldn't just go, oh, okay. Well, good luck, and, I'll see you around work. We're not anymore.

Matt (9:30)

I'm glad she's stuck around.

Scott Benner (9:32)

Yeah. No kidding. That's lovely. So is there damage to the bladder, or what's the recovery like?

Matt (9:36)

Every year, I've gone for one or two cystos where they go and take a look. I actually just went last week and got my five year clearance. The urine was clear from any cancerous cells, and the scope inside was completely negative. I've gotten some chemotherapy initially, and, luckily, it took. So right now, it's just maintaining urine and a scan, I think, once a year now. But, yeah, everything is gone. No issues. I'm not dribbling everywhere. You know? It's it's pretty good as far as that goes.

Scott Benner (10:09)

That a good sign, finally. Yeah. You keep going, you are gonna find her aligned one day.

Matt (10:14)

You know, she's she's dear

Scott Benner (10:16)

diary, he's dribbling. I'm out. So I did my best. Wow. And then tell me when that happened again, what year?

Matt (10:26)

That was, we found it in September 2020. Normally, it was under 50 and smokers or who was prevalent with. And at the time, I was 42. And, just to preface that, I was a a firefighter paramedic for a long time, and I worked on the hazardous materials team. And, we think it was a it's from the the foam that we use

Scott Benner (10:48)

Oh, really?

Matt (10:49)

to fight fires as an environmental exposure.

Scott Benner (10:52)

Matt, I gotta tell you. I worked in a paint shop in a sheet metal place for years, and every day that I don't die, I'm pretty amazed, honestly. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. As a kid, I was just around I was just around a lot of shit in the air, and, you know, we didn't wear mat. Nobody did anything. You just walked in and worked.

Matt (11:10)

Oh, no. Yeah. Yeah.

Scott Benner (11:11)

So Yeah. I can't believe I don't have a problem from something like that.

The Sudden Onset of Type 1 Diabetes

Scott Benner (11:16)

How long after this process does the diabetes appear, and how do you figure that out?

Matt (11:21)

Well, I was good. Because it was September, '24. I had kinda stress really left the job here where we live now, And, we travel a lot, so we were preparing for a trip. But prior to the trip, I had been to a concert with a friend of mine, and there was, like, a beer tasting event, like, three hours prior to the concert.

Scott Benner (11:46)

Mhmm.

Matt (11:46)

So we go around the room. We're drinking all this beer, and I know I everything was fine right then because I wasn't peeing all the time. So drank all that beer, you know, peeked, like, maybe once or twice, watched a concert. Everything was good. Mhmm. And then we went to Turkey in November, and I'll just say that I may have had some touch up work that some people may do with turkey every now and then.

Scott Benner (12:16)

You get your eyes pulled back a little? What'd you do?

Matt (12:18)

Just a little just a little bit. Just a touch.

Scott Benner (12:20)

Nice.

Matt (12:22)

And, after that, they give you some steroids after I didn't realize at the time, but I my vision was getting blurry, my close vision, but my distance was fine. And I just had LASIK surgery done the year before, and my vision was perfect. So I contacted them, said, hey. My vision's a little blurry because I give you some medicine. And, they're like, oh, it should should go away. So I said that was November. And then sometime after that, I just started, like, peeing all the time. And I I drink a lot of water. I work out all the time. Mhmm. So it's normal for me to, you know, pee.

Scott Benner (13:00)

Yeah.

Matt (13:00)

This was just ridiculous. I I couldn't sleep and working night shift and trying to come home to sleep, and you're up every thirty minutes to an hour going to the bathroom. Like, what?

Scott Benner (13:11)

So you're peeing, like, on the hour almost?

Matt (13:13)

It was almost hourly. I'll drink a a gallon of water at work every shift, and I'll drink a gallon when I'm home. So it's normal, but this was to the point where I'm like, what the you know? Right. This is unreal.

Scott Benner (13:24)

And did you think, I'll just ignore this for a few years, and then if it gets bad enough, I'll have my wife look into it?

Matt (13:31)

Absolutely. Absolutely.

Scott Benner (13:33)

No. What do you do with that information once you realize it's like, you know, this isn't normal?

Scott Benner (13:39)

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Scott Benner (14:01)

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Scott Benner (14:34)

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Matt (15:36)

Well, my my vision got really bad, and it was it was pissing me off.

Scott Benner (15:41)

Yeah.

Matt (15:41)

I'm like, you know, these are kind of diabetic symptoms. I'm like, there's no way in hell that I'm diabetic. And so it goes on and on, and it's been, like, three months. And, like, I couldn't leave the house without, like, stopping in a parking lot or, you know, I had to plan everything. It just it was so ridiculous that Cassie finally talked to me, and she's like, let's go to urology. That's the only doctor I'd seen here.

Chassie (16:05)

It's true. It's true. But that is the only physician Matt had, and that was only because he had bladder cancer, and we were out So of that's the only place I could get him to go because I agree. These are all screaming. Yeah. He's not the stereotypical of what you think of, and that was such a hard barrier in his head to get through. He's like, I know I have the polyuria. I'm peeing all the time. I know I have polydipsia. I'm drinking water all the time. Mhmm. And he just made, you know, excuse after excuse thinking, no. It can't be. No. It can't be. No. It can't be. And so and he was suffering for three, four weeks probably, just miserable. And then when I finally said, Matt, you look ill. Mhmm. I mean, you you don't look well. Matt is a I know this is a podcast, but Matt's a big guy. I mean, he works out. He looks big and buff.

Scott Benner (17:05)

Yeah. Matt, you're a robust person. Like yeah.

Chassie (17:09)

He's thick.

Scott Benner (17:10)

Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.

Chassie (17:10)

I mean, he is he is extremely muscular, extremely fit. And, Scott, he looked sick. I mean, he had lost 25, 26 pounds in two months unintentionally. And with his history of bladder cancer, that's always a cancer diagnosis.

Scott Benner (17:28)

Right. But, Matt, tell me something. When you think diabetes, can you kinda go through the psychological thing that stops you from wanting to—I know nobody wants to think they're sick in general, but why is diabetes, like, even a bridge too far beyond that? Because people talk about it all the time. I'm wondering if you can put it into words.

Matt (17:48)

Well, first off, type one had had never even entered my my mind. Unless you have a a connection to type one, I think it does you just don't even think of it.

Scott Benner (17:58)

Okay.

Matt (17:58)

You think type two, you think, you know, metformin. You think, oh, I gotta lose weight. I've gotta work out and get healthier, and I was already healthy. So to me, I'm like, there there's just no way. And not to put a negative, you know, light on it, but I'm like, if it is type two, what is there that I could change in my lifestyle? Because I'm the pickiest eater. I don't have a sweet tooth. Mean, my BMIs are are both because the height and weight, you know, that I don't go by that. And, because if it was just taking metformin or something like that and working out, there would be no problem. But I'm just stubborn, and I was like, there's there's no way this is gonna go away. And, when it was brought to my attention how much weight I had lost, and I just I'm not one that would weigh myself all the time, but it ended up being, like, thirty to forty pounds, you know, after the three months. And I didn't see it in my face till I started going back and looking at pictures, and I was like, it really got to me. Right. And I was like, okay. Let's let's go ahead and and get checked out.

Scott Benner (19:02)

At that point, are you thinking I'd prefer this to be diabetes because I don't want it to be cancer? Do you have to have that thought?

Matt (19:09)

Absolutely.

Cognitive Bias and ER vs. Specialized Medicine

Scott Benner (19:10)

Yeah. I would imagine. Also, let me just say here for everybody who who follows me on Instagram and knows this, but I'm having, my office—I'm having an office built in my basement. And so I'm doing my best, but there are gonna be times that you're just gonna hear banging in the background. And I don't think there's anything—we'll just have to use this as a time stamp in the podcast for when Scott got his own office finally and moved out of this tiny room making the podcast. But I'm doing my best not to speak while it's happening so editors can take it out later. But every once in a while, you're not gonna hear it, but I'm gonna hear it. That's gonna be stuck in my head.

Chassie (19:46)

On this episode, you can blame me. I was beaten mad in the background for being such a stubborn patient. So for this episode, it was me.

Scott Benner (19:53)

In fairness, every physician I've spoken to, nurse—you guys are all the same. Like, you should all have to walk around the hospital with a shirt on that says, do as I say, not as I do. You you know? So I take how it happens. Tissue urologist, do it or do you have to go find a doctor to actually give you a diagnosis?

Scott Benner (20:14)

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Matt (21:37)

Well, first thing they do, like, every visit, you go get the urine sample. Oh, by the way, I think the banging you hear is every time I say, his chassis hitting No.

Scott Benner (21:45)

Got it. Trust me. I have weird connector words. It took me years to stop them. I used to have stickies on my monitor with words and, like, lines put through them because I would use connector words when I was thinking. I've learned just stop talking until the next word comes to you. It's an easier way to handle it, but don't worry about it. You guys are doing great. Don't think anything of it.

Matt (22:04)

Okay. Good. Alright. So I give the urine sample. We go in the office, and the urologist comes in. He's a great guy. He goes, you've got sugar in your urine. And just like stomach sunk, he's like, it it's diabetes. Just like, you know, playing his name, it's diabetes. Mhmm. And still, you don't think type one. Right. It just doesn't occur. So he was like, let's go ahead and and refer you to, you know, local endo. So we leave the office, go ahead, immediately call on the way home, and it was just a garbage call. It's like, well, let—give us your insurance information. We'll call you back next week if, you know, your insurance works with our office. That just wasn't good enough for Chassis who, luckily, she did stick with me. And so loving and caring, she's like, let's find some other way.

Scott Benner (22:57)

Yeah. Chassie, you—there was not a half a second where you're like, I could have bailed back at the cancer thing. Well, Matt, what is it about you? You're so delightful that none of these health issues run her off.

Matt (23:08)

I just smell really good, I guess. I don't know.

Scott Benner (23:10)

It's the pheromones.

Chassie (23:12)

Ain't that terrible? I'm a forever doctor at work, at home. Like, I'm—I'm attracted to my patient, my husband. Like, I get to doctor at work. I doctor at home. I'm really committed to the field is what I'd like to think.

Scott Benner (23:24)

I thought some guy must have just been really terrible at Chassis in a former life, and she's like, this is a nice person. I'm sticking this out. Yeah.

Chassie (23:30)

You're so good at this game, Scott.

Scott Benner (23:32)

Oh, okay. Alright.

Matt (23:34)

I'm a long term study. That's all it is.

Scott Benner (23:37)

She's like, I can't wait to see how this turns out. What a funny way to think of yourself. She's just really, like, you know, interested in what's happening. I listen. I've said over and over again, I I'm only still married because my wife wanted our next kid to look like her first kid. She was probably like, how am I gonna move all this stuff out of the house by myself? You know what I mean? It's a lot of effort. Exactly. So wow, man. So you get in with somebody quicker than a week? Did she, like, shake down some person she knows and make them see you? What happened?

Chassie (24:13)

So it's one of the things that is so frustrating in health care. This is just a specific—our niche, obviously, with you is—is type one diabetes and for our diabetic patients out there. And I think we all can agree no matter where we're listening to this from, there are not enough endos. I wish that the world and the diabetic populations everywhere had more endocrinologists available. And even here, we live in Orlando, and there's just not enough to keep up with the patient needs. And so this was yet another example, and we were living it of how, you know, you need to see endocrinology, and you just can't get in.

Scott Benner (24:54)

Yeah.

Chassie (24:55)

And Matt was, again, he looked so unwell that I—I truly thought it was cancer, not diabetes. And so he was becoming more symptomatic and more symptomatic, and we obviously needed further testing. And he had no medications that he was taking for anything, and he looked so unwell. And he had to be unwell for me to even get him to the urology appointment. And I thought, let me reach out to my colleagues. And so there's a women's physician group that several of us are involved in in Orlando, and honest to goodness, I just called in a favor. Yeah. It was nothing more than just the graciousness of a colleague saying, oh gosh. Absolutely. I'll see him tomorrow.

Scott Benner (25:41)

So, Chassie, if that wasn't possible, I mean—and with your background and what you do for a living, like, he's a prime candidate to go to the ER. Right?

Chassie (25:50)

100%. And that's exactly where I would have taken him, where we would have ended up, and the only place that he would have been able to at least be thoroughly evaluated and keep him from being very, very ill.

Scott Benner (26:07)

Can I ask you a question, like, while we're on this subject here?

Chassie (26:10)

Of course.

Scott Benner (26:11)

You're an ER doctor, and you have a patient in front of you who you love who looks like you should go to the ER. But you were still like, let me see if I can get him to another doctor. What's the disconnect there? Like, how come everybody who comes on here talks about the ER and like, I mean, do you know I took my mom to the ER three times before someone found her cancer? They one time imaged her and said, this is a UTI, but she's so full of urine. It's hard to tell, so we're gonna drain her out and, blah blah blah. But they imaged her first. The urine blocked the scan. You couldn't see the uterine cancer she had. Right? And then they were like, oh, she should—I mean, three times till somebody found a mass that was huge. Like, how is that possible? I know you're a good doctor. Okay? I've met you. You seem like a reasonable person. What happens? Like, where—where's the disconnect in something like this? Like, how come you didn't just put him in a car and drive him to the ER? There's gotta be a reason, unless I'm thinking into it too far.

Chassie (27:11)

No. I'm so glad you asked that, and it's something that I think in the ER that we take for granted because, oh my gosh, every single patient all you want to do is everything for every patient. You know, we in the ER, remember, there is no specialty.

Scott Benner (27:31)

Mhmm.

Chassie (27:31)

You have to know everything from head to toe. I have this rash on my scalp. I'm vomiting. My baby has a rash. I've lost 30 pounds this week. And, again, I think most of us in the ER, we just wanna fix and cure everything, and the problem is that there's a saying in emergency medicine that we're a jack of all trades and a specialty to none.

Scott Benner (27:53)

Mhmm.

Chassie (27:54)

And, unfortunately, I wish that the ER could be a one stop shop for everything. That's just not how emergency medicine works. And the key to an emergency department is truly emergency things. Now these aren't things that necessarily aren't important and don't need further care, but these are emergent diagnosis. Like, in your population, DKA, those are all emergency things. But even something as simple as sending labs to actually test for, say, antibodies in your type one, not possible Yeah. in the ER. A biopsy for your mom's mask, not possible in the ER. And so the ER is this huge catch net for every single ailment, pain, symptom, rash, bump, lump, symptom of I don't feel good, anything. And you do as much as you possibly can, and then we really have to rely on our specialty colleagues for all of these higher level specific tests to kinda get you in the right direction. Now if I could be an OB GYN and an endocrinologist and a urologist and everything, I promise you, I would. I just am specifically trained in emergent situations and narrowing things down and being as thorough as I possibly can. And, again, referring for follow-up or consulting on my colleagues for those further evaluations and diagnoses and testing. Like, for example, no ER doctor can order antibodies for testing the difference between type one and type two.

The Limits of Clinical Tracking and Generalist Training

Scott Benner (29:38)

But why not? Because what it feels like is that you're involved in a a special kind of medicine that sort of like if this, then that. If my arm's falling off, you're the right place to go. Right? Like, that kind of thing. But if I have, you know, diabetes, I'm gonna send you to endo. But then we all know that when you say, well, you're gonna have to go to endo, like, they sent Matt out, and he called immediately and got told, you know, we'll talk to you next week. And, like, you know, if he was in DKA and you guys didn't have the background you have, like, you don't know where that would have ended up. He would have probably ended up back in the ER, but then DKA would have made them say, oh, he has type one diabetes. Right?

Chassie (30:16)

Exactly. Okay. Mhmm. Exactly.

Scott Benner (30:19)

From your perspective, like, what's the—because everyone says it's broken. It can't be fixed, but it doesn't seem that difficult to fix. I don't know. It feels like the map we use to get to the end is just a little skewed. You know what I mean? Like, let me give you an example and see if this goes anywhere. I had to take Arden into the hospital, I don't know, like, last year. She had an infection. And I was going through her symptoms with an AI model. And I had all the possibilities in front of me of what I thought was gonna happen, what could possibly happen. And the ER doc would talk to her, disappear in the back, come back again, and then talk to me. And it felt like she was reading the chat GPT answer that I had to me, which really made me think that she went in the back and did the same thing I did. And maybe not. Maybe just her training and her if this, then that, like, just comes out that way. And I it's possible she was just a great doctor. Like, I have no idea. But my point is that if she and I came to the same conclusion and I have no training, why can't that thing say, hey. This could be type one or type two diabetes. We get to order this lab, or we can contact Endo who could give us a script right now digitally. Like, why does that stuff not happen? Like, why is it always go wait and maybe you'll get sicker? Or if you don't, good for you. Like, why does it work that way?

Chassie (31:40)

So for example, let's use specifically since this is the Juice Box podcast, for example, type one testing. So there's only a couple of laboratories in the entire country that can test for GAD antibodies, which is one of the main antibodies that we look for to distinguish type one and type two. Right? Mhmm. So even if I'm standing in front of you and I have your blood and I send it off, that test takes over one week to complete.

Scott Benner (32:14)

Okay.

Chassie (32:15)

It is not a test that exists in, well, any hospital I've ever worked at, and I've worked in many. Tel—and so a lot of these diagnoses that we experience are really are they're very niche. These are things that take days to weeks to diagnose. And so that's one of the great things about the ER is that I hope nobody ever gets sick, but there's always a doc there twenty four seven to help get you through those things. And if if there's ever a gap in between, you know, managing you outpatient in the comforts of your own home, then that's when we utilize the emergency department and inpatient if we need to admit you. Now here's the thing. I knew Matt was not in DKA. I see DKA for years. I can look across the room and go, oh, boy. That's—oh, they're in DKA. And I knew that wasn't Matt. So did I know Matt didn't feel well? Yes. Did I know he needed other testing? Yes. Did he need to sit in a hospital room for days to a week until we get these answers?

Chassie (33:18)

No. No. Could we manage this outpatient? Absolutely. And if he needed to go to the ER in the meantime, even temporarily to be discharged, you know, back home and still wait, then that was an option. But I am I was very fortunate to know that, yes, Matt, we don't have all the answers. No. Matt doesn't feel good. Yes. We need to keep going. We're on a journey here to get diagnosed, treatments, things like that. But I also knew that we could always go twenty four seven anytime, anywhere if we needed to.

Scott Benner (33:50)

It would happen.

Chassie (33:51)

He just didn't need to at that point. He just felt bad, and we were impatiently waiting for follow-up and testing.

Scott Benner (33:57)

Yeah. Okay. I have a question. Like, if you had somebody with a 400 blood sugar and you gave them some insulin in the ER, brought their blood sugar down, took the insulin away, and it went right back up again. Isn't that a pretty good sign? It's type one and not type two? No. No? That wouldn't work?

Chassie (34:16)

No. I wish. Oh my goodness. You know how finicky diabetes is. I wish it was that simple, but no. And that's honestly, I think that the biggest takeaway as a physician with your patient—and I speak for me, but I hope I speak for all of my physician colleagues out there—is that's why it's so important just to have healthy conversations with your patients to say, hey. You know, it looks better now, but this can go on, and this can go up. It can go down. And if you're not feeling well—and Matt can attest to this. I tell my patients. If you're not feeling well or if something happens, it's okay. Just come back. I don't want you out there suffering and being miserable. Even if I can't do everything you need here from the ER, I don't want you out there in the world alone or being sick. And if you need something, that's okay. Our plan b is always you come back here. This is always a safe space. This is a safety net for you. And if we need to admit you to keep care going on, that is absolutely fine. I hope you never need to be admitted to the hospital. But if that's what it takes, then that's what we do.

The Endocrine Shortage and Individual Motivation

Scott Benner (35:19)

Can I ask you why—why do you think that there aren't more just diabetologists? Like, just people who are not full blown endos, but, like, just handle diabetes. If if diabetes is so prevalent in the population, why aren't students wanting to be doctors who take care of it? Is it because the prevalence is mostly type two and that people don't seek treatment until they're—is it a money thing? Can you not make money doing it? Like, I'm wondering why it feels like that's a thing everybody would be rushing to do because there's a need—you know, the need's there, and the need would translate to business.

Chassie (35:54)

Oh, the need is definitely there. Yeah. And, again, this is the Juice Box podcast. So our niche here is endocrinology and type one and type two diabetes, but there's also so many different disease processes out there that, you know, sometimes just grab your heart as a doctor or a nurse even or when you're young and your grandma goes through x, y, or z. And I do. I think all of us just have these different life moments that kinda draw you into where you end up in life and your job. Like, even with you, with Arden. I mean, look what Arden has brought you. That's led you down this path. And if she had had a, you know, a different process or struggled with a a different disease, I think that you'd probably be really passionate and be the next expert in x, y, or z.

Scott Benner (36:45)

Something different. Yeah. Yeah. I take your point.

Chassie (36:48)

That's the beauty of life is that experience is a great teacher. And I would like to say that, my gosh, I have an extra, extra deep place in my heart now for all of my diabetics, type one and type two. You know? Because when you live through something, it does. It makes you passionate about it, and it makes you wanna be more and learn more. And so I'm thinking that with the prevalence, like you're saying, surely there's so many young nurses and young doctors out there who are being affected by type one and type two diabetes, and they are. They're going to be passionate about this and go into these fields.

Scott Benner (37:22)

A great insight. I appreciate that. Seriously, that is a really great insight. Because I just—I always think of it as—I mean, I know everybody's—you're hoping your doctor is one of those people who just grew up thinking, like, I wanna help people. Some of them grew up with, like, I'd like to try to make some money. And so, like, why would those people not flood to where the need is because the need is billable? But it's just—I don't know. It's a real—it's very interesting. And that endo shortage is across the country

Chassie (37:47)

It is.

Scott Benner (37:48)

as far as I can tell from talking to people.

Chassie (37:50)

It is. And it's a career that's too long for you to just do it for the paycheck, I think. I'm sure there are people in every specialty or every field in the whole world that can do it for the paycheck, but medicine is a tough job if you don't actually really like what you do and like your patients. And Yes. you I think as a patient, you probably want the doc that enjoys that specialty and enjoys that niche because, again, it's just a win win all around.

Scott Benner (38:20)

Matt, you feel that with what you do? Like, if people are amenable, the job's easier?

Matt (38:25)

Oh, without a doubt. Okay. Alright. Well, you wanna treat everybody the same, and you normally can. But, of course, you get attitude and you have, you know, demands and, you know, it kinda—you keep a happy face and you keep doing your job the best you can and don't wish any ill will. You just wanna help people in in our field move on to the next one because they're definitely lining up waiting to—

Scott Benner (38:49)

But that attitude stretches. That makes the day a little longer.

Matt (38:53)

Yeah. Yeah. Gotcha. Okay. I do wanna say with as far as education goes, I actually recently looked into becoming a diabetic. I'm going blank on the name of the title of the certificate is.

Scott Benner (39:05)

Like a diabetes educator?

Matt (39:06)

Educator. Yes. And when I looked into it and the time it takes and, obviously, type one is at the forefront of my mind. And I looked into the certificate, and it was gestational. It was type two. It was type one. And to me, I thought it's too much to try to be a specialist at all of them. I'd rather be a specialist at one of them. And I think type two has a pretty good handle right now, but I just I need to be an advocate the most I can for type one. I've joined all these research groups, and I do wanna give a shout out to my endo, doctor Gujdraw. I've referred, like, four or five people to her just because she is so amazing. And we even have to drive to get to her, and I tell people she's worth the drive. Yeah. Just because she came from an educational background and teaching background, and I was blown away by the care I received by her. And I'd never met her before in my life, and she had this plan written down and explained things to me in ways that I've never known. Because coming from a paramedic background, you learn really just diabetes, like, one form diabetes. You're like, high or low. Mhmm. From an emergency standpoint, if it's low, you bring it up. If it's high, you bring it down. Sure. And it's like, are they conscious? Are they unconscious? Do they have a gag reflex? Can you just give them something to eat? You have to start not being give them d 50. That was my background. And then getting into nursing, I took a bridge program that was paramedic to RN. And I I can't speak for all courses and all schools, but I don't remember anything diabetic related. And you hear DKA and just your acidosis and this and that, and and DKA is not really a a sugar issue. It's a fluid issue and electrolyte issue, which leads to arrhythmias, and that's where your death comes from. And one of the reasons I didn't go to the ER is not that Jesse didn't say, hey. Do you wanna go? It was all on me. But I wasn't vomiting. You know? I wasn't worried about ketones. I—I stay in a ketonic state right now because of the way I eat. Yeah. I try to stay as low as low carb as possible. And, you wanna make sure your potassium is right, your fluid's right, and I take multivitamins and I drink water. So I wasn't worried about DKA. I mean, no matter how high the sugar got, I think I kept myself out of it. But, that's just the specialties are—I'd rather be a master at one even though—and I am an ER nurse, and you do learn a little bit about everything. But I wish there was more training on on diabetes when you go through the, you know, the RN course. I think it's because they're specialties like endo and these diabetic educators that they don't really lean on it.

The Future of Diagnostics and Personal Impact

Scott Benner (41:57)

Do you guys wonder if diagnostic stuff is gonna go more towards a computer?

Matt (42:03)

I think it is. It may be beneficial, but it may not. Like you're saying, imaging was missed on your mother. I've seen it time and time again. When you have imaging done in the ER, it gets sent off to the radiology, and, normally, it's not read in house. And we wait for the radiology, or that's their specialty to come back and say, hey. You know, this is what I see. And I've seen—just in chassis, I've seen time and time again where she looks at an X-ray, she looks at a CT that has a a negative read by the radiologist, and she's like, there's something there. There's just something there. So I called back and say, you know, of course, as polite as possible, can you take a look at this? And, you know, this is what I think I see. This—this is your spectrum, but this is what I'm seeing. And they've said, oh, yes. And, actually, in my case, that actually happened with my CT with my bladder cancer. They came back as negative. And I'm so thankful that I had her just with this video of the ultrasound to say, no. There's—there's something here. Yeah. And the call was made back to that radiologist who was very apologetic and, you know, made an addendum to the CT read. And, of course, now there's something there after it was removed. So I—I could be pissed off, and that makes me think how many people have missed, you know, diagnoses. And, it—it's a—it's a sad state of medicine there.

Scott Benner (43:28)

The thing that happened with my mom is that what would happen is basically the mass would block her bladder. Her bladder would fill up. She'd be in pain. She'd go to the ER. They'd image her, say, oh, her bladder's full, and then say, this must be a UTI, and then, you know, drain her, and then everything's fine. Then she's okay again. She goes back, and this happened again and again. But every time it would happen, someone would say, her bladder's full, so we can't really see what's going on. Like—but nobody ever said, so maybe we should scan her after we do it again. That didn't happen. I had to be the one to say that on, like, the fourth visit. I finally said, why don't you get the urine out of her and then scan her? That's it. And somebody went, oh, okay. And then they did that. So, I mean, I don't know what I'm talking about. I had to see it three separate times before it occurred to me to say something about it. But they knew each time that the full bladder was a problem, but then nobody did anything about it. They just said it. Oh, that was a problem, and then moved on again. And I assume it's too many people, not enough resources, people are tired, probably have an—you know, less trained people because it's moving so quickly. I realize there's a lot of big issues. I mean, these things must happen over and over again. Like, wouldn't a trainable AI model who you're teaching if this, then that could then figure out, oh, by the way, drain the bladder first. Instead of asking humans to hold so much information in their head, like, if you couldn't just have it that way and be a little more directive for—not that you wanna take the human part out of it, but just as a reminder, because how are you supposed to remember? Like, you know, Chastity, you said about it a little while ago. Like, you can't be great at everything. Like, you know what I mean? Like, you know, emergency medicine. So wouldn't it be cool if a voice came from over your shoulder and said, hey. Don't forget this or look at this real quickly? I don't know. Maybe I'm wrong, but it feels like that's gonna happen.

