Scott Benner 6/28/25 Scott Benner 6/28/25

#1562 Best of Juicebox: Getting Off The Diabetes Roller Coaster

You can always listen to the Juicebox Podcast here but the cool kids use: Apple Podcasts/iOS - Spotify - Amazon Music - Google Play/Android - iHeart Radio - Radio Public, Amazon Alexa or wherever they get audio.

From January 2016. Bethany, mom of 4-year-old T1D Will, finds the nerve to be bold with insulin after a phone call with Scott.

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DISCLAIMER: This text is the output of AI based transcribing from an audio recording. Although the transcription is largely accurate, in some cases it is incomplete or inaccurate due to inaudible passages or transcription errors and should not be treated as an authoritative record. Nothing that you read here constitutes advice medical or otherwise. Always consult with a healthcare professional before making changes to a healthcare plan.

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Scott Benner 6/27/25 Scott Benner 6/27/25

#1561 After Dark: Significant Addiction

Breaking the Cycle — Robert Steps Up for His Family

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Scott Benner 0:00
Friends, we're all back together for the next episode of The Juicebox Podcast. Welcome.

Robert 0:15
Hello, everyone. My name is Robert. My wife is a type one, Kelly, and my son now he's newly diagnosed type one, and he's five

Scott Benner 0:24
if you're living with type one diabetes. The after dark collection from the Juicebox Podcast is the only place to hear the stories that no one else talks about, from drugs to depression, self harm, trauma, addiction and so much more. Go to Juicebox podcast.com. Up in the menu and click on after dark there, you'll see a full list of all of the after dark episodes. Nothing you hear on the Juicebox Podcast should be considered advice medical or otherwise, always consult a physician before making any changes to your healthcare plan.

This episode of The Juicebox Podcast is sponsored by the twist AI D system powered by tidepool that features the twist loop algorithm, which you can target to a glucose level as low as 87 Learn more at twist.com/juicebox, that's twist with two eyes.com/juicebox. Get precision insulin delivery with a target range that you choose at twist.com/juicebox, that's t, w, i, i s, t.com/juicebox. This episode of The Juicebox Podcast is sponsored by the contour next gen blood glucose meter. Learn more and get started today at contour next.com/juicebox this episode of the juice box podcast is sponsored by Medtronic diabetes and their mini med 780 G system designed to help ease the burden of diabetes management, imagine fewer worries about Miss boluses or miscalculated carbs thanks to meal detection technology and automatic correction doses. Learn more and get started today at Medtronic diabetes.com/juicebox

Speaker 1 2:19
Hello, everyone. My name is Robert. My wife is a type one, Kelly, and my son now is newly diagnosed type one, and he's

Scott Benner 2:25
five. He's five. Wow. How old was he when he was diagnosed? We actually

Speaker 1 2:30
thanks to Kelly. So she was diagnosed in 2012 or not, 2012 uh, when was when she was 12. She actually caught Madden when he was really early on with stage one one night he while he pissed through his diaper. And she thought, well, that's weird. He didn't drink that much. She tested his blood sugar, and I think it was 253, if I recall correctly. And she thought, well, that's weird. I'm gonna take him into the doctor. And then they did a antibodies test and found two antibodies and that he was spilling glucose into his urine. And so he actually got tracked from the age of two until about a month ago, month and a half ago, officially hit full diagnosis.

Scott Benner 3:12
So let me kind of pick through it this way. You meet your wife. How old is she? How old are you?

Speaker 1 3:17
Let's see, I was 18, she was 19. And how old are

Scott Benner 3:20
you now? 31 and 32 okay, and you got married at how? At what

Speaker 1 3:25
age? Oh, let's see, it would have been nine years ago. Shoot, I don't know, 2122 somewhere in

Scott Benner 3:31
there. I think you're supposed to remember that off the top of your head, Yeah, nah, that's fine. Like, watch this. I was married on August 3, 1996 see that by always, say

Speaker 1 3:40
this. I mean, yeah, that's fair. Yeah, I was married March 7, 2016 I just not that fast in math. I don't

Scott Benner 3:45
think it's math when you're talking about dates, but I hear what you're saying. My point is, you've been with her for a very long time. She's had diabetes for that entire time, right? Correct, right? And so you've been living with it for a while. So from your perspective, what is her type one diabetes from your perspective? Oh, how do you mean? What do you see as her life like? If you had to describe her life with type one, what would you describe it as?

Speaker 1 4:10
Currently, just another day in the life? I mean, there's not really much difference. I will say I have seen, in my opinion, from my point of view, a pretty amazing transformation. So when I met Kelly, we both actually started working at Super Target, and that's where I met her. I still remember the first time I saw her. It was like it was out of a movie. Fantastic. Oh how so tell me. So I was walking to go clock in, and she had just walked out of the break room area where she had just clocked in and legitimately flipped her hair a little bit, and right there it was just it was done. I was locked in. And then I was nervous for like a month to even talk to her. And then I remember, I went through her line. She was doing check out, I think I bought, like a Snickers bar I didn't even want, and went to walk away. And I was like, Hey, can I get your number? And then it just started this crazy life that we have. Wow.

Scott Benner 5:00
She said, Yes, surprisingly, I don't know why she was probably like, I could use that snicker if I get low. This is awesome,

Speaker 1 5:06
pretty much. So when I met Kelly, you know, she managed it to stay alive, but didn't really put a whole lot of effort into it, for lack of a better term. And then when she ended up getting pregnant with our oldest, Bailey, who is now 10, it was like a light switch. Her a 1c, and I could be wrong on this, I want to say was around 1111, and a half, when she got pregnant with Bailey. And by the time Bailey was born, it was down in like the fives and sixes, and she's pretty well maintained that six Mark ever since, when

Scott Benner 5:39
she's living with like an 11 and you guys are dating and married. Do you understand? Like, I can't ask her what her understanding was of it, but like, do you understand that there's a lot of ceiling to do better, and that this could be dangerous for her and is actually dangerous for her?

Speaker 1 5:55
Now, yes, at that time, had no idea. Okay, I knew nothing about type one diabetes. This is a shameful thing on my part. But even after we got married, I was it was her thing. I pretty well stayed out of it unless she either got low or was insanely high. Do

Scott Benner 6:11
you know? Why was it conscious? Were you like, Oh, this is her thing. She doesn't want me involved in it. Or were you just happy not to have to be involved? You do know,

Speaker 1 6:19
it was more of a I tried to just respect her space. And in hindsight, you know, years in it, I should have been more involved with it, to just have an understanding and be a part of it. But she never said, Hey, Eric. Never asked. I should say, Do you have an interest in learning, or I would like you to learn this? And I tried to disrespect her privacy, even though we were married and had been together for ever.

Scott Benner 6:41
Have you talked about it since then? Absolutely, were you doing the right thing or, like, is that what she wanted? I guess is my question.

Speaker 1 6:49
You know, I've never asked her that. We've talked about it a lot in other aspects, but I've never asked her, like, Hey, did you want me involved? Or did you not?

Scott Benner 6:58
I just heard myself the other day, which is the thing that doesn't get to happen for most people. I heard myself having a conversation about something, and it just reminds me now that I've been alive for so long, has taught me that no matter what I'm experiencing, the people around me are having a different experience, and that, you know, you can be doing something and just think like this is the right thing to do. I know it is. It feels good. I'm looking at everybody. Everybody seems good with it. And you ask somebody else later, and they said, No, I wish you would have done that, or I wish you wouldn't have done that, or that made me feel this way, or like you never really know how other people are experiencing the same exact thing as you just so odd. But you know, so I'm what, yeah, so I'm like, You're, saying, like, good faith. Like, hey, this is a thing. She's had it for a long time. She says she's doing okay. Like, everything seems fine. I'd like to give her space. Like, what if she was sitting over there thinking, God, like, I wish he'd like jump in with this. Or maybe he she's thinking, guys handling this exactly right. This is why I love the guy. So, yeah, you don't know.

Speaker 1 7:59
Nope. And guess what, when we get off this call, I'm gonna go inside and ask her,

Scott Benner 8:03
yeah, that's good idea. Go start a fight right now. That'd be awesome. Oh,

Unknown Speaker 8:06
hey, at this point I look for the fights.

Scott Benner 8:10
Keep things fresh. Oh, absolutely. It's a Friday. You could ruin the whole weekend if you tried hard enough. Let's

Speaker 1 8:15
go with Scott's blessing. I hereby ruin Easter weekend.

Scott Benner 8:20
I don't know where the eggs are. Ask your mom,

Unknown Speaker 8:24
she would kill me. That's

Scott Benner 8:26
awesome. I've recorded with her recently. Is that right? Correct? Like, a week and a half ago or so? But I don't think we spoke about you. Does that surprise you? Not at all. Okay, she's moving along. She gets pregnant. Or you guys don't know if you do it on purpose or not, one way or the other, she's pregnant. How old is pregnant. How old is she? Do you think then? Like, what year is

Speaker 1 8:45
that? Let's see, I want to say she was 20 and I was 19. Oh, wow. She had Yeah, she was almost 21 I was 20. They was right there. It was not very long. Robert,

Scott Benner 8:55
am I right to say that this wasn't you guys going, like, you know what we should do? We should make a baby.

Speaker 1 8:58
No, this was I was in the shower, and somebody decided to climb in with me one day. She

Scott Benner 9:04
gotta stop flipping her hair around. Honestly. Listen, people gotta take responsibility for where their hair goes. So do you guys get married because she's pregnant?

Speaker 1 9:13
No, we actually just remained dating for a while. It was kind of chaotic. A little backstory on her pregnancy and whatnot. It was really complicated. She had all sorts of issues, pre eclampsia, obviously, type one. Ironically, you might be able to answer this. Do most women, when they are pregnant have really good, like, control of blood sugars and what have you?

Scott Benner 9:34
Oh, gosh, it's seasonal, like within the pregnancy, fair, yeah, there's a time where it's it's easier than there's a time where your your insulin needs ramp and ramp and ramp and ramp and go crazy. And then some women report that literally, after giving birth to the placenta, their blood sugars go like, right back to normal again. And then Breastfeeding can mess it up. It's like, it's a roller coaster of hormonal impact. Six, really.

Speaker 1 10:00
So I kind of assumed beings, you know, everybody's different, but with Kelly, all three pregnancies, you would never guess that she was type one. Yes, she still took a little bit of insulin here and there, but it was wild. Like her blood sugar is just a virtual flat line the entire time. No issues at all. Yeah, wild.

Scott Benner 10:17
And it's super interesting. And so that. So that first time she's 20 in that you guys are in that age there, like, 2021, 19, right in there. And she's been, you know, like you said, double digit, a one sees staying alive, but not doing well for herself. What do you think changed her? Like, you were there, right? Like, what did you see that flipped the switch?

Speaker 1 10:38
I was not actually there. A lot of it. We have a real we have a wonderfully wild life. She has talked about recently that really it came down to her endocrinologist asking her, Hey, essentially, do you want your child to live? I mean, I'm that's very crude, but hey, if you don't get this under control, that your baby's not going to survive. And that was the light switch. Okay, that changed it all. And now, ever since she's had masterful control of everything, and it's been awesome.

Scott Benner 11:06
Were you at Lollapalooza Robert during this or,

Speaker 1 11:09
Oh, no, I was in Cancun on screen, Britain. I'm just kidding. No, we just, we had a really, really rough, I don't wanna say childhood, because we weren't kids. We were adults. But when we were first together, the first, like, two, two and a half years or so, pretty rough. Even the first couple years of marriage, pretty rough due to a lot of mistakes I made. No, I never cheated on her and never did anything like that. Just said a lot of dumb stuff, and, hell, we can dissect that if you want. I hear that you like to, uh, solve people's problems, but I'm

Scott Benner 11:37
just trying to make a podcast, Robert, if you feel better when it's over. That's a bonus

Speaker 1 11:41
day. There you go. But no all said and done, I missed a lot of when she was pregnant with Bailey. My mom also had stage four cancer at the time advanced, so I was kind of between that and Kelly, and there was a lot going on. But I have

Scott Benner 11:56
to imagine, if you're if you and your girlfriend are pregnant at that age, not on purpose. It probably turns chaotic very quickly after that. Yeah, yeah, absolutely. I can't imagine. Not like, shower sex was probably the last great thing that happened for a while, for a little bit, yeah, at some point, you pulled your head out of your ass. Is that fair? Yeah, okay, and then you get together. It's not easy, but you you're saying that at some point, like, you got through all that, like, there's a rocky part in the beginning of the marriage, but like, there's a point where you find, like, happiness, and you know how to do it all of a sudden, or not all of a sudden, but eventually, yeah,

Speaker 1 12:32
that was, like, a year and a half ago. We've been married almost 10 years. You just figured it out, not just figured it out, yeah, I

Scott Benner 12:37
started acting like an adult four years ago. Just in case you're wondering, there you go. Are you being serious? Would you characterize her as putting up with you until that point? Yes,

Speaker 1 12:47
absolutely. There is no reason that she should have stayed married to me to this long again. I'm not a bad person. Great husband. All that, just emotionally very

Scott Benner 12:55
dumb. Okay, let's put it that way. What brought you around,

Unknown Speaker 13:01
Kelly, threatening to divorce me. Finally,

Scott Benner 13:04
she's like, You got to figure out how to be an adult, or I'm gonna quickly. Yeah, yep,

Speaker 1 13:08
fix your shit, or I'm out. I said, All right, everything's fixed. Got it.