Matt (45:17)

That would be great. I—I always tell people we're practicing medicine. We're practicing, and, one day, we get it right. Yeah. Yeah. Just to keep it a little light. Yeah. But I do know for diagnostics, like, if they're doing ultrasound in the bladder, they want the bladder full because they get a better, you know, view. Mhmm. And it sounds like her bladder being full was causing pressure, causing more pain, but they absolutely should have scanned, you know, before and after. It's just kinda follow the steps, and they—they should have gotten there without you saying that. But, you know, it's situational and—

Scott Benner (45:49)

If people jump to conclusions, old UTI. Right? Yes. Overweight type two. Like, instead of just doing the steps in between, they make a leap. And that leap, you know, maybe sometimes works out and sometimes doesn't. But I don't It's when it doesn't work out is when it's scary.

Chassie (46:08)

No. I—I'm so glad you brought that up, and that is a constant challenge probably in any field, but especially in medicine that you'll have a cognitive bias because your brain is trying to pull in all this information and make connections. You know, we're the human body. We are so much more intimately connected than we even realize. And you try to make associations like you said, old lady, UTI. I bet that's it. And it's a beautiful thing of the brain. It's amazing that we can take all of these random data points and put them all together and come up with this. Not even in medicine, just in life. You take all of these data points and make sense of them. You know? And it's so important, and it's so humbling to be in medicine to unwire your brain and to think outside of the box and to think, oh, no. No. No. No. Disassociate that. Let's don't think about that. What if it isn't that? What if it's this, or could it be this? And it's—it's definitely a humbling part of medicine that I think you work so hard to learn and make associations and train and—and—have keywords and think, oh, gosh. I bet it's this. And yet you have to be so diligent to make sure that you don't associate all of those things, that you keep taking a step back and taking a step back and taking a step back as you're trying to dive into your patient and better understand them. And that's one of the beauties and one of the most frustrating parts of medicine is making it make sense and then taking nothing and making that make sense as well. So it is. It's a humbling part. And I think to your point, that AI definitely has a place in medicine and the rest of the world. Just anything that could help you be a better physician, a better nurse, a better podcaster, you know, a better investor, anything like that to make the human world better is fantastic. And there's definitely a role in taking some of the cognitive load out of medicine with AI, and there is. Yeah.

Scott Benner (48:14)

When I first started making this podcast, I'd just be angry about it. Like, why didn't they know? How come they didn't? Like, that kind of thing. But the more I've done this for years and years and spoken to more and more doctors and people who are actually in that situation, my takeaway is just that—I mean, there's too much information for one person to process. And that's why we talk about specialty all the time because if you put somebody in a unique enough position, you can maybe make them enough of an expert where they're gonna see it most of the time. I would have been alright with that right up until a couple of years ago when I realized somebody could just take a large language model for endocrinology and train it on everything that human beings have ever known about it. And then you're at the point now you can talk to it. You could say, here are my symptoms, and it can point you in a direction. And then blend that with the human artistry of, I've seen this before or I've—you know, somebody said that to me one time, like, that kind of stuff. I just think that we're asking too much of people. And in a situation where if you make a mistake, somebody has a really significant—you know, from death to, you know, injury and pain or whatever. I just think that we've reached our limit for what we can do. And the information's out there. Why not let something who's got the ability to hold more ideas in their head and draw more connectors? Like, why not let it do it? It makes sense to me. So

Chassie (49:34)

I love that. And I'll even interject and say, that's a beautiful metaphor for emergency medicine that sometimes we've done all we can do. Like, you know, let's go to the specialist. Like, let's keep going. Like, let's keep going. Let's figure this out. Because, yeah, you do. You tap out in what you can do and what you wanna do. And I don't know. That really hit home with what you just said about feeling like in the emergency department, that you wanna do everything in the world and you wanna fix everything. And how do we take all that information and—and still keep going and take the next step?

Scott Benner (50:09)

Well, sometimes you just get to the end of your knowledge. You know? Like, everything that's gonna occur to me has occurred to me. You know? Maybe I can sleep on it or think about it, but that's gonna be too late for a person in the ER. Right? Like, and that job you guys have already talked about. It's tiring. Weird hours, weird shifts, people yelling at you. Like, it's not even—it's nowhere near a utopic situation where you could sit and think. Maybe I'm out of my mind, but it—it—this seems obvious to me. So we'll find out what's gonna happen, but it makes a ton of sense to me.

Chassie (50:39)

No. I love it. I don't think that any forward thinking physician that just wants the best for their patients or any forward thinking nurse that just wants the best for their patients, I don't see how we—none of us would not be asking for more help. You know? If it's a better outcome for the patient, that's kind of what we're all here for anyway.

Scott Benner (50:57)

Yeah. Right. Who cares how you get to it? Somebody's better off, they're better off.

Matt (51:00)

I do wonder how that would be looked at. Like, you said, you use an AI model and you felt like the doctor went back and read the same model. And if it was common knowledge that, hey. We're using computers or AI to come up with a game plan, Are they gonna say, oh, this idiot just went back and googled, you know, my symptoms? At what point does it become, hey. This is the way things are done or, hey. They just don't know what they're doing and they're—you know, I could have googled it.

Scott Benner (51:25)

Yeah. I think the answer is my kid's kids will be okay with it. It's a generational thing. You're gonna—Yeah. I'm sure. You're gonna have to live through it. You know what I mean? So but it doesn't mean that they'll be right. By the way, I didn't—I was kind of comforted by it, to be perfectly honest. Like, you know, I mean, this wasn't some great detailed thing that I was figuring out about Arden, but, like, I was able to take her symptoms and say to myself, like, I think it might be this, but I don't wanna jump to a conclusion. Let me ask the model. The model came back and said, well, it could be this, this, or this. It most likely is this. And that made the most sense to me. I did not mention it to the doctor. And then, like I said, she came back. It felt like she was reading me back the same list I had in my pocket. And And see—you know—

Chassie (52:08)

That's a great doctor right there. That tells me that, yes, I wasn't there, but I'm gonna have faith in my colleagues out there. And, yes, that means that we are all on the same page, that we are all getting good information in, and you're getting good information out.

Scott Benner (52:22)

I felt the same way. Like, I felt like she was older, but not old old. And I thought she's probably been doing this forever. And the same if this, then that ran through her brain. She started with that, and she came up with the idea. I—I thought it was awesome, but it also proves out that if a human knows the entire map to the diagnosis, then we can write it down one time, and then the model can go find it too. I see all the other reasons where people's egos would get hurt by this or, you know, people are gonna say, well, why would I be a doctor if I'm just gonna be a button pusher? And, like, I mean, I can see all the—there's a lot of possibilities for where it could go wrong. But I don't know. I just see it as potentially valuable and something somebody should be looking into. You know? Because you guys are terrific. You love your jobs, and, you know, it'd be great if you could have more, I don't know, bullets in the gun when you're doing it. Matt said something earlier. Made me think of this. Arden's friend is in nursing school right now, and she just called me in the middle of the day. And she said, hey. We just had our diabetes lecture and everything. And I was like, right. And she goes, we're done.

Scott Benner (53:23)

And I said, okay. She goes, well, I'm not gonna learn more about diabetes. And I said, okay. And she goes, I couldn't keep Arden alive with what they taught me today. Wow. But she only knew that because she grew up with Arden. Yeah. So she was stunned. She's like Wow. I've said this on the podcast a few times because I really want people to hear it. Like, she's like, well, what else didn't they tell me about? And now I know all the stuff they didn't tell me about, and it freaked her out. And I said, listen. If you really wanna be freaked out, wonder about all the other things you thought you learned front to back that you completely think you understand now. Not just that this was the one thing you had enough context for to call it out and go, wait a minute. That's not nearly enough information to understand type one diabetes. Yeah. And I told her, I was like, listen. You are being trained just like you guys were talking about. I told her the same thing. I said, you are being trained to, like, save somebody in a moment, like, to see the big picture stuff that's gonna end their life and slow that thing down. You're not learning everything about anything. And it's just—she's 21. It was interesting to see how it hit her. You know? Like, it was shocking to her a little bit.

Matt (54:24)

It's almost like you have to have some tie to that disease process to learn more and know more. Like, the type one, when I went into my endo, and I didn't know anything about basal. I had no clue. Like I said, I knew high. I knew low. I knew how to fix that.

Scott Benner (54:41)

Yeah.

Matt (54:41)

But she's explaining basal to me like a sink faucet just dripping, a slow drip throughout the day. And I was like, damn. And in one of your other podcasts, I don't remember which title, but talked about when you go to the ER, it's like, listen to your type one patient. They know better than anyone, and it's absolutely true. And I've even talked to coworkers who if you saw me throughout the day, I'm type one consumes me. It takes every bit of my mind, every minute of every day. And they see me at work. I've got my phone open looking at my CGM, my pump's beeping, you know, my times change, and it's a diabetic haven, the ERs, because there's—there's cookies and, you know, snacks. That's—that's how you make nursing staff happy is you feed them crap. And—and I don't eat anything. And then I'll eat—like, I do protein bars, protein chips, and I'll even—something I learned from one of your podcasts going, I'm not afraid of insulin by far. I—I love to see bold with insulin. I'm very aggressive with insulin. Mhmm. So I'll go low, and I'll dose for what I'm eating. And they're like, you're crazy. You know? Like, no. Because it's going to go up, and I'm—can't do the fight with the high low roller coaster. Yeah. I said, you don't understand how this feels, you know, as a type one. I said, it goes low, and I get a horrible stomach pain. Like, my legs start trembling, and I go high. I get hot, sweaty, and it's horrible. Like, I'm not fighting that, and I've learned how to handle this. But you have to have that tie, and now when I see people with—I'll see an Omnipod on somebody, and I get goosebumps. It's like patient's family.

Chassie (56:22)

Yeah.

Matt (56:22)

And it's emotional to me. Yeah. I—I went to discharge a a little boy the other day who wasn't even my patient, but it was at shift change. And his mother's sitting there, and I see an Omnipod on the back of her arm. And I, like, pointed at it and, like, immediately got goosebumps. And, it's just become a whole—it's my life. I don't wish them on anybody, but I—I wish everybody would be as—as tuned into it as I am. And I wish everybody could—could manage it like I do, but it's taking a huge, huge mental hit on me. Yeah. I feel—I'm getting emotional right now even talking about it.

Scott Benner (56:58)

No. I feel it, Matt. I'll tell you, I have very not similar, but similar feelings when I look at all the people in the Facebook group and the people that come on and talk about how they feel. You know, I've said before, like, I've been doing this a really long time. So when somebody comes on and says, you know, this thing you taught me is really saving me, I feel incredibly emotional because I don't just think about them feeling better today. Like, I think about their future and, you know, the things that they're avoiding and, you know, the possibility of, like, having their own kids one day or, you know, wherever life's gonna take them. And then you, you know, juxtapose that over the knowledge of, like, you know, even your coworkers you just said. Right? They think you're doing it wrong. They don't understand. I spoke with an endocrinologist recently in a private situation, and I was talking about, you know, how fat impacts blood sugar, and this person didn't know what I was talking about. I mean, they were an older person who'd been doing this probably the better part of thirty years. And they weren't telling me, oh, that's not a thing I teach. It's too advanced. They were saying, what's this now?

Scott Benner (58:01)

Like, you know, and I'm like, yeah. You know, you have a high enough fat meal, slows down your digestion, often unbalances the bolus, and then you're left with a carb hit later that there's no insulin for. And they were like, I don't know what you're saying. And that's a person who's, like, front lines talking to somebody. And this was a not a small institution. It's not like I was talking to somebody in the middle of nowhere. Like, you know? So what chance do people have really, you know, to get enough of an understanding to do a good job for themselves? And there's no one to blame. I feel like this conversation proves that out. Like, you can't blame the guy in the ER where you get diagnosed. You can't even blame the endocrinologist, you know, because there's no training there for them either. Like, you are literally at the—it's a coin flip. Like, do I get somebody who looked into this further on their own and understands it better, or did I not? And then that's the path you get to go on. No matter which endo you get, you're gonna believe them when they tell you something. So then maybe if you get given bad information and you have enough trouble in your life, you might dig in and look for yourself, But that's not how most people's minds work. Like, I've been talking about this a lot lately because somebody called me direct. They were like, Scott, you're very direct, and I didn't know what they were talking about. I was like, what do you mean I'm direct?

Scott Benner (59:17)

You say what you mean? I'm like, everybody says what they mean. They're like, no. They don't. No. Recently, I had a young girl tell me, like, she only stuck up for herself in a doctor's appointment because she thought that's what I would do. And she said, otherwise, she would have just taken what was said to her and just accepted it. And when that's the case, then it's coin flip after coin flip as to whether or not like, just imagine you're walking through the earth, and every time you come to a fork in the road, you gotta flip a coin. And then walk in that direction with all the confidence in the world that you're moving in the right direction right up until you find out you're not. How do you find out you're not? You have neuropathy. How do you find out you're not? Like, you could trigger finger. You know, your blood sugar is 40, and then it's 400 all day long. And then you're caught in a situation where you're now altered. Like, mind's altered, and you need to make a good decision without any direction or knowledge. I'm telling you that this is what happens to people. It's so important that on day one, they get put in the right direction. Like, we made that whole grand round series. It really is made for doctors so that they can get you going on the right foot. Because once you put somebody on the right path, it's not a coin flip anymore when you get to the next fork. There's somebody standing there waiting for you to say, oh, this is the right way to go. Go this way now. And that's how you end up well. It's actually not that difficult. But, you know, explaining it to people, getting it spread out across the world, like, I mean, that's the part that's kind of impossible. Like, I think I'm having some impact on it, but not nearly enough. You know?

Chassie (1:00:49)

Do you remember what I told you when I first met you? I've—you've meet a lot of people. You probably don't.

Scott Benner (1:00:54)

I remember where we were standing, but I don't remember what we talked about.

Chassie (1:00:58)

So what I said to you when I met you is I thanked you for all the work that you've done, and I told you that I know how to treat sick versus not sick. And if Matt were dying right now, I can save his life. If Matt was struggling or crashing or in DKA or having a heart attack or had limb ischemia, losing his leg, I know how to save him. I can treat him and make sure he stays with us another day. But being his wife and living by his side minute to minute, hour to hour with type one diabetes, I felt so clueless, so lost. And to be honest, I told you that it made me feel dumb. And I thanked you for showing me how to be a partner to Matt and live through this with him and keep him well so I never have to see him in those states where he actually needs me. And that's the beauty of what you do, Scott, is that this is the day to day living life when you're not there with your doctor. You're not there with your nurse. You're not there with your nutritionist. You're not with a pharmacist. It's all of these moments in between where your impact is so huge because now, day to day, when Matt's not with his medical team, he's doing great.

Scott Benner (1:02:42)

Yeah.

Chassie (1:02:43)

And that's all I want for him.

Scott Benner (1:02:45)

That's very kind, and thank you. That touches me to hear you say that.

Matt (1:02:49)

He jumped in right before me. I—I was gonna say that hope when I first met you, standing there all alone like a lost puppy dog, I had to come to you and talk to you. I hope I didn't come off like an idiot because I remember being just so thankful to you. And, it was really the first to get to you was my endocrinologist who first visit with her. She said, listen to this podcast. So luckily, I had—it seems to be the right people at the right time in my life that everything my whole life has been timing. And luckily, the timing's on the right side for me now. I thank you. I think I didn't even—don't even know how to truly thank you, but—and even at the time when I met you, I hadn't listened to, like, the—I forgot how it worded on the website, the, like, the dark—

Scott Benner (1:03:37)

After dark stuff?

Matt (1:03:38)

Yeah. After—after dark stuff. Yeah. I didn't even know about that because I had just been listening on, like, YouTube. I have no social media. Tracey's on the Facebook page. So I just do YouTube, and I went up to the website. I was like, oh my god. There's so much more. So I'm just constantly going through it. I'd be in the gym. I'm listening to everything, and it just led me just from the basics, I've listened to the Omnipod stuff and the Dexcom stuff and how to—like, Neobold, and I've realized that I used my version of Neobold and didn't realize it till you came out with that podcast. Mhmm. I was like, shit. That's what I'm doing. Yeah. And I realized that I've learned so much just picking everything up and then trial and error. It's just amazing. And I wish I could teach everything I know to other people, but it's—unfortunately, Arden was diagnosed, but you've helped so many people, including her.

Scott Benner (1:04:29)

I don't know. I think she's the last one I helped. I was listening to her argue with me last night about changing her pump, and I was like—I was like—I was like, you ought to listen to my podcast.

Matt (1:04:40)

Can still hear you saying, oh, she loves going to Moe's. And she loves their queso, but she gets some Tostitos too. And there's a little things that just stuck with me, and I forgot what it was. Do you—not gummy bears. I forgot what her sugar thing was.

Scott Benner (1:04:54)

Yeah. She's using gummy bears right now, but she's pretty sick of them. So now I'm just eating them.

Matt (1:05:00)

Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. I forgot what I have in my drawer now. I had some buy one, get one something little snacks, but I hardly ever need them. I'm so focused on it. My entire fear with diabetes was that one day, Chassis will find me on the floor, you know, unresponsive. And I think that's what kept me going and being so focused and a pain in her ass or a pain in everyone's ass because I'm—you know, like I said, it consumes me, but I don't wanna do that to her.

Scott Benner (1:05:31)

Oh, Matt, listen.

Matt (1:05:32)

Or anybody else, but—but her—her in particular.

Scott Benner (1:05:35)

Let me lighten this up for you. You've been very emotional and open. I feel like you were gonna have a great night tonight. I just wanna say that. I feel like she is like, oh, I did pick the right guy. This is awesome. Special night for you coming up, Matt. Make sure those little snacks are in the bedside table. Okay? Here we go. Here we go. You have no idea how hard we try to not be a patient. Well, no. But I—that fear you have, I mean, that's what motivated me when Arden was little. Like, I just did not want my daughter to be the kid that passed out at school. Like, that was Yeah. a lot of my initial motivation. You know what I mean? It's, just to try to avoid a problem for her. You know, I interviewed a woman the other day who helps people with diabetes. And I don't wanna give her details, but, like—because you guys will hear at some point. But my point is that I was listening to what she does, and I think she does a really good job at it. But her ability to reach people is one on one, or sometimes she'll go to, like, a a JDRF event, probably ends up talking to 40 people, which I think is amazing for those 40 people that are there. And I still don't think that I'm saying anything that a lot of other people out in the world aren't saying. I think that the thing I did was I just found a way to put a megaphone in front of it that other people have failed at doing.

Scott Benner (1:06:49)

And maybe they haven't tried or maybe it just hasn't worked out for whatever reason. My thought always was—and this started out as a competitive thing, but now talking more about, like, this idea of, like, spreading good information around, It's become more about that for me, obviously, over time. But it started out as competitive. Like, if I'm gonna make a podcast, I don't want 50 people to hear it. Like, I'm not wasting my time on that. Like, I want 5,000 people to hear it. I want 50,000 people to hear it. I want a 100,000 people to hear it. I have that kind of motivation. And so once I was able to build it up that big, now I'm like, okay. Now we're actually en masse. Like, look. Your endocrinologist said go listen to that podcast. You're in Orlando. I have an email that I answered two weeks ago from, like, Northern Canada where someone said, hey. I need a website where I can share your podcast easier with my patients. That's an endo there. And I looked this morning to see that the show was incredibly popular in New Zealand for some reason yesterday. And, like, that's the kind of stuff—I don't know. That's my—maybe I am more direct or aggressive or—I don't know. I don't honestly care. But what I'm saying is is that, like, it's nice to help a person. It's really nicer to help 10, and it's really cool to help a 100,000 of them. Like, that's how it's gonna spread around because then if you bump into a bad start at your physician's office, maybe you've got a real chance to get off of that coin flip path and onto a meaningful path sooner if the information is not just available. But, like, forget this podcast. This podcast, YouTube channels, any way people get information out, they're all stuck in and if a tree falls in the woods, does anybody hear its situation? There's probably somebody out there doing it better than me or understands it better than I do, but they're not as good as communicating it in this time in history. Like, that's the thing I'm really good at. And so, you know, I'm just hoping it reaches more people like you because listen to you. Like, you don't know Matt. Matt—if Matt was standing in front of you, he would give you the feeling that he could grab you by the side of your head and throw you if he wanted to. To hear him be vulnerable like this is strange because I've met him in person. And, like, you know, face to face, I wouldn't think of you, and this is me jumping to conclusions, obviously, but you wouldn't strike me as a kind of person who's running around with this fear inside of them. But if you are, then everybody is. You know what I mean?

Scott Benner (1:09:20)

So I don't know, man. Like, I'm glad the podcast helped you and that it's obviously making your relationship better, and I'm thrilled about that. But I just wanna make some more people hear it. Like, that's really what I'm trying to do. I I have a limited time on this planet, and I am trying to make it so that as many of you as possible don't suffer. That's really it. And, it all comes back and supports my daughter somehow. Yeah.

Matt (1:09:46)

Yeah. I don't care how anybody else does it. You're the guy.

Scott Benner (1:09:52)

But there's a lot of ways to do it, but I appreciate that. Thank

Matt (1:09:55)

But—but you don't have the ego. You're down to earth, but maybe because we're so, you know, open and forthcoming and honest that it just—you struck us as, you know, that—that you're it.

Scott Benner (1:10:05)

Now maybe what that tells you is that more people feel that way than you think because people pretend to be dainty or demure or, you know, like that kind of thing. But when you really start talking to them, more people have my attitude than don't. You know? Like, it maybe they don't have the nerve to say it out loud or stick up for themselves, but they have that feeling inside. Yep. You know? Like, a person who doesn't speak up still feels like they wish they could. I'll tell you that when I first started making the podcast, my wife was like, what's the tone you wanna strike? And I said, well, I mean, there's a lot I don't understand, so why don't I just be the avatar for the listener? And I'll come from the why—I—don't—understand—this perspective, somebody teach me. And that way you guys can feel more vulnerable and and let that information flow through. And, you know, it's just, I don't know. At this point now, it's a mix of everything. I can't dissect what this is anymore, to be perfectly honest with you.

Matt (1:10:57)

It's perfect. It's what everybody needed. That's what it is.

Scott Benner (1:11:00)

I appreciate that.

Chassie (1:11:00)

It is. It's—it's I'm telling you. It's great for the layperson, the medical person. I think that you are at a really interesting fork. We'll call it fork since you're talking about the coin flip. You're at that interesting fork where you can have the candid approach to diabetes, but you also have enough medical background and enough accurate knowledge to manage it too. And what a beautiful spot you're sitting at to be the candid, supportive dad, but to be so well informed that you can keep up with physicians and nurses and other medical professionals. And, again, say the things that all of us wanna say and maybe just don't communicate it from the patient side or just don't communicate it from the medical professional side. So enjoy that fork because you've taken it and you've shown amazing, amazing things

Scott Benner (1:11:52)

You're right.

Chassie (1:11:52)

to both sides of this. Yeah.

Scott Benner (1:11:53)

You're very nice. Listen. We're out of time, but let me ask you a question. Can I call this one Turkish Eye Lift or no?

Matt (1:12:00)

Because It's your podcast.

Scott Benner (1:12:03)

You can call it.

Scott Benner (1:12:06)

Also, you can—they get rid of these crow's feet for me? What does that cost?

Matt (1:12:09)

And I can tell you it's cheaper there if you wanna do it.

Scott Benner (1:12:13)

That's the place to go.

Matt (1:12:16)

I don't know about right now in the in this world, but it's the place to go.

Scott Benner (1:12:19)

Listen. I'm not leaving America right now. I don't I'm not looking to be judged outside of the country at the moment. So, you know, I'm I'm holding on. But travel plans have changed. Well, you guys are terrific. I wish you a ton of success. It sounds like you're obviously off to a really great start with all this. And, Matt, you know, I can't imagine what it's like living with that background noise of, like, you know, having to go check on cancer every six months or every year, but I hope you're able to not think about it day to day.

Matt (1:12:49)

Just become the way of life. I'm on the better end of it now. So and I've got a—the support system that I needed and never had before, and Chassis has been everything to me and almost as important as you are to me.

Scott Benner (1:13:02)

Almost, Chassis. You heard that?

Matt (1:13:04)

But she'll she'll get there. Yeah. She'll get there one day.

Scott Benner (1:13:06)

Yeah. Later tonight, she'll jump ahead of me in that race. I'm pretty sure. Yeah. So You guys are terrific. I'm so glad we were able to work this out so you could both be here. Thank you so much. I really appreciate it. Thanks so much. Thank you. Yep. Hold on one second. Okay? A huge thanks to US Med for sponsoring this episode of the Juice Box podcast.

Scott Benner (1:13:31)

Don't forget, usmed.com/juicebox. This is where we get our diabetes supplies from. You can as well. Use the link or call (888) 721-1514. Use the link or call the number, get your free benefits check so that you can start getting your diabetes supplies the way we do from US Med. The podcast you just enjoyed was sponsored by Tandem Diabetes Care. Learn more about Tandem's newest automated insulin delivery system, Tandem Mobi with Control IQ plus technology at tandemdiabetes.com/juicebox. There are links in the show notes and links at juiceboxpodcast.com. The podcast episode that you just enjoyed was sponsored by Eversense CGM. They make the Eversense three sixty five. That thing lasts a whole year. One insertion? Every year? Come on. You probably feel like I'm messing with you, but I'm not. Ever since cgm.com/juicebox. Thank you so much for listening. I'll be back very soon with another episode of the juice box podcast. If you're not already subscribed or following the podcast in your favorite audio app, like Spotify or Apple podcasts, please do that now. Seriously, just to hit follow or subscribe will really help the show. If you go a little further in Apple Podcasts and set it up so that it downloads all new episodes, I'll be your best friend. And if you leave a five star review, oh, I'll probably send you a Christmas card. Would you like a Christmas card? Have a podcast? Want it to sound fantastic? Wrong way recording.com.

READ FULL TRANSCRIPT

#1859 Weekends Left

Scott and Erika explore the psychology of wasted time, identity, and the real-world reach of diabetes advocacy.

Proudly supported by

Key Takeaways

• Mastering Diabetes Fundamentals: Practical insights like pre-bolusing, understanding insulin action, and making proactive dosing adjustments form the basis of effective everyday diabetes management.
• The Nature of Healthcare Communication: Healthcare tracking and medical metrics are deeply tied to human interactions; individuals require a safe space to work through their emotional reactions before practical advice can truly resonate.
• The Psychology of "Wasted Time": High-achieving caretakers and professionals often struggle with an internal tension between deep focus, self-imposed expectations, and the fear of underutilizing their limited time.
• Fulfillment Through Direct Feedback: Navigating digital creation or remote advocacy highlights the vital role that real-time, human-facing feedback loops play in maintaining long-term commitment and motivation.
• Mortality and Mid-Life Introspection: Reevaluating generational shifts, parenting dynamics, and personal metrics of societal impact is a natural psychological development phase when looking toward the future.

Resources Mentioned

• Juicebox Podcast Website: juiceboxpodcast.com
• Able Now: ablenow.com
• Medtronic Diabetes (MiniMed 780G System): medtronicdiabetes.com/juicebox
• Kontoor Next Gen Blood Glucose Meter: kontoornext.com/juicebox
• Erika Forsyth Therapy & Consultation: erikaforsyth.com
• Wrong Way Recording: wrongwayrecording.com

FULL EPISODE TRANSCRIPT

Introduction and Deep Thoughts on Wasted Time

Scott Benner (0:00)

Here we are back together again, friends, for another episode of the Juice Box podcast.