Scott Benner 13:11
Don't worry about I know what to do now. Is it that simple, Robert? Did you know what to do and you just were like, it's easier to screw around. Or did she need to tell you what it was? Or did you have to go seek out some help somewhere else? Contour, next.com/juicebox that's the link you'll use to find out more about the contour, next gen blood glucose meter. When you get there, there's a little bit at the top. You can click right on blood glucose monitoring. I'll do it with you. Go to meters, click on any of the meters. I'll click on the Next Gen, and you're going to get more information. It's easy to use and highly accurate. Smart light provides a simple understanding of your blood glucose levels, and of course, with Second Chance sampling technology, you can save money with fewer wasted test strips. As if all that wasn't enough, the contour next gen also has a compatible app for an easy way to share and see your blood glucose results. Contour next.com/juicebox and if you scroll down at that link, you're going to see things like a Buy Now button. You could register your meter after you purchase it. Or what is this? Download a coupon, oh, receive a free contour, next gen blood glucose meter. Do tell contour next.com/juicebox head over there. Now get the same accurate and reliable meter that we use. Today's episode is sponsored by Medtronic diabetes, who is making life with diabetes easier with the mini med 780 G system, the MiniMed 780 G automated insulin delivery system, anticipates, adjusts and corrects every five minutes. Real world results show people achieving up to 80% time and range with recommended settings, without increasing lows. But of course, Individual results may vary. The seven. 80 G works around the clock so you can focus on what matters. Have you heard about Medtronic extended infusion set? It's the first and only infusion set labeled for up to a seven day wear. This feature is repeatedly asked for, and Medtronic has delivered. 97% of people using the 780 G reported that they could manage their diabetes without major disruptions of sleep, they felt more free to eat what they wanted, and they felt less stress with fewer alarms and alerts. You can't beat that. Learn more about how you can spend less time and effort managing your diabetes by visiting Medtronic diabetes.com/juicebox

Speaker 1 15:39
I've actually sought out help, whether that be personal counseling. We've been seeing a marriage counselor for what, three years, something like that. Now I go to various meetings for various issues, just trying to work on it. Now, in hindsight, to my benefit, she told me years ago what I needed to change and fix, but it just in one ear out the other ear, and it wasn't until that year and a half, two years ago, that she finally nailed it home. What were those things? Oh, let's see. So I guess a little bit more backstory as well. To circle back, we didn't get married until after I joined the army when Bailey was six months old. I was unemployed. I had been fired the day that Bailey was born because I requested time off for my job. It was a whole cluster. And first six months, Kelly basically floated everything, and then I joined the Army just to provide for my daughter. I was gone for almost a year before I saw them again between various trainings and what have you we ended up getting married at a courthouse, unfortunately, before I deployed, and then I was gone another year, and almost a year and a half before I was actually home, and steadily in home for a while. So it was pretty rocky at the start, and now I don't remember

Scott Benner 16:53
what your question was, just what were the things that you had to fix? Oh, that's

Speaker 1 16:57
right. Okay, so all of that being said, over the years, unfortunately, and it got really bad. My second deployment was a pretty bad porn addiction. I'm pretty ashamed to say that, but it was pre bad, okay, I came home from my second deployment and she found, you know, browser history, if you will. That was from, you know, just a couple days of being home, and at that point even said, Hey, that needs to stop now, or I'm out. And I didn't really believe her. To me at that time, it was just kind of a, oh, this is a normal thing, whatever. She's just overreacting. And I didn't really let it sink into what she was saying. And then for about three and a half or so years, three years after that, just I hit it, I hit it, I hit it. And finally she found it one night, and then I lied about it. And it wasn't the porn issue, it was the lying about it. And that's when she said, yeah, you can get out. You need to get fixed. I'm done. I'm not going to deal with this anymore. And the first and only time I've ever begged in my life, I begged her not to go anywhere. She said, You need to find some meetings or something, get some help. Position, it's not going to fly. And so from that day on, I went, started going to SAA, and I just hit one year of being free of that, that nonsense. And awesome. Good for you. Yeah, yeah, turn my life around. Man, it's

Scott Benner 18:16
crazy. I mean, it's might not sound crazy to you, but it feels crazy to me. In the last 30 days, you're now the second guy that's told me this. And when he told me, I was like, Get out of here. And he said, No, it ruined his marriage, and, like, you know, everything else. And I was like, I was like, Oh, okay. I'm like, and I thought to myself, I'll never hear that again. And now here we are. So what does a porn addiction look

Speaker 1 18:37
like? Oh, boy. We're talking two or three times a day of watching content and whatnot, whether I was here at home with family, you know, lock the self in the bathroom, type deal, you know, being at work, using a stall at work, whatever it might be, like, there's it was bad, and I'm ashamed beyond all belief to admit that and even say it. But it's reality. It's what happened.

Scott Benner 18:58
You're not watching it like war and peace. You're watching it, like, functionally, right? Yeah, yeah. Gotcha. You're not like, Oh, I love the plot of this one. Let us settle in and get through I wonder what's going to happen next. There's no way to know. How old are you now? 31

Unknown Speaker 19:14
I just hit 31 in February. Okay, you're

Scott Benner 19:17
a couple of generations removed from me. Like, as far as how we grew up. What's the attraction of digital over live? Because Kelly wasn't telling you you can't be with me, right? No, okay, no. What's the draw?

Speaker 1 19:36
So there's, there's a couple things with it. Firstly, I mean, my wife and I are great now, but when we were younger, truth be told, I'm just a terrible communicator when it comes to personal things, especially on the emotional level. I just recently learned how to do all that stuff, so we never really communicated. Therefore, the sex life was kind of not where both of us wanted it. For example, I was going for a little bit more often, whereas Kelly is you. Pretty content with not very often, and works with me. It's mind blowing either way. And truthfully, the addiction part started really bad during my second deployment. It started with as almost like a sleep therapy, because the schedule that I was on and the routines we had and all that, like it was really tough to get sleep and or fall asleep. And then it kind of just it snowballed over the year that I was deployed, and then after that, for a couple of years, it was pretty

Scott Benner 20:30
bad. By the end, yeah, you were using it like a sleeping pill at first,

Speaker 1 20:33
at first, right? And then it just became routine and everything. And truth be told, and I've told Kelly this too, there was a I was glad that she found it. In the end, though, it almost ruined my marriage, because for about two years, I internally was battling with depression and stuff due to it, because I wanted to break that and I couldn't. And then her saying I'm out was when I say it genuinely just it broke. It was done. Yeah, it shocked to the system, and I was out.

Scott Benner 20:59
So for two years you wanted it to end, but you just couldn't find a way to make it end, correct, right? Wow, does it escalate? Like, this is a question I asked the last person too, and I'm gonna, I'm gonna ask it to you too. Like, does what it takes for it to work? Like, does the dose need to change? You know what I'm saying? Does your search history get weirder and weirder as time goes on. The brand new twist insulin pump offers peace of mind with unmatched personalization and allows you to target a glucose level as low as 87 there are more reasons why you might be interested in checking out twist, but just in case that one got you twist.com/juicebox. That's twist with two eyes.com/juicebox. You can target glucose levels between 87 and 180 it's completely up to you. In addition to precision insulin delivery that's made possible by twist design, twist also offers you the ability to edit your carb entries even after you've bolused. This gives the twist loop algorithm the best information to make its decisions with, and the twist loop algorithm lives on the pump, so you don't have to stay next to your phone for it to do its job. Twist is coming very soon. So if you'd like to learn more or get on the wait list, go to twist.com/juicebox. That's twist with two eyes.com/juicebox. Links in the show notes, links at Juicebox podcast.com.

Speaker 1 22:28
No, luckily, luckily. I was not somebody that had to get into the like rampant, weird, yep, because, hey, some of my soldiers in the past, the things they talk about was just wild. Okay, no, but there were days when it 3045, minutes, just, there's no desire to do it, but, like, it just, it had to be done type thing. Does that make sense? I

Scott Benner 22:48
mean, I'm hearing you, yeah, like, but you could, like, if, if, like, babysitter brunette was your thing. Like, you could handle that the whole time. Like you didn't have to start saying babysitter brunette on a Ferris wheel or be like, that

Speaker 1 22:59
kind of thing. Yeah, I got you pretty much. Okay, short, sweet, to the point, gotcha. Gosh,

Scott Benner 23:03
it's an interesting problem. Do you see a connection between it now that you're free of it, between it and and just regular social media? Does it have the same draw as social media, or is it different because it has the sexual, like, like, the physical touch aspect to it as

Speaker 1 23:17
well? Well, I'm not really a big social media person, okay,

Scott Benner 23:21
so you're not overtaken by Instagram or Tiktok or something like you could do that. You wouldn't, you wouldn't get caught up in it. No, okay, it's more about the the ACT than it is about right, yeah, then the scrolling or being on your phone or something like that. Yeah. Did you ever feel weird handing other people your phone because it was also your sex device?

Speaker 1 23:40
Oh, god, yeah. Anytime that Kelly would be like, Hey, can I see your phone real quick? Immediately? You know, you always see those memes of somebody sweating or whatever. It's like, oh god, what's gonna happen? Did I clear this? Did I clear that? Did I delete this, that? I delete that, whatever it might be. Yeah. Now don't care.

Scott Benner 23:55
Now you're okay. Now, okay, oh yeah. Well, I also was thinking, like, you ever been in a place and you, like, check out and, like, you like reading a code, and like, the person to the register is like, here, just give me it. I'll just read it off there. And you're like, I'm like, I don't know if I wash my hands, like, recently, like, this is my phone. It's filthy. Like, you know what I mean? Like, I don't think you should be and they just grab it. I'm like, uh, I don't know. Like, anyway, Okay, I'm back. I'm asking a serious crowd. I'm not trying to be funny. Like, I just yeah, like, you know, if you're handing it to her and you're like, Oh, sweetie, listen, don't, don't take the phone. Yeah?

Speaker 1 24:24
I mean, yeah, internally, yes, yeah, I would never say it out loud, because that was a red flag,

Scott Benner 24:29
yeah, yeah. But that was part of it too, though, right? Like, part of the Depression part, I would imagine, correct? Oh, absolutely, that you're hiding things, hiding things, hiding things constantly. Do you think if you would have went to her and said, This is a problem for me, but I don't want to get rid like, imagine you didn't want to get rid of it. Could you say to her, can we incorporate this into our life? Do you think she'd be like, Oh, God, weirdo, get away from me. Or do you think she would have said, if this is something that's important to you, I can talk to

Speaker 1 24:55
you about it now. Yes, that being said, I want nothing to do with it. Still, almost. In my life never it's interesting. And I only say that because there was, at one point, shortly after she found it and told me she was done, that she even said she's like, it wasn't the porn, it was the issue. In fact, I was actually batting around the idea of, like, exploring it together. It's the fact that you lied to me about it, blatantly to my face, and then tried to lie about the lie. That's where the issue was lying at

Scott Benner 25:23
Gotcha. Do you have any other Did you have any other addictions? Do you alcohol, drugs, anything like that?

Speaker 1 25:28
Nothing. Never. I've never drank a day in my life. I've never done any drugs in my life.

Scott Benner 25:33
Nope. Do you think if you were born 20 years sooner, you would have had a pile of magazines somewhere? Or do you think that this is a function of the time.

Speaker 1 25:42
I would say yes, only because my father had a pile of things. In fact, that is partially what ruined his marriage to my mother

Scott Benner 25:49
and you knew about it. Unfortunately, his thing might have almost ruined your thing. Yeah, yeah. And you have boys. I have one boy and two girls. You might have broken a

Speaker 1 26:00
cycle here. I really hope so. And unlike my father and his father, if you will, I will actually talk to my son about, like, Hey, listen up. Man, this will ruin your life. Don't let it.

Scott Benner 26:10
It's interesting. Man, it really is. I mean, the access is, is unprecedented. I mean, for all the good you can do with it, the access there's, I mean, there's obviously the opposite problems this morning, even, like I told you before we started, I'm interviewing tight end from the Chiefs later today. I know what I want to talk to him about. Like, I have a vibe already. I've got some questions that people sent in. I know what I want to do, but I still thought, like, let me get background. And I just opened up. Like, while I was taking out the dogs this morning, I put my headphones in, I opened up chat GPT, and I said, I'm interviewing Noah Gray from the Kansas City Chiefs today, and I want to learn more about him. And then I had a full on conversation with my phone for 10 minutes. It's wild. It is, like, it really is crazy. But you know, for every moment like that, where it's valuable, like, I guess, you know, there can be others, so, okay, a lot of others. Yeah, all right, so you, anyway, you did this. And you, I mean, it's an amazing thing. How many years do you think it took you to, like, get through the process?

Speaker 1 27:06
So that's the thing too. Like, it wasn't really a problem from the years of about, let's say 2017, till 2020, that three, four year time frame, and then it was during the first deployment, and then the years following. So I would say a total of, let's see one. We'll say four years, four years total, where it was really, really

Scott Benner 27:25
bad, and then a year for you to go through, like, treatment for it. Correct, did your insurance cover that? It's all free. Oh, is it awesome? Oh, like, aa, kind of a vibe, yeah, basically, okay, wow, that's great. So, like, a public meeting helped you with it. Correct, I've been

Speaker 1 27:40
going to this meeting for, yeah, like I said, I just hit a year. It's all free. It's it's awesome. Is it in person? It's all over, zoom. Okay, there's people from all over the world to join in. Do

Scott Benner 27:51
you see them? Or are they? They stay private, and you see like somebody leading the meeting.

Speaker 1 27:56
It's your choice. You can choose to have camera on or off. They encourage camera on, just because it gives that more homely feel, I guess, or like, the actual community

Scott Benner 28:05
feel, but you can turn it off if you prefer when you saw other people. Did you think? Like, Was it one of those things where you're like, Wow, I can't believe, like, how shockingly normal everyone is here, like, like, because I would imagine you you kind of worry that you're about to turn on a camera to find out you're part of a very strange group. But then you realize, no, these are just like everybody like me. Yeah, I definitely

Speaker 1 28:27
went in. I mean, the very first meeting, for example, I did not turn on my camera. I said, Hello, and that was it. Was just nervous. Didn't know what to expect in anything. Second and third meeting, same thing. And then finally, the fourth meeting, I actually spoke up, but I anticipated, you know, seeing the, let's see stereotypical, you know, 45 year old male who hasn't left his mother's basement. And, yeah, you know, whatever. And it wasn't, it was just normal people living normal lives, with careers and families and just normal people looking for help.

Scott Benner 28:59
It's really interesting. Oh, okay, well, I'm glad that exists. Where is you in a plug where somebody could go get help for that?

Speaker 1 29:06
It's just sex out as sex addicts, anonymous, so they deal with either like sex addiction and or porn addiction. I don't have a plug. I didn't even think

Scott Benner 29:14
to No, that's fine. Did this help your personal relationship? Like, did it take things to where you wanted it to be, or is it now just a process of building back?

Speaker 1 29:24
Oh, absolutely, which, I mean it. I don't know if we have enough time in the day to to dig all that apart, but yes, I mean, I have never been, and this is going to sound cheesy and cliche, but like, I've never been more in love with Kelly. I've never been more, for lack of a better term, obsessed with my life. I can't take my eyes off of her, where, in the past, she was a shadow in the background. Unfortunately, our marriage has never been better. I'm 100% dedicated to my wife. I even told her the other days I'm like, you know, in the past, Kel I would have said the kids take precedence over you, but you want. 100% take precedence over the kids, not because I love them, but because you're who I'm going to be with for the rest of my life. And eventually, the kids will leave home. These little leave us, yeah, god damn right, yeah, sons of

Scott Benner 30:10
gonna give them all my money and my time and attention, and they'll abandon us at the end, when we're old, we can't walk Exactly. And then they'll say things like, Oh, my dad, he's such a pain, or,

Unknown Speaker 30:23
trust me, I'm waiting. I'm waiting for that day.

Scott Benner 30:25
And she accepted you back like, in her heart, you feel like

Speaker 1 30:29
we're getting there. Yeah, it was not immediate. And she said that, and I said, Hey, you take all the time you need now. I did caveat that with Kelly, if 10 years from now, you're still holding on to this, or you're still like, we got problems.

Scott Benner 30:42
Yeah, the stick when I'm not looking or something. Let's be done. Usually

Speaker 1 30:46
it's a frying pan. But yeah, I joke. Of course, nobody calls CPS

Scott Benner 30:50
on us. Nobody's hitting anyone. Please stop

Speaker 1 30:53
honestly. But yeah, I would say it took a few months, probably six, seven months, before she really would start, or started to open up. At least from my perspective, she may have a completely different viewpoint. And now it's, it's almost fully back, yeah, if not better than ever. What

Scott Benner 31:09
do you know how to do now that you didn't know how to do before?

Unknown Speaker 31:12
Just communicate. That's it. Just communicate. I mean,

Scott Benner 31:16
tell people how you feel, not be worried that you're going to be embarrassed by it or that they're going to judge you. Just say it, let it be there pretty

Speaker 1 31:23
much, which is such a crazy thing, because I I've always been able to do that with other people. But when it comes to my wife, was never the case. Why do you think you know I don't know. I just always, I don't even have a I don't have an explanation, yeah, or a reason, not a thought.

Scott Benner 31:39
Just don't want her to judge you or be disappointed in you, maybe, or I'm trying to go through what might motivate me?

Speaker 1 31:45
Yeah. I mean, I can say you just always had that thought of like, you need to be the perfect husband, if that makes sense, or like the perfect man and like, I can't show her my flaws. She'll see how flawed I actually am, and that will cause her to to want to go find better, which, in hindsight, is absolutely ridiculous, not because she can't find better, definitely can. And I tell her that, yeah, but like that, that vulnerability is, is what now has helped us build that, that relationship even

Scott Benner 32:12
higher, and you feel like she appreciates it absolutely. She give it back to you, yeah, yeah. Okay, what have you learned about her diabetes in the last year that you didn't know before. And I'm assuming you've got more mental space now to pay attention like, so is it a thing that you you picked up more about or

Speaker 1 32:30
absolutely like, I've picked up more on hers how to properly now, not in depth as much as how her her algorithm works on her pump, or anything like that. I did have to says, Take this Kelly, when you listen, I had to use a glooguone on her a few months back, and she's never actually had to use one. So I have a W that she doesn't.

Scott Benner 32:49
I was like, see, not everyone's perfect. On the other side, somebody had a seizure.

Unknown Speaker 32:54
I have saved your life. You're welcome.

Scott Benner 32:58
It's tough to be a boy. It happened right there, like, in the house, like,

Speaker 1 33:03
yeah, that whole thing. So she woke up, wasn't feeling well. She was kind of down and out. And it was about a day and a half that she just was she we were battling her lows. Could not keep it up. She couldn't keep anything down. And then one night, it was, like, 530 ish in the evening. Finally, I just decided, like, you know what, we're going to try to open this up and just see what happens, because I can't keep her up. She can't stay conscious more than a couple of minutes. Wow. And then it was, like a week before she fully recovered, but now she's she's good to go. Was

Scott Benner 33:31
she sick? She have an illness?

Speaker 1 33:33
Yeah. I don't know if it was just the flu or a cold or what happened, but she started, she wasn't feeling well, like I said. She kind of just the sweats and the shakes and the chills, and then she started throwing up, and then it just kind of didn't stop. Therefore, we couldn't keep the sugar in her system and all the food, and it just, it was

Scott Benner 33:50
a spiral. It was you, you said, I think we should try glucagon. Yeah.

Speaker 1 33:54
And she'll laugh about this if and when she listens to it, because in the moment, trying to handle three kids, two dogs, all the stuff and her and, like, just manage it like an idiot. She's virtually unresponsive. And I asked her, like, Hey, do you think we should use a glucagon? And as soon as it left my mouth, I was like, you dumb ass, just go get it and do

Scott Benner 34:12
it. Why am I still asking her opinion? She's unconscious? I want to say something that for anyone listening who's not married, is what it feels like to be married when you're a boy, honey, what do you think? I don't want to be wrong, is all I'm saying.

Unknown Speaker 34:28
Honestly, I know there's an answer.

Scott Benner 34:29
So the emergent nature of it allows you to just take the leap,

Speaker 1 34:34
yeah, basically, which, in hindsight, I also should have called 911, but like I said, I was trying to do dinner. Take care of the kids, take care of her. And I did not inevitably call 911, and I should have, I just managed it here at home. And as soon as she started to come back round, she also then started to help me manage her.

Scott Benner 34:51
But was she seizing, or was she just not like No, no,

Speaker 1 34:56
to my knowledge, at least since we've been together, she's never had a seizure. She just passes out and or loses all functionality. That being said, Yeah, I don't think she's ever, ever had a seizure, to my knowledge. Yeah.

Scott Benner 35:08
Can I ask you a weird question? Do you think her desire was to leave you and that you stopped her, or do you think her desire was to get you to stop because she didn't want you guys to break up? I

Speaker 1 35:19
think it's a mixture of both. Like I said, there's a lot of past that also built up to that moment. I mean, hell, a week ago, she just threatened divorce with me. Did you think she meant it? Yeah, I would say so in the moment, but then, you know, the next day, I don't think so. I think she was just pissed off about a couple of things that that had happened. Luckily, nothing to do with me personally, but just frustration overall, I think. So, yeah, so, I mean, in short, we had to get our floor replaced, and one of my good friends did it for us. He's very handy with that kind of stuff, but he didn't listen to her, and he stood up. And so now we're dealing with that,

Scott Benner 35:54
and she's divorcing you because of that, yeah, because I refuse to

Speaker 1 35:58
demand the money back type thing. And it's like, I'm trying to work with him on it, but it's kind of just, it's going to cost us more to fix that error than what a long story can I play

Scott Benner 36:06
devil's advocate here? Is it possible that she feels like she now knows how to get you to do stuff? Who knows? Probably you put your phone down when she said it the last time. So she was probably like, hey, this works. I wonder if I can get my money back for the floor.

Speaker 1 36:19
You're going to get me in trouble. But, yeah, that thought has been, that thoughts been there, not not per se, just to get the money back, but the maybe I can make him do something he doesn't want to. But

Scott Benner 36:29
you're making, you're making me think that, like, six months from now, it's going to be like, I can't believe you didn't weed whack after you cut the grass. I'm going to divorce if you don't get out there and weed whack. Yeah, at that point, bye, get out. No, that's, that's when you'll go, Oh, I didn't understand. This is not a real thing anymore. I got you, she's just, she's working me now, yeah, yeah, no, no, that's something

Speaker 1 36:47
to circle good. Yes, good. I was just gonna say to circle back. But hey, if you got another question, go ahead. No, no. Circle back all of that. Say free headspace, being more committed and more focused on Kelly and like just the marriage and everything, I definitely have learned more with her. And now that our son is officially and he's using the Moby, I am learning all of that as well. And now I'm gathering more of an understanding of how to operate his and handle his which hopefully translates to hers in the coming years, a little bit more efficiently than Yeah, you know my crude knowledge now,

Scott Benner 37:18
can I just say tandem diabetes.com/juicebox Thank you. Sorry, I gotta get the plugs in where I can. Oh, yeah. How do you like the Moby for him?