Scott Benner (0:15)

My diabetes pro tip series is about cutting through the clutter of diabetes management to give you the straightforward practical insights that truly make a difference.

Scott Benner (0:24)

This series is all about mastering the fundamentals, whether it's the basics of insulin, dosing adjustments, or everyday management strategies that will empower you to take control.

Scott Benner (0:34)

I'm joined by Jenny Smith, who is a diabetes educator with over thirty five years of personal experience, and we break down complex concepts into simple, actionable tips.

Scott Benner (0:44)

The diabetes pro tip series runs between episode one thousand and one thousand twenty five in your podcast player, or you can listen to it at juiceboxpodcast.com by going up into the menu.

Scott Benner (0:55)

Nothing you hear on the juice box podcast should be considered advice, medical or otherwise.

Scott Benner (1:00)

Always consult a physician before making any changes to your health care plan.

Scott Benner (1:05)

This episode is sponsored by Able Now, tax advantaged savings accounts for eligible individuals with disabilities.

Scott Benner (1:14)

If you or your child lives with diabetes, you may qualify for an ABLE account because of ongoing medical needs, and many people in the diabetes community do.

Scott Benner (1:22)

With ABLE Now, you can save for future expenses without affecting eligibility for certain disability benefits such as Medicaid.

Scott Benner (1:29)

Learn more and check your eligibility at ablenow.com. You spell that ablenow.com.

Scott Benner (1:39)

Today's episode is also sponsored by Medtronic Diabetes, who is making life with diabetes easier with the MiniMed seven eighty g system and their new sensor options, which include the Instinct sensor made by Abbott.

Scott Benner (1:54)

Would you like to unleash the full potential of the MiniMed seven eighty g system? You can do that at my link, medtronicdiabetes.com/juicebox.

Scott Benner (2:03)

The podcast is also sponsored today by Kontoor Next Gen blood glucose meter.

Scott Benner (2:09)

Learn more and get started today at kontoornext.com/juicebox. Oh, look at me. Erica's starting off laughing because I've said to her, let me tell you what I wanna talk about while you're being recorded and give you absolutely no preparation whatsoever. So, hey, Erica.

Scott Benner (2:27)

How are you?

Erika Forsyth (2:27)

That's right. Hi. I'm well. Awesome to see you.

Scott Benner (2:31)

Thank you. I woke up this morning around 5AM because I was warm. I'm very delicate, Eric. I I cannot sleep above a certain temperature. That's just so no.

Scott Benner (2:45)

I woke up because I was warm, and I don't know. I went and like, I noticed Arden's blood sugar was a little higher than I wanted it to be. So I walked into her room, pushed a couple of buttons, and I went back and got in bed. And before I could fall asleep, I started thinking about time. Before I knew it, I was writing what appears to be an essay at this point that I put online, and I kinda would like to go through it with you.

Scott Benner (3:11)

It's gotten 45, like, pretty thoughtful responses back from people already on my introspective day, and I think I can tie it together with, diabetes pretty well. So okay. Okay. So you can I and this is not therapy? Erika's not I'm not asking Erica for free for free therapy.

Scott Benner (3:32)

Also, it would not be right because she's not I'm not one of the states that she can help.

Erika Forsyth (3:36)

Well, that's right. And you're not my client.

Scott Benner (3:38)

Oh, there's a number of different reasons this would be wrong. I started off because this is a thing that happens to me kind of over and over again. I get bored pretty easily, and I have a kind of a a high drive to do things, and I work a lot. So very often, I do a lot of things behind the scenes for the podcast, and some pan out and some don't. But sometimes they're good, and I just don't have a way to deliver them to people.

Scott Benner (4:10)

And that ends up hitting me back as it feels like wasted time to me. And I know I bring this up a lot, but I really do feel like wasted time might be to me, it's, like, the biggest sin. So, anyway, I can I read you a little bit of this and then we can talk for a sec?

Erika Forsyth (4:27)

Wasted time is a—

Scott Benner (4:29)

It bothers me. So you. I said I get bored sometimes, but the boredom manifests as waste because I desperately hate wasted time. Every regret I have is about time. I don't mourn not doing something, but I do despise not having done it because then the opportunity to do so is lost.

Fulfillment, Purpose, and Algorithmic Limits

Scott Benner (4:48)

I am not a person who feels as if every moment has to be electric. I value quiet and stillness. But once the moment has passed, I think about what I can't retrieve, which is very often time. I said when this feeling strikes me, I never see it coming, and it often arrives after a massive amount of work that I put in or effort that doesn't quite bear the fruit that I envision. And lately, I've been working on creating alternative learning environments for type one, but eventually, met with the truth that most people will never know they exist.

Scott Benner (5:18)

And even if I find a way to introduce them, an even greater percentage won't spend the time to look. And I said, that cycle can sometimes make me feel useless, but not in the my life is worthless kind of way, but more in the I'm wasting time way. And then it hit me, like, should I do more speaking events? Should I create more social media that the algorithms will like better? Do I do live chats online?

Scott Benner (5:39)

Should I make more content? Should I come up with new ways to say things? And I honestly don't know. So I don't know. I started wondering if I'm wasting time and people's responses this is not this is not all I wrote, but I'm gonna stop here for a second.

Scott Benner (5:57)

People's responses were very they're lovely, but they want me to know what the podcast has done for them. And I keep thinking, it matters what it's done for them. Don't get me wrong. But if it doesn't do something for the next person or if you have an idea that helps people that you can't find a a wider venue for, then I get this feeling of, like, I could be doing something else. But not I don't wanna do it outside of this space.

Scott Benner (6:28)

Anyway, I'm I'm gonna if if you have thoughts, you can jump in. And Mhmm. And then if not, I'll keep reading. So you tell me what you wanna do.

Erika Forsyth (6:35)

So I would be curious to learn more about the the space between the quiet and stillness, which you value. And then when it starts to feel like that quiet and stillness feels like that it it transitions or turns into waste or, like, you're not you're not producing anything.

Scott Benner (7:03)

So I think that's a function of my I have a lot of expectation for myself. So I know I'm accomplishing something, but it's not as much as I feel like I could. Mhmm. And it's not because I don't even think it's because I'm not doing the thing. It's that the thing doesn't have a place to go afterwards.

Scott Benner (7:26)

Like, I almost feel like a person who would tell you, I'm a painter, but if nobody sees my paintings, then I'm not a painter. But I would be. Right? If I sat in my house and I painted and I didn't do anything else except hang it up or throw it away or whatever, I would have painted. I would have used my time in a way that I felt valuable, that I enjoyed.

Scott Benner (7:44)

And there's something that happens in the interim. I think it's because I think it's because I've seen the podcast work for so long that I know that for many people who it reaches, they all end up having a valuable outcome too, or it's very likely at least. Not reaching them used to make me feel like I was failing to reach them, but I don't feel that one anymore. Now I feel like not reaching them means I wasted the time to put the content together even though it's it's heard by a lot of people. That's that's my answer to that.

Erika Forsyth (8:28)

Not reaching them makes you feel like you wasted the time putting the content together. Okay. What what's interesting is I I have not seen or or read this. Was this on the the, Facebook group?

Scott Benner (8:41)

I put it up in the private group. And I think on my website.

Erika Forsyth (8:43)

I've not read it, but it's interesting that what you shared so far in a summary of the responses is that it seems like people are reading what you are posting and maybe thinking that you are seeking some sort of validation of how you have met their needs. Right? Like, that's but I and I hear that's not that's not the point of the post. Is that incorrect?

Scott Benner (9:07)

I it might be. Like, I don't I that's one of the scary things about putting, like, putting something like this out into the world. I do not mean it in a needy way, and I do not feel needy about it. But some people, after reading it, apply how they feel about how they're being valued in the world, and then you get that mirrored back to you. This is something I'm kind of accustomed to being like, working in kind of a one way medium like the way I do. Mhmm. So some people hear me and and don't understand what I'm saying or sometimes I'm not clear or sometimes they understand perfectly but take it in a different way than I feel.

Scott Benner (9:40)

I do not feel useless. I do not feel like I'm day to day, I I feel great. It feels like I'm wasting my time. It feels like I'm fixing your car and then you don't get to drive it. Does that make any sense? Mhmm. I'll read a little more. I said, I spend a fair amount of time reexamining the podcast for universal truths. I find them that I stop short of sharing because the methods at my disposal are designed to limit my reach. And that feeling leads me to wonder if I'm overvaluing my impact.

Scott Benner (10:11)

So there's two thoughts there. The first one is is that I can make I can make a good sandwich. I don't have shelf space at the grocery store. Right? So if Facebook won't serve a post or TikTok or Instagram or even the podcast, which is everything is throttled by somebody.

Scott Benner (10:29)

And I know that's a thing that some people think creators say when they're not successful. I know from talking to people in the industry that there's only so much the algorithm lets you have. It just really is kind of the way it is. Like, it'll stop you at some point. So if I put together a great tool or an episode and then it just I don't know.

Scott Benner (10:49)

Like, it it doesn't reach people on the mass that it could. Not even like, I'm not even saying, like, I'm not reaching the people. Like, they're connected to me already and I still can't get it to them. That part feels I don't know. That that that that I it's really hard to put that part into words.

Scott Benner (11:07)

But then the rest of it, the self confidence wavering sneaks into this is that I know how I think I impact people, and I know my intention to, but I do wonder if I'm actually having the impact that I think I am. Does that make sense? Right? Because it's easy to get confused when, the course of any day, a nurse practitioner from New York and Texas and Florida will send a note and say, hey. You know, do you have a QR code? We share this podcast so much in the office. Like, you know what I mean?

Scott Benner (11:40)

I wish I had a QR code. Oh, sure. I'll send it to them. And that makes it feel like everybody's listening. Mhmm. You know? But that's not everybody. And then somebody comes on the podcast, and they're, like, completely lost or unable to help themselves. And you think, well, how did that miss them? Or I had a guy on last week who's, like, 60 years old.

Scott Benner (12:00)

He just found the show a year ago and had, a massive change for him. But I've been doing this for twelve years. Like so that means if he hasn't been aware of it for eleven years, then there's somebody right now that isn't aware of it that might be eleven years from now if I keep making it. Mhmm. Right? Mhmm. Mhmm.

Scott Benner (12:23)

This is let me know when this gets self indulgent. So so I start to wonder if I'm actually doing anything valuable enough for it to be worth, and this is probably the rest of it. For it to be worth the 1,343 remaining weekends that the actuarial table says I have left.

Erika Forsyth (12:43)

Oh my gosh.

Analyzing Family, Trust, and Lifelong Impacts

Scott Benner (12:45)

I listen. I wrote this, but I'll say it to you. I've lived twenty nine thousand two hundred and nineteen days and four thousand one hundred and seventy four weekends, and there are just far fewer remaining. And I just don't wanna waste one of them doing something like this. And I work very diligently and long hours, but not in a way that makes me upset with my time.

Scott Benner (13:09)

But if you saw how most of my days go, I genuinely think you'd be horrified. Like, I work—cook, take out the trash, do the dishes, work, cook, work, sleep. Like, that is really how my life goes. And it's you know, my wife has a similar work ethic, so neither of us is, like, yelling at the other one to stop. And even if we did, you don't know us, but Right. It's stopping anyway.

Scott Benner (13:37)

So, you know, it's hard to do something that's valuable as reported back by the people you're doing it for and then not do it. Like, so when it comes to, like, should I watch a half hour sitcom or should I make this, I don't know, bolus estimator work better, well, then I sit and do that. Right? And then it works. And then you put it out there and you're stunned by, a, how many people are actually helped by it, but then, b, how few that number actually is.

Scott Benner (14:13)

And it just there's always that, like, thing that happens. The Kontoor Next Gen blood glucose meter is sponsoring this episode of the Juice Box podcast, and it's entirely possible that it is less expensive in cash than you're paying right now for your meter through your insurance company. That's right. If you go to my link, contournext.com/juicebox, you're gonna find links to Walmart, Amazon, Walgreens, CVS, Rite Aid, Kroger, and Meijer. You could be paying more right now through your insurance for your test strips and meter than you would pay through MyLink for the Contour Next Gen and Contour Next test strips in cash.

Scott Benner (14:58)

What am I saying? My link may be cheaper out of your pocket than you're paying right now even with your insurance. And I don't know what meter you have right now. I can't say that. But what I can say for sure is that the Kontoor Next Gen meter is accurate.

Scott Benner (15:14)

It is reliable, and it is the meter that we've been using for years. Kontoornext.com/juicebox. And if you already have a Kontoor meter and you're buying test strips, doing so through the juice box podcast link will help to support the show. As I told you earlier, Able Now is sponsoring this episode. Able Now, of course, tax advantaged Able accounts for eligible individuals with disabilities.

Scott Benner (15:38)

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Scott Benner (16:04)

Funds in an ABLE now account can be used for a wide range of everyday needs, including education, transportation, health care, assistive technology, and more. There's no enrollment fee, and you can open an Able Now account with a small initial contribution and build from there. Learn more and check your eligibility at ablenow.com. That's ablenow.com, ablenow.com. I'm gonna stop talking to him.

Erika Forsyth (16:31)

Yes. Yeah. So the themes that I am thinking about that probably most people consider in their their kind of work life balance are when where where do you find fulfillment, self worth that, you know, that value piece? Where do you feel, like, internally where you feel like I'm you're the value, self worth, fulfillment, those types of words, feelings. The other theme that's coming up as you're talking to me is, like, the sense of, like, powerlessness or feeling out of control. When you when you do feel like you're fulfilled and you're getting you feel like you're there's you're finding self worth in what you do. It is productive. It is helpful. But then what happens when there's that experience of powerlessness in the production and then the consumption?

Scott Benner (17:32)

Yeah. No. That's exactly right. It it it's exactly right. It made me start digging into, like like, where I see value in my life. Right? My existence. And I I kinda break it down between, like, family, the planet, and and what I do, like, professionally for everybody listening. It's interesting because as far as, like, a, you know, a global citizen, I think I do a pretty good job. I love just being around my family. Like, I don't have, like, dreams of, like, going out tonight or being silly. Like, I don't I don't I like people. I love people. I love groups. But if we're not talking about something important, I zone out really quickly and wanna leave.

Scott Benner (18:13)

I'm not excited to I wouldn't go to a bar, I guess, is my example. Right? Small talk. Social. Wanna make small talk. Like, I wanna sit down and, like, have, like, an actual conversation about something. Right or wrong. I'd like to hear somebody think about something and say what they think and hear what I think and bounce it back and forth a little bit.

Scott Benner (18:31)

I cannot waste because it always feels like wasted time. Like, always, always, always. And I don't feel like the work I'm doing if I just died down, like, ten minutes from now, if you were here to tell me, Scott, you have ten more minutes. Right? I would not, for a split second, feel like I wasted my life.

Scott Benner (18:49)

I would stand up, find my family, and just sit with them for nine minutes. Right? Like, I don't even wouldn't necessarily wanna say anything to them or do anything. I would just kinda wanna be there. And even when we have that kind of time, that is really the kind of time that like, you you know, like, my and my kids are getting older, and it's, you know, it's clear they're not gonna be around as much, you know, pretty soon.

Scott Benner (19:13)

And so you always I always think about, like, well, what am I not doing right now to maximize what the time is left? And then I realized I wouldn't do anything differently. Like, there's this thing that I feel like we all think, like, right, like, that you you philosophize that at the end of your life, you're gonna wish you did something more or wish you did something less. I don't have feelings like that. I'm very happy with how I interact with my family.

Scott Benner (19:38)

The only thing I would miss if I died is this, whatever this is. Like, you know, the time and the space and the being around each other or even just knowing that they're in the building Mhmm. Which is incredibly valuable. And you don't realize till your first one goes off to college, you do not realize that your house literally feels different with fewer people in it. It is not a thing that you can conceptualize until that person is gone for days at a time, and there is some sort of a hollowness in the air that I don't know how to explain. Right? If you said to me, well, what would we do differently, Scott, so that we don't feel like our time is wasted? My honest answer would be, I don't really wanna do anything differently. I'm happy with this. Like, this, I think, works well.

Scott Benner (20:23)

I talk to my kids. They know how I feel. I listen to how they feel. I'm aware of their goings ons, their concerns, and their troubles. They know about mine. We're honest with each other, you know, as much as people are, and I think that's good. Like, that's it. Am I doing enough with my time such that it can be considered not wasted when I cease to be here? The question is multifaceted, of course. How have I impacted those around me, the planet? Do I take lessons after I inevitably make a mistake? And then I I tell a little story about I said I once pulled out a chair from underneath of my mom. I did it on purpose. I was really young. And I remember her falling.

Scott Benner (21:01)

I remember exactly where we were. As a matter of fact, I could drive you to that place, walk into the room, and stand you where it happened because it was so horrifying. I believe it. Right? Mhmm. I remember how disappointed she was. I remember that she was hurt physically, and it felt like she was hurt spiritually. Like, she looked at me like, how did that like, how did he do that to me?

Scott Benner (21:21)

Mhmm. Really, she I don't even think she said anything. I just knew I I knew I fucked up as soon as it happened, and I don't think I—was like, feel that. I can feel it right now. If I was five or six years old, I would've, that that's it. Right? Mhmm. And so I never did it again. Like, I screwed up. I learned. I didn't do that again. But more importantly, I remember how she felt and how me doing that thing to her made me feel. So that taught me, like to me, it's trust. Right? Like, don't revoke her trust from you. Like, that's a that's an important thing. It's it's stuck with me. Right? So then I wondered, like, is my family better off for knowing me?

Scott Benner (21:59)

I think they are. Do I create a better space for people I intersect? I think I do. Have I told my children enough that they will do the same as they grow up? I think I have. So, again, I don't feel wasted. Nothing like that. I feel like the podcast and the people it's helping are a second opportunity. When I think about my parenting skills, I cut my teeth on my brothers, basically, to their you know, much to their, chagrin, and I've apologized to them already. But I was like, I basically got put in front of my brothers when I was 13, and somebody was like, here, you make sure they don't die until we get home. You know? I parent practiced on them, made a lot of mistakes. I started to parent Mhmm. My own kids, then started taking in my wife's, you know, input and blended that. And since we've blended that together, I feel really good about the kind of father I've been.

Scott Benner (22:51)

And now I feel like I really just take my my perspective on the world and just apply it to diabetes and then my ability to, like, conversate and just lay it over top of that. Like, I actually think of that as my job. Mhmm. And that is nice because you all will never go to college and leave me here by myself. So Yeah. So there there will always be new people to help, which seems really important to me probably because I'm adopted. Let's not get too deep. But, like, right, like, I've been abandoned a couple of time. I'm adopted. My adoptive parents got divorced. Like, I desperately don't want people to, like, leave. I used to think that was the thing I was gonna get past. I gotta be honest with you. I think it's just part of who I am. Like, I like people to be happy and fulfilled and doing as well as they can be doing.

Scott Benner (23:41)

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Erika Forsyth (24:51)

And that's that's also driving this question of kind of how much is enough, the wasted you know, what is wasted time and wanting to serve people and not missing, like, missing that opportunity is really— That's it. Twenty one minutes after you figured it out. That is it. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. So if I'm not if if I'm not helping as much as I could be, then I wonder if it lights up that feeling of, like, not that people are gonna leave, but that they're not gonna have the happiness that comes with—I don't know what happens when people are satisfied. And I'm talking about their physical health or their happiness or anything like that. Right. Right.

Quantifying the Reach of Diabetes Concepts

Scott Benner (25:34)

Really odd position. Like, this is a really new kind of job in the world. You know? Like, it is really strange that Mhmm. I I I bought a $500 microphone and taught myself how to use a couple of pieces of electronics in front of me. And now in any given month, a few 100,000 people hear what I say. Mhmm. It's a weird responsibility. Mhmm. And I feel like I'm doing a good job with it, like, as time goes forward.

Scott Benner (26:00)

There's no preparation like, as a person born in the seventies before the Internet, there's no preparation for, like, living this, like, life. Like, I am picking my way through it the entire—not that everybody's not, but, like, at least if you're born with a phone in your hand and your job involves a computer, it seems kind of like Mhmm. This whole thing still seems ridiculous to me. Patently ridiculous. Right. You know what I mean? Like, on some level, I'm like, how is this what's happening? How is my version of common sense? Because that's really all this is. Like, how is it is it striking so many people? I gotta be honest. Like, I expected to, like, do this and it not to work. You know what I mean? Like, I didn't think it was gonna really work. And then once it does, you're like, oh my god.

Scott Benner (26:44)

People react to this well. And then you think, okay. That's fine. It's nice. It's just entertainment until the first person tells you their story and it's, you know, and it's I was abused as a child, and I was thinking of taking my own life, and I couldn't manage my diabetes. And then you told me how to do it, and now I'm here and I—that's a lot. You you know what I mean? Like and then it happens once and you think, that's insane. And then it happens 10 times, and you're like, well, that's weird. And then it happens a 100 times and a thousand times and to the point where you have to remind yourself to be present with them when they're telling you because they start telling the story and you think, well, I've heard this already.

Scott Benner (27:27)

And there's almost a little voice inside you that goes, get to the part where I helped you and then we can stop recording right now. I don't actually feel that way, but, like, you you kind of know. And sometimes I lead people there because I think it's funny and sometimes I think it's gonna be helpful for people who are chewing. But even if they don't get to say it when they're recording, they tell me when the recording stops. Mhmm. Like, every time. And to know it's doing that and then how do you not find more people to give it to? Right. Does that make sense?

Erika Forsyth (27:56)

Because you yeah. Yeah. Because you get that you're having that feedback loop of the idea you have bold with insulin. Right? If we just didn't, like—we'll just use that to summarize. Right. And then that people have a positive experience. It helps them. You hear that story. So, of course—and then from your also your—the kind of your trauma and, like, that fear, but also desire to keep people satisfied is driving. It's what's driving you. You have—you have to assess your purpose and the drive. And then the tension is when you're not doing that and feeling like you're wasted time, does that circle back to kind of, like, the identity piece of who like, well, who am I? What am I doing? Where is my purpose?

Scott Benner (28:47)

I live, like, in a vacuum when I make this, and I work a lot. So even for all of you that go to work, it doesn't matter what job it is. Right? Like, I mean, Erica, you interact with people constantly, and you get to see them rise or fall. You have a completed feedback loop. Mhmm. There are people who hate my guts. Like, sometimes I hear from them too. Honestly Mhmm. That's valuable too. Mhmm. I've never once thought, oh, everybody loves this. Like, I think there's a certain—a certain person in a certain situation who jives well enough with how I talk and—and—and it ends up working. I'm sure there are plenty of people who hate me. Like—and I mean, like, fundamentally, I'm fine with that. Having the ability to, like, project your thoughts onto so many people without being able to see how it's touching each one of them is—is, like, a little crazy.

Scott Benner (29:33)

You have to keep trying to intellectualize it because—because I could—I could describe 25 different kinds of people that I've spoken to in the last twenty five days. Vastly different human beings who in the end or at some point in the conversation say, hey. This thing you're making really helps me. I feel like you know me pretty well. Like, I'll joke around a lot, but I do not have, a big ego about this. I don't—I—I don't think I have a lot of weird narcissistic tendencies around it. Like, I don't even—I'm not even really fueled by that part of it. Like, when they tell him like, you must—like, people must thank you. I mean, it's nice for a second, but, like, I don't walk around three inches taller afterwards for the rest of day finding other people to let know that I've helped other people. Like, it's Mhmm. It's not—do you know what I mean? Like, it's not like that. It's a little just—it's like a slow drip. It keeps me on the positive side. I think most of my days are good because I know I'm helping people. I'm not running around chest out being like, hey. Look at me. Look what I'm doing. Like, I don't feel that way. I—I—I had to go to the doctor.

Scott Benner (30:36)

My doctor's moving to Paris. Her husband got some great job, and I'm losing my doctor. Yeah. She's retiring and going to Paris. I tried to talk her into divorcing him and staying. She didn't wanna do it. Apparently, they're just gonna go and live their lives, and I have to figure out what to do about that. So I go to meet—I go to meet another doctor, and five seconds into it, he says, what do you do for a living? I was like, where? What is this about? Like, you're just my doctor, but okay. I go, I make a podcast, and I just wanna leave it at that. But he doesn't wanna leave it at that. Oh, how do you do that? It makes money? That's like a—like a real job, then all the questions start. And I answer all the questions. What's the podcast about? I tell him. He looks mortified for a second, like, thinking he missed that I have type one diabetes when he was, you know—Uh-huh. And I said, it's not me. It's my daughter. Blah blah. Like, going back and forth a little bit. He's like, I gotta leave the room. I'll be back in a few minutes. He clearly went out there and, like, researched me while he was out there. Because then he came back in and knew a bunch of stuff about the podcast, and I was like, it's all just very strange because I'm not really famous. I don't even know how to con—conceptually put that together. I mean, you've seen me in public with you. I'm famous in spaces, not for real.

Erika Forsyth (31:50)

In type—in type one space. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. We go to a type one space. I'm George Clooney. Was like, I'm—they're like, I remember you from Oceans 11. I'm like, I know. It's me. And, like—but then, like, I walk out the door. I tell that story all the time. Like, in that space, I can't walk from one side of the room to the next. I walk outside of the building and somebody run me right over their car and be like, oh, I just hit a guy with my car. Like, you know, like, it's very—it—even that's odd to some degree or another. Right. Right. You know? So, anyway, I'm gonna read you a little more because then this is the—this is where I kinda talked myself into believing I was doing a good job. So I said I—it's gonna sound weird to some people, but I asked a large language model that has been fed my podcast. I asked it. I just said, which phrases, specific diabetes care ideas have I personally coined or thought of? Like, stuff that's outside of the norm. And then it gave me back its answers. Then I googled those answers to see how they popped up in the world. And I found—first thing I found was just a person on Instagram trying to raise awareness around diabetes awareness month, I think, a year or two ago. And she said, have you ever heard these two terms, rage bolusing and crush it and catch it? And then she talked about, I did some research and rage bolusing seems to have been coined by a blogger named Curry Sparling. And crush it and catch it was coined by Scott from the Juice Box podcast. And then she went on to talk about how valuable, like, that idea that I set out loud has been in her life. And I thought, okay. Well, then I guess I—that—I mean, it got to her. Like, you know what I mean? Like, has to get to other people. And I—I looked a little more, and there were people, like you said earlier, like, said it kind of, like, offhandedly, but, like bold with insulin. And that's the thing that I said that people still say ten years later, like, I did—I did that. Okay? Yeah. And so I'm like, okay. I am having a positive influence. And then you have to try to extrapolate in your head, my reach is greater than I think it is. And can I just accept that and let that tell me on days when I'm not getting feedback that things are reaching people? Can I just believe that they are?

Erika Forsyth (34:04)

Can it be enough?

Scott Benner (34:05)

Can it be enough? Can I just let it be and stop thinking about it? And most days, yes. But I've been working on something for, like, the last week, like, head down eighteen hour days, and I got finished with it, and it's really good. And I thought, no one's gonna use this. Was like, I wasted all of my time. No one's gonna use this. And some people will, but not to the extent that I should have spent seventy five hours on it. Do—do you know what I mean? Like, I was like, it's not gonna get used like—

Erika Forsyth (34:34)

Then are do you get—are you frustrated with yourself for that?

Scott Benner (34:38)

No. Because that's what needed to be done for it to work as well as it works. Okay. Right? So I'm—and I'm happy it exists. I'm pissed more people aren't—and I'm literally mad that more people aren't going to get the benefit of it. Going back eight or nine years, I don't know if I've ever like, was offered—Mhmm. I—thinking thinking thinking. I was offered $3,000,000 for the podcast, like, eight or nine years ago. And I said, no. It's okay. I'm good. I was like, I can make that much money if I keep it going along enough, and I think it won't help as many people if you and your lawyers are involved in it. So I just wanna keep doing it like this. And then since then, I've been approached multiple times by companies that want to take the more valuable pieces of the podcast and turn it into—they wanna paywall it. They want to—they, you know, they wanna, turn it into a course that you have to pay for. SaaS is a word that gets thrown at me a lot. Software as—I don't even know what it means exactly.