Speaker 1 37:28
Uh, it's awesome, especially since he's five and doesn't stop moving, even in his sleep half the time, I swear. Yeah, being so small and compact, and we have this little fanny pack for him, and he loves it. He tries to help us change his sights all the time, and anytime we're, you know, giving him a Bolus or anything, or messing with his algorithm, he's on his phone trying to help us do it and learn it and understand it, even at five years old. So nice. A good friend. He's a champ.

Scott Benner 37:53
How did he take being well, I guess. How did you take his diagnosis? Because now you, I mean, you've lived with Kelly for a long time, like, Yeah, you didn't deep understand it, but you still know how serious it is. So when it happens to your son, how does it strike you? So

Speaker 1 38:07
her and I have actually talked about this, that both of us had the same reaction of like, Oh God no, please no. Type deal, because Kelly has and I mean, wealth of us have lived through Kelly and the crap she's gone through. Yeah, that being said, I am beyond grateful that my wife has been dealing with it for two plus decades, because her knowledge base is about the same as yours respectively. So yeah, she's able to help his it has made the transition very smooth. I couldn't even imagine being a parent with a child and not knowing anything about type one, and all of a sudden being slapped in the face with

Scott Benner 38:43
it. Yeah. I mean, listen, you didn't know how to be a person. And look where that got to you exactly. If you could go back to your parents, what would you tell them? They should have told you, oh, all

Speaker 1 38:55
the words I would, if it was me now, I would smack both of them upside the head and have a lot of very mean, vicious words with my parents, but,

Scott Benner 39:04
but once you got after the anger, what would you tell them? Like, hey, look, we're gonna I'm gonna push a reset button and I'm gonna go be eight again, and here's what you need to do.

Speaker 1 39:13
How about you teach your children how to communicate with everybody, let alone people that are important to them, and not just fight, scream, hit each other and get each other

Scott Benner 39:21
arrested. That's what you grew up in. Yeah, yeah. Mostly, that sucks, man. It really is terrible. I'm sorry you don't have a lot of chance to break away from a start like that. It's not, no, I, and I will say, like, not, not an actual plug,

Speaker 1 39:38
but a plug for my family. Like, I have a really, really really big family, lots of aunts and uncles and cousins, and they did help. But yeah, I mean, my dad ended up in jail, I think twice, for hitting my mom, but my mom also was a piece of an egg. Came on. Love you,

Scott Benner 39:51
Mom. Hope Heaven is great. My God, is she not here?

Speaker 1 39:56
No, she died years ago. Oh how cancer she had stretch forward, man. Kidney Cancer. Initially, they gave her six months, and she lived for four years. So she fought like hell. I do respect my mother, but also, in hindsight, she played a lot of the BS games when it comes to divorce and custody and stuff that, in hindsight, ruined any chance of a relationship with our Father, my brothers and I. So,

Scott Benner 40:17
yeah, there's a man that's a lot to deal with. You've seen or been through emotional abuse, physical abuse, a parent incarcerated, any mental illness? Do you think

Speaker 1 40:27
I'm sure it's there in hindsight, never officially diagnosed?

Scott Benner 40:31
Yeah, you're already halfway into the category of those aces, you know, that list that pretty much proves out that you're gonna have trouble as an adult. Good to see that that holds up. Yeah, it's interesting, right? Like, if you could go back and fix that with all them, do you think you would? Because I also think then you wouldn't be in a shower at 19 getting a girl pregnant,

Speaker 1 40:52
truth be told, in reality, no, because, though it has been really rough, I mean, I lived more life by the age of, like, 15 than a lot of people. I'm not going to say most. I've heard some of your episodes, but the a lot like, I had a lot of death and a lot of loss and a lot of just emotional trauma by the age of 1415, yeah, that most don't hit until they're like, 40 or 50, but in hindsight, I mean, it made me who I am today. So as cliche as that may sound, yeah, I would love to change some of my mistakes, but it's gotten me where I'm at. I'm doing pretty well.

Scott Benner 41:27
I told a story to Arden last night from my, like, my late teens, and I realized, like, this is too far generationally, like, removed, like, it sounds insane to her and and I was like, but that was, like, nobody thought that was even weird when it happened, when it happened. Yeah, it's interesting how, how things morph over time. I heard you say something earlier that, like, it sounds like you listen to the podcast too. Yes, I tried to, but you listened to it, just to try to understand what Kelly's listening

Speaker 1 41:59
to initially. Yes, again. When she found your podcast a few years back, I was still in just the bad place of not really listening to my wife and just being, yeah, being a mess. But after listening to a few episodes and trying to just check that box of like, Oh, she suggested I listen to it. I just listen to a few. Say, you listen to it, whatever carry on, it actually ended up being very interesting, and little did I know was going to be so helpful, because now Madden is a diabetic. Yeah, your head now I've been crushing, or had crushed the pro tips, I will say bold beginnings was nice, but also, having been with Kelly for so long, and kind of having that I did not listen to all the bold beginnings, you're probably past it already, exactly, yeah, but the Pro Tip series, I think I've listened to it twice already and still about to start a third time just to pick up what I missed.

Scott Benner 42:49
It helps, right? Every time, like you feel like you add a little something to it. Yeah, you're building blocks slowly.

Speaker 1 42:54
And it's funny too, because I'm somebody, I got to listen to and or do something multiple times to truly understand it. And Kelly, at first, was getting frustrated. She's like, wait, you only listen to two episodes? I'm like, Yes, but I've listened to it two or three times now. But I really, I get the two episodes I've listened to sank in now.

Scott Benner 43:10
Yeah, exactly. I can move forward. Yeah, listen. I'm doing my best. I'm a boy. I don't know if you remember all of our history, but I'm trying exactly. I honestly had a thought recently where I thought, like, I think I'm gonna go re listen to it like, and I haven't heard it in a long time, which is weird, because I intersect with it every like, hour. I'm always like, you know, leaving lists for people, or like, Hey, you should try this. Or, you know, maybe give this one a try. But I think, like, I should go back and listen to it again. It's been a little while now, so

Speaker 1 43:43
might as well. I mean, what? You got lots of free time on your hands? Oh, I'm just sitting

Scott Benner 43:47
around staring So, yeah, exactly. No, come on. I'll do it in my ear, you know, while I'm while I'm doing something else, I just think that it's important, because I think it's possible I'll hear things and think, oh, I should have said that differently. Or maybe there's a different way to to, you know, approach this in the in the future. So, I

Speaker 1 44:04
mean, I've heard you say that on episodes before, like, oh yeah, I talked about this one thing, you know what? I should have done it like this, and then a couple episodes later, I'm going to phrase it this way, and you fix that.

Scott Benner 44:13
I'm trying, I'm trying to grow so your other two kids are you now, like, worried that they might get type one?

Speaker 1 44:20
No, I can comfortably say no. I don't know why. It's just a gut feeling that being said. We do get them checked every What is it two years? I think they check for antibodies, or every once a year, or something like that, okay, just just to monitor it, right and see,

Scott Benner 44:35
is there any autoimmune in your family on your side?

Speaker 1 44:37
Not to my knowledge, but that is stuff that was never discussed growing up. Nobody's

Scott Benner 44:42
gonna tell you if they had Hashimotos or celiac or something like that. Yeah,

Speaker 1 44:45
that's, that's not how, how it works in my family. Yeah, arthritis

Scott Benner 44:49
even, that's the thing you might see. Did you see any?

Speaker 1 44:53
Yeah, my mom had that more. So she said, granted, it turned out my mom was a pill popping addict at the end. So sorry about. But hey, like, I said it's life, but

Scott Benner 45:03
you said you don't drink or do drugs. Like, do you think that's because of, like, watching, are you having like, an adverse reaction to your mom? Like, saying, No, I'm not going to

Speaker 1 45:14
do that. No, because I didn't realize my mom was a drug addict until much older, like, she had already passed away, and then it was, like two years after that, that it just clicked one day, really, it started with the alcohol. So like I said, I come from a very large family. I was always selected as the DD, but also I have a lot of raging alcoholics in my family. And so anytime it was, like a family barbecue, or whatever it would be, I would just see the hot mess that everybody was, and just think to myself, from a young age, like, I don't want to do that. Yeah? I'm not looking for this. Yeah, I'm no, no thanks. And then drugs kind of just, you know, how I went, Hey, drugs are bad. Don't do drugs. And then as I grew older, I just realized it wasn't my style, yeah,

Scott Benner 45:56
yeah, no, I hear that's all. I'm glad for you. That's a listen. That's a it's a big possible burden that a lot of people deal with. It you don't have to. So imagine the one addiction with

Speaker 1 46:06
another one. Yeah. Oh, compounding addictions, yeah,

Scott Benner 46:10
would have been not great. Let me kind of throw it back to you for a second. So you did me. You did me a solid like I was looking for some extra recordings, and you're you jumped right in, which is awesome. I appreciate it. But when you did that, what was your intention? Like, I mean, there's no world where you were like, You know what I'm gonna do? I'm gonna go on a podcast about diabetes that my wife listens to and tell them about my porn addiction. Like that wasn't in your head, right?

Speaker 1 46:33
No, I came into this with a clean slate. I even asked Kelly last night. I was like, hmm, should I vaguely attempt to have like, bullet points to talk about? She's like, Nah, you're much better on the fly. Just go with the flow of the conversation. So that's what we're doing. Yeah? She's

Scott Benner 46:46
like, don't plan I yeah,

Unknown Speaker 46:50
do not plan anything. It will be an absolute mess.

Scott Benner 46:52
Oh, that's awesome. So what do you think moving forward looks like for you guys? Like, not, not with your relationship stuff. I hope well for you there. Like, I feel like, you know we've talked that through. But like, diabetes wise, do you see yourself being involved with her more? No. Do you see yourself having an involvement with your son? Like, what do you expect is going to be like to raise a kid for the next 10 or 15 years with type one? What are you thinking is is going to be your responsibility?

Speaker 1 47:21
So we've actually talked about that. We actually just talked about a few days ago. She

Scott Benner 47:24
got you talking about everything now, Robert, Hey, I

Speaker 1 47:27
can't shut up. I never shut up. I'm always talking good the where was I going to go? Thanks, Scott. So I had asked her, you know, I I'm still going to, I don't want to say be hands off with hers, because I'm still going to understand and build an understanding and develop all of that, but I'm not going to be somebody who is micromanaging hers, for example, because she is a grown ass woman and can make her own damn choices. That being said, I did bring it to her attention that I am going to try to learn enough and have a comfortable enough base to manage maddens so therefore it is not a burden on her shoulders or that she doesn't feel like she has to be the one to do it. Because we've actually talked about, I have brought it up to her in the past, like, Hey, you are very knowledgeable. Why don't you go back to school and be somebody who helps, you know, manage other type ones, and just not be a doctor, per se, but you can maybe a nurse or somebody that helps do that. And she talked about that. She's had friends that have done that, and the burnout is just too much trying to manage your own and also everybody else's. And so I applied that to even our son. That I'm not saying you won't do a good job, Kelly, you're gonna do a great job, but also I don't want you to feel like you have to be the one to do it, and that you can feel comfortable enough, and she does that to pass it to you, yeah, that you know that I'm just, I'm going to be there and I'm going to be able to do it, and it's not required by you.

Scott Benner 48:51
So out of concern for her, like you don't, you don't want her to burn out, because I imagine your expectation would be, is that she'll then focus on your son and then not take care of herself,

Speaker 1 49:02
which has already kind of happened, not to the extent of, like, you know, emergency calls or anything like that, but her numbers went from a really steady line to pretty all over the place, just because her focus has been on Madden's and, you know, bolusing for his meals and not doing it for hers until she's already started eating or done With the meal and then doing it. It's yeah, trying to alleviate that as much as

Scott Benner 49:23
possible. I feel like I remember her saying that when I when I spoke to her, and well, that's really thoughtful of you, man. I try. Yeah, no, no, I listen. I think it's obvious from our conversation that you've been trying the whole time, even though you didn't know how to try for a while now you do. You're making a lot of good decisions, from what I'm hearing. So So you figure if you can be as good at it as she could have been, then either, what do you think? You think that his diabetes becomes your thing and she does hers, or you just think you split it up more like, I don't know what you're working like. You out of the house during the day, or where are people?