Erika Forsyth (35:48)

I have no idea.

Scott Benner (35:48)

Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. But—but we could set up a SaaS, and you'll make $5 off every person that gets—blah blah blah. I get, like, stuff that I—and I always go, no. It's okay. I'm alright. I'm—I'm okay. And as you get older, you think, like, should I just maybe one time just take it? You know, like, maybe just cash out here a little bit, and then I could just sit back and not care and just keep doing it. I so badly don't want anybody to have to pay for anything. So then I think, like, can I create this other stuff I'm creating? Like, maybe I could just put that behind, like, a paywall, like, one—like, a website that does something or something like that. And then I go, I don't know how many people are gonna do it. You know what I mean? Couple 100 people are gonna give me $10 a month. What am gonna do? Take $3 off of people? Like, I'm not doing that. You—you know what I mean? Like, it just feels dirty. And then—but then I don't have an outlet. I almost wanna do it just so I have an outlet for my thing. Does that make sense?

Erika Forsyth (36:41)

Yeah. Yeah. It's— The—the desire to—well, you—you have this product that you believe in, and you—you—I just think, yeah. As a—thinking about it as a product helps me Yeah. maybe put words to it of, you know, listen. Take the pill, and it'll help you. I promise. Right? Like—but the product is the listening and the application and the internalization to make it work for you and your family. Right?

Scott Benner (37:08)

I think the other problem is that I'm the product too. It's not the—

Erika Forsyth (37:12)

words intellectual property.

Scott Benner (37:14)

But no. No. No. It's No. It's my translation of it, I think, is what works. Because I don't say anything that somebody else doesn't know. But yet, tens of thousands of people tell me, my god, you're the first person that's ever told me to pre bolus. I can't have been the first person that told them. I'm the first person that impacted them and, like, got through to them that they should do it and told them why and gave them, like, reasons and painted pictures with words and, like, that I'm not the first person that told them the bolus before they ate. Like—or maybe in some cases, I am. But because I've seen the information written down. Right? It's valuable the way it's written down. But how do you get somebody to read it? And then after they read it, how do you make sure that they understand it? And then if they don't quite understand it, like, do you get them to come back and look at—there's just—there's too many obstacles. It's why everybody wants to blame health care for everyone's not understanding their diabetes. It's not the health care's fault. It's a human problem. Like, it just is. It's like the person communicating to you and your ability to hear them and your ability to go back and forth. It's not that you don't have enough time for the doctor to tell you what to do. It's that that's not enough time to have an actual human interaction about it. It's enough time for somebody to say something at you. By the time you get done having your feelings about it, you're done already. And mostly your feelings are gonna be, hey. I'm trying my hardest. Don't pick on me. Leave me alone. This is hard. Like, all the, like, first line reaction stuff that happens. You don't ever get to the other part. So I—I make a place where people get together and talk about it long form so they have time to work through that first reaction and get to the part that helps them. I've told you before, like, anybody listening has probably heard me say before, like, the number of emails that I have that are like, you're an asshole are plentiful. And a lot of them are of a follow-up email from six months later that say, hey. I wrote you six months ago and told you you're an asshole. I really wanna apologize. I've realized that I was having a reaction. Something something something something, and I'm listening now. My a one c is going down. I just wanna let you know and thank you and blah blah blah. Like, that all—that tells me is that I don't think you can circumvent the way people learn or listen or feel, and this time is what it takes. So then the question becomes, like, can I ever stop doing it? Like, do you know what mean? Like, an obvious—I'm gonna have to. Look at me. I'm a wreck. It's almost over. Right?

Human Connections and the Longevity of Support

Scott Benner (39:46)

How much longer can I possibly keep myself upright? Oh my gosh. I don't know. Like, if I made this right until I died, I'd be happy. I have no problem with that. Mhmm. I don't wanna travel for the sake of traveling. I'm not looking to own anything. If you gave me a billion dollars right now, I would not buy a yacht. You—you know what I mean? Like, I wouldn't go buy—I—I—you know, I always say I wouldn't buy a yacht. I wouldn't buy a jet. I have to tell you, I might get a jet. But I don't wanna go to the airport. And if you give me a billion dollars, then I could probably afford it. But, like, you know, like, I don't have, like—like, even about, like, we've—you know, you asked me, like, where to—how do you wanna retire? What do you wanna do when you're retired? Like, I don't know. Like, I used to think it was a problem that I didn't know, but I think it means that I'm supposed to be here doing this right now. I'll figure that out when this isn't right anymore. Does that make sense?

Erika Forsyth (40:36)

Yes. But the—the fact that you're—you're even thinking about that and the—the wasted time question, it also is a natural part of where you are in your life stage. Like, you're not—you're not there yet. Right? But, like, it's a really norm—these are normal questions and wonderings and curiosities for where you are kind of—I mean, you're still—you're still quite young.

Scott Benner (40:59)

But this is when you start thinking about this stuff.

Erika Forsyth (41:01)

In that kind of pre—preretirement. Yeah. Mhmm.

Scott Benner (41:04)

I just hope this is funny to you. The next line of what I wrote says, before I go on, I thought it would amuse you to know that I'm beginning to think writing this was a waste of time. Yeah. And that's not a joke. I got into it and I started thinking, like, I do not need to be, like, picking through my stupid feelings Friday morning at 06:00 in the morning laying in bed trying to type quietly because Kelly's, like, snoozing hard still. And, like—and—and I'm, like, there tight. I got up. I left the room. I went and did it somewhere else so I could type more vigorously. And, plus I—I was in a weird angle, you know, in bed—in bed. It's gonna start hurting my elbow because I'm old. And—but—but I really did have the thought of, like, this is stupid. Like, even this feels like—but it's not that I think it's stupid to share it or that it's stupid to think it or write it down. I start thinking, how is this gonna help somebody? And if it's not, then what's the point of it? I'm even thinking about that now while I'm talking to you about it. Okay? Right. Right. As I—I—I said, and certainly after here, I—I said it—this is, at the very least, self indulgent and at its worst, about to appear boastful. And I said, so let me try to turn this ship in a direction that has some potential value for you. In 2018, about two years after I started Juice Box, I ran across a person online saying they were gonna be more bold with their insulin. It was the first time I ever felt like the podcast was reaching people. Today, people tell me the show has been valuable to them, but it can be difficult for me personally to quantify those messages. But today, as I mentioned, I looked around a little bit. I found a mother talking about nudging up a low blood sugar. That is not a word people used before I said it. A blogger, like I said to you earlier, was talking about the intention of crushing it and catching it. People say Bolton Vincent all the time. When you Google reference me about pre—when you Google pre bolus, it references my words, whether it references me or not. Their reference to tug of war at a mealtime around insulin pops up in Google searches around diabetes without attaching itself to me. I've seen references to stopping arrows using a blanket of insulin, a lot of other stuff out in the world. And I just told people, I'm like, please—I said, and still, and please don't read this as melancholy because I am not melancholy. I wonder what I am not doing that I could be doing. Not so much from—for—I said not for you so much, but for me so that I can stop feeling like I'm wasting time. And then the way I tried to bring it back to people is I said, if you wanna help me feel like my time is being spent valuably, take some of yours and learn about your diabetes in a way that gives you more—more health, more happiness, and more time. So even while I was writing this thing about me, I was two thirds of the way through it and I was like, if this can't be valuable to somebody, I'm not gonna post it anywhere. Mhmm. I'm not looking for people to tell me because I know what's gonna happen. I've been doing this a long time. Right? Like—and also even that, and I shouldn't say this out loud, even the people who are gonna come back to me to hold me up like a mother, I'll go back and answer them. I'll say, appreciate your time, like, the—your responding. I'll respond to everybody tonight. But I know in my mind that feeds the post, and it makes someone else who hasn't tried the podcast read it and think, oh, I wonder what these people are talking about. Even that is me trying to engineer finding other people to find information that will hopefully leave them happier and healthier. And then the other thing is weird, and you know me. I don't think of myself as the person I'm describing, but I clearly am. But it's not how I think of myself. Like, it's—it's how I think of myself when I do this, but you and I are doing right now or when I sit and write that. Yeah. But if you caught me offhandedly at a movie and asked me about me, I don't know that I'd ever mention any of this. That feels bipolar to me somehow. But I think it's got something to do with the disconnect of the fact that I don't have any human facing contact about what I do. I really think that might be the problem. Like, I've—no. I don't get it back. Like, do you know what I mean? Like, it—it—it's not the same to have somebody write it to you. Like, when you're at Friends for Life or you're at Touched by Type one or you do something like that or at a gas station. I've had people approach me in public. Like, do you know what I mean? Like, then you feel it. But there's so much time in the middle of those things happening that like, you know, eventually, I've been in this room for four months churning out content. And I don't—I don't even talk to anybody in a while. So much so that there are people in my life who will contact me and say, hey, today's episode, you should go listen to it. And I—I'll stop and listen. And it happened to me the other day, a gentleman from Canada who's blind. His name is Roger. There's so many valuable takeaways in his conversation. And I recorded it eight weeks ago, and as I was listening back to it, I didn't remember some of it. Like, it's like I was hearing it for the first time. Alright. I'm done. Sorry.

Erika Forsyth (46:13)

Well, no. I—I think what is interesting that's standing out too is separating, like, the dry—like, you have this drive and purpose to wanna help people. And as you're reading your post and thinking about the feedback and people thinking, oh, is this just you looking for validation and compliments? It's— Some people are gonna think that, but it's—you're wrong if you think that. Yeah. But the dry—the drive is how can I help more people because the helping is what— It keeps me—it keeps me motivated? Yeah. Like, I can—there's a number of things. I used to just use downloads, but then Apple changed their algorithm and everybody changes how their—their content, like, counting works. And then it wasn't—this is gonna sound strange probably, but it wasn't enough to motivate me. I guess, though, I don't gamble because I couldn't possibly risk enough to win enough for it to mean something. Like, I wouldn't—I would never gamble $10 to win 20. Like, do you know what mean? Like, I—I already have $20. I would never risk $10 over that. And so the amount I need to risk to win something that would actually hit me that hard, I would never risk in my entire life so I don't gamble. And so part of that answer is that if I can't keep building and winning big, then it doesn't feel like the slot paid off. And then I have to find that somewhere else to keep making the content. Not because making it's not valuable or I don't love hearing from people. Like, all that is true. It just gets really complicated because of—for reasons that I don't think I completely understand. Right. I—I don't believe I'm actually ever gonna completely understand. It'll probably take another generation of having jobs like mine until, like, it's something we can all put our finger on. But, like, I—you know, it's—it's hard and I don't—this is weird. You know? So then I'm just thinking if people are listening, they might be wondering or questioning. So if you can't—but the only way to kind of know that you're helping people is by feedback. Yeah. I—and I don't wanna ask them. And I don't wanna ask them for it. Yeah. Right. So then is it more about, like, the belief and kind of internal affirmation and validation that you could offer yourself that you are helping. It works until the competitive part of me catches up with me. And then the competitive—but—which, by the way, is how something like this gets accomplished. I've been making a diabetes podcast for twelve years. It—that's popular and—and exists in enough downloads to carry— Well, the idea is to drive. Feel like me. Like—like, you know, there are times where you look out into the world and see, like, crazy business people, and you realize, like, it takes that lunatic right there to get that accomplished. Right? Because most of us would be like—most people listening, probably sound crazy. Like, I work all night, like, all the time, like, constantly, to be honest. I'm gonna work. I'm gonna get up tomorrow morning on Saturday. I'm gonna work. I'm get—gonna up and write something. I'm gonna make social media for something. I'm gonna think about what I'm gonna talk to you about next time. Jenny and I are putting another series together about something. I'll do notes. I'll mine old content to find different ways to talk to you guys about, like, you know, simple ideas, just looking for word ways to reword them or looking for different delivery systems for them that are outside of social media because social media won't let me deliver it to you the way, you know, it wants. There's nothing sexy about the stuff I'm talking about, so most of the algorithms don't care about it. And I don't get up and think like, oh, what a waste of time. Like, I don't—I—I think it's awesome. I can't believe I'm lucky enough to do this. Seriously, like, it—what a stroke of luck. I've had, like, real jobs before. This is way better. This is way way way better. I haven't cut myself. I'm not dirty at the end of the day. I don't smell weird when it's over. It's a lot of value in this for me, and it does mean something to me. Yeah. It's almost like a receiving line can feel. If you've ever been through, like, at a wedding or a—or a funeral or something like that. Like, the last person to shake your hand at your mom's funeral is as devastated and trying to support you as the first person was. But by the time you get to the end, you just think, where's the end of this line at? You know? Like, I gotta get out of here because the messaging is only so varied. So I'm happy for you Yeah. when your a one c is better and your variability is lower and your eyesight improved. And like all the other things that get said to me, it's—it's not lost on me, and it's certainly not like—it's not small in any way. You are also not the first person to tell me that if you're telling me today. And by the way, here's the conundrum. Please don't stop telling me that because it's the only thing that keeps me going. So it's just a very—do you see what I'm saying? Yeah. Yeah. There's no, like, balance to it. It's like all or nothing constantly. And—and—and because it's spread out oddly, I get it when it's given to me. And most of my time is just spent sitting here. But the post today, you—I'm guessing you weren't thinking, I—I need a little hit of dopamine, and I need some affirmation. So I'm gonna make this post that may land as if I'm seeking that. But, really, it's a reflection of—right. Is that right? Yeah. I just woke up, and I started thinking about wasted time. Yeah. And I saw that number recently that—like, somebody's talked about how many weekends they had left. And I was like, oh god, how many weekends do I have left? And then I looked and then you realize the actuarial table, which by the way is incredibly accurate. It says I'm only gonna live for twenty, twenty six more years, something like that. Like, so what the hell? Like, that means I'm in the last third of my life. Right? And, you know, I see how people treat people in their sixties. It isn't with a ton of respect all the time. So, like, this is, like—is this my last decade to have an impact on the world? This is my last decade to have impact on my kids? My kids are gonna stop listening to me pretty soon. They're not gonna come back and ask until it's—till I'm too old to answer. That's when they're gonna realize I'm a valuable asset. So there's all that. My wife and I have been married thirty years. Clearly, one of us is gonna kill the other one with a pillow soon. It's gonna be me.

Erika Forsyth (52:46)

That's actually not true, but that's right.

Scott Benner (52:47)

I'm not losing, Erica. I'm gonna win. I—we joke all the time. Like, if one of us dies first, the other one is gonna first think I won. Like, did I—I outlasted that son of a bitch. Oh my gosh. I've been looking at, like, moving to a southerly state that we can't move to because my wife's job is here. And I'm even one of those people, like, I go, I think I should do that. That would definitely make me happy. It's not feasible. I just won't think about it again. That's it. Like, that's fine. I just won't think about that again. Maybe it'll work out in the future. Maybe I'll die in this house. I have no idea. I won't opine it. It won't make me crazy. That's it. Like, I'm—I'm very accepting of whatever's happening around me. I'm not a person who—I don't dream very big. The only thing I dream big about is finding more people that have diabetes to give them better outcomes as much as I possibly can. Mhmm. I even at this point think I've covered the part of, like, leaving something behind for my daughter that she can benefit from. I don't really think there's much more for me to do there. Maybe some pregnancy stuff for, you know, for older people. Like, that might, you know, be valuable for down the line. But—and also it's a job now, so I can't not do it. Mhmm. You know what I mean? And—and I don't have that feeling of, oh gosh, I wish I didn't have to do this. I don't feel like that at all. I actually like it a lot. I just had somebody ask me. It was one of my daughter's friends. She's like, do you really like making that podcast? And I was like, oh, you mean? I said, yeah. I really do. Why? And she goes, every day you have to talk to somebody? And I was like, yeah. She was, ugh. Just like—I could. She's like, I wouldn't wanna do that. I said, that's the best part of my day. I said that in front of my family, and I apologize to everybody. I said, you guys are the best part of my day. But, like, like, I—the part right your workday. Yeah. The best part of my workday is talking to somebody I've never met before. Always. Every day, I love it. As a matter of fact, I did not record yesterday and the day before on purpose to, like, prep my taxes and stuff like that. Mhmm. And after two days of not recording, I was like, ugh, I miss not recording with people. Like, so Mhmm. I tell you I like hearing their stories and that's true, but then I also told you that I can't remember their stories eight weeks later. I feel like I'm a repository for people's stories sometimes and that I don't remember them in detail as much as I remember them in feeling or vibe or something. And then I think that informs better the way I answer the next person, which then leaves the conversation more valuable for people who are listening in. Like, I think that's what I'm doing, but I don't even know that for sure. You know what I mean?

Erika Forsyth (55:34)

Well, it's a lot—it would be a lot of details to hold on to and could be also a response of your kind of nervous system in a protective way, because you do hold—you hear and hold a lot of pain and trauma as one would in a therapy space. And so I wonder too that you're—you're absorbing, you're recognizing patterns, you're remembering the feelings, and responding out of that. But the details— You gotta let go of for defensive—like, personal defensive reasons. Yeah. So I'm not overburdened with them at any point. Also, I've also learned that people listening to me have a cavalier attitude about horrible things actually helps them. Like, I get a lot of notes about that. I—I was so sure our lives were over till I heard Scott laughing about his daughter having a problem or, like, two people on the podcast jokingly talking about something that happened in the past that if it would happen to me right now, I would think was the end the world. Like, so even that is—it's not performative. I don't perform on the podcast. That's gotta be obvious to people, I would hope. If—and that's by the way, that's the other thing. Like, you can't control how people take you in. Mhmm. So there are people out there who fundamentally misunderstand me. I can't do anything about that. You know? And then there are people who get it. That's just—that's crazy. Like, that I do—have you any idea how many—how many people I talked to who I think, like, I should keep a list there in case my wife goes. This won't—this lady made a lot of sense. I have to look her up afterwards. Because you start having, like, really—like, it's almost like speed. I think I kinda do speed dating that's recorded, but about, like, a certain topic because I'm—I'm very careful not to know what we're talking about before we start. I really, really do not wanna know what we're gonna talk about before we start because I wanna be surprised by it. I wanna have a natural reaction to it, and I want the people listening to feel like they're learning this as we go to and not just hearing me regurgitate a question that I know is gonna end in a certain place. Mhmm. And I don't find that difficult. Like, I find that kind of invigorating. Do—do you—do you like that? I mean, people come in—you don't know what your day is gonna be. Right?

Erika Forsyth (57:48)

I don't unless, you know, I've gotten to know them over weeks or months. Do you find that comfortable or uncomfortable? I think once—I guess, it just probably depends on the—the—the situation and the—and the goal and the theme of the therapy. But I think that's part of the nature of the job. You know? You don't know—even if you're working towards a goal, someone might present in a way different mood and affect one week than they do the next, and that's—that's part of the nature of the job, and I guess I like that. Yeah. I do too. I—I—I love everything about what I do, to be perfectly honest. Mhmm. I don't like Apple Podcasts. They can go to hell. I don't like Facebook and that kind of stuff. But the rest of it, I really like. Anyway, I don't know. I hope people know I'm trying to help, and I hope it's valuable to them. And I think it is for most people, like, you know Mhmm. And then those who it's not valuable for, I would expect they would just put it down and move on and try to find something else that's valuable for them. I don't even feel—I'm not—I don't even feel like I'm letting anybody down, to be perfectly honest. I don't know. Like, I'm a very competitive person. And when I am not, like, winning at the rate that I expect to win at, it makes me feel like I'm wasting my time. So, anyway— And—and then not helping. Yeah. And—and then not helping. Mhmm. And then vicious circle. As it goes again. Mhmm. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Alright. Okay. Well, Erica, this is a lot about me. Erika Forsyth dot com if you felt like Erica could listen to your problems while you prattle on and—and offer a interjection that would be valuable to you. How do I finish with this? How do you know? How do we land this plane? I can take it. Do I sound like an asshole? Do I sound like—am I—do I come off as pompous or narcissistic or like—but I don't—I know how I feel. I don't know if that's how I seem. Well, I—I think since I'm—I'm not your therapist— Of course. —and I'm not your, you know, I've gotten to know you on and off screen, so to speak. Yeah. Right? And in person, and I know—I—I know you beyond what people might think how they know you. Mhmm. Right? So I could see people saying you are—you are narcissistic by even talking about yourself in this episode by posting and seeking validation, but I know what's underneath that is truly you are wanting to make sure that as many people hear and—and want to receive and integrate what you have to—to say about how to manage diabetes. Yeah. Like, that's your drive is—is to help and want people to feel successful with their lives. The drive isn't so that people can say, Scott, you're amazing. Yeah. But that's what I think what people often—yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. So that's, I guess, that's the feedback. Yeah. I appreciate it. I think that if that's how it appears to people, I—it would be odd if they were still listening an hour into this. But I would say to them that mine is a really weird position to be in. You should try it one time. I'm not being vulnerable. I actually am vulnerable. Right? Like, I wouldn't know how to do this. I'm not doing this thing in a way that I know will work. Like, this, I think it works because I only know how to do it like this. If you're gonna put yourself in this position, then these are the things you're gonna talk about to some degree or another because this is the situation. This is how I feel. You guys should know how I feel, you know, because I'm the one talking to you about other stuff too. So if you wanna know where I'm coming from, like, this is where I'm coming from mostly. Yeah. You know? Like—and so you can measure everything else I'm saying against this because when I am being silly or flippant, I'm—this is still who I am at my core even though I—as I said earlier, I don't know that this is how I would describe myself. Mhmm. But I just think that's how—I think it's just because I grew up in the seventies, to be perfectly honest with you. You—you know what I mean? Like, because I am—I am a sweet, kind, soulful person who really thinks about things way more than he should and—but not to the point of insanity. Erica will tell me a lot when we're done recording, "I love listening to you think about this stuff." Mhmm. Because not everybody sits and—and thinks about these things all the time. And it's—it's important to me to know that not only are we doing something, but it's valuable and it's being done for the right reasons. I am like a boy scout like that. Mhmm. But I would totally shoplift when I was a kid. I just want you to know. And—and—and—and there's part of me that, like—I mean, there's also a complete part of me that doesn't match any of that at all. Yeah. You—you know? But, like, this thing that I'm doing, this is me. You're getting the—when you're listening to the podcast, you're getting an odd mix of the best part of me and the most cynical part of me kinda blended together, and a lot of me is missing from this. And that's just a part of you. Yeah. Right? But that's what we or the audience, right, the listeners, the viewers, whatever— Whatever they are. —see and hear. But that's just a part of you, but it's—but it's public. Right? Wouldn't it? Yeah. But it's not the whole thing. It's not the whole thing. We are all made up of many, many parts. I don't even know that I could properly share all of who I am. I don't even know if I'd know how to do that. Like, if you told me to cut myself into a pie, I'm sure there's plenty of pieces of the pie I wouldn't be able to fill in and that I would—and if somebody came along and said, oh, you're like this, I'd be like, don't see that about me at all, but it's probably a 100% true. I'm just giving you the parts that I think lead to happier, healthier. Like, that—that's really all I'm trying to do. I just think I'm—like—again, I think I have a common sense way of thinking about stuff that people can understand, and it tends to translate well that way. Because certainly, you could figure out how to pre bolus on your own. And—and I'm also incredibly—I'm incredibly interested in how people think and why they think the way they do. Yeah. And that—that is a unique part of you that I think in—enables the podcast to be successful because you are thinking of those things, but also still really listening. Yeah. Why did— Why'd you say that? You're always thinking why. Yeah. Why'd you do that? Why did it occur to you that way? Why do you want that to happen? Like, that—the why is, like, it's so important. And, of course, like, you know, it probably take a Freudian, therapist ten minutes to figure out that I wanna know why my parents left me. Right? But, like, we're not gonna figure that out. They're dead. So, let's—let's try to figure out why you guys are making stupid silly mistakes and see if—see if you can fix them or if maybe I can. I wish for this to go on for a lot longer for a lot of reasons, but there's, like, part of me that just wants to be able to ten years from now go, hey, Erica. This is the last time you're ever gonna be on this podcast. And she'd tell me what you've noticed. Like, how did this grow? You know what I mean? Like, what do you think it did for people? And did I, you know, did I help it at all? Because it's—you know? Anyway, you're right. It's a weird thing to talk about. There are plenty of people who do not talk like this. I—I don't know if I ever said to you, but, like, recently, I've said it a bunch of the podcast. Somebody told me that I'm direct and that completely threw me for a loop. They're like, you're very direct. And I thought, no. I'm not. And then I realized to a lot of people, I'm well beyond direct. And I did—like, I just don't see the way I am as different than—than—I guess nobody else would either see themselves as different. But Mhmm. Apparently, I'm very direct, I guess. It's what they tell me. Anyway, guys, Erica's gotta go. Oh, gosh. It's late. Thank you very much. I really do appreciate your time. I know you didn't get to talk much, but thank you so much. No. It's all good. A huge thanks to today's sponsor, AbleNow. AbleNow offers tax advantaged able accounts for eligible individuals with disabilities. If you or your child lives with diabetes, you may qualify because of ongoing medical needs. With Able Now, you can save for a wide range of disability related expenses without affecting eligibility for certain disability benefits such as Medicaid. And thanks to recent federal law updates, more people are eligible than ever before. Learn more and check your eligibility at ablenow.com. You spell that ablenow.com. There's links in the show notes and links at juiceboxpodcast.com. I'd like to remind you again about the MiniMed seven eighty g automated insulin delivery system, which, of course, anticipates, adjusts, and corrects every five minutes twenty four seven. It works around the clock so you can focus on what matters. The juice box community knows the importance of using technology to simplify managing diabetes. To learn more about how you can spend less time and effort managing your diabetes, visit my link, medtronicdiabetes.com/juicebox. I'd like to thank the blood glucose meter that my daughter carries, the Kontoor Next Gen blood glucose meter. Learn more and get started today at kontoornext.com/juicebox. And don't forget, you may be paying more through your insurance right now for the meter you have than you would pay for the contour next gen in cash. There are links in the show notes of the audio app you're listening in right now and links at juiceboxpodcast.com to Kontoor and all of the sponsors. I can't thank you enough for listening. Please make sure you're subscribed or following in your audio app. I'll be back tomorrow with another episode of the juice box podcast. If you're looking for community around type one diabetes, check out the juice box podcast private Facebook group, juice box podcast, type one diabetes. But everybody is welcome. Type one, type two, gestational, loved ones, it doesn't matter to me. If you're impacted by diabetes and you're looking for support, comfort, or community, check out Juice Box podcast, type one diabetes on Facebook. Have a podcast? Want it to sound fantastic? Wrongwayrecording.com.

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#1857 Jersey Represent

Adult-diagnosed LADA veteran and breast cancer survivor Naomi shares how cancer reframed her relationship with diabetes numbers, her strategies for running, and a realistic take on cure timelines.

Proudly supported by

Key Takeaways

• Adult-Onset Misdiagnosis: Latent Autoimmune Diabetes in Adults (LADA) is frequently misdiagnosed as Type 2 diabetes initially, demonstrating the critical importance of autoantibody testing (like GAD) for older adults presenting with elevated glucose[cite: 3296, 3297, 3301].
• Empowered Self-Advocacy: Naomi stresses that patients must heavily research and actively advocate for their treatment plans, including pushing providers for insulin therapies when remaining at baseline elevations of 140–150 mg/dL[cite: 3289, 3290, 3292].
• T1D and Running Dynamics: Managing long-distance running requires adjusting for competitive environmental triggers like "foot-to-floor" syndrome, carrying fast-acting glucose infrastructure, and tracking shifting patterns where adrenaline spikes give way to late-run crashes[cite: 3496, 3502, 3510].
• A Shifting Horizon on Perfectionism: Facing a serious alternative health challenge, such as stage 1 breast cancer, can fundamentally reset care priorities, easing obsessive anxiety over singular blood sugar fluctuations[cite: 3393, 3397, 3474].
• Transplant Realities: While experimental clinical islet cell and stem cell protocols show monumental promise, structural delivery challenges, insurance roadblocks, and the need for regular anti-rejection infusions create a prolonged timeline to general availability[cite: 3937, 3954, 4007, 4010].

Resources Mentioned

• Omnipod 5 Automated Insulin Delivery System [cite: 3275, 3489]
• US Med Supplying Delivery Fulfillment [cite: 3278, 3447]
• Breakthrough T1D (Formerly JDRF) [cite: 3517, 3888]
• Juicebox Podcast (Small Sips & Bold Beginnings Series) [cite: 3264, 4104]
• Think Like a Pancreas by Gary Scheiner [cite: 3327]
• Healthy Kick Ass Lada (Community Reference Manual) [cite: 3327]

FULL EPISODE TRANSCRIPT

Introduction and LADA Misdiagnosis

Scott Benner (0:00) Friends, we're all back together for the next episode of the Juice Box podcast[cite: 3262]. Welcome[cite: 3262].

Naomi (0:15) Hi[cite: 3262]. My name is Naomi[cite: 3263]. I am from New Jersey, and I am a type one diabetic diagnosed in 2016 as an adult[cite: 3263]. One of those lotta people[cite: 3264].

Scott Benner (0:27) If you'd like to hear about diabetes management in easy to take in bits, check out the small sips[cite: 3264]. That's the series on the Juice Box podcast that listeners are talking about like it's a cheat code[cite: 3265]. These are perfect little bursts of clarity, one person said[cite: 3266]. I finally understood things I've heard a 100 times[cite: 3267]. Short, simple, and somehow exactly what I needed[cite: 3267].

Scott Benner (0:48) People say small sips feels like someone pulling up a chair, sliding a cup across the table, and giving you one clean idea at a time[cite: 3268]. Nothing overwhelming, no fire hose of information, just steady helpful nudges that actually stick[cite: 3269]. People listen in their car, on walks, or rather actually bolus ing anytime that they need a quick shot of perspective[cite: 3270]. And the reviews, they all say the same thing[cite: 3271]. Small sips makes diabetes make sense[cite: 3271]. Search for the Juice Box podcast, small sips, wherever you get audio[cite: 3272].

Scott Benner (1:20) Nothing you hear on the Juice Box podcast should be considered advice, medical or otherwise[cite: 3273]. Always consult physician before making any changes to your health care plan[cite: 3274]. A huge thanks to my longest sponsor, Omnipod[cite: 3275]. Check out the Omnipod five now with my link, omnipod.com/juicebox[cite: 3275]. You may be eligible for a free starter kit, a free Omnipod five starter kit at my link[cite: 3276]. Go check it out[cite: 3277]. Omnipod.com/juicebox[cite: 3277]. Terms and conditions apply[cite: 3277]. Full terms and conditions can be found at omnipod.com/juicebox[cite: 3278]. Today's episode is also sponsored by US Med[cite: 3278]. Usmed.com/juicebox or call (888) 721-1514[cite: 3279]. US Med is where my daughter gets her diabetes supplies from, and you could too[cite: 3279]. Use the link or number to get your free benefit check and get started today with US Med[cite: 3280].

Naomi (2:20) Hi[cite: 3281]. My name is Naomi[cite: 3281]. I am from New Jersey, and I am a type one diabetic diagnosed in 2016 as an adult[cite: 3281]. One of those lotta people that you hear about[cite: 3282].

Scott Benner (2:34) That you hear about[cite: 3282]. We hear we hear from a lotta people with lotta[cite: 3283]. You're almost up to a decade, or you hit it already[cite: 3284]?

Naomi (2:40) Yes[cite: 3284]. So I'm almost coming up to a decade this summer[cite: 3285]. Wow[cite: 3285]. I didn't need insulin originally when I was first diagnosed[cite: 3286]. My my sugars were, you know, pretty pretty well controlled with low carb and exercise[cite: 3287]. And, gradually, you know, as the years went on by year five, I was realizing that my my glucose numbers were creeping up, you know, even despite a low carb, high exercise diet and and a diet of exercise as well[cite: 3288]. But at that point, I really had to push my endocrinologist for insulin[cite: 3289]. I felt as though, you know, all of the research that I had done and everything that I had read, you know, told me that being at one forty, one fifty all the time, like, wasn't really normal[cite: 3290]. I know it's, you know, within range for many people, but I knew at that point, you know, well, maybe somebody should be offering me insulin at this point, but it wasn't happening[cite: 3291]. So I I just pushed for it and advocated for it[cite: 3292]. And every time I went said, you know, I think it's time[cite: 3293]. I think it's time[cite: 3293]. I wanna try it[cite: 3294]. I think I'll be okay with it[cite: 3294]. And that that got me down to, you know, more reasonable range with fasting numbers and things like that[cite: 3295].

Scott Benner (3:50) So question[cite: 3295]. When you were diagnosed originally, they told you you were type two[cite: 3296]?

Naomi (3:56) Yes[cite: 3296]. Originally, I was diagnosed at first by my regular GP[cite: 3297]. He noticed that my sugar was high, one time when I went just for an average visit[cite: 3298]. I had no symptoms, felt nothing, wasn't drinking excessively, wasn't going to the bathroom a lot like you hear with a lot of other people[cite: 3299]. I'm gonna send out your blood for this antibody auto antibody test to just see if you have the antibodies for type one diabetes[cite: 3300]. I was positive for just the GAD one, but he wasn't sure[cite: 3301]. He said it was, like, borderline and potentially I could have been type two[cite: 3302]. He referred me to an endocrinologist[cite: 3303]. And I'm still with that endocrinologist today, and I really do like her a lot[cite: 3303]. But she was kind of of the school, it doesn't really matter if you're type one or type two, we're just gonna watch your numbers[cite: 3304]. And I thought that was a little you know, odd[cite: 3305]. I thought, you know, well, no[cite: 3305]. Shouldn't we know because I may eventually need insulin if I am a type one[cite: 3306]?

Scott Benner (4:51) Also, what the heck[cite: 3306]? Right[cite: 3307]? Why don't we know for sure[cite: 3307]?

Naomi (4:54) Yeah[cite: 3307]. I just like to know[cite: 3308]. I mean, I'm the type[cite: 3308]. I like to know everything about everything[cite: 3308]. I research everything[cite: 3308]. I read everything[cite: 3309]. So...

Managing Hypothyroidism and Breast Cancer

Scott Benner (5:00) Oh, Amy, I don't think you need to be the type to wanna know that[cite: 3309]. That one's that one's pretty easy[cite: 3310]. So you I heard you stumble when you said I'm still with her[cite: 3310]. Is that the, like do you feel like I'm about to judge you for not finding a doctor who didn't misdiagnose you for five years[cite: 3311]?

Naomi (5:15) I'm not I'm not so much worried about you judging me[cite: 3312]. I'm I'm worried about my own judgment of myself sometimes that I that I stick with her[cite: 3313]. I really do like her, and she's been helpful, you know, throughout the years[cite: 3314]. And, you know, I just realized that the relationship is more of, me doing the research and me advocating for myself rather than[cite: 3315]...

Scott Benner (5:35) And her having access to a prescription pad[cite: 3315]?

Naomi (5:38) Yes[cite: 3316]. And sometimes I feel yeah[cite: 3316]. Like, not that I know more than the endocrinologist, but I know a lot at this point[cite: 3316]. You know, obviously, as a type one diabetic, you educate yourself, and you're your own best advocate[cite: 3317]. So...

Scott Benner (5:50) Yeah[cite: 3317].

Naomi (5:50) I always go in there prepared with, well, what about this[cite: 3318]? And let's try this[cite: 3319]. And what about this research[cite: 3319]? And you know[cite: 3319]?

Scott Benner (5:56) Well, how old were you at the original diagnosis with the GP[cite: 3320]?

Naomi (6:00) I was 47[cite: 3321].

Scott Benner (6:03) So 47 years old[cite: 3321]. You went to the doctor just because you were going[cite: 3321]?

Naomi (6:06) It was my regular yearly physical[cite: 3322].

Scott Benner (6:08) Okay[cite: 3322]. You showed up that day being like, I'm 47[cite: 3323]. I'm doing great[cite: 3323]. I have no complaints[cite: 3323]. And you left that office an hour later going, I have diabetes[cite: 3324]?

Naomi (6:17) No[cite: 3325]. It was not an hour later[cite: 3325]. He said my sugar was high and, you know, we'll send we'll do this other blood work and we'll send it out[cite: 3325]. So it wasn't until, a couple weeks later that he called and I was I remember, you know, I remember the call exactly[cite: 3326]. I was in a hotel room at, like, my son's college orientation[cite: 3327]. And he he said, you know, I think that you have diabetes because you've borderline for this antibody[cite: 3328].

Scott Benner (6:40) Your sugar's been elevated to [cite: 3328]

Naomi (6:42) a one c[cite: 3329]. So it was kind of a shock because, you know, I was, you know, very good health[cite: 3330]. And...

Scott Benner (6:47) Fair to say you left that appointment[cite: 3331]. He said we're gonna send some blood out[cite: 3331]. You didn't think about it again[cite: 3332]. You didn't think someone's [cite: 3332]

Naomi (6:52) gonna in a million years would I have suspected I had diabetes[cite: 3332]. Now I had just come off of this you know, subsequently to the diagnosis, I had read that it could be triggered by a virus or an infection of some sort[cite: 3333]. So I had just come off a very, very bad infection for which I was hospitalized[cite: 3334]. So in my my endocrinologist didn't think necessarily there was that correlation, but in the back of my mind, I thought, oh, maybe that's what did trigger it[cite: 3335].

Scott Benner (7:18) So you've obviously done a lot of picking around since then[cite: 3336]. And so hindsight, is there other autoimmune stuff in your extended family[cite: 3336]?

Naomi (7:26) Not in my extended family at all[cite: 3337]. No[cite: 3338]. I I have thyroid issue[cite: 3338]. You know, I'm on I have is it hypothyroidism[cite: 3338]?

Scott Benner (7:34) Hypo[cite: 3339]. Yeah[cite: 3339].

Naomi (7:35) Yes[cite: 3339]. So I'm hypothyroidism[cite: 3339]. My dad was a type two diabetic, but that was really, I believe, diet related, and he was overweight and all of that[cite: 3340]. But no one in my family that I know of was a type one diabetic or had any autoimmune issues[cite: 3341]. So it's it was such a shock[cite: 3342]. You know[cite: 3342]?

Scott Benner (7:52) No[cite: 3342]. No[cite: 3342]. No[cite: 3342]. I hear you[cite: 3342]. How long had you had the the hypothyroidism diagnosis[cite: 3343]?

Naomi (7:58) That I've had for about twenty years[cite: 3343].

Scott Benner (8:00) You're gonna say that's longer[cite: 3344]. Right[cite: 3344]?

Naomi (8:02) Mhmm[cite: 3344].

Scott Benner (8:02) Yeah[cite: 3344]. Yeah[cite: 3344]. Yeah[cite: 3344]. And nobody else in your family has that[cite: 3345]? No[cite: 3345]. Just lucky[cite: 3345].

Naomi (8:07) To my knowledge, unless, you know, with my grandparents, you don't know[cite: 3346]. They're not here anymore[cite: 3346]. You know, I can't ask them[cite: 3347]. But Yeah[cite: 3347]. But it wasn't something that I was aware of or that my parents talked about my grandparents having[cite: 3348].

Anxiety and Perfectionism

Scott Benner (8:17) Gotcha[cite: 3349]. Okay[cite: 3349]. Have you all you described yourself in your note as a perfectionist[cite: 3349]?

Naomi (8:25) Yes[cite: 3349].

Scott Benner (8:25) Has that always been the case[cite: 3350]?

Naomi (8:28) You know, I've always been a little bit of sort of an overachiever and, you know, wanting everything to be perfect and in place and organized and me being on top of everything[cite: 3350]. And, that is a tough sell with diabetes because it's hard to be a perfectionist with diabetes because you can't be perfect[cite: 3351]. Yeah[cite: 3352]. So that that's tough[cite: 3352]. So in the in the beginning and and even to this day, I say, you know, I'm not as obsessive about my numbers, but I kind of really still am a little bit, and I check my my phone much more often than I think is probably healthy[cite: 3352].

Naomi (9:04) Mhmm[cite: 3353]. I'm trying to get my mindset more to the place of, you know, yes[cite: 3353]. I wanna have good numbers and be in range all the time, but at the same time, I also don't want to take years off my life by stressing about the numbers and worrying about the diabetes and checking my numbers so frequently[cite: 3354].

Scott Benner (9:19) That kind of personality trait[cite: 3355]. Entire life as a child and a teen in high school too[cite: 3355]? Or more as in your twenties[cite: 3356]?

Naomi (9:28) At that time, I I felt that there was less to obsess about or control[cite: 3356]. Like, I didn't have control issues when I was growing up or anything like that or wanting to be in control all the time[cite: 3357]. But with the diabetes, I feel as though it almost got worse because you had this number and you have the technology where you can look at it all the time and you can manage it all the time and you can micromanage it, you know, with microdosing[cite: 3358]. And, you know, so I'm sort of in that place where I I am very on top of it[cite: 3359].

Scott Benner (9:58) Yeah[cite: 3360]. Let be a little less obtuse[cite: 3360]. Okay[cite: 3360]?

Naomi (10:00) K[cite: 3361].

Scott Benner (10:01) Do you have anxiety, and did it start when your thyroid diagnosis came[cite: 3361]?

Naomi (10:07) No[cite: 3362]. I I will say right now, no[cite: 3362]. I do not have anxiety[cite: 3362]. I have struggled with anxiety in the past, and I've been in therapy for that and everything, but not in a not in a very long time[cite: 3363]. But I think it has crept back up with the diabetes[cite: 3364].

Naomi (10:24) I don't think of myself as an anxious person[cite: 3365]. I think of it as more of, you know, I wanna be in in control of my diabetes[cite: 3366]. I wanna control it rather than have it control me[cite: 3367].

Scott Benner (10:34) Yeah[cite: 3367]. Yeah[cite: 3367]. Yeah[cite: 3367]. I also wanna tell people who are listening around the country and around the world that you talk faster[cite: 3368]. You probably seem anxious to them, but you're just from Jersey[cite: 3369].

Scott Benner (10:43) So...

Naomi (10:44) I'm from I'm from New York originally[cite: 3370].

Scott Benner (10:45) I I just...

Naomi (10:46) talk very fast, so I will try to slow that down[cite: 3371].

Scott Benner (10:48) No[cite: 3372]. No[cite: 3372]. You're doing fine[cite: 3372]. I'm I'm slowing myself down so the two of us aren't doing it together[cite: 3372]. Okay[cite: 3373]. Because I you and I are probably very close to each other, physically[cite: 3373]. Mhmm[cite: 3373]. Yeah[cite: 3374]. Yeah[cite: 3374]. So, if I get going, you and I'll just be going at a speed that no one else will be able to listen to[cite: 3374].

Scott Benner (11:04) So...

Naomi (11:04) Yes[cite: 3375]. And and I especially find I talk faster when I am very interested in the topic, and I'm very invested in the topic[cite: 3375]. I tend to get a little more excited about it[cite: 3376].

Scott Benner (11:15) Yeah[cite: 3376]. Sure[cite: 3376]. Hey[cite: 3376]. Listen[cite: 3376]. It took me it took me the better part of, like, six years making this podcast to learn how to slow myself down[cite: 3377].

Scott Benner (11:20) So...

Naomi (11:20) Wow[cite: 3378].

Scott Benner (11:21) So what I was gonna say is that, like, anxiety can be a side effect of, like, a mistreated thyroid[cite: 3378]. And so my last question about your thyroid is is do you know where your TSH level sits[cite: 3379]?

Naomi (11:32) I have it in my blood work[cite: 3380]. I don't know it off the top of my head, but I'm doing fine according to my endocrinologist[cite: 3380]. I am on medication for it, but I'm not it's not anything where she's had to adjust my medication because I'm too high or too low[cite: 3381]. I'm I'm within the normal range[cite: 3382]. I do know that[cite: 3382].

Scott Benner (11:48) I bring this up because the normal range is pretty wide and a really a well thought out endo around thyroid will will manage your TSH under a 2.1[cite: 3383]. So do you have any other hypothyroid symptoms[cite: 3384]? Are you tired a lot, can't get rested, hair falls out, brittle nails[cite: 3384]? I'm trying to think anything like that, fatigue[cite: 3385].

Naomi (12:09) You know, I I have some of that, but that's due to my my breast cancer diagnosis[cite: 3385].

Scott Benner (12:17) Yeah[cite: 3386]. Well, listen[cite: 3386]. I I'm not a doctor[cite: 3386]. What I'm gonna tell you is if you dig around in that blood work at some point and realize that your TSH is, like, three and a half and she's telling you it's good, then then[cite: 3387]...

Naomi (12:28) No[cite: 3387]. I just found it[cite: 3387]. I pulled it up in my you know, in the Apple Health app, you can, if you connect it to all of your health apps in your MyCharts, you can just punch in TSH in the search bar, and it it just came up[cite: 3388]. So I am 1.3[cite: 3389].

Scott Benner (12:42) Oh, that's beautiful[cite: 3389]. Okay[cite: 3389]. Good[cite: 3389]. You are a perfectionist[cite: 3389]. You have your health app attached to your look at you[cite: 3390]. You're proving you're proving yourself right the whole way[cite: 3391].

Naomi (12:49) I didn't do that myself[cite: 3391]. My son had to set that up for me[cite: 3392]. So...

Cancer Realities and Shifting Perceptions

Scott Benner (12:52) Tell me about the cancer[cite: 3392].

Naomi (12:54) Okay[cite: 3393]. So I was diagnosed with the breast cancer last summer[cite: 3393]. Also, you know, another shock because I think of myself as such a healthy person, but, you know, it can happen[cite: 3394]. It happens to one in eight women[cite: 3395]. So, again, regular mammogram[cite: 3395]. I didn't feel anything[cite: 3395]. It wasn't the mammogram that picked it up[cite: 3396]. It was the ultrasound that picked it up[cite: 3396]. They did a biopsy[cite: 3397]. I luckily, I was stage one[cite: 3397]. It had not spread to my lymph nodes, so so I am very lucky[cite: 3398].

Naomi (13:20) However, anyone with breast cancer knows you they send your tumor out when they do the surgery[cite: 3399]. They send it out to some lab in California, they do something called an Oncotype DX score[cite: 3400]. And that is, a score that tells you whether or not you will benefit from chemotherapy[cite: 3401]. My score came back very high, so they did recommend chemotherapy[cite: 3402]. So I did go through the whole treatment process of chemotherapy and radiation, and, I finished radiation in February[cite: 3403].

Scott Benner (13:52) Congratulations[cite: 3404].

Naomi (13:54) Thank you[cite: 3404]. Thank you[cite: 3404]. So and now I'm just on the, aromatase inhibitor, which is supposed to tamp down your estrogen[cite: 3404]. I had the type of breast cancer ER positive[cite: 3405]. My cancer grew in estrogen, so they tried to block that as much as possible going forward[cite: 3406]. And and I think that does cause some you know, that causes some fatigue and all that[cite: 3407]. Also, just basically what my body has been through, you know, over the last, you know, eight months or so[cite: 3408].

Scott Benner (14:19) Two things[cite: 3419]. First of all, my anxiety grows and estrogen comes from my wish and my daughter[cite: 3409].

Naomi (14:23) That'll do it[cite: 3410].

Scott Benner (14:26) Yeah[cite: 3411]. Yeah[cite: 3411]. Yeah[cite: 3411]. And the the second thing is you said something offhandedly a second ago that I wanna double back to[cite: 3411]. You know, I think of myself as a healthy person[cite: 3412]. And I think I'd like to point out to people that just because your your thyroid went kablooey and so did your pancreas, and and you had breast cancer, I don't know that that doesn't mean you're not a healthy person[cite: 3413, 3414]. Like, I wonder what everyone's expectation is about the process of life to death and what's supposed to, like, quotes, finger quotes, supposed to happen to you through that entire process[cite: 3415]. I think about that because I'm 54[cite: 3416]. So what am I? I'm a little older than you[cite: 3416]. Right[cite: 3417]?

Naomi (15:07) You're a little younger[cite: 3417]. I'm 57[cite: 3417].

Scott Benner (15:09) Oh, I'm sorry[cite: 3417]. Did the math wrong[cite: 3417]. Thank you[cite: 3418]. Finally, I'm younger[cite: 3418].

Naomi (15:11) You're a baby[cite: 3418].

Scott Benner (15:13) So there you are[cite: 3419]. You're 57[cite: 3419]. I'm 54[cite: 3419]. My son said to me, I don't know, a year ago, like, how many things have been wrong with you[cite: 3419]? He told me[cite: 3420]. Like, as I as I as I so, like, for instance, and I had to have my right knee cleaned out[cite: 3420]. Oddly, my the big toe on my right foot stopped bending, and, like, the guy had to go in there and, like, I don't know what he found, that he cleaned it up a little bit, did some microneedling and all this stuff[cite: 3421]. And it's been, like, a couple of years now, And I would tell you that it's odd that I'm having this conversation now because I'm not actually wearing shoes right now[cite: 3422]. But I couldn't I couldn't you know, can you make a fist with your toes[cite: 3423]? Right[cite: 3423]?

Scott Benner (15:54) I couldn't do that with my right toe for, the first eighteen, twenty four months after the surgery, but I can now[cite: 3424]. Like, it was Interesting[cite: 3424]. Good idea to go get the surgery[cite: 3425]. It ended up being a great thing[cite: 3426]. Blah blah blah[cite: 3426]. Right[cite: 3427]? I've, had a carpal tunnel surgery because I injured my hand[cite: 3427]. I've you know, I use a GLP medication[cite: 3428]. I had to have, like, something, like, you know, throughout my life[cite: 3428]...

Naomi (16:15) Like normal normal aging thing[cite: 3428].

Scott Benner (16:17) I yeah[cite: 3429]. I had a I had a my shoulders are like, I had a motorcycle accident when I was a kid[cite: 3429]. I never got it fixed[cite: 3430]. I had to have, like, rotator cuff surgery, like, stuff like that[cite: 3430]. And my son looks at that and goes, holy hell, man[cite: 3430]. He's breaking all over the place[cite: 3431]. You know[cite: 3432]?

Naomi (16:32) Yes[cite: 3432].

Scott Benner (16:33) Yes[cite: 3432]. What I see is I see that, like, you're an expectation of getting to your grave without something like this going wrong in your meat sack that is rotting in front of you every day long[cite: 3432]. I just look at it as trying to stay ahead of father time[cite: 3433]. And Yes[cite: 3433]. Because if somebody said to me, are you healthy[cite: 3434]? I would say yes[cite: 3434].

Scott Benner (16:54) You've probably heard me talk about US Med and how simple it is to reorder with US Med using their email system[cite: 3435]. But did you know that if you don't see the email and you're set up for this, you have to set it up[cite: 3436]. They don't just randomly call you[cite: 3437]. But I'm set up to be called if I don't respond to the email because I don't trust myself, a 100%[cite: 3437]. So one time, I didn't respond to the email and the phone rings at the house[cite: 3438]. It's like, ring, you know how it works[cite: 3439]. And I picked it up[cite: 3439]. I was like, hello[cite: 3439]? It was just the recording[cite: 3439]. It was like, US Med, doesn't actually sound like that, but you know what I'm saying[cite: 3440, 3441]. It said, hey, you're, I don't remember exactly what it says, but it's basically like, hey, your order's ready[cite: 3441]. You want us to send it[cite: 3442]? Push this button if you want us to send it[cite: 3442]. Or if you'd like to wait, I think it it lets you put it off, a couple of weeks or push this button for that[cite: 3443].

Scott Benner (17:37) That's pretty much it[cite: 3444]. I push the button to send it, and a few days later, box right at my door[cite: 3444]. That's it[cite: 3445]. Usmed.com/juicebox or call (888) 721-1514[cite: 3445]. Get your free benefits checked now and get started with USmed[cite: 3445]. Dexcom, Omnipod, Tandem, Freestyle, they've got all your favorites[cite: 3446]. Even that new islet pump[cite: 3446]. Check them out now at usmed.com/juicebox or by calling (888) 721-1514[cite: 3447, 3448]. This episode is brought to you by Omnipod[cite: 3449].

Scott Benner (18:19) Would you ever buy a car without test driving at first[cite: 3449]? That's a big risk to take on a pretty large investment[cite: 3450]. You wouldn't do that[cite: 3450]. Right[cite: 3450]? So why would you do it when it comes to choosing an insulin pump[cite: 3451]? Most pumps come with a four year lock in period through the DME channel, and you don't even get to try it first[cite: 3452]. But not Omnipod five[cite: 3453]. Omnipod five is available exclusively through the pharmacy, which means it doesn't come with a typical four year DME lock in period[cite: 3453]. Plus, you can get started with a free thirty day trial to be sure it's the right choice for you or your family[cite: 3454]. My daughter has been wearing an Omnipod every day for seventeen years[cite: 3455]. Are you ready to give Omnipod five a try[cite: 3456]? Request your free starter kit today at my link, omnipod.com/juicebox[cite: 3457]. Terms and conditions apply[cite: 3457]. Eligibility may vary[cite: 3457]. Full terms and conditions can be found at omnipod.com/juicebox[cite: 3458]. Find my link in the show notes of this podcast player or at juiceboxpodcast.com[cite: 3459].

Naomi (19:19) You know, I'm glad you said that that because that's the perspective I'm trying to get to because I still do feel extremely healthy[cite: 3460]. I mean, I am I work out all the time[cite: 3461]. I'm a long distance runner and I'm still running, you know, and I ran through treatment[cite: 3462]. And I I part of me, 50% of me feels that I'm very healthy[cite: 3463]. I eat well, obviously, because I watch what I eat because of the diabetes[cite: 3464].

Naomi (19:43) So I have that, but then I also have the fifty percent of me that's like, oh my gosh, got the thyroid issue[cite: 3465]. I have osteopenia, which many women my age get[cite: 3466]. I have breast cancer, I have diabetes, and I'm falling apart, I'm breaking down[cite: 3467]. So I go back and forth[cite: 3468]. I'm still feeling very healthy, but I do worry about the things that are happening to my body[cite: 3468]. But many people live very long fruitful lives, obviously, with type one diabetes and having survived breast cancer[cite: 3469]. So...

Scott Benner (20:14) Yeah[cite: 3470]. Yeah[cite: 3470]. Well, I'm glad you're looking[cite: 3470]. I I understand your trepidation around, like, making the proclamation, but at the same time, I like that you're searching for it[cite: 3471]. I also did not mean to rhyme trepidation and proclamation[cite: 3472]. I very much apologize[cite: 3472]. I apologize to everybody for that[cite: 3473].

Naomi (20:28) For a Monday morning[cite: 3473]. But I also wanted to mention that with with the diagnosis of the breast cancer, it really helped me to sort of be a little less obsessive with the diabetes numbers because I realized that as much effort as I put into managing my diabetes, here came this thing along that was so much bigger and that really was life threatening and that could could kill me[cite: 3474]. And so it really made sometimes when I hear people talk about diabetes, it's the worst possible thing that ever happened to them[cite: 3475]. Now I have this perspective of like, God, if I only just had diabetes, that would be awesome[cite: 3476]. So it is interesting how things happen in life and changes your perspective because you can you really can[cite: 3477]. If you are in control or have some, you know, good range of control with your glucose numbers, you can live well into your eighties and nineties[cite: 3478].