Speaker 1 50:02
So don't let me forget that point. You just asked the question. So it's funny, with me being in the Army for the moment, I actually live in Texas, and they still live in Florida. Oh, it's a, it's a whole thing. I'm at, I'm here in Florida until Tuesday, and then I fly back to Texas, and I don't know when I'll

Scott Benner 50:18
be coming back. I didn't realize you were still in Oh, okay, yeah,

Speaker 1 50:21
I'm actually so I guess to summarize that I may not be here soon. I'm supposed to have back surgery on May 8, artificial disc replacement. Oh, they might discharge you. So I may get medically discharged. I may not. We have to figure it out, but it's a lot in the air limbo. What would you do for work if you got discharged? I don't know. Whatever job isn't higher.

Scott Benner 50:41
What do you do in the army? Why are you laughing?

Speaker 1 50:47
Because I get this a lot, and it's hard. It's not hard to explain, but my brain then goes hyper focused. So I do art, air defense, artillery. In short, I sit in a box with computers and would operate in a live situation, radars and interceptors. I work on the biggest system that the Army has to offer. Currently, it would focus more on like ICBMs or nuclear bomb type things, or really, really long range missiles. If somebody was to shoot one of those, I would be the person who would try to intercept it. In short, no kidding,

Scott Benner 51:18
yeah. Well, I mean, I hope you have a lot of luck. I hope you're good at it. How do you know if you're good at it?

Unknown Speaker 51:24
I'm still alive. You

Scott Benner 51:28
have not actually intercepted an ICBM missile, though, right?

Unknown Speaker 51:31
No, no. And if I had, I wouldn't be able to tell you about it. Yeah, no,

Scott Benner 51:35
I would imagine, obviously. But my point is, like, I feel like that would have got out. What do you it's all like, like, simulation training and stuff like that.

Speaker 1 51:43
Pretty much we do live fires for just testing capabilities, but never actual live scenario, obviously, like you just said, but yeah, just simulation training. I think I'm pretty good. I always get good scores, if you will, on evaluations. But

Scott Benner 51:57
I want you, I know I want you to be good at it. That's, yeah. Do you know this is like a complete left turn, but since you brought this up, do you know any guys that fly drones? I'm beginning to hear that it's as hard on them as people who actually hold a gun and point it at somebody.

Speaker 1 52:11
I do, actually, I know a couple of them, and it is very difficult for some. There is a, I mean, I'm not a doctor, so somebody goes and Googles it. Don't leave Scott a bad review for my lack of knowledge. Thank you. But there, there is a, I don't wanna say special, but like, a different kind of PTSD. I've known that it's developed in some drone pilots, I know, whereas you know, you're looking at basically a video game screen, for like, a better term, and just watching people and things disappear. Yeah, to not put it too crude, it can be. It can be a challenge. I would

Scott Benner 52:44
imagine. I don't see how that would have a different impact on you than literally standing in front of somebody and taking their life with with a gun or your hands or something like that. So, man, yeah, that that's something else. But you think you could still do that, like after the surgery, though, right?

Speaker 1 52:58
Technically, no, because there's a lot that goes into it in terms of setting up the equipment and a lot of like, heavy lifting you have to do and all that. And I will have those restrictions. Oh gosh, for example, like, as soon as I moved to Texas, they took me out of my primary job and put me in operations. So now all I do is sit at a desk in a computer and work with my bosses on operating things. I know that's very vague. Yeah, no, I

Scott Benner 53:22
understand what you mean, though. So is it your goal to get back to the the box you sit in? Or no, no, you don't think it's going to happen.

Speaker 1 53:29
No, that's being said. Okay, so this, this might get some people going. I love the army. The army has provided us so many opportunities. I would be living in the POS little farm town I grew up in the same dead end job everybody else has. If I didn't join the army, that being said, I'm also done with the army. Okay? It has broken my body and my mind almost beyond repair. It has almost ruined my marriage multiple times. It has made it to like, I can't even play with my kids right now because my back is messed up. And that is, for example, this. This almost made me cry the other day, my middle child, Amelia, whispered something in the back of the car when we were driving home. Actually, it was while you were recording with Kelly, and Bailey yelled at her, my oldest and I said, what happened? And Bailey goes, Amelia said, you just use your back as an excuse that it hurts so you don't have to play with us and that that broke my heart, yeah? Because for years, like, I mean, I've just kind of put up with it, and now it's to the point

Scott Benner 54:26
it's, it's a pro, it's a real problem. You want to get it fixed and move on and get get your life going in the private sector somehow.

Speaker 1 54:32
Yeah? I mean, we're my kid. My oldest is 10, and she's moved like, four times, four times, and it's really hard on them. They've expressed they want me to get out. They're tired of moving and making new friends, and they're all young. Yeah, it's time. Yeah,

Scott Benner 54:48
okay, well, I hope the procedure goes easily and that you're you're back at it, is it

Unknown Speaker 54:52
lower back? Yeah, it's l5, s1,

Scott Benner 54:56
it's just completely deteriorated. Yeah, there's nuts. And left of it, I almost said something real hippie dippie too, but I'm literally feel free. I'm gonna be judged by the people listening. But not that I don't think there's something wrong with your back, but I would implore you to read a book by John Sarno called Healing back pain before you have surgery. Okay, that's all healing back pain. Yeah, all right, John Sarno, I don't say that. You know, it can't fix a physical problem with you, but in my experience, can help you think about your pain in a way that might be valuable. That's fair. Yeah. So anyway, for anybody out there, actually, though he's got a book called, I think, mind body connection, that I found very valuable in my life, not a cult or anything like that.

Unknown Speaker 55:40
Hey, what if it is I'm in

Scott Benner 55:42
if it works, like, what do I care? Yeah, Tom Cruise seems happy. Hey, exactly, although I don't think his kids talk to him, but I don't know. I only know what I read. Listen for a short guy, he's done really well. I don't have a lot where I need to feel bad for Tom Cruise, I don't think nope, nor you. Have you ever been in an active war zone,

Speaker 1 56:01
with bullets flying, no, with artillery shells falling, yes.

Scott Benner 56:05
So you've been you've been like, what do they call it like in theater, doing your job?

Unknown Speaker 56:09
Yes, twice. Wow, only twice still

Scott Benner 56:13
seems like a lot, but impactful in a way that's hard to put into words, like a thing that stays with you forever. Or is it more because it's so, like, computerized, is it more removed? Now, you wouldn't know, because, I mean, it's not like you were an EOG or anything like that, but, like, yeah, right,

Speaker 1 56:30
yeah, nothing like that. And so my second tour was over in Israel, right before everything popped off. And over there, there's always rockets flying. And that was, I remember the first time being over there, and shells started falling, and I perked up, like, what is happening? And everybody else was just like, still doing their work, yeah, didn't even phase them. And it occurred to me, You know what? Just ignore it. If it's your time, it's your time. And that's just kind of the approach you take. You can't panic, you can't freak out. Hey, if one happens to find me today, one, Kelly gets a fat paycheck. Two, she gets to find somebody better. And three, I don't have to be here no more. So

Scott Benner 57:06
here we go. My back's gonna stop hurting. The kids are gonna have money Exactly. And but I love your I honestly, I love the way of thinking about that, that, like, if it finds me, it finds me, is worries a waste of imagination. Like, if you're there, you're there, like, so it's either gonna happen or it's not, pretty much. Yep, and you're saying that the people there are so accustomed to it, like in that entire region, that they don't even move when it happens,

Speaker 1 57:32
pretty much. I mean, they'll get off the street, get inside, but otherwise it's and granted. Again, this is before everything kicked off. Yeah. And over there, this was 2020, to 2021, when it was standard, if you will. Yeah, now, obviously it's completely different, but yeah, I mean, hey, get off the street, get inside the store. Maybe hunker down. Those of us that were at work at our Pat site, just keep working. Don't you don't even have to go to the bunkers or anything, because they're not going to do anything to stop it. So might as well be productive.

Scott Benner 57:59
Yeah, and then, and then just, you wait a little bit, and then just back, like, back at it. People duck into stores, and then it stops, and they keep going pretty much, wow. That points to a perspective that obviously we don't have here for sure, correct? Yeah, if that happened here, we would, it would shut it would shut you off for, you know, for a very long time, interesting. Yes, it's very interesting. Well, I appreciate, you know, I don't want to say something like, trite, like, thanks for your service, but I appreciate what you're doing, and I hope you you're able to, like, break free of the pain and and get your life going in a different direction. Do you have any idea what you'd like to like, it's because you have, like, that small town vibe. You're like, I'll just get a job. But like, I mean, do your skills translate to something

Speaker 1 58:38
kind of, it's very niche thing. It's pretty much just defense contracting. And truth be told, I actually tried to get out of the army last year write out my contract. I was done with it. I sent out over 500 applications over nine months, and I had three job interviews and one job offer that took me overseas for 16 months, and I considered that one, but then health insurance was going to be an issue, especially with two type ones in our house, kind of need good

Scott Benner 59:03
insurance, so you stayed in for another year to try again. I actually signed for four years.

Speaker 1 59:08
And it's funny, because my back wasn't even really the issue. And as soon as I moved to Texas, my Army doctor looked at it the first time I ever met him. I might offend you, I might not, but you're worthless to me. I said, Yeah, that's true, because of your back, because of the back, and then immediately he was like, yeah, there's nothing we can do. You've been managing this for almost a decade. The only thing left is surgery to try to fix it, and that may not even work, so we'll give it a shot. And that's how we ended up here. And it's pain, right? Pains the issue? Yeah. I mean, just a couple days ago, I couldn't feel my legs, they were completely numb. From waist down, I could still walk, which was weird, but it was more of a foot drag than a walk. Wow, it's just something different. Every day.

Scott Benner 59:50
I'm sorry. No back. Back pain is terrible. I know I genuinely think you should check out the book that I told you that that doctors I think he's paying. Yes now, but like I said, John Sarno, like, look into his books and see if you find one that kind of speaks to you. It's there's some of them are shorter. I think they're very worth reading, and it might be helpful for I'll do that. Absolutely awesome. We I know I'm gonna say, if Is there anything we haven't talked about, but you didn't really come on here to talk about anything. So for a guy who didn't have a plan, you talked about a lot. I just

Speaker 1 1:00:22
want to say that's true. No, I mean, like I said earlier, I didn't really come with a plan. I was hoping to learn something potentially. But again, I'm not want to ask

Scott Benner 1:00:31
questions about something like, I'm, I'm, I'm here. Really, no, awesome.

Speaker 1 1:00:35
Okay, well, I'm sure there will be, and, you know what, a day or two from now, I might think, Oh, damn, I should ask about this, yeah, yeah. But initially it was just maybe he'll say a little nugget of knowledge or two that I didn't

Scott Benner 1:00:46
think about dude I might have if you didn't lead with porn addiction. But like, I mean, sorry you asked you put it into, what you put into a place I couldn't leave. Like, what was I supposed to do? I have so many questions still, but I, you know, out of deference to your situation and your new position in life, I and the fact that this is a diabetes podcast, I'm not gonna ask.

Speaker 1 1:01:09
I know, believe me, like 10 minutes ago to cross my mind, like, Dude, we have not talked about diabetes or anything at all.

Scott Benner 1:01:14
Well, no, what? Listen. You might think that, but what I think we talked about is you're not the only dad with a problem who has a kid with diabetes, and Kelly's not the only lady married to you. Do you know what I mean? Big picture, it's a really valuable story, because the thing you brought up, man is super serious. It wasn't easy to get rid of it. It plagued you for a long time. It caused you a significant problem, personally, emotionally, with your marriage on top of all that, like, well, you came from a tough family, right? And you're doing a lot better. And to me, I think these people listening need to hear somebody who maybe went through something more difficult than the thing they're going through, and came out the other side of it, and otherwise, hopefully, just everybody heard talk to each other, because that's what I I'm hoping came out of this, is that people understand that if you're not talking to each other, this isn't going to work out facts. Yeah, yeah. So we talked about a lot, and it'll help people with their diabetes plenty. Don't you worry. Seriously, that's fair. I appreciate it very much. Of course. Can you hold on one second for me? Yes, sir. Thank you. Excellent.