Insulin Administration and Running

Scott Benner (21:24) You know[cite: 3479]? Yeah[cite: 3479]. There should be no issue with that[cite: 3479]. Well, okay[cite: 3479]. So you got to the point where you talked to that doctor into believing you needed insulin[cite: 3480]. And are you, like where are you in the, like, the LADA chain of command[cite: 3481]? Are you, like, in full need of insulin[cite: 3481]? Are you taking just [cite: 3482]

Naomi (21:40) Oh, yeah[cite: 3482].

Scott Benner (21:41) Yeah[cite: 3483]. Yeah[cite: 3483].

Naomi (21:41) No[cite: 3483]. I'm I'm in full need now[cite: 3483]. In the beginning, I started with pens[cite: 3483]. You know, the first couple years, I used pens[cite: 3484]. And then I as I educated myself more, I realized, well, there's more I can be doing[cite: 3485]. You know, why don't why can't I give myself point five unit of insulin as opposed to a full unit[cite: 3486]? And then I started, you know, researching pumps and exploring the pumps[cite: 3487]. And and I knew, just given my lifestyle and activity level, I I knew that I didn't want one with a tube, although they're very successful for so many people[cite: 3488]. But I did go with the Omnipod[cite: 3489]. And, you know, I don't I don't take as much insulin as some other people because I do tend to eat a low carb diet[cite: 3489]. But there are times where, you know, I'm out to eat or wherever if I want dessert, you know, and I definitely you know[cite: 3490]? Yeah[cite: 3491]. But I typically don't have more than thirty units a day[cite: 3491].

Scott Benner (22:26) Okay[cite: 3491]. Yeah[cite: 3491].

Naomi (22:27) I mean Sometimes it's as low as, you know, ten units if I'm eating, you know, very low carb that day[cite: 3492].

Scott Benner (22:32) How does the running affect your insulin needs[cite: 3493]?

Naomi (22:35) The running is tricky because, you know, again, with diabetes, it's it's all about sort of decision, the management around, you know, okay[cite: 3494]. Well, when am I gonna do my run[cite: 3495]? Like, I typically wanna do it in the morning before I've eaten[cite: 3495]. But sometimes when I wake up in the morning, I have foot to floor syndrome or dawn phenomenon or whatever you call it that that makes me go up[cite: 3496]. So I tend to take it I might take a unit or two, when I wake up to just keep myself, you know, under one forty[cite: 3497]. But then sometimes, you know, when I go out for the run, I tend to drop lower when I run[cite: 3498]. So I wanna be you know, I'm always looking again at the number to make sure, okay[cite: 3499]. Well, I'd love to be around one twenty, one thirty when I start to go out for a run, but, you know, sometimes I'm not[cite: 3500]. Sometimes I'm sitting at 90, and then I drink some juice or I eat something[cite: 3501]. I always make sure that I have to have, I have a belt with me, that I always have snacks[cite: 3502]. I have, you know, the running pants or the running shorts where the pocket so I can always carry a juice box[cite: 3503]. You know[cite: 3504]? But, again, during a run, I do like to check my numbers because I don't, you know, I don't want one time, I I did go very, very low during a run[cite: 3504]. I just got distracted[cite: 3541]. I wasn't checking it, and I started to get that numb tingly feeling around your mouth that you get when you go very low[cite: 3505].

Scott Benner (23:48) That's usually really low, right, for people too[cite: 3506].

Naomi (23:50) And then I looked, and I was, like, 45 or something[cite: 3507]. And I'm like, oh my god[cite: 3507]. I can't believe I usually, I'm, you know, a little more on top of that when I'm running[cite: 3508]. So I do check it when I run because I like to make sure I'm not going low during a run[cite: 3509]. It's funny[cite: 3510]. I used to go high when I ran, and I think in the beginning, it was like my liver dumping glucose or something[cite: 3510]. I didn't know what it was[cite: 3511]. But from what I've read, you know, it could have been that[cite: 3511]. But now all the time, I tend to skew lower[cite: 3512]. So I like to try to eat something before I go or make sure I have food with me so that I can maintain, you know, a certain level[cite: 3513].

Naomi (24:24) But there's, I don't know if you there's a woman I follow[cite: 3514]. I follow her on Instagram and TikTok, and she's she's a runner[cite: 3515]. And she's always, like, you know, saying what her numbers are during a run[cite: 3516]. And she I actually saw her run, and She was running in the New York City Marathon, and she was running for breakthrough t one d[cite: 3517]. And, you know, it's just inspirational that Yeah[cite: 3517]. She's able to do it, you know, with but so you can[cite: 3518]. You can do it[cite: 3519]. Well, you're doing it[cite: 3519]. Careful[cite: 3519]. Like, yeah, in marathons, when you have, like, gels and goos and things like that, I don't wanna have that because I don't wanna have to take insulin while I'm running, but I can take a little bit of it[cite: 3520]. If I'm if I'm on the lower side, you know, I can have a little bit of it[cite: 3521]. I can have, like, a sip or two of Gatorade[cite: 3522].

Scott Benner (25:06) Yeah[cite: 3522]. No[cite: 3523]. I think I mean, I've interviewed a a handful of people who've done marathons[cite: 3523]. They always wanna come on the podcast, and I I always feel bad because my my inclination is always to ask them, like, why are you running so much[cite: 3524]?

Naomi (25:18) I know[cite: 3525]. But but No[cite: 3525]. Again, it's like every marathon, I say, okay[cite: 3525]. This is definitely [cite: 3526]

Scott Benner (25:23) the last one[cite: 3526].

Naomi (25:23) I'm 57[cite: 3526]. Like, I cannot do this anymore in my body[cite: 3526]. But my kids are running it this year, and I wanted you know, just that you know, I'm so excited to do it with them and to have that opportunity[cite: 3527]. So I wanna go out on a high note running it with them[cite: 3528].

Scott Benner (25:39) There was a woman on recently[cite: 3539]. Do you listen to the podcast[cite: 3541]?

Naomi (25:43) Yes[cite: 3529]. Yes[cite: 3529]. Not not everyone, but, you know[cite: 3530]...

Scott Benner (25:45) Well Was it [cite: 3530]

Naomi (25:46) it wasn't Addy, was it[cite: 3530]?

Scott Benner (25:47) Let me look[cite: 3531]. There's an [cite: 3531]

Naomi (25:48) an Addy Taylor on[cite: 3531]?

Scott Benner (25:50) No[cite: 3532]. Oh[cite: 3532],

Naomi (25:51) she's the runner that I follow[cite: 3532].

Scott Benner (25:52) I don't know why I can't seem to hook up with her, actually, because I think [cite: 3533]

Naomi (25:56) Oh, she's Yeah[cite: 3533]. She's very fast too[cite: 3534]. She's I mean, she's a lot younger than I am, but she I think she runs, an eight, eight thirty pace[cite: 3534]. You know[cite: 3534]? I'm an old lady[cite: 3602]. I'm doing the old lady pace[cite: 3603].

Scott Benner (26:05) Well yeah[cite: 3536]. Oh, episode seventeen thirty one[cite: 3536].

Naomi (26:08) Okay[cite: 3536].

Scott Benner (26:08) So let's see[cite: 3536]. Diagnosed forty nine years ago, Linda shares her philosophy on borrowed time and her incredible feat of running in seven marathons on seven continents in seven days[cite: 3537].

Naomi (26:18) Oh, that's in seven days[cite: 3538]?

Scott Benner (26:20) And she did it three separate times[cite: 3538].

Naomi (26:22) Okay[cite: 3539]. What episode is that[cite: 3539]? Seventeen thirty one[cite: 3539]?

Scott Benner (26:24) Seventeen thirty one[cite: 3539]. As you were talking, I thought, oh, I think Naomi would really like that[cite: 3540]. Yeah[cite: 3540].

Naomi (26:28) Now that is impressive[cite: 3541]. That is impressive[cite: 3541]. I mean, I'm I'm a runner, but I'm not in that category of running[cite: 3541]. Because a lot of women wanted or a lot of people in general, runners, wanna run the world majors or they wanna run a marathon in every continent[cite: 3542]. But to do it in that short amount of time, I mean, I'm lucky if I can do one a year[cite: 3543]. You know[cite: 3544]?

Scott Benner (26:48) Yeah[cite: 3544]. I don't listen[cite: 3544]. I've I I I jogged across the parking lot at the shop right the other day, and that was enough[cite: 3545]. I was good[cite: 3546].

Naomi (26:53) K[cite: 3546]. And that's something[cite: 3546].

Scott Benner (26:54) Yeah[cite: 3547]. I I was like, oh, let me get out of the way[cite: 3547]. You know[cite: 3547]?

Naomi (26:56) Scott, you gotta start somewhere[cite: 3548].

Scott Benner (26:58) Well, I started and stopped at the other side of the driveway[cite: 3458]. You know, I don't when when you're walking across the may I share a pet peeve[cite: 3549]? When you're walking from your car to the grocery store, please, first of all, let's not zigzag[cite: 3550]. Let's not go diagonally across where people are driving[cite: 3551]. And if your ass is in the way, hustle a little bit[cite: 3552]. You you know what I mean[cite: 3553]? Like, don't [cite: 3553]

Naomi (27:20) look up pace[cite: 3553].

Scott Benner (27:20) Yeah[cite: 3554]. Don't look up everybody and go, I see that I've walked in front of your car[cite: 3554]. You're all gonna have to I I I just try to I just try to pick up the pace a little bit[cite: 3555]. Yeah[cite: 3556]. Also, may I may I share[cite: 3556]?

Naomi (27:30) Well, Scott, I'll give you a suggestion[cite: 3556]. Just park park further away from the entrance, and then you get more steps in[cite: 3557].

Scott Benner (27:36) Park in the park[cite: 3557]. I'm not out of my mind, Naomi[cite: 3558]. No[cite: 3558]. I actually boy, I'll tell you what[cite: 3558]. I was my I'm sorry[cite: 3559]. My brother is in Wisconsin texting[cite: 3559]. It's still snowing three days later is what he just sent me[cite: 3560].

Naomi (27:50) That's you know, I'm done with it[cite: 3561]. I'm over it[cite: 3561]. Me too[cite: 3561]. I'm in the Northeast too[cite: 3562]. So I we don't have snow right now, but it's chilly and cold [cite: 3562]

Scott Benner (27:56) and And why did it start raining again[cite: 3562]? Like, horrible[cite: 3563].

Naomi (28:00) My my son just ran the, my younger son ran the Napa Marathon, and I was out there[cite: 3563]. And I was just thinking, like, why don't I live out here[cite: 3564]? This is insane[cite: 3564].

Vigilance vs. Longevity Outlook

Scott Benner (28:09) Okay[cite: 3564]. Beautiful[cite: 3565]. We'll get to that in a half a second[cite: 3565]. I just wanna share with you, I'm not sure if I'm mentally ill or I'm youthful, but I was at, I was at the grocery store recently[cite: 3566]. I can't believe I'm just gonna talk about the grocery store completely, but there were there just weren't many people in it[cite: 3567]. It was a little later at night, and I would, like kinda speed up a little bit and sort of jump up in the air and hold my body weight up on my cart and let the cart take me down the aisle[cite: 3568].

Naomi (28:36) Oh, you are definitely useful then[cite: 3569].

Scott Benner (28:38) And and, like and I and I'm like, oh, I and I did it[cite: 3569]. I was like, oh, that was awesome[cite: 3570]. So I do it more lately, like, when no one's in the aisle[cite: 3570]. I wanna be clear not when people are in the aisle, but when the aisle's clear[cite: 3571]. Right[cite: 3571]? And I always feel like this is, like, the secret thing I'm doing that nobody knows about[cite: 3572]. And then I realized it hit me one day[cite: 3573]. There are cameras all over that place[cite: 3573]. There is someone [cite: 3574]

Naomi (28:58) Someone someone's [cite: 3574]

Scott Benner (28:59) watching going, you[cite: 3574]. What is this person doing[cite: 3574]?

Naomi (29:02) Yes[cite: 3574]. And you have to be careful[cite: 3575]. Right[cite: 3575]? Because you've had knee surgery and, [cite: 3575]

Scott Benner (29:05) you know That'll be fine[cite: 3575]. But, like but I honestly, as I'm doing it, I thought I it actually it occurred to me later because I I went out in the parking lot[cite: 3576]. There's this, like, little dip in the parking lot[cite: 3577]. Like, you kinda go down a slight hill[cite: 3577]. And I'm like, why am I walking across the parking lot when I could ride the cart down here[cite: 3578]?

Naomi (29:21) When I could [cite: 3579]

Scott Benner (29:22) be So I driving[cite: 3579]. I did that[cite: 3579]. And then I got all I packed up and everything and, you know, gotten the got my car to leave[cite: 3580]. And I actually stopped for a second and thought, I wonder how many 54 year old people would do this[cite: 3581]. Like, is the and that's when it hit me[cite: 3582]. I was like, is this a positive thing about me, or is there something wrong with me[cite: 3583]? And I and I [cite: 3583]

Naomi (29:42) Only little of both[cite: 3584].

Scott Benner (29:43) Yeah[cite: 3584]. Right[cite: 3584]?

Naomi (29:45) That's why But I but I love it because I I'm especially I mean, especially I I was always like this, but more so after a cancer diagnosis[cite: 3585]. You have to live life[cite: 3586]. You have to embrace every moment and find the joy where you can[cite: 3586]. Yeah[cite: 3587]. So why not do that[cite: 3587]? Yeah[cite: 3587]. Why not[cite: 3587]?

Scott Benner (30:01) My mom passed away in her eighties from cancer, and it taught me a lot about the idea of, like, waiting till the end to do stuff[cite: 3588]. Also Right[cite: 3589]. As you bring it up, like, why are you not why don't you move to California[cite: 3589]? Why don't I I'm trying so hard to get my wish to go, like, south, like, to get it because warm[cite: 3590]. Yeah[cite: 3591]. Because it's terrible here[cite: 3591].

Naomi (30:20) I know[cite: 3591].

Scott Benner (30:21) Or and you have context for this[cite: 3591]. I I said okay to I'm doing this talk at Hofstra[cite: 3592]. And I gotta drive out on the island, like, on a Wednesday afternoon[cite: 3593]. And I'm just like the whole time, I'm like, why did I say yes to that[cite: 3594]?

Naomi (30:34) Not fun[cite: 3034]. Not fun[cite: 3595]. Although people say the traffic in in, outside, you know, San Fran area is bad too[cite: 3595]. But, yeah, in in the metropolitan area, ugh, forget it[cite: 3596].

Scott Benner (30:42) Yeah[cite: 3597]. But don't you think the weather would, like, stabilize that feeling for you[cite: 3597]?

Naomi (30:46) I do[cite: 3597]. I say that to my husband all the time[cite: 3598]. You know, why don't we do this[cite: 3598]? But, you know, our kids are in New York[cite: 3599]. Wanna We be close to them[cite: 3599]. He said, you think Jersey is expensive[cite: 3600]? California is [cite: 3600]

Scott Benner (30:56) Yeah[cite: 3601]. I I'm listen[cite: 3601]. I'm looking like I looked at Tennessee[cite: 3601]. First of all, Tennessee does not have income tax[cite: 3601]. That's a that's a thing[cite: 3602]. And secondly, people from Tennessee are probably like, please stay where you are[cite: 3602]. Leave us alone[cite: 3603]. But I but [cite: 3603]

Naomi (31:11) I doubt that[cite: 3603].

Scott Benner (31:12) But, like 45 I'm looking, like, in an hour radius, like, around, like, Nashville, for example[cite: 3604]. Property is just not nearly as expensive as it is here[cite: 3605].

Naomi (31:21) Right[cite: 3605]. You [cite: 3606]

Scott Benner (31:22) know, there's no way that [cite: 3606]

Naomi (31:23) property tax is a lot lower[cite: 3606].

Scott Benner (31:25) I you have no idea[cite: 3607]. I saw a house the other day, and I don't know what the house cost, $3,400,000[cite: 3607]. The property taxes were, like, $1,500 a year[cite: 3608].

Naomi (31:35) It's crazy[cite: 3608]. My, someone that I I worked with that I talked with for many years, she moved down to she retired in New Jersey and moved down to Charleston, that area[cite: 3609]. And, her taxes are I think she pays something like $22,000 a year[cite: 3610].

Scott Benner (31:49) Yeah[cite: 3610]. Yeah[cite: 3611]. If I ask people to tell you what you pay if you tell you what you pay No[cite: 3611]. People no[cite: 3611].

Naomi (31:55) Don't do that[cite: 3612]. Don't do that to people[cite: 3612]. Exactly[cite: 3612].

Scott Benner (31:57) Yeah[cite: 3612]. They'd pass out[cite: 3612].

Naomi (31:58) Jersey, New York metropolitan area[cite: 3613]. It's really outrageous, but yet, you know, near the Jersey Shore[cite: 3613]. I'm near New York City, so I like those things[cite: 3614].

Scott Benner (32:07) Yeah[cite: 3614]. I like them too, but I don't actually do any of those things[cite: 3615]. Although my kid did go to the the art museum the other day, and I did think, okay[cite: 3616]. Well, that's a good part about being here[cite: 3617]. But anyway okay[cite: 3617]. I wanna talk about your your diabetes care and your, you know Okay[cite: 3618]. Your assertion that you're, you know, very focused but found a little more leniency for yourself[cite: 3619]. So where did all that come from[cite: 3620]? Obviously, it's not coming from your endocrinologist[cite: 3620]. You did your own research[cite: 3621]. What did you go out and learn[cite: 3621, 3622]? How did learning that form and shape how you wanted to take care of yourself[cite: 3622]?

Research and Vocabulary Gap

Naomi (32:40) Well, I do like to be on top of everything that's going on with my health[cite: 3240]. You know[cite: 3623]? And so I knew that I wasn't going to be a passive diabetic patient[cite: 3624]. I wanted to do everything within reason that I could do to, not have nondiabetic numbers, but to be within a healthy [cite: 3625]

Scott Benner (33:01) Do your best[cite: 3301].

Naomi (33:01) For for a diabetic[cite: 3626]. Right[cite: 3626]? So I started just, you know, following people on Instagram and, you know, hearing about different, like, book recommendations[cite: 3626]. Of course, you know, I read, you know, Healthy Kick Ass Lada, and I read, Think Like a Pancreas[cite: 3327]. I actually had to read that like many people do, like, two or three times because it it was very technical[cite: 3328]. And in the beginning, I didn't have the vocabulary, and I didn't really understand it until I started using insulin myself and became familiar with I was never even taught the word bolus[cite: 3329]. Didn't know what My diabetes educator never used that word[cite: 3330]. So when that kept coming up, I kept thinking, what is this bolus thing that everyone is talking about[cite: 3331]? So I had to learn all of this[cite: 3332]. And the more I learned, the more I wanted to know[cite: 3332]. And, you know, the latest research that's happening and, you know, obviously, learning about islet cell transplants and, you know, looking at clinical trials and things like that[cite: 3333].

Naomi (33:47) And, you know, the latest research that's happening and, you know, obviously, learning about islet cell transplants and, you know, looking at clinical trials and things like that[cite: 3633]. So I really wanted to put myself in a position of knowledge so that I would be able to I realized early on that it wasn't going to be my endocrinologist[cite: 3634]. Like, the difference between diabetes and cancer is with cancer, I let my oncologist direct everything[cite: 3635]. She's the expert[cite: 3636]. This is cancer[cite: 3636]. This is a big deal[cite: 3636]. Whatever she tells me to do, I do[cite: 3637]. With the endocrinologist, I learned early on that I might know a little bit more than she does when it comes to dosing or the limits and the benefits of different types of pumps and things like that[cite: 3637]. I realized that early on[cite: 3638]. So I wanted to make sure that I educated myself and read everything that I could read and, you know, following certain doctors on on Twitter that are diabetes experts[cite: 3638]. You know[cite: 3639]?

Scott Benner (34:44) Do you think your endo doesn't know, or do you think that the the way that the visits are set up doesn't allow for long conversation[cite: 3439]? Or [cite: 3440]

Naomi (34:53) I think it's more that, that you're in and out in such a short amount of time[cite: 3640]. And she does defer to the diabetes educator in her office more so because I think that I don't know, you know, if it's her area of expertise or not, but I I I see her referring me to you know, oh, that's a question for the diabetes educator or ask the diabetes educator that, or we'll have her look at your numbers and, you know, tweak things if necessary[cite: 3641]. But but they're never the ones to tweak things[cite: 3642]. I'm always the one to tweak things[cite: 3642]. Like, I adjust my IC ratio[cite: 3643]. You know[cite: 3643]?

Scott Benner (35:26) Does your educator have that knowledge[cite: 3643]? Do they seem more knowledgeable to than the endo to you[cite: 3644]?

Naomi (35:31) Or Yes[cite: 3644]. I haven't[cite: 3644]. I just kind of stopped going because I feel like I'm at the point now where I do know I certainly know plenty enough to manage myself[cite: 3645]. You know, I don't know[cite: 3646]. It's hard to say, Scott[cite: 3646]. In the beginning, I don't think I got the best education from the diabetes educator[cite: 3647]. I was told to take a few units of insulin before meals[cite: 3648].

Scott Benner (35:52) Mhmm[cite: 3648].

Naomi (35:52) But I she didn't go into depth about insulin to carb ratio or count the carbs[cite: 3649]. And I I I literally just started taking three units of insulin with every meal regardless of what I was eating[cite: 3650]. And then I realized, wait[cite: 3651]. I'm dropping, like, really low[cite: 3651]. Like, what's and I called her, and she said, well, you have to you you know, it's based on the number of carbs you and maybe you know what[cite: 3652]? To be fair, it is possible that she did go over that with me, and I was too overwhelmed at the initial appointment to process it[cite: 3653]. So I don't wanna completely throw her under the bus[cite: 3654]. It could have been my [cite: 3654]

Scott Benner (36:23) Right[cite: 3654]. Are you are you comfortable partially throwing her under the bus[cite: 3655]? Does it sound like a thing you would do, like, here that you have to count your carbs to measure your insulin and that you would ignore that[cite: 3656]?

Naomi (36:33) Yeah[cite: 3657]. I don't know[cite: 3657]. And that's that's why I don't really go to her anymore because now I'm now I know enough where I can you know[cite: 3657]? Okay[cite: 3658]. Maybe I'm really not a one to 15 ratio anymore[cite: 3658]. Let me try going down to one to 12, you know, and see what that does[cite: 3659]. And I really like to I remember one podcast you talked about your daughter's management and correcting if she went above one twenty[cite: 3660].

Scott Benner (36:53) Mhmm[cite: 3661].

Naomi (36:54) And at at the time, I was still early on[cite: 3661]. I thought, oh my god[cite: 3661]. I would love to be at one twenty[cite: 3662]. Like, why would you correct them[cite: 3662]? But now, of course, I'll do, like, a micro correct you know, a little micro dose correction at that because I wanna stay under you know[cite: 3663]?

Scott Benner (37:06) Yeah[cite: 3664].

Naomi (37:06) I just you know, so I'm I'm a lot better at management[cite: 3664].

Scott Benner (37:09) Are you using a manual pump[cite: 3665]? Like, are you using Omnipod dash[cite: 3665]?

Naomi (37:13) I use no[cite: 3665]. I'm using Omnipod five[cite: 3666]. You are[cite: 3666]? I use it in auto mode because Jenny said to do that[cite: 3666].

Scott Benner (37:18) Oh, wait[cite: 3667]. Wait[cite: 3667]. Manual[cite: 3667]?

Naomi (37:19) No[cite: 3667]. Auto[cite: 3667].

Scott Benner (37:20) You're letting it make its decisions[cite: 3667]?

Naomi (37:22) Yes[cite: 3668]. Yes[cite: 3668]. But it doesn't it doesn't give me that much, I think, because I don't use that much insulin, like, throughout every day[cite: 3668]. It doesn't give me that much basal[cite: 3669].

Scott Benner (37:30) Okay[cite: 3669].

Naomi (37:31) You know, I'm mostly bolusing for it, but, like, just for fun, I'm, like, looking what I am right now[cite: 3670]. Like, I'm at 94, which is great, but I still have, like, one point five units in me from breakfast[cite: 3671]. So that's why I do like to manage it because I still have 1.5 units on board[cite: 3672].

Scott Benner (37:48) You wanna pay it[cite: 3748].

Naomi (37:48) I don't wanna go low, so I check it and, you know, I'll have whatever[cite: 3673].

Lifestyle Adjustments and Emotional Toll

Scott Benner (37:52) Yeah[cite: 3674]. And you're the way you eat now is not different than the way you ate before diabetes, or it is[cite: 3674]?

Naomi (37:57) No[cite: 3675]. No[cite: 3675]. It it's definitely different[cite: 3675]. It's definitely different[cite: 3675]. But it took me a long time to get there because I was a big pasta bread person[cite: 3676]. And and I still I do love that stuff, but I don't I definitely hardly ever eat that stuff only because for me, once in a while, if I'm at a restaurant, maybe I'll order pasta[cite: 3677]. But for me, it's just harder to dose for it because if you don't know the exact number of carbs, as you know, you know, it's just a little trickier[cite: 3678]. So I sometimes will do it[cite: 3679]. Like, I'll sometimes say, screw it[cite: 3679]. I'm just getting whatever I want[cite: 3679]. I'm gonna get the cake too for dessert[cite: 3680]. You know[cite: 3680]? And I'll estimate the the number of units or if I'm at a Mexican restaurant or something[cite: 3681]. You know[cite: 3682]? And then I end up with, like, taking twenty, twenty five units for the meal, and I'm still, like, either going low or high[cite: 3682]. And so to me, it's almost not worth the trouble because it sends me into a little bit of, like, an emotional I I don't like how I feel emotionally because I'm like, ugh[cite: 3683]. Got it[cite: 3684]. You know[cite: 3684]? I didn't get it right or something like that[cite: 3684]. So it's almost easier for me to stick to the things I know[cite: 3685]. You know[cite: 3685]? Like, always get like [cite: 3686]

Scott Benner (38:59) Yeah[cite: 3686]. Naomi, you beat yourself up about it if it doesn't go [cite: 3686]

Naomi (39:02) I do[cite: 3686]. I think [cite: 3687]

Scott Benner (39:03) your age[cite: 3687]? You've been around a while[cite: 3687]. You don't know[cite: 3687]?

Naomi (39:07) Yeah[cite: 3688]. No[cite: 3688]. I'm I'm experienced with it, and I know that it's not I know that sometimes it is a guessing game[cite: 3688]. But I think, you know, there are times where, okay, you know, pizza, you're gonna do an extended bolus[cite: 3689]. And I do the extended bolus, and sometimes it works and sometimes it doesn't work[cite: 3690]. So then I'm like, ugh[cite: 3691]. It's just easier not to eat the pizza[cite: 3691]. You know[cite: 3691]?

Scott Benner (39:26) Yeah[cite: 3692]. I understand[cite: 3692]. I I just wondered, like, because you're you know, at your age, I thought maybe there'd be some more, I don't know, grace built in [cite: 3692]

Naomi (39:34) Yeah[cite: 3693]. For you[cite: 3693]. Yeah[cite: 3693]. No[cite: 3693]. Well, that's that's the goal[cite: 3693]. I mean, I'm trying to do that every day[cite: 3694]. I'm trying to, like yeah[cite: 3694]. Like so some days, like, I know my range, I do a 70 to one forty range[cite: 3695]. I know that I'm not gonna be in a 100% range, like, every day all the time[cite: 3696]. Yeah[cite: 3696]. I would love to, but I don't I used to beat myself up if I was at, like, 90% in range[cite: 3697]. And now I don't do that at least[cite: 3698]. Now I'm like, 90% in range is awesome[cite: 3698]. You go, girl[cite: 3699]. You know[cite: 3699]?