Thanks for tuning in today, and thanks to Medtronic diabetes for sponsoring this episode. We've been talking about Medtronic mini med 780 G system today, an automated insulin delivery system that helps make diabetes management easier day and night, whether it's their meal detection technology or the Medtronic extended infusion set, it all comes together to simplify life with diabetes. Go find out more at my link, Medtronic diabetes.com/juicebox the episode you just enjoyed was sponsored by the twist a ID system powered by tide pool. If you want a commercially available insulin pump with twist loop that offers unmatched personalization and precision or peace of mind. You want twist, twist.com/juicebox, I'd like to thank the blood glucose meter that my daughter carries. The contour next gen blood glucose meter. Learn more and get started today at contour next.com/juicebox and don't forget, you may be paying more through your insurance right now for the meter you have then you would pay for the contour next gen in cash. There are links in the show notes of the audio app you're listening in right now and links at Juicebox podcast.com. To contour and all of the sponsors. I can't thank you enough for listening. Please make sure you're subscribed or following in your audio app. I'll be back tomorrow with another episode of The Juicebox Podcast. You stories.

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Scott Benner 6/26/25 Scott Benner 6/26/25

#1560 Pump-Ready With Jordan

Jordan Wagner has been to more pump trainings than he can count—and he’s seen it all.

+ Click for EPISODE TRANSCRIPT

Scott Benner 0:00
Hello friends and welcome back to another episode of The Juicebox Podcast.

Today's guest is Jordan Wagner, a nurse, a diabetes educator and a person living with type one diabetes, and today, Jordan and I are going to talk about getting you ready for your pump or CGM training, so that you can get the most out of it and get started on the right foot. If this is your first time listening to the Juicebox Podcast and you'd like to hear more, download Apple podcasts or Spotify, really, any audio app at all, look for the Juicebox Podcast and follow or subscribe. We put out new content every day that you'll enjoy. Want to learn more about your diabetes management. Go to Juicebox podcast.com up in the menu and look for bold beginnings, the diabetes Pro Tip series and much more. This podcast is full of collections and series of information that will help you to live better with insulin. Please don't forget that nothing you hear on the Juicebox Podcast should be considered advice medical or otherwise, always consult a physician before making any changes to your healthcare plan or becoming bold with insulin. This episode is sponsored by the tandem mobi system, which is powered by tandems, newest algorithm control iq plus technology. Tandem Moby has a predictive algorithm that helps prevent highs and lows, and is now available for ages two and up. Learn more and get started today at tandem diabetes.com/juicebox this episode of The Juicebox Podcast is sponsored by us med. Us med.com/juicebox, or call 888-721-1514, get your supplies the same way we do from us. Med, All right, guys, Jordan's Back. We're in our second episode together. What are we going to talk about today? Jordan,

Jordan Wagner 1:56
yeah, so I wanted to kind of touch on a couple things here, but the big topic is just going to be getting an insulin pump, how to be successful for the training, leading up to the training, looking at the CGM that are compatible and being used with these pumps, and then realizing that sometimes there can be inaccuracy in CGM, and really How to address those inaccuracies. What could cause those inaccuracies? So just really looking to set someone up well for getting an insulin

Scott Benner 2:28
pump, there's more CGM now than there's there's ever been, right? Like, so absolutely,

Speaker 1 2:33
yeah. And then if you, if you think about things going on outside the US, there's even, there's even more CGM, more options.

Scott Benner 2:39
Give me an example of one that's outside of the US that you wish was inside the US.

Speaker 1 2:44
Yeah. So for example, you have the blanket on the name right now, but there's the new Medtronic CGM. They have it currently in the US, but it's only compatible with the in pen, whereas it sounds like it's going to be compatible with the Medtronic 780 G insulin pump, and it's, it's going to be a disposable sensor, as opposed to the Guardian sensors. Right now, you have to keep the transmitter. So it sounds like they're trying to get on board more with some of the other CGM brands where they've gone away from having to keep the transmitter or save a piece. It's all disposable now. So that's an example there. Yeah,

Scott Benner 3:20
the simplara, that's what it is. Yes. Thank you. Yes. And then that's been in Europe for a bit now, right?

Speaker 1 3:26
Yeah, I believe so, yeah. So they get the CE marks over there way sooner. The FDA in the US is usually a little bit slower to approve things. Okay, when it comes to diabetes tech, if you kind of want to know what's coming down the pipeline into the US, or perhaps other countries, looking at the European countries, that's going to be a good spot to start, yeah, because they can get the okay over there a little easier, a way easier, way sooner. Yeah, for the moment, there's still Dexcom, g6 Yes, and there's g7 and then Libre is up to what the libre three

Scott Benner 3:57
plus

Speaker 1 3:58
or libre three plus. And so the variation between the libre three and the three plus, you've added an extra day. So the three plus is 15 days. It's, it's the same size, but that one's going to be compatible, more friendly with with the insulin pumps. Okay,

Scott Benner 4:13
do they make it like with the people you help who are on liberty three plus as specifically, do they make it 15

Speaker 1 4:19
days? Usually? Yeah. I mean, I would, I would, it's hard to quantify that, but I would say maybe 60% of the people that I'm helping are making it the full the full time there. And I think one of the things, aside from sensor failures, is that, because it's so small, there's less tape area, whereas, like, if you think about the the Dexcom, and I really think that tape is very sticky with the Dexcom personally, but there's also an overtape that comes with the sensor, so it helps to keep it on a little bit better. There the libre three. Then three plus is the size of a penny, so it's a lot smaller taper. I think that contributes to it falling off more easily with some patients that I work with,

Scott Benner 4:59
Oh, I see. See by making it so much smaller, it also doesn't allow you as much tape, because it's not like it's a penny, is it really that small?

Speaker 1 5:10
Yeah, it's the size of two pennies stacked on top of each other. Wow. But

Scott Benner 5:14
then the area around it with the adhesive is not as much, and you think it's coming off because of that. Maybe, I think that's

Speaker 1 5:20
one of the reasons, too. Yeah, you know, I hear people say that, you know, they they bump their arm on the door and it fell off. And I know that can be said about all sensors, but that's just my theory. Is that by bringing the size down, while that's that is a nice thing to do, you've also got less tape surface area, okay? And so I always tell people the three or the three plus. You might consider getting an overtape for it. You might have to go to a third party place to get those, but it just helps to keep it in place longer.

Scott Benner 5:51
Do you have a preference between g7 and libre three plus?

Speaker 1 5:56
Yeah, so I mean, my personal preference is g7 and that's simply because I use the tandem pump, the TE Slim x2 with control iq plus, but the three plus is not currently compatible with tandem. You can use the FreeStyle Libre two plus that is compatible with tandem, but the three plus is not quite there yet. I've sampled the three plus, honestly, I think it picked up on low blood sugars a little sooner. One thing that I like about Dexcom over the Libre is that you can have the rising quickly or the falling quickly features on the Dexcom. So we think about Dexcom, you've got the the flat line, the steady line, there's diagonal, there's straight up or down, and then there's double arrow up or down, whereas the Libre is going to have all of those, but it's not going to have the double arrow up currently. And so I kind of liked knowing if, if I really messed up and I'm rapidly rising. There's that slight variation there with the Dexcom versus the libre,

Scott Benner 6:55
yeah, and that it's valuable to know like this is happening quicker than correct. And maybe I feel like it

Speaker 1 7:00
is, yeah, now I will say the Libre is nice in the sense that it it shows you're reading every minute compared to every five minutes. Oh, okay, I've talked to many Dexcom reps about that, and you know, hey, can we, can this be a feature in the future? Basically, when you look at the studies, there's no clinical there's no significant clinical difference when it comes to reading every five minutes versus every minute. So it comes down to a user preference, essentially. Oh, I see, but I don't think it's from Dexcom perspective. I'm I'm not speaking on their behalf, but I'm thinking it might not be financially worth it for them to to do that when there's no statistical significance

Scott Benner 7:38
to it. Yeah, because they have to. I mean, they have to remake the software, and then they have to put it back through the FDA again, correct? Yeah, I guess is that? Why that they don't make what seems to be the most obvious change, which would be rate of change. Like, having rate of change would be awesome, just like, plus five points, minus three points, like, on every reading. I think that's really helpful. But,

Speaker 1 8:00
yeah, no, that would be helpful. I mean, you have, you kind of have to guess a little bit, but like, the arrows do actually represent numerical values, yeah? Then again, you can't really know for sure, right? Because it's kind of giving you a range, you know, like two to three milligrams per deciliter, or or, like, four or five, or whatever it is. And then you kind of have to guess a little bit, like, oh, well, if it's every five minutes, and I do the math on this, maybe, maybe it's like 16, maybe it's 20, right? But it's not gonna exactly give that to you. I'm a fan of it. I like having it, so, oh, big time. Yeah. I get it through third party stuff, you know. So I see it on night Scout, I see it on sugar pixel, like, then it's, it's really helpful. I think, yeah, well, building off that, I mean real fast, just a side note here. You know, I worked with a patient the other day who was blind and he was only checking his blood sugars like once a week when a family member could come over. Didn't really know about CGM, so told him about that. But, like, I thought with with Dexcom, it'd be so cool if they had a feature that it audibly told you your blood sugar, like every 15 minutes, or every 30 minutes, whatever you programmed for it. I mean, I know they have the Siri feature, where you can have the you could say, like, hey Siri, what's my glucose at? Or whatever you programmed it, and it'll tell you, but to have the option where it automatically tells you, for people who are blind, I thought that'd be such a cool feature to have in the future. I

Scott Benner 9:23
think that, generally speaking, disabled people and elderly people are widely ignored by all of our devices. Yeah, that's for sure. Yeah. I mean, listen, I'm not running the company, and I can almost hear their arguments in my head. Against you want me to make a giant screen with numbers? Nobody else wants that like, in my mind, I think you just have to make space for that in your business plan, because these are people who have likely been customers of yours, patients for their whole life, and then for them to enjoy this, this stuff, and then get to a certain level where then all of a sudden it's like, well, I guess I don't get this anymore. You know, I don't like it. I don't like giving people something like that. Than taking it away from at some point, whether you're taking it from or they can't use it just one way or the other, right, right? Yeah, it would be nice if it was paid more attention to the other what's the other guard? The guardian for is, yes, is the one that's working in a US now for Medtronic,

Speaker 1 10:16
yeah, yeah. So you got the guardian for and that's nice, because you don't have to calibrate the sensor like some of their previous models, did you know, and the accuracy of it has gone up a lot there. So when you're looking at CGM accuracy, you want to look at something called the marred value, okay? And that stands for mean absolute, relative difference. The easiest way to understand that is to basically think, what is my glucose level in the blood right now, and how close can we get that on a device? So we want to be as accurate as possible. So when you're looking at a margin value, you want that number to be as low as possible. The lower the number, the more accurate the sensor is. And so you know, Medtronic sensor has improved drastically over the years. So have, you know, the libre and the and the Dexcom sensors, but, yeah, you want to be looking at that there. And so like the Guardian four has improved a lot in their in their values there, so it's a much more reliable sensor. Now. Do you have any patients using the ever since CGM, you know, I actually don't. No, yeah, okay, that's not as commonly seen. That's for sure. You know, I know Nico, sure she wouldn't mind. She's been posting all about it, but she's on the ever since now, had a chance to have coffee with her and Ryan, not that long ago. And really interesting to hear about that. Yeah, so I'll be, I'm really curious to hear about her experiences more with it.

Scott Benner 11:39
I am too, genuinely am, because, I mean, obviously there's, I mean, a lot of these companies are sponsors, so, but, like, but, you know, ever since is a sponsor, and I feel like my job is just to let people know about it, because, yes, because it's so new, you know, and it's different, it just is, like, at this point, you know, there's three CGM that go on the way they go on, and then there's one that's inserted, like, ever Since, and you're gonna wait to see if the if the public adopts the idea and goes with it or not. I can see that, I think, in a John right now, I don't use his full name, who's using it, and I see him in the group talking about the time that he loves it, yeah? Like, I just keep that. I mean, he's going out of his way to tell people that he how much he's enjoying it. So,

Speaker 1 12:18
yeah. And I think that's great, like, just the sharing of information. Like you know, my job as a diabetes educator is not to tell you what to do, it's to share the information you get, to take it and decide what you want to do with it. And so, like you said, I'm a big advocate for sharing about your own personal diabetes journeys with people or within the podcast group there, just so other people can see it, because it could just be a simple post that literally changes someone's life, and go, Hmm, maybe I should try this or do this differently, right?

Scott Benner 12:46
So, so tell me this. This just your, you know, your opinion, obviously. But any one of these four CGM, if you had a shot at having one, and you couldn't have any of the others, you're not losing, right? There's not one of them that you're just like, oh, I can't believe this is the one I got. Like, these are all like, life changing devices. Am I right?

Speaker 1 13:05
Absolutely right. Yes. Okay. And again, like that whole marred value system, these CGM have improved so much that you could look at the marred value on some of these CGM and compare it to, you know, a middle tier glucose meter, and it's actually going to be a higher margin value on the CGM than it would be the actual glucose meter, meaning that the CGM could literally be more accurate than actually poking your finger. Yeah. So that technology has improved so

Scott Benner 13:31
much, I say to people all the time when they're like, oh, this, this CGM is wrong again, I test it. I'm like, I've never seen that meter before in my life. Like, where, like, rock, did you get that under Exactly? And, you know, like, they have some janky, like, third party, like, you know, meter, and they're like, look, this says this, but my Dexcom says that. I'm like, I'd be more inclined to believe the Dexcom, like, absolutely, yeah, when

Speaker 1 13:52
you got the other consideration there too, with the the glucose meters, if you don't actually quality control, check your glucose meter, which most are not doing, then there's a good chance that it's not even right at all, even if the marred value on it is good. That is something you need to be checking. Like, for example, in the hospital setting, we have to do that every 24 hours to ensure that the meters are as accurate as possible.

Scott Benner 14:17
So, and nobody's doing that at home, like meters all used to come with that, yes, but they don't even come with it anymore, do they? This episode is sponsored by tandem Diabetes Care, and today I'm going to tell you about tandems, newest pump and algorithm, the tandem mobi system with control iq plus technology features auto Bolus, which can cover missed meal boluses and help prevent hyperglycemia. It has a dedicated sleep activity setting and is controlled from your personal iPhone. Tandem will help you to check your benefits today through my link, tandem diabetes.com/juicebox this is going to help you to get started with tandem, smallest pump yet that's powered by its best algorithm ever. You. Control iq plus technology helps to keep blood sugars in range by predicting glucose levels 30 minutes ahead, and it adjusts insulin accordingly. You can wear the tandem Moby in a number of ways. Wear it on body with a patch like adhesive sleeve that is sold separately. Clip it discreetly to your clothing or slip it into your pocket head. Now to my link, tandem diabetes.com/juicebox, to check out your benefits and get started today. I used to hate ordering my daughter's diabetes supplies. I never had a good experience, and it was frustrating. But it hasn't been that way for a while, actually, for about three years now, because that's how long we've been using us, med, us, med.com/juicebox, or call 888-721-1514, us, med is the number one distributor for FreeStyle Libre systems nationwide. They are the number one specialty distributor for Omnipod, the number one fastest growing tandem distributor nationwide, the number one rated distributor in Dexcom customer satisfaction surveys. They have served over 1 million people with diabetes since 1996 and they always provide 90 days worth of supplies and fast and free shipping us med carries everything from insulin pumps and diabetes testing supplies to the latest CGM like the libre three and Dexcom g7 they accept Medicare nationwide and over 800 private insurers find out why us med has an A plus rating with a better Business Bureau at usmed.com/juicebox, or just call them at 888-721-1514, get started right now, and you'll be getting your supplies the same way we do.

Speaker 1 16:51
Most of them don't, yeah, so you might even have to go to the manufacturer's website. And maybe I'm incorrect, but it maybe some of them don't need to do that, but I was under the impression that you should still be doing that sometimes, well,

Scott Benner 17:03
one way or the other, having accurate numbers is obviously the most helpful thing that you could possibly do. I agree with you. Like CGM, I would say, get a CGM before a pump. If you can only have one thing, I think it makes a huge difference. Not that a pump wouldn't be awesome, but, like, if you could just get one thing, I get a CGM I think it would change your life. Oh,

Speaker 1 17:24
absolutely, yeah, it truly, truly will. And again, the accuracy of these has improved so much, and that's also helping to make these insulin pumps have these, you know, tighter controlled algorithms,

Scott Benner 17:35
right? Yeah, the better the CGMS get, then the more aggressive the pump companies could be with their algorithms, I imagine

Speaker 1 17:42
absolutely, yeah, because there's uncertainty, right? If the CGM is not as accurate as possible, the pumps not going to target a lower glucose level, because you have a margin of error. And if it's you know is going on the low side. They don't want people to be low all the time, because there's that huge risk for one, probably lawsuits as a pump company. But then two, you're harming patients, and so not what you're trying to do as the CGM get better. Yeah, they're gonna, they're gonna get tighter and tighter, for

Scott Benner 18:07
sure, what do you tell a person who comes to you and says, Listen, I want to get one of these algorithms. But, yeah, my CGM is not accurate all the time, and I don't want that thing making insulin decisions. When you know my CGM says I'm 220 but I'm really 170 or I'm 170 you know, but it says I'm 65 or, like, how do you answer that question? Because I've always struggled with that,

Speaker 1 18:29
so that's a great question. Yeah. So CGM, their accuracy, can be great under the right circumstances. So first I would be asking some questions to the to the person there. So for example, when did you put the CGM on? Because there's something called insertion trauma. And the first 12 to 24, hours of wearing a CGM, you are going to notice that there could be some variables in the accuracy there. And that's simply because, if you think about it, you've created a small hole in your skin that's going to cause inflammation. And when the body has inflammation, it's going to send an inflammatory response there, yeah, white blood cells, the whole, the whole thing, right, right? So that's going to naturally throw off the the CGM, potentially, because CGM are looking at, it's an enzymatic so enzymes, it's a reaction happening there. So if you have any other like micro things in your body going on there, it could throw off the sensor. So if they've put it on in the first 12 hours and they're telling me this, I would tell them not to really worry about it too much, because these CGM, you wear them for anywhere from, you know, seven to 15 days, depending on the brand

Scott Benner 19:36
you use. Yeah, that's not the question, though, like Jordan, the question is, isn't this thing going to give me too much insulin if it thinks my blood sugar is higher than it is? But I don't know how to explain that. Arden has been using some kind of an algorithm for years, and I don't imagine that her CGM is always spot on right, and it's never been a problem. Is that random luck, or is that you. Is that not is it? You know what I mean, like, I don't know how to quantify I'm you might not either. I don't know how to quantify it. All I tell people is, she's been wearing it for a really long time, and so far that hasn't been an issue.

Speaker 1 20:10
Yeah, I guess what I would say to that is, the algorithms are designed to reduce your basal rates if you're going too low. So for example, if you look at control IQ with tandem, they have a target range of 112.5 to 160 if you drop below that 112.5 or are predicted to in 30 minutes, your basal rates gonna slow down. So there's a pretty big gap there between a low blood sugar and that number there, because you could be 130 and dropping, and it's going to back off on the basal rate. So I would say, even if you're not actually 130 in that moment there, it's allowing for enough margin of error to where you're not actually actually at a low blood sugar for that basal rate to start slowing down there.

Scott Benner 21:00
What about if my blood sugar is 300 on the CGM, but it's really, I don't know, 180 and it's bolusing, and then the number doesn't move. I would describe Arden's experience with Dexcom as really good and even lucky to some point, like she wears them right out to, like, the 10 days plus 12 hours. She very infrequently gets one that just goes haywire. Yeah? And it's a thing I'm gonna ask you about, which is, like, personal body chemistry in a second, but like, like, so I'm saying, okay, like, it works really well for her, and I've still seen times when it tells me her blood sugar is 100 points higher than it really is, right? And the algorithm is bolusing during that. But yet, I'm not here also telling you that she got super low afterwards. But you know, also, I might be talking myself out of this. I also know how to look at that CGM and say something's not right, like, because I know what we've done and I know what should happen, and I've seen it so many times that when it doesn't happen, I think that number is lying to me. I know pretty soon, when it's happening like it doesn't take me, you know, I guess maybe that's the difference, if I'm looking for anyway, I'm sorry, there's a question

Speaker 1 22:06
in there. No, no, you're good. You're good. But so there's a couple things there, but to your point, right? You know how to look at the CGM graphs, and you can just look at it, and maybe it says it's stable, but you just know that it looks a little funky, right? Yeah. And so that that ties back into even, like in our first conversation, we talked about knowing your baseline and having plans, right? You have to know your baseline and what and what works right, because maybe you have a failed pump site or something, and that's why it's high and it's not coming down. But to that question, maybe I don't have the specific, specific answer to that, but like I would, I would be just going through a checklist, essentially, of saying, are you doing everything correctly to make sure that you have the most accurate readings on your CGM, right? Are you staying hydrated? Yeah. Like, if you're not, if you're not hydrated, you're going to have less interstitial fluid there, and that's not going to work out well for the readings of the CGM, right,

Scott Benner 23:00
right? So first of all, I asked you the question because I think in the end, I wanted you not to have an answer because, and I don't think I have a specific answer, because my answer is, this, is that, yeah, okay, maybe you found a flaw in the system, right? And, yeah, sure, it should be better than that, but at this point it's not, but it's still, even with that being a, you know, a weakness in the big picture, it's still so much better than anything you're going to do manually and absolutely, you know what I mean, like, I'm, for most people, you can still be half at this and get an A, 1c, under seven, like, Oh, definitely, definitely, just, it's just awesome. You can have a whole month where you're just like, I don't know, I wasn't really paying attention, and look down and be like, Oh, I have a six, six this month. Yeah. It's not crazy to think. And so I would say, I guess my real answer is, in a world of uncertainty, I prefer the uncertainty that comes with that than the uncertainty that comes with something

Speaker 1 23:57
else. Yeah, I think that's very fair. And then if you also look at, like, all of the CGM companies, I think they do account for this sometimes, because they will give you specific instructions when you're going through the setup process, that there are times that you should actually physically poke your finger, yeah, and see where you're at. So even though, even the companies themselves say, hey, like, you probably shouldn't, like, 100% of the time, just rely on this. Like, there are times where you do need to actually maybe confirm the reading a little

Scott Benner 24:25
bit. When I see people complain about I think, listen, everybody has their experience, and you should voice your opinion. I'm not saying don't pressure people to make their things better. But when I see somebody who's more newly diagnosed, like holding up a CGM and going, This thing doesn't work, I think to myself, someone ought to put your time machine and let you go live on regular and mph for a couple of days, totally. And you might come back and go, Oh, this thing is awesome. You know what I mean? Like, and I know that's just the fact of life. Like, you know, not everybody comes in at the same spot, and they don't all have the same perspective, but I wish they knew. Like, sometimes. When I see people doing that, I wish they knew. And I'll, you'll actually see very often online, older people with type one will send me notes and say, hey, somebody put up a post that their libre wasn't very accurate, or the Dexcom wasn't very accurate. And like, you should take that down. And I'm like, Well, I'm not, I'm not going to, but their points always the same thing. Like, you should not let people think that CGM aren't terrific. And I'm like, Well, I'm not into telling people what to say, but I get my point is that I get their greater point like they've been around long enough to know that a CGM, even with its foibles, is maybe the greatest thing you could have. It

Speaker 1 25:36
absolutely is. I mean, take my uncle for an example. He was diagnosed with diabetes in the 50s, right? And so he was having to boil his syringes before taking an insulin injection. Yeah, you know that to check glucose, you had to go pee and see what your urine had for glucose in it. And, I mean, that's like, two, three hours from what's even at. So, like, like you're saying a CGM is just, hands down, so much better. Even if there's a little bit of inaccuracy at times, it's just gonna be so much better for most

Scott Benner 26:08
people. I just interviewed a lady recently, and her thing's not out yet, but it'll be out soon enough. You know, she told a story of her mom diagnosed in like her, I think 11. She may be 11 or 12 years old. She was dead before she was 50 Wow. And the whole time just saying, No, I'm doing a great job. I'm doing a great job. And I thought while she was talking, if you could somehow go back, that means long time ago now, right? It's probably 50 years ago. This story is like when, when the woman was diagnosed, but you go back 50 Years and slap that Dexcom on that 11 year old, and she'd know she wasn't doing great, right? You know what I mean, and then she'd have a fighting chance to do something about it, at the very least. So I'm a big fan. I know I went way off the mark with what you were trying to talk about here. I apologize.