Scott Benner (40:01) How do you beat yourself up[cite: 3601]? Is it, like, is it unpleasant self talk[cite: 3700]? Of course in your mind[cite: 3700]? Do you [cite: 3701]

Naomi (40:07) Well, it's a lot of, it's actually for me, it's more like, oh god[cite: 3701]. But, I'm so educated about this[cite: 3702]. Why didn't I get that dosing right[cite: 3702]? And then it's also even though I know this is an irrational fear, I worry about long term side effects from spiking too high even though rationally, I know that that is not gonna affect my life unless I'm high, you know, above 200 all the time [cite: 3703] Which is such a rarity[cite: 3703]. You know[cite: 3704]? So as much self talk as I do to that's negative, I'm trying to do a lot more self talk that's hey[cite: 3704]. Listen[cite: 3705]. Sometimes you hit it, and sometimes you don't, and it's okay[cite: 3705]. Yeah[cite: 3705]. I'm not gonna have long term side effects, you know, because I spiked to two fifty one day for an hour[cite: 3706].

The Parenting Journey and Adrenaline Spikes

Scott Benner (40:51) My journey[cite: 3707]. My god[cite: 3707]. I just I I tried so hard to find a word that wasn't journey, by the way, just now[cite: 3707]. But but but I guess my personal journey through all this from, you know, Arden being two and newly diagnosed to her being you know, this summer will be 22[cite: 3708]. So Arden's Arden's gonna have diabetes for twenty years in July[cite: 3708]. And [cite: 3709]

Naomi (41:12) And how is she doing with it[cite: 3709]?

Scott Benner (41:14) You know, really well[cite: 3709].

Naomi (41:16) And she she manages herself now[cite: 3710].

Scott Benner (41:18) Yeah[cite: 3710]. Yeah[cite: 3710]. I mean, I I'd say, like, ninety eight percent[cite: 3711]. Like, there's times, like, I know, you there's times I'll I got a text the other day while she was running around trying to get out the door for for class, and she's I just got a text, it just said, please come fill a pod for me[cite: 3712]. And I and I was like, okay[cite: 3713]. Like, stuff like that[cite: 3713]. Or Yeah[cite: 3713]. Like, once in a while, like, she when she goes out and spends the night somewhere else, she takes just this little, like, bag she takes with her with all of her stuff in case she needs something[cite: 3714]. She's like, I need you to pack my bag or something[cite: 3715]. Yes[cite: 3715]. My point is that from it's been it's been a ride[cite: 3716]. You know what I mean[cite: 3716]? Yeah[cite: 3717]. And I don't think it I don't think it's over yet[cite: 3717]. But Yeah[cite: 3717].

Scott Benner (41:57) From, like [cite: 3718]

Naomi (41:57) And and it's exhausting[cite: 3718]. It's the it's the fatigue of the constant decision making really, you know, cannot be understated, I don't think[cite: 3718].

Scott Benner (42:04) I have to tell you[cite: 3719]. I mean, I just I had some thoughts the other day about that[cite: 3719]. I'll share as I'm going through this[cite: 3720]. But, like, you know, from when from two years old, you're like the abject horror and shock[cite: 3720]. Right[cite: 3721]? And then they're like, oh god[cite: 3721]. I'm gonna kill her[cite: 3721]. Like, that thing[cite: 3721]. Then the recognition that, like, I don't know what's going on[cite: 3722]. Like, I say to people all the time, like, I didn't have a podcast to listen to[cite: 3723]. Like, I didn't know what was I Yeah[cite: 3724]. I didn't know what was going on[cite: 3724]. Right[cite: 3724]? And then you're looking at the higher a one c's, eight's, nine's[cite: 3725]. You look at the doctor, you realize, they don't I don't think they're gonna be helpful[cite: 3726]. You know[cite: 3727]? So then you gotta figure out on your own, you know, for me, figuring out on your own, I don't know what it says about me, but I didn't go exterior of this house figure it out[cite: 3727]. I'd I'd I'd turned to, like, you know, experimenting with things, figuring stuff out[cite: 3728]. Luckily, a CGM came, helped me along[cite: 3729]. Getting onto a pump was nice, but, like, not not exactly, like, you know, a big shift to the the care[cite: 3730]. It was more about the way you care for it[cite: 3731].

Naomi (43:04) Mhmm[cite: 3731].

Scott Benner (43:05) And then she starts to get older and has every, you know, concern issue that you can imagine, you know, trying to manage and, like, all the stuff that comes with growing and getting older and[cite: 3731, 3732]...

Naomi (43:17) Being a teenager, being a younger girl[cite: 3732].

Scott Benner (43:19) Son really or father daughter relationships, like, the whole thing[cite: 3733]. She gets hypothyroidism at some point[cite: 3733]. That adds to the problem[cite: 3734]. All the way up to, you know, in the last couple of years, she's really developed, like, an aversion to needles[cite: 3734]. So, like, like, all that stuff, like, everything from there to here and all that in between Yeah[cite: 3735]. And thinking you're doing well personally when you're not and not realizing it[cite: 3736]. So Right[cite: 3736]. I mentioned earlier, like, you know, like, a couple of my medical things, but, like, one of them is that I use a GLP med now[cite: 3737]. I probably have for nearly three years[cite: 3737]. Right[cite: 3738]?

Naomi (43:55) Mhmm[cite: 3738].

Scott Benner (43:56) And I've lost about I I think at my at my biggest number, lost about 70 pounds[cite: 3739]. I seem to have kinda, like, gone back to about 65[cite: 3740]. Like, it seems to be where my body is sitting at for lack of a better way of saying it[cite: 3740]. I never thought of myself as a heavy person[cite: 3741]. I I don't really know another way to explain that[cite: 3472]. And and [cite: 3472]

Naomi (44:13) Mhmm[cite: 3742]. Mhmm[cite: 3742].

Scott Benner (44:14) Even so much so is that when I started losing weight, I think I had lost, like, my first 15 pounds[cite: 3743]. My son was living in Atlanta at the time for his, like, first adult job[cite: 3744]. And we went to visit him, and I remember walking in the door of his apartment and just being like, I can't wait for him to look at me and go, oh my god[cite: 3745]. No[cite: 3746]. My dad's lost weight[cite: 3746]. And after, like, an hour or so realizing this was not happening, and I and I said to him, I'm like I'm like, maybe this is just a boy thing[cite: 3746]. I'm like, how am I looking[cite: 3747]?

Naomi (44:41) Have you noticed anything[cite: 3747]?

Scott Benner (44:43) Yeah[cite: 3747]. Yeah[cite: 3747]. Yeah[cite: 3747]. Like, it now is a good time to say that I look like I've lost weight[cite: 3748]. And he goes, oh, I have you[cite: 3748]? And then we had, like, a real conversation[cite: 3749]. He said, I don't think of you as a fat person, he said[cite: 3750].

Naomi (44:54) How interesting[cite: 3750].

Scott Benner (44:55) Yeah[cite: 3751]. And then I looked back at some pictures over, you know, time Mhmm [cite: 3751] and realized that I was not a person jumping in front of cameras a lot[cite: 3752]. And then my wish pulled up a photo of us, I think, at my son's, like, senior day baseball game in college, and I am so fat in that picture[cite: 3753].

Naomi (45:16) Probably yeah[cite: 3754].

Scott Benner (45:17) I had no idea[cite: 3754]. And and I haven't gotten the nerve up yet to ask my wife, and I hope Arden never hears this one[cite: 3754]. But I haven't gotten the nerve up yet to ask my wife, how much of what happened to us do you think is the stress from Arden's diagnosis[cite: 3755]?

Naomi (45:34) Yeah[cite: 3756]. Yeah[cite: 3756].

Scott Benner (45:36) And how much of it was just how we are or what we are Yes[cite: 3756]. Whatever[cite: 3757].

Naomi (45:40) Right[cite: 3757]. Right[cite: 3757]. And just lifestyle lifestyle or what you eat and things like that[cite: 3457]. But I no[cite: 3758].

Scott Benner (45:44) I sleeping[cite: 3758].

Naomi (45:45) I think right[cite: 3758]. The diabetes and I one thing I do wanna say is it is hard enough managing this disease as an adult managing myself[cite: 3759]. I give so much credit to all the parents out there[cite: 3760]. I cannot even imagine[cite: 3760]. You know, I'm checking getting up in the middle of the night or my alarm goes off in the middle of the night[cite: 3761].

Naomi (46:04) I cannot imagine, you know, having that responsibility of I give you so much credit for doing that, you know, for so many years[cite: 3762]. And I do think, like, lack of sleep, worrying about that, the decision fatigue, and all of that, and the stress, I'm sure that it has an impact in some way[cite: 3763]. I mean, you know, it probably impacts different people in different ways, but I think you had her on, what what's her name[cite: 3764]? Bain's mom[cite: 3765]? Bain[cite: 3765].

Scott Benner (46:27) Yeah[cite: 3765]. Mar Marley[cite: 3765].

Naomi (46:28) I love her love them[cite: 3765]. Yeah[cite: 3766]. I love them[cite: 3766]. And, like, first of all, the fact that, you know, she puts it all out there, not only does it educate in the same way that you have done[cite: 3766]. I mean, it is educating so many people and teaching so many parents, you know, what to do, how to live like this, and, you know, normalizing it to some extent[cite: 3767].

Naomi (46:47) But but what she goes through and with a little baby toddler like that and what you went through and all parents who have, you know, type one kids, it is cannot be easy[cite: 3768]. You know[cite: 3769]? And [cite: 3769]

Scott Benner (46:58) I'm gonna have to talk about this somewhere in more in more like [cite: 3769]

Naomi (47:01) stress like, that it sounds like you're coming out of it now[cite: 3769].

Scott Benner (47:05) I swear to you, like, I just I looked at that photo and I thought that can't be me[cite: 3770]. And then I realized, like, that's probably how I was a large part of the time[cite: 3771]. And I swear to you, if you would have come up to me and said, hey, Scott[cite: 3772]. Tell me you know, be be honest and tell me about your weight right now[cite: 3773]. I would have said something like, yeah[cite: 3773]. I could I should probably lose 20 pounds[cite: 3774].

Naomi (47:26) Mhmm[cite: 3774].

Scott Benner (47:27) And if you said, are you fat[cite: 3774]? I would have said, no[cite: 3775]. No[cite: 3776]. I'm just like, I just need I I didn't[cite: 3776]. Like, you can't see it[cite: 3776].

Naomi (47:34) Did you feel unhealthy[cite: 3777]? Did you [cite: 3777]

Scott Benner (47:36) feel Yeah[cite: 3777]. But you make excuses for everything[cite: 3777]. You know, like, had, what's that[cite: 3777]? I had, plantar fasciitis[cite: 3778].

Naomi (47:44) Mhmm[cite: 3778].

Scott Benner (47:45) Right[cite: 3778]? Really bad[cite: 3779]. Like, terrible[cite: 3779]. And you think, like, oh, what's wrong with my heel[cite: 3779]? And now I realize, like, what's wrong with my heel is that I was carrying around 70[cite: 3779].

Naomi (47:53) Was it weight[cite: 3779].

Scott Benner (47:54) Yeah[cite: 3781]. Yeah[cite: 3781]. Yeah[cite: 3781]. But I at the time, I didn't think about that[cite: 3781]. I wonder how much of my knee having to get cleaned out was that[cite: 3782]. All that other stuff[cite: 3782]. And, yes, my back hurt like crazy all the time[cite: 3783]. My lower back was and I just said, oh, I've my back's always hurt[cite: 3784]. And, you know, like, just all these different things[cite: 3785]. And I don't know[cite: 3785]. And then, you know, it's funny[cite: 3785].

Scott Benner (48:14) I think that there's also times that my weight wasn't as whatever it was when I saw that photo[cite: 3786]. In those times, you're probably a little more active[cite: 3787]. Those are probably times where you find yourself a little more in front front of a camera[cite: 3788]. So then you remember yourself in the pictures where you look or you take a photo from a great angle, and then, like, that's how you think of yourself all the time[cite: 3789].

Naomi (48:35) I think that you have a point because there's definitely this part of, you know, type one diabetes management that that people don't see where it is the you know, sort of like this overwhelming sense of, you know, you're managing stuff all the time and you're making decisions[cite: 3790]. And for a parent, you're worried about your daughter[cite: 3791]. So you're you have that sort of this, like, background noise all the time, and I I definitely think that can impact your health [cite: 3792] and weight and all that kind things[cite: 3792].

Remote Dosing, Algorithms, and the Uncoupling Phase

Scott Benner (49:03) Worries not Yeah[cite: 3793]. Is boy, worry[cite: 3793].

Naomi (49:06) Like, coming coming out of this now with Barden being a young adult, you know, you will be moving into a different phase where it really is her her deal and hers like, you know, will it free up, like, that mental space in your head and, you know, you'll have, you know, all of this other [cite: 3793]

Scott Benner (49:24) Well, I'm gonna say no, probably[cite: 3793].

Naomi (49:26) But you always worry about your kids, but the diabetes aspect is a whole other[cite: 3794].

Scott Benner (49:31) Well, I I mean, it's nice to say, but let me tell you this as a great example[cite: 3794]. Right[cite: 3795]? Last night, I told you when we first got on, like, I slept in this morning because I was up in the middle of the night[cite: 3795]. So last night, I don't know, around 03:15 in the morning, I've woken up by something[cite: 3796]. I'm like, what was that[cite: 3796]? You know[cite: 3797]? And Mhmm[cite: 3797]. It's Arden's blood sugar[cite: 3797]. Mhmm[cite: 3797]. And it's going up[cite: 3798].

Scott Benner (49:54) And she's at the end of a pump, and I think to myself, like, if I was when I thought it was, even at 03:15, back in the day, I never would have let her go to bed with this pump on[cite: 3798]. Right[cite: 3799]. I would've said, hey[cite: 3799]. We're gonna change your pump before you go to Right[cite: 3799]? But she's trying to ride it till the end[cite: 3800]. It's different[cite: 3801]. I'm not telling her what to do[cite: 3801]. Blah blah blah[cite: 3801]. So I [cite: 3801]

Naomi (50:14) hate to waste the insulin[cite: 3801].

Scott Benner (50:15) No[cite: 3802]. Trust me[cite: 3802]. I don't care about that part[cite: 3802]. I care about the control part[cite: 3802]. And it's an old site, and I I see it not working well at the very end here[cite: 3803]. And I would have swapped that pump before she went to bed, but she didn't[cite: 3804]. That's fine[cite: 3804]. It's three fifteen[cite: 3805]. I'm seeing a one forty diagonal up number[cite: 3805].

Naomi (50:32) Mhmm[cite: 3805].

Scott Benner (50:33) And I think, at first, I guess I'm tired[cite: 3806]. I don't think of it at all[cite: 3806]. It probably just hits me the algorithm will take care of it[cite: 3807]. But then 03:30 comes around and I realize it's one sixty five[cite: 3808]. And I go, okay[cite: 3808]. So I pick my phone up and I can still, like, remote bolus, like, because, you know, walking into her room when she's 21 is weird[cite: 3809]. You know[cite: 3810]? And I tried very hard not to do that[cite: 3810]. I looked at what the the algorithm had been doing[cite: 3811]. I reset a slightly lower target to make it more aggressive, and then I I put some insulin[cite: 3812].

Scott Benner (51:08) And after I put the insulin in, I thought, I don't think that was enough[cite: 3813]. But I don't wanna be too aggressive because [cite: 3813]

Naomi (51:14) Right[cite: 3814].

Scott Benner (51:14) She really does take care of this on her own, and maybe I should just go wake her up and blah blah blah[cite: 3815]. But I just anyway, I put in the little bolus[cite: 3816]. Twenty minutes later, I was like, that wasn't enough[cite: 3817]. I put in a little more, and thirty minutes later, I was like, this isn't gonna do it[cite: 3818]. I made one larger bolus, like, don't know, like a unit and a half or something like that[cite: 3819]. Like, you know, larger compared to the first one[cite: 3820]. And I did get on top of it, and I did get her blood sugar back down to, 95[cite: 3821]. And then I went back to sleep at 05:30 in the morning[cite: 3821].

Scott Benner (51:42) And I was, like, sitting there trying to be busy[cite: 3822]. I was actually doing stuff for the podcast[cite: 3822]. I made this great I I think I decided on a new, series to make with Jenny[cite: 3823]. Like, I was doing a bunch of stuff, but I wanted to be asleep because I'm old[cite: 3824]. I can't be up in the middle of the night like this anymore[cite: 3825]. Yeah[cite: 3825]. Right[cite: 3825]?

Scott Benner (51:59) So now I'm a little lucky[cite: 3826]. I didn't I wasn't recording with you until eleven[cite: 3826]. I just opened up my phone and pushed my alarm way back, and I thought, I'll I'll make this sleep up in the morning[cite: 3827]. But most people do not have that luxury[cite: 3828]. And, you know, like, most people can't just say, well, I'm just not gonna get up in the morning[cite: 3828]. Yeah[cite: 3829]. My I have a weird job[cite: 3829]. You know[cite: 3830]? What I realized is that once I was up and I saw her blood sugar rising, I couldn't just go back to sleep and let it keep going up[cite: 3830]. Like, I wasn't gonna be able to do that[cite: 3831]. Yeah[cite: 3831]. I mean, it just seems unreasonable not to do something about it[cite: 3832]. Knowing the situation the pump was in, end of us I I this isn't Yeah[cite: 3833]. It's not gonna work[cite: 3834].

Naomi (52:36) Up[cite: 3834].

Scott Benner (52:36) Yeah[cite: 3834]. So she gets up this morning, and the shower lately has been making her blood sugar rise[cite: 3835]. So she gets up in the morning, and I think if I was in charge, I would definitely change that pump before she got the shower[cite: 3836]. So she was getting, like, fresh from that, and I'd put in a bolus[cite: 3837]. But she's not gonna do that, and I don't look because this is the part where she's gonna have to figure it out[cite: 3838]. She actually [cite: 3838]

Naomi (53:00) said say now she's at the age where, you know, I don't know how she felt about you, you know, being on top of managing her diabetes[cite: 3839]. You know[cite: 3840]? You had to be when she was very young[cite: 3840]. But as she got older, did she did she look at it as sort of like, oh, thank goodness[cite: 3841]. Someone else is managing this for me, or was she, you know, even, like, through her teenage years, oh god[cite: 3842]. I can do this by myself, dad[cite: 3843].

Scott Benner (53:21) No[cite: 3843]. She was good right up until, like she was fine with it[cite: 3843]. I would say, like, her second year of college, we started to, like, separate even more[cite: 3844]. I mean, we had been slowly separating over time, which was the plan[cite: 3845]. But a better second year of college, it was the first time I got like that[cite: 3846]. I'm an adult[cite: 3847]. And I was like, oh, okay[cite: 3847]. Yeah[cite: 3847]. Because I thought you were 19, but whatever[cite: 3848].

Naomi (53:43) Right[cite: 3848]. Is that hard for you to give up the control[cite: 3849]?

Scott Benner (53:47) What did Gwyneth Paltrow do to that poor man in that band[cite: 3850]? Did she thoughtfully uncouple from him or something like that[cite: 3851]?

Naomi (53:53) Did Oh, right[cite: 3851].

Scott Benner (53:54) When she said that, she's like, we're thoughtfully uncoupling up uncoupling[cite: 3851, 3852].

Naomi (53:58) Yeah[cite: 3852]. You're thoughtfully uncoupling[cite: 3852].

Scott Benner (54:00) Yeah[cite: 3853]. Yeah[cite: 3853]. Yeah[cite: 3853]. So what so we were doing that, right, you know, and have been doing that for, you know, to the point where we're not really I'm not that involved, like, the day to day anymore[cite: 3853]. But Yeah[cite: 3854]. I watched this morning go exactly the way I knew it was gonna go[cite: 3854].

Naomi (54:14) Mhmm[cite: 3855].

Scott Benner (54:14) And my hope is is that she is now gathering the same data that I was gathering back in the day and that she will come to the same Yes[cite: 3855]. Or or similar, you know, conclusion that I came to[cite: 3856].

Naomi (54:28) She probably will because she grew up with you as her dad, and she, [cite: 3857] you know, was able to have that advantage of learning from you know[cite: 3857]?

Scott Benner (54:36) Because of all that, if I don't stop her from getting high overnight, she's not gonna stop it[cite: 3858]. She isn't waking up[cite: 3859]. Yeah[cite: 3859]. And this morning, because of just because of the order she did things in this morning, her blood sugar popped up over 200[cite: 3859]. Now I've seen I can tell she's already changed the pump, and she's put in insulin, and it's gonna come back down, and she's gonna be fine and everything[cite: 3859]. But, like, those are those little things, like, I don't think she knows yet the value of stopping that 200 from ever happening[cite: 3860].

Naomi (55:08) Mhmm[cite: 3861].

Scott Benner (55:08) Not that it's a problem one time[cite: 3861].

Naomi (55:10) Right[cite: 3861].

Scott Benner (55:10) But if it's happening every three days, then there's a value in changing your structure, like, how you structure your time[cite: 3862]. I a 100% believe she's gonna do it[cite: 3863]. But Yeah[cite: 3863]. She's I'm watching her go through it right now, and it's interesting because you probably one of the reasons I asked you earlier, like, you know, you're older[cite: 3864]. Why don't you know not to not beat yourself up[cite: 3865]?

Naomi (55:30) Right[cite: 3865].

Scott Benner (55:31) And I look at her, and I realized that what she's doing right now is she's trying to find she's trying to find the way she does it, and she's trying to make it work within her life[cite: 3866].

Naomi (55:43) Yeah[cite: 3867]. And she's still early on in being independent about it[cite: 3867].

Scott Benner (55:47) So For sure[cite: 3867]. Yeah[cite: 3849]. Yeah[cite: 3849]. So I don't I'm not I'm not at all, like, I wanna And [cite: 3868]

Naomi (55:52) she and she also she's at the age where she should be she has a lot of other stuff going on, and she should be living her life and not constantly thinking about diabetes like some of us[cite: 3868].

Scott Benner (56:04) And that's the balance balance[cite: 3869]. That we're striking right now is that I see that listen[cite: 3869]. I'll say over and over again[cite: 3870]. In college, 21, managing it herself, somewhere between, like, a six three and a six seven usually she stays[cite: 3870]. I think that's awesome[cite: 3871]. Like, I've just I've interviewed too many too many young women in college who were like, I don't know[cite: 3871]. I was an eight or a nine or a 10 or 11[cite: 3872]. I wasn't even paying attention[cite: 3872]. I don't know[cite: 3873]. Like, I think this is a crazy win[cite: 3873]. And I do think she'll get back to it, but she called it the other day[cite: 3874]. Something was happening the other day, I was like, hey, Arden[cite: 3875]. Like, I don't mean to be in your business[cite: 3876]. I was like, but please take a look at this[cite: 3877]. You know what I mean[cite: 3877]?

Scott Benner (56:40) And she said, dad, this is my health journey[cite: 3878].

Naomi (56:44) Wow[cite: 3878].

Scott Benner (56:44) And I was like, she's got such a sarcastic sense of humor that I couldn't tell if she was fucking with me or if she [cite: 3879]

Naomi (56:51) mocking you[cite: 3879].

Scott Benner (56:52) Yeah[cite: 3880]. Your yeah[cite: 3880]. Or or if she really feels that way[cite: 3880]. And what I I kind of left the moment with was thinking, I think it's a little bit of both[cite: 3881]. Like, I think she's uncomfortably making fun of it, but she does mean that[cite: 3882]. Like, she means I'm trying to figure this out[cite: 3883].

Naomi (57:10) And she's learning as she goes[cite: 3883].

Scott Benner (57:12) And I think she's doing terrific[cite: 3884]. Like, if she hears this as later in life, you know, Arden, I thought you'd I thought you were doing terrific the whole time you were doing it[cite: 3884]. So,劇 there's still little stuff[cite: 3885].

The Disconnect in National Guidelines

Naomi (57:22) Can I, I know our time is up, but I just wanted to ask you two things because I'm so I feel so fortunate to get to talk to you[cite: 3885]? I've listened to you for so long[cite: 3886]. You've done such good in the diabetes community about just teaching people about how to manage their diabetes in a very in-depth, intentional way[cite: 3887]. So thank you for that[cite: 3888]. But I wanted to ask you, why is it that you know, the American Diabetes Association will say, you know, you're fine, between, you know, 70 and one eighty[cite: 3888]. Like, that's the range you should be aiming for[cite: 3889]. You know, 6.4, like a one c, you're okay as long as you're under seven[cite: 3890].

Naomi (57:59) And other experts in the diabetes field are like, no[cite: 3891]. You should aim for nondiabetic numbers or you should be, you know, under you you should have, like, a 5.5 a one c[cite: 3892]. You know[cite: 3893]? Why why is there this, like, disconnect[cite: 3893]? You know[cite: 3893]? Because sometimes you don't know what to follow[cite: 3894]. I kinda wanna follow, you know, the guidelines of being a little more lax and and thinking, like, I've gotta live a long healthy life, but yet you have this other group contingent of peep you know, guessing contingency of people saying, you know, you've gotta be, you know, below six a one c, you know, and I don't know[cite: 3894]. What what are your thoughts on that[cite: 3895]?

Scott Benner (58:30) You know[cite: 3895]? No one's invited me into a meeting to talk or to listen to what they're thinking[cite: 3896]. But my from the outside and at the risk of sounding like a, you know, a prepper who's, you know, building a coffee table out of, dried dry good foods, I don't think I'd be looking for an institution to tell me how to take good care of myself[cite: 3897].

Naomi (58:49) Mhmm[cite: 3897].

Scott Benner (58:49) And I don't think it's because they have bad, intentions[cite: 3898]. I think they probably make a decision that we're gonna say something that will most reasonably capture as many people as possible[cite: 3899].

Naomi (59:02) Right[cite: 3900].

Scott Benner (59:03) And people who are, like, consistently above 200 if you can get them below one eighty all the time[cite: 3900]. What a joy that would be for them[cite: 3901]. Yeah[cite: 3901]. Right[cite: 3901]? Right[cite: 3901]? And so they're not speaking to you one at a time[cite: 3902].

Scott Benner (59:13) Mhmm[cite: 3903]. So I think they look at the technology[cite: 3903]. They probably talk to doctors[cite: 3903]. I mean, what do you see in your practice[cite: 3904]? What are people capable of[cite: 3904]? And talk and I think the problem is they're talking about us as an amalgam[cite: 3905]. Mhmm[cite: 3905]. So what can we expect the populace to do[cite: 3906]? I think they could handle 70 to one eighty[cite: 3906]. And there are gonna be people that can't handle it, and they'll they'll drift out on the high side, and their health will go the wrong way that way[cite: 3907]. And there'll be people who can handle it, who, I guess, they're hoping will do what you did and learn more about it and and go towards a lower, you know, more stable number[cite: 3908].

Naomi (59:49) Mhmm[cite: 3909].

Scott Benner (59:49) I just think it's a limitation of, I don't know, of of [cite: 3909]

Naomi (59:53) Trying to meet the masses[cite: 3953].

Scott Benner (59:54) Yeah[cite: 3910]. Yeah[cite: 3910]. Right[cite: 3910]. Just I how are you supposed to do that[cite: 3910]? And Mhmm[cite: 3910]. I do also think that it's a disservice to do that to people Mhmm [cite: 3911] because, you know, why are we least common denominating people's health, you know, and saying, look[cite: 3912]. There are gonna be some people who can't maintain a one eighty blood sugar[cite: 3913]. We don't want them to feel bad or whatever else they're concerned about there[cite: 3914]. At the expense of a person like yourself who I think pretty clearly can keep an a one c in the fives if they want to[cite: 3915].

Scott Benner (1:00:26) Mhmm[cite: 3916]. Why put that pressure on you that maybe you're working too hard and you don't need to be[cite: 3916]?

Naomi (1:00:31) Yeah[cite: 3917]. That's what I'm trying to figure out[cite: 3917]. Right[cite: 3917]? Like, am I working too hard[cite: 3917]?

Scott Benner (1:00:34) Because I see those conversations online all the time[cite: 3918]. People are they'll say, well, there hasn't been any study that proves that having an a one c, a blah blah blah, this low, is it any valuable[cite: 3919]? And I'm like, well, they how are they gonna study that[cite: 3920]? Right[cite: 3920]. Like and so saying there hasn't been a study doesn't make it it doesn't make it a fact either[cite: 3921]. Like, you don't know[cite: 3922]. And I'm gonna tell you they don't know either, and no one knows[cite: 3922]. So my opinion always is if I can't substantiate it, if God can't come down himself or herself and say, if you have a 6.5 a one c your whole life, you're absolutely gonna be fine[cite: 3923]. It's not a problem[cite: 3924]. Then why would I not on the side of caution and push for a lower a one c Mhmm [cite: 3924] or more time in range or a tighter range, a lower tighter range, or whatever[cite: 3925]. Like, that's a pretty big coin flip you're taking there[cite: 3926]. Because the day you find out it's not okay, you don't get to jump in a time machine and go back and do it again[cite: 3927]. You're you're now stuck with whatever outcome comes[cite: 3928]. And so so that's, you know, much like everything else in life[cite: 3928]. You're it's a risk reward[cite: 3932]. You're you have to weigh it on your own and decide how much effort am I gonna put in, and is some of that effort gonna be wasted, or am I gonna you know, or is it gonna work out for me[cite: 3929]? Or by the way, can I keep a five five a one c and still something goes wrong[cite: 3930]?

Naomi (1:01:50) You could get cancer[cite: 3950].

Scott Benner (1:01:51) Well, if you're yeah[cite: 3932]. And if you're so if you're looking for if you're looking for, promises, I would say this life thing's probably not for you[cite: 3932].

Naomi (1:02:00) Yeah[cite: 3933]. Right[cite: 3933]. That's a good perspective[cite: 3933]. Yeah[cite: 3933]. Yeah[cite: 3933]. Yeah[cite: 3934].

Clinical Trials and Technical Limitations

Naomi (1:02:03) And then my last question is that, you know, now I'm interviewing you, but I I just am curious about your thoughts[cite: 3934]. You know, obviously, with all of this news about, you know, islet cell transplants and, talk of a cure and all of that, and I don't wanna be on the, I think a cure is around the corner if it's really not[cite: 3935]. Where do you fall on that spectrum[cite: 3936]? I mean, I'm hopeful and obviously a lot of the research out there and the clinical trials with the people that are off insulin now, you know, it's it's wonderful[cite: 3936]. But do you think that that is going to be something that's available to the masses, like, in our lifetime, around the corner[cite: 3937]? Forget about it[cite: 3938]. What are what are your thoughts about that[cite: 3938]?

Scott Benner (1:02:39) Let me tell you a story that I think is gonna highlight how I feel about this[cite: 3939]. First, I'll tell you that, I think it's really great[cite: 3940]. I mean, it's fantastic[cite: 3940]. And I'm looking on my schedule right now to tell you that I believe where is it at[cite: 3941]? Maybe three weeks from now, I'm interviewing the lead researcher [cite: 3942] for that thing[cite: 3942].

Naomi (1:02:59) Oh[cite: 3942].

Scott Benner (1:03:00) For that thing[cite: 3942].

Naomi (1:03:00) Doctor with Wittowski[cite: 3943]. Wittowski[cite: 3943]? Oh, oh, good[cite: 3943].

Scott Benner (1:03:04) I already had Katie Hand on[cite: 3943].

Naomi (1:03:06) Katie on[cite: 3944]. I listened to that one[cite: 3944]. Mhmm[cite: 3944].

Scott Benner (1:03:08) And, I mean, exciting stuff about, you know, the that Tego [cite: 3945]

Naomi (1:03:12) Tego Pruvart[cite: 3945].

Scott Benner (1:03:13) Yeah[cite: 3945]. The immune suppressant drug and all that stuff[cite: 3946]. I think that's all very exciting[cite: 3946]. And I think for Katie and the other people, like, there's some guy, like, number eight or something like that online[cite: 3947]. He's like, hey[cite: 3948]. They just sent him back and gave him more cells, and I guess he's not using insulin[cite: 3948]. That is super exciting for him[cite: 3949]. Yeah[cite: 3949]. You you know[cite: 3949]? I also think you had to really listen to Katie when she said that she was lucky to be Part [cite: 3950]

Naomi (1:03:35) of that trial[cite: 3950].

Scott Benner (1:03:36) A viable candidate for that trial[cite: 3950]. So imagine how many people that said they wanted to be in it and they did some testing and went, sorry[cite: 3952]. It's not for you or at least at this time[cite: 3953]. Also, it's not FDA approved[cite: 3953]. It's not like it's I mean, it's it's they're, like, trying to it's a proof of concept at this point, and it seems Yeah[cite: 3954]. Very, very exciting[cite: 3955].

Scott Benner (1:03:57) I agree with you[cite: 3955]. Having said that, I one day took out my recycling the way I had taken it out for years and years and years, and the truck went down the street and didn't take half of it[cite: 3956]. And I called the municipality, and I said, why in the hell did they just take some of my recycling and not all of it[cite: 3957]? We talked it through, and she said, oh, you still using that blue container[cite: 3957]? And I said, yes[cite: 3958]. She goes, we're not picking up the blue containers anymore[cite: 3959]. And I went, how was I supposed to know that[cite: 3960]?

Naomi (1:04:29) Mhmm[cite: 3960].

Scott Benner (1:04:29) And she says, it's on our website[cite: 3961]. And I laughed, and I said, you think I spend a lot of time on your website, do you[cite: 3961]? I said, you didn't send out a note[cite: 3962]? Call, text, email Right letter, anything[cite: 3962]? Yeah[cite: 3963]. No[cite: 3963]. We just don't do that anymore[cite: 3963]. And I said, I have to ask you[cite: 3963]. Why not[cite: 3964]? And she said, the cans are too heavy[cite: 3964]. And I said, can I ask you a question[cite: 3965]? Why won't you hire people who are strong enough to pick up the cans[cite: 3966]? Wouldn't that be weird if I hired doctors who didn't know anything about medicine or a recycling guy who can't pick up the cans[cite: 3967]? Like, I was like, what what what is going on here[cite: 3968]? Well and then she's arguing back and forth with me, and I I was like, look[cite: 3969]. I'm not trying to be difficult[cite: 3969]. I'm like, I paid $75 for that blue can[cite: 3970]. Are you gonna give me $75 back[cite: 3971]? No[cite: 3971]. But we'll give you other cans if you want[cite: 3971]. And I said, but those cans are smaller, and you only come for the recycling twice a month[cite: 3972].

Scott Benner (1:05:24) How many little green cans am I supposed to strewn across my property[cite: 3973]? How much property do you think I have exactly[cite: 3974]? What am I in the can, you know, storage business[cite: 3974]? I'm like, what's going on here[cite: 3975]?

Naomi (1:05:34) Don't you know I run a diabetes podcast[cite: 3976]? I'm busy[cite: 3976].

Scott Benner (1:05:35) Time for you now[cite: 3976]. Also, the blue one held all my recycling[cite: 3977]. It was one nice can[cite: 3977]. Right[cite: 3977]? So I said, okay[cite: 3978]. I'll go dump it into the green can[cite: 3978]. Are you gonna come back and get it[cite: 3978]? She goes, no[cite: 3979]. I said, can I bring it to you[cite: 3980]? She says, no[cite: 3980]. I said, what do you want me to do with it for the next two weeks[cite: 3981]? And you know what she said[cite: 3982]? You can throw it in the trash[cite: 3982]. I said, well, then why in God's name am I recycling if I can throw it in And the you know what her answers were[cite: 3983]? Not helpful[cite: 3984]. And she was in charge[cite: 3984]. I'm gonna tell you that when institutions when this is how things work is my point Mhmm [cite: 3985, 3986] and you're telling me

Naomi (1:06:13) Don't don't get your hopes up[cite: 3886].

Scott Benner (1:06:14) Don't get your hopes up is my point[cite: 3987]. Yeah[cite: 3987]. Yeah[cite: 3987]. Yeah[cite: 3987]. Thank you[cite: 3987]. Okay[cite: 3988]. Okay[cite: 3988]. That thank you for taking my point out of that[cite: 3988]. I'll I'll tell you the same thing that I've been thinking for, like, fifteen years or more[cite: 3989]. I once interviewed a guy, a researcher working on I think it was Veritex back then[cite: 3990]. They were making this pouch of cells they were gonna implant under your skin, blah blah blah[cite: 3991]. Mhmm[cite: 3992]. And, it was really interesting[cite: 3992]. Certainly didn't seem as quickly successful as this one out of Chicago right now[cite: 3992]. But point was is they were having some success with it[cite: 3993]. And I asked him during the course of the interview, if you got it all together right now like I said, just say right now a bell went off and it works[cite: 3994]? Right[cite: 3995]? I said it works great[cite: 3995]. When do I get it[cite: 3995]? Mhmm[cite: 3995].

Scott Benner (1:06:59) And then he started talking about, well, you know, we've gotta source the cells, and we've gotta you know, you gotta put infrastructure in place to build the pouches[cite: 3996]. And then there's gotta be training that's done with the doctors, and you have to find doctors that can do the procedure and, like, you know, and insurance, of course, you're gonna loop in, blah blah[cite: 3997]. And he pauses, and he goes, I don't know[cite: 3998]. Fifteen years[cite: 3998]? And I said, so even if you figured it out today and it worked for sure[cite: 3999]...

Naomi (1:07:23) Yeah[cite: 3999].

Scott Benner (1:07:24) You're saying fifteen years later, that's when I'll see it[cite: 4000]? And so my I think my point stands[cite: 4001]. I mean, you can see right now there's you know, I don't believe that the current law even allows for the cells to be I don't know[cite: 4001]. I'm I'm not even sure[cite: 4002]. But right now, there's legal issues with how, you know, how available the cells are gonna be, the islet cells are gonna be[cite: 4002].

Naomi (1:07:47) Right[cite: 4003].

Scott Benner (1:07:48) Even if you had a pile of them a mile high and 10 feet, you know, and 10 miles wide [cite: 4003]

Naomi (1:07:53) Doesn't mean it's gonna get to the the people [cite: 4003]

Scott Benner (1:07:54) that you're mean that how many doctors are gonna do the procedure[cite: 4003]. I'm like, I mean, there's a guy doing it right now[cite: 4004]. What's he gonna give them to what's he gonna put all 2,000,000 of you in line and do it[cite: 4005]? Like, right[cite: 4006]? Like, there's a, you know, a drug protocol afterwards where you have to go I think what did she say[cite: 4006]? She's getting a an infusion every twenty one days[cite: 4007]? Mhmm[cite: 4013]. Who's doing that[cite: 4007]? Who's paying for that[cite: 4008]? You're gonna go tell the the insurance company right now they're gonna pay for that[cite: 4008]?

Naomi (1:08:20) And she's going flying to Chicago [cite: 4009]

Scott Benner (1:08:22) Because they're only right now, they're only doing the infusions there[cite: 4009].

Naomi (1:08:25) There[cite: 4010]. Right[cite: 4010].

Scott Benner (1:08:26) My point is there are a lot of there are a lot of steps between now and then[cite: 4010]. Yeah[cite: 4011]. I also think things will change a lot between now and then[cite: 4011]. I mean Right[cite: 4011]. One of the things I would imagine and she mentioned is they'll probably try to find a way for you to give yourself the drug at home at some point[cite: 4012]. Right, instead of it being infused, or maybe they can send it to an but these are not things that happen quickly[cite: 4013]. Yeah[cite: 4014]. Right[cite: 4014]?

Social Media Traps vs. Real Community

Naomi (1:08:47) It's hard to not be enthusiastic when all of this news is coming at you so quickly[cite: 4014]. But at the same time, I think it it like you said, you know, it's important to be realistic about [cite: 4014]

Scott Benner (1:08:58) Here's where I'll complain[cite: 4015]. I think it's a bit I need my right word[cite: 4016]. I think it's a little unfortunate that the way social media works and the way that people keep their accounts active and popular is intersecting with this[cite: 4017]. Mhmm[cite: 4017]. Because this is all very exciting[cite: 4017]. You should know about it[cite: 4018]. It's amazing[cite: 4018]. It could very well end up being what ends up happening for people[cite: 4019]. But when you give it to people in TikToks and Mhmm [cite: 4020]

Scott Benner (1:09:33) Instagram reels, it makes it feel like it's happening now[cite: 4021].

Naomi (1:09:36) Tomorrow[cite: 4021].

Scott Benner (1:09:37) Yeah[cite: 4021]. Is not happening right now[cite: 4022].

Naomi (1:09:39) Yeah[cite: 4022].

Scott Benner (1:09:40) Right[cite: 4023]? And so my fear becomes is that people will go, well, I don't really have to bolus that one fifty because I'm gonna get [cite: 4023]

Naomi (1:09:49) I'm gonna be cured [cite: 4023]

Scott Benner (1:09:50) if I treat it[cite: 4023]. Jam islets cells [cite: 4024]

Naomi (1:09:52) islets cells[cite: 4024].

Scott Benner (1:09:52) In my liver, and then I'm gonna take in some juice[cite: 4024]. And then I'm gonna because they only heard, you know, the TikTok version of what's going on[cite: 4025].

Naomi (1:10:00) Right[cite: 4025].

Scott Benner (1:10:01) And also the people who are doing a good job of sharing their story, it also makes it feel like it's everybody[cite: 4026]. So for the same reason that they'll tell you social media is bad for young women, for exact example[cite: 4027]. Right[cite: 4028]? Like, nobody holds a camera in front of themselves when they're not looking great Mhmm [cite: 4028] and doesn't and they're not at the beach or in the best part of their day or whatever[cite: 4029]. And so what happens is young girls see that, and they think my life's not that exciting[cite: 4030]. I don't always look this good[cite: 4031]. Like, blah blah blah[cite: 4031]. Makes It people feel badly[cite: 4031]. I think that that same thing of having someone stand up and constantly telling you how well their trial is going makes it feel like, oh god[cite: 4032]. That's a thing that exists right now, and I don't have it[cite: 4033]. And I don't think that's I don't think it exists right now[cite: 4034]. It exists right now for those people [cite: 4034]

Naomi (1:10:48) Mhmm[cite: 4034].

Scott Benner (1:10:49) Which is awesome[cite: 4035].

Naomi (1:10:50) And it's it's really a handful of people[cite: 4036]. It's like [cite: 4036]

Scott Benner (1:10:53) I am certainly not down on it[cite: 4036]. I think it's awesome[cite: 3955]. I just think that if [cite: 3955]

Naomi (1:10:57) step in the right direction, but it could be years before[cite: 4037].

Scott Benner (1:11:01) Yeah[cite: 4038]. Just keep in mind that my daughter's had diabetes for twenty years, and the Walgreens gave her the wrong test strips the other day[cite: 4038]. I've been getting them there[cite: 4039].

Naomi (1:11:10) Never ends[cite: 4039].

Scott Benner (1:11:11) Never ends[cite: 4039]. And you're and I'm telling you that there's an infrastructure in place that relies on people and money[cite: 4040]. Another thing[cite: 3755]! Right[cite: 3756]? 13 infusions over thirteen days[cite: 4042]. It could push off the the onset of your type one diabetes for a couple of years maybe if if you catch it in time[cite: 4042]. I've interviewed people who have done it[cite: 4043]. Right[cite: 4043]? Yeah[cite: 4043]. But they had to fly somewhere, put themselves in a hotel for thirteen days[cite: 4044]. Their insurance didn't wanna cover[cite: 4045]. They fought with insurance over and over and over again[cite: 4045]. While they were fighting with their insurance, they were losing the time they needed to get the thing[cite: 4046]. It almost didn't happen[cite: 4047]. Blah blah blah blah blah[cite: 4047]. I don't know what it actually cost in cash[cite: 4048]. I'm sure it's millions of dollars[cite: 4048]. Like, you know what I mean[cite: 4049]? Point being, like, there's not a, I don't know, a building full of Band Aids right now, and we're just trying to figure out how to get them to your house[cite: 4049]. Like, that's not what's happening right now[cite: 4050].

Naomi (1:12:02) Yeah[cite: 4050].

Scott Benner (1:12:02) Right[cite: 4050]? There's there's so many confusing steps that need to happen between the excitement you're seeing with these people, and I am genuinely excited by it, and you actually having access to it that I don't think my answer to your question is is that I don't think that it's time to get excited that it's coming[cite: 4051].

Naomi (1:12:23) Okay[cite: 4052]. Yeah[cite: 4052]. Yeah[cite: 4052]. I think it's time [cite: 4052]

Naomi (1:12:25) That's a good perspective[cite: 4110]. I mean, I'm really looking forward to listening to [cite: 4053]

Scott Benner (1:12:29) Me too[cite: 4053].

Naomi (1:12:29) Your interview with doctor Witowski and Yeah [cite: 4054] and see what he says about it[cite: 4054]. But yeah[cite: 4054]. I mean, I think that's people have been saying too, you know, oh, twenty years ago, they said a cure is right around the corner[cite: 4055]. Yeah[cite: 4056]. And I I'm like you[cite: 4056]. I mean, I'm I'm very excited by it, and, obviously, it is a step in the right direction[cite: 4056]. But I understand what you're saying about, you know, the process of getting from there to all type one diabetic diabetics no longer needing insulin[cite: 4057].

Scott Benner (1:12:55) Yeah[cite: 4058]. I mean, I saw a guy on Instagram, and, you know, he got it one time, and it it lowered his insulin needs but didn't stop them[cite: 4058]. And then they had to bring him back and give him more cells[cite: 4059]. They they that's part of the process, apparently[cite: 4060]. And so this is still in the testing phase[cite: 4060]. They're trying to figure out, you know, how much to give you to get the outcome you're looking for[cite: 4061]. Like, they don't know any of I'm gonna guess that guy's gonna tell you, like, look[cite: 4062]. I've got an idea, but, you know, I'm gonna have to do this 50, a 100 more times before I even have an answer[cite: 4063].

Naomi (1:13:25) Yes[cite: 4064]. And is it is it worth it to just delay you're, you know, you're delaying the progression, but if you're still gonna get it and need insulin anyway, you know, insulin's not a bad thing[cite: 4064].

Scott Benner (1:13:35) I don't know that any of us know where it's gonna end[cite: 4065]. So I'm excited to talk to him because I'm gonna ask him those questions[cite: 4066]. Okay[cite: 4066]. And I try I I and quite honestly, I I almost recorded with him, like, five months ago, and then there was a scheduling problem[cite: 4067]. So, like, it took this long to fix like, to to get back around it again[cite: 4068].

Naomi (1:13:51) And Good[cite: 4068]. And now now is probably the better time to talk to him[cite: 4069].

Scott Benner (1:13:54) Maybe[cite: 4069]. Yeah[cite: 4069]. And hopefully[cite: 4070]. And hopefully, listen[cite: 4070]. Hopefully, it's a great conversation[cite: 4070]. The guy comes back on every six months and gives you a little update about what's happening and gives you a feeling, but I'm gonna ask him[cite: 4071]. Maybe he'll tell me differently[cite: 4072]. Maybe he'll say no, Scott[cite: 4072]. Get real excited[cite: 4072]. Like, you know what I mean[cite: 4073]?

Scott Benner (1:14:08) I don't know what he's gonna say[cite: 4073].

Naomi (1:14:09) Well, I'll be list I'll be listening for sure[cite: 4074]. And Thank you[cite: 4074]. Also, please thank Jenny for me because she really taught me everything I needed to know about Omnipod use[cite: 4075].

Scott Benner (1:14:17) Oh, you're welcome[cite: 4076]. I'll I'll let her know[cite: 4076].

Naomi (1:14:19) Appreciate that[cite: 4076].

Scott Benner (1:14:20) Yeah[cite: 4077]. Yeah[cite: 4077]. I mean, would've it been nice if you would have ended saying how valuable the podcast was for you[cite: 4077]. But sure, Jenny[cite: 4078]. As well[cite: 4078]. No, Jenny[cite: 4078].

Naomi (1:14:25) I mean, I think I did I think I did allude to that[cite: 4079].

Scott Benner (1:14:27) Yeah[cite: 4079]. I know[cite: 4079]. But this was the last thing people hear[cite: 4080]. You know what mean[cite: 4080]? And this is what sticks in their head[cite: 4081]. Scott doesn't think that the cure is coming, and Jenny's better[cite: 4081]. That's what they're gonna leave this with[cite: 4082].

Naomi (1:14:38) Scott thinks there's no heal hope, [cite: 4082]

Scott Benner (1:14:40) and Jenny's awesome[cite: 4082]. Scott's a hopeless and Jenny's awesome[cite: 4083]. I'm very hopeful about it, and Jenny is awesome[cite: 4083]. So...

Naomi (1:14:46) Alright[cite: 4083]. That's great[cite: 4084].

Closing and Handout Resources

Scott Benner (1:14:48) I appreciate you doing this with me[cite: 4084]. I really do[cite: 4084].

Naomi (1:14:50) No[cite: 4085]. Thank you so much[cite: 4085]. And, you know, just really if if it weren't for Juice Box, you know, you can really pick and choose what's right for you in terms of what you need to listen to and what's relevant for you[cite: 4085]. And you've done so much in the die world of diabetes and education[cite: 4086]. So thank you[cite: 4086].

Scott Benner (1:15:05) Naomi, you can't say it now[cite: 4087]. It feels like I bullied you into it[cite: 4087]. You know what mean[cite: 4088]?

Naomi (1:15:08) I didn't even remember that you told me to[cite: 4088].

Scott Benner (1:15:11) I appreciate it very much[cite: 4089]. I actually, did something recently[cite: 4089]. I had a hospital reached out to me and said, can you please make it easier to share the podcast for us[cite: 4090]? So we've been building like a website to like Oh[cite: 4091]. Like where they can kinda go and print from or or text an image of a list of things and stuff like that[cite: 4092].

Naomi (1:15:31) Right[cite: 4093]. Right[cite: 4093].

Scott Benner (1:15:32) I was like, okay[cite: 4093]. Like, I think I got it about where they want it[cite: 4094]. And so I went on to the Facebook group and I was like, hey[cite: 4095]. You know, if you're like a a health care professional who suggests the podcast, could you reach out because I need to, like, share this link with you and see what you think of it[cite: 4096]? And, like, a couple of dozen people reached out in twenty four hours and they were like, oh, I Yeah[cite: 4097]. I I was like, oh, it may I was like, oh, I'm glad this is helping people[cite: 4098]. You know[cite: 4099]? So, hopefully, we'll make it a little easier on the doctors so they can, and the educators because, apparently, they're sharing, like, things they're printing out or, you know [cite: 4099]

Naomi (1:16:03) Right[cite: 4099]. Like a hand like an old school handout or something[cite: 4100]. Yeah[cite: 4100].

Scott Benner (1:16:07) They're they're looking at me, and they're like, could you maybe, you know, make this easier for us, please[cite: 4101]?

Naomi (1:16:12) And, you know, a lot of people some people get their inform you know, people get their information in different ways[cite: 4102]. So for the people that like to listen and are, you know, out and about all the time and have a have earbuds in, you know, it's it's so helpful[cite: 4103]. And the Omnipod one, for sure, and, like, bold beginnings[cite: 4104]. I mean, at the beginning, I really did listen to those over and over again[cite: 4104].

Scott Benner (1:16:33) Yeah[cite: 4105].

Naomi (1:16:33) Because you you pick things up the second time that you missed the first time or you need it reinforced[cite: 4106]. You know[cite: 4107]? And so [cite: 4107]

Scott Benner (1:16:40) I agree[cite: 4107]. I I I think it it's a thing that people do end up going over a number of times when they're trying to teach themselves[cite: 4107].

Naomi (1:16:47) And it's the one thing[cite: 4108]. When when you're diagnosed as a type one diabetic, you're not specifically told this is a disease where you will have to educate yourself and do deep dives yourself[cite: 4108]. Yeah[cite: 4109]. You know, I almost wish I had been told that from the beginning so it wouldn't have been such a shock[cite: 4109]. You know[cite: 4110]?

Scott Benner (1:17:03) Yeah[cite: 4110]. No[cite: 4110]. I hear you because it really does feel like what I really took from what you said earlier was that, like, even though you're focused on it and you're a bright person, you're trying to learn and everything, like, there is still that, like there's there's a an insecurity in your mind[cite: 4110]. Like, am I doing the right thing[cite: 4111]? Is this Right[cite: 4111]. Am I doing too much[cite: 4111]?

Naomi (1:17:21) Feels like a guessing game[cite: 4112].

Scott Benner (1:17:22) Yeah[cite: 4112]. Yeah[cite: 4113]. Yeah[cite: 4113]. Yeah[cite: 4113]. I I that wasn't lost to me that you said that[cite: 4113]. I thought that was really interesting[cite: 4113]. So, anyway, thank you again for doing this[cite: 4114]. Hold on one second for me[cite: 4114]. Okay[cite: 4114]?

Naomi (1:17:31) Okay[cite: 4114].

Scott Benner (1:17:40) A huge thanks to my longest sponsor, Omnipod[cite: 4115]. Check out the Omnipod five now with my link, omnipod.com/juicebox[cite: 4116]. You may be eligible for a free starter kit, a free Omnipod five starter kit at my link[cite: 4117]. Go check it out[cite: 4118]. Omnipod.com/juicebox[cite: 4118]. Terms and conditions apply[cite: 4118]. Full terms and conditions can be found at omnipod.com/juicebox[cite: 4119]. A huge thanks to US Med for sponsoring this episode of the juice box podcast[cite: 4120]. Don't forget, usmed.com/juicebox[cite: 4120]. This is where we get our diabetes supplies from[cite: 4121]. You can as well[cite: 4121]. Use the link or call (888) 721-1514[cite: 3279, 4122]. Use the link or call the number, get your free benefits check so that you can start getting your diabetes supplies the way we do from US Med[cite: 4122].

Scott Benner (1:18:37) Hey, kids[cite: 4123]. Listen up[cite: 4123]. You've made it to the end of the podcast[cite: 4123]. You must have enjoyed it[cite: 4124]. You know what else you might enjoy[cite: 4124]? The private Facebook group for the juice box podcast[cite: 4125]. I know you're thinking, Facebook, Scott, please[cite: 4125]. But no[cite: 4126]. Beautiful group, wonderful people, a fantastic community[cite: 4126]. Juicebox Podcast, type one diabetes on Facebook[cite: 4126]. Of course, if you have type two, are you touched by diabetes in any way, you're absolutely welcome[cite: 4127]. It's a private group, you'll have to answer a couple of questions before you come in[cite: 4128]. We'll make you're not a bot or an evil doer, then you're on your way[cite: 4128]. You'll be part of the family[cite: 4129]. I can't thank you enough for listening[cite: 4129]. Please make sure you're subscribed or following in your audio app[cite: 4130]. I'll be back tomorrow with another episode of the Juice Box podcast[cite: 4131]. Have a podcast[cite: 4131]? Want it to sound fantastic[cite: 4131]? Wrongwayrecording.com[cite: 4132].

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