Speaker 1 26:50
No, it's okay. This is, I mean, that's, this is a super valuable conversation, like an understanding, yeah, I

Scott Benner 26:54
like talking more deeply about this kind of stuff, all right? So CGM get one if you can. I hope your insurance covers it. I can't say enough good things about it. But like you said, there's a lot of these CGM now that are supporting algorithm based systems. So yes, you were nice enough to put a list here together, so I don't have to do it off top my head. But right now we have Omnipod five, the beta bionics, eyelet pump tandem, which at this point is, what is the x2 Moby, and they might have a two. Are they working on? I shouldn't say it's out loud if I'm wrong. But is there a tubeless pump?

Unknown Speaker 27:25
Yeah,

Scott Benner 27:25
so there will be a tubeless pump in some point in the future. Again, I don't speak for the company, but they're working towards that. That's a goal for the future. Yes. And then medtronics Got that 780 G that people seem to love. And then there's a they're a brand new sponsor, actually twist their pumps, not even it's April 18. It's not out yet, but it's, it's coming very soon, from what I understand, very soon. Yep. And that pump is going to run a version of loop. It's good. They call it the what twist loop algorithm, yeah. And that's going to be a version of loop. So you've got a version of loop, you've got Omnipod five, you've got beta bionics, which says, Just tell me your meal is going to be average, smaller than average, larger than average, breakfast, lunch or dinner. Yep, the 780 G, which I started hearing about two years ago from people in Europe who were telling me that it was awesome, which I they there's, they don't use the 780 G in Europe, but it's the same pump with a different number on it. And I mean Omnipod five, which has been chugging along for a while now. And people seem to love the control IQ, and now they just upgraded it to control IQ, plus, yeah, these pumps all need your CGM data to work with. Can I ask you my first question is, if you have any idea, like, what the backroom scuttlebutt is like, how come some companies are like, hey, ours works with this one, but not that one, or that one, but not this one. Like, how does that happen? Like, how can you bring to market? Like, oh, it works with libre, but it doesn't work with Dexcom. Works with Dexcom, it doesn't work with libre. Like, do you know how that happens?

Speaker 1 28:49
I don't know exactly how that happens. I know it's a frustrating. It's frustrating. It's obviously a business negotiation thing. I don't know exactly, but there's also, yeah, good.

Scott Benner 28:59
You can say what you want to say, but I just don't understand from a like, if somebody's like, No, it's okay. We don't want to work with yours. I'm like, I don't like, or they can't I don't know, like, I guess I don't understand the back room of it, but it's frustrating for somebody to say like, either, oh, I really want to try that pump, but I don't, you know, I use this one, not that one. Or, you know, what's worse, I think sometimes is that people get stuck with things they don't want because it works with the thing that their insurance covers, or, I don't know, yeah, and

Speaker 1 29:27
I mean, there's also a lack of education from the prescribers themselves. How so well, it would be awesome if all the prescribers actually knew in depth about some of these insulin pumps. For example, you might have an older provider and all he's known for years and years is Medtronic so then every patient is going to go, I want an insulin pump. He goes, Okay, that means that you get a Medtronic pump. When that maybe that's great for that patient, but they don't know about the other options. It'd be great if the providers knew the options available, and could. Could speak to them.

Scott Benner 30:00
I listen. I can't talk about this with you. I will get very upset, but I can't wrap my head around that like that's your job and you don't have a weekend to figure out the five or six pumps that are available.

Speaker 1 30:11
Scott, listen this. So I just was in an endo office the other day looking at someone's schedule, and this endocrinologist had booked three appointments in the same 15 minute slot? Yeah, I guess not. So that's, I mean, if you're quick, you got five minutes with each patient.

Scott Benner 30:28
You get a day off eventually. Like, wouldn't the week get easier if you spent one Saturday understanding what all the pumps did? Or Can't you just ask a support staff to put together a one page on each one of them for you?

Speaker 1 30:39
Oh, you you should. I mean, you totally should, right? I mean, there's the other side of that too. It's like, maybe they do that, but maybe this person's only in the office once a week, or like that. That was literally the case at this particular office. It was that the person who would do any of the the pump trainings or putting anything together was only in house once a week. So you're working with all these

Scott Benner 31:02
conflicting schedules. I make a podcast. I work on the weekends, okay? And like, I hear you, it's not my point. Like, I think my bigger point is that if you were digging a ditch and your shovel broke, going to get a new shovel, even if it's a waste of time and you're supposed to be digging, is way more productive than digging with the broken shovel. Like, I don't understand not, it's insane to me that an endocrinologist could look at me and go, Oh, you want the tandem. I don't know anything about that one. You have to get the Omnipod, or vice versa, or whatever. Like, you don't know anything about it. Like, if you don't know who the knows, then, right? Seriously. Like, that's how it would that's how it feels to me every time somebody tells me something like this, like, Oh, my doctor said they couldn't support that one, or they didn't understand how that worked, or they wanted me to use I mean, look at Canada given their kids aren't, you know, mph and regular still, because they're like, well, there's no one at the school to give them an injection, injection. They're wearing rocket ships that give them insulin, right? What are you talking about?

Speaker 1 32:03
Yeah, no, I wholeheartedly agree with you. Like, but anyways, yeah, but yeah. I mean going into a pun training, like, if you want to be successful, do your homework, right? Because, as as we just discussed here, the provider might not know everything about the pumps, so it would serve you well to do your homework. Research different pumps, look at their websites, figure out which one you're thinking about, because maybe that takes you to go into the office and say, hey, I want tandem or, oh, I want Omnipod. So just research it beforehand, so that you're not stuck in a position where you might not have

Scott Benner 32:36
what you want. Let me ask you something. Do you have a one sheet for each pump?

Speaker 1 32:40
I do have a little one that I created for like, hospital use. Yeah,

Scott Benner 32:43
would you want to share it with a guy who makes a podcast to put on his website? Sure, no problem. Okay, thank you. All right, I'll do it if nobody else is going to do it. Yeah? I just, like, for the life of me, you know what I mean? Like, I listen, I have a ton of compassion for doctors. I know how hard their job is. I know. I know. Listen, I've been through it 16 different ways. I know all the problems, right, and I'm not unfeeling to the issue. But like, you can't be unfeeling to that the people are coming to you, like, whether it's fair or not, you're what's between them and success.

Speaker 1 33:13
Absolutely, yeah, you're that. You're supposed to be the expert. So like, in my mind, like, like, what you're saying, there's no excuse for a provider to, especially an endocrinologist to not know about the pumps.

Scott Benner 33:23
Yeah, right. So this is your wheelhouse. So tell me what the keys to pump training success are

Speaker 1 33:28
absolutely yeah. So like I said, be prepared. Know the pump that you wanna do, I would say also look at your insurance coverage. Okay, so before you start this whole process, you should have a general idea of what you're getting yourself into. So what I would recommend you do is you actually call your insurance company. They're not going to give you a specific number at that moment, but they might be able to tell you what percentage of coverage that you'll be able to have for each particular pump. You can even ask them, like, is this being run through pharmacy? Would this be run through DME? What are the differences there? That way you have a general idea of what to expect for payments and things like that. Now let's say you get an answer and you go, wow, this is ridiculous. This is too high. I can't I can't do this check with each of the pump manufacturers because they oftentimes will offer payment plans. And perhaps you have a payment plan, it's, maybe it's 50 bucks a month, or whatever it is, that would allow you to still get an insulin pump, otherwise that you wouldn't have been able to

Scott Benner 34:27
get it at all. Yeah, you don't want to fall in love with the convertible if you can't get the loan for it. Like, so, like, exactly, yeah, know what your purchasing power is like through your insurance or whatever. Like, what is it you're eligible for before you show up and fall in love with something and then find out you can't

Speaker 1 34:41
have it absolutely. Yeah. Now you're also going to want to know where, where are your supplies coming from? Okay? So a lot of people, I'll get them trained up, and that was maybe a question that was never brought up or asked, and now they don't know where their supplies are coming from for their next pump change, right? So they'll get, like, three months of supplies to start. I don't actually know where I'm gonna get my stuff, so make sure you know where it's coming from. Generally speaking, the pump companies will look at a supplier that's contracted with with your insurance. Yeah, right. So like, I know you talk about us Med, you know there's edge Park Byram. There's a bunch of them out there. Just make sure you know where it's coming from. Because you don't want to love the pump, be using it. And then you get to where you're like, oh, it's been three months, and I have no supplies, right? You want to know? You got to

Scott Benner 35:26
know that. Give me a second. Here. You can get your diabetes supplies the same way my daughter does from us, med, us, med.com/juicebox, or call eight. I don't know if I know the number of thought my, damn it. I don't think I know. It's so funny. No, they, I just wanted to bring up that they're, they're a sponsor, so, but, yeah, like, I'm a, I'm a huge fan of that, like, so my daughter's Dexcom comes from us. Med, her OmniPods come from there. We're on a, you know, actually, just was on the phone with them today because we switched insurances. And it's so interesting, because no matter which company this is, you see people mad at them all the time, like nobody's ever madder than somebody who sends medical supplies to you. And in fairness, I would say that they all feel like they should buy a new computer to me sometimes, but I know that's an oversimplification, but like it just feels, it feels like a process. It's a little outdated for you know where technology is. Having said that I woke up one day and I was like, Where the hell are Arden supplies? And then it hit me, oh, we changed insurance. That's my fault. Yeah. Like, you know what I mean? Like, oh, I never called them and said that I called them up. I just kept assuming, like, Oh, it'll show up. And this I called and I said, Hey, we switched insurance, and it's not a fun process. They've got to contact your doctor again because the new insurance company wants verification, and the whole thing is a rigmarole, like, it hurts, like, you know what I mean, but once it's set up, there's nothing like it. Because I don't know how some of these other companies work, but us Med, like, they call my house, I push a button on the phone, and the stuff comes and, like, you can't beat that with a stick. That's awesome, you know what I mean? Totally, totally,

Speaker 1 37:01
yeah. And that might not be everyone's experience with every single company. So just, you know, work with the companies, and if you don't really like them, I mean, you can, you can switch suppliers, sure? Yeah,

Scott Benner 37:12
absolutely. I've worked with Edge Park, I've worked with us Med, I've worked with other companies. I've worked with CVS, Caremark. Like, I don't know what it is about the process, but it always feels like, God, it shouldn't have this many steps, agreed. You know what I mean. But the thing I like about us Med, the best is that, once it's up and running, it is so automated, it's just, it's awesome. So, but, yeah, like, that's an interesting point, right? Because people are diagnosed and they like, your doctor gives you some supplies, maybe to get you set up, and then, or, you know, your first order comes with some stuff. And you probably just, like, you probably don't even think about it, like, Where does this come from, right? You know? And some people probably just think local pharmacy. But that's not always, you know. I mean, after, you know what, it is not bad, but after you've got this Albatross, I was gonna say Albatross, after you've had diabetes for a while, you don't want to be at the pharmacy all the time picking stuff up, you know? Yeah, no, I hear that, yeah. What else you got

Speaker 1 38:07
there? Yeah? So I'd say also, you need to know who your point person is. So the way it works is a lot of times you'll have an actual employee from the pump company who's doing a lot of the back end stuff, right? So they're they're working with a doctor to make sure that all the the orders and the prescriptions are correct, making sure settings are dialed in that employee there may not actually be the one who's going to train you on the pump, right? So you're going to want to know who is the actual pump trainer that's going to train train you. So like, as an example, I do pump trainings outside of working in a hospital as a contractor. And there's also endocrine clinics that have their own trainers there, and then sometimes there's trainers from the actual company. So you want to know who that person is, because they're going to be a really good contact point for you to while you're learning how to how to use the pump, or if you need help with the supplies and things like that. You gotta know who that is, and you need to communicate with that person. I would recommend don't leaving that person unread, like you wanna get things situated and scheduled up listen to their recommendations. Now that person there also is likely not gonna be able to come to your house. In the old days, you could go and do pump trainings at people's houses. But there's, there's definitely a safety issue that can come sometimes with that. And so most of the pump companies will say you need to do this at your doctor's office, like a coffee shop, a diner, a library, something like that, a public location where

Scott Benner 39:36
you can't be absconded with Jordan, where you don't end up in somebody's trunk. Is that what

Speaker 1 39:41
you're saying? That's exactly there. There's a few trainings that before these policies were really implemented. Let's just say I was like, I need to get out of here. You're

Scott Benner 39:50
like, this isn't going my way. I wish I remembered this guy's name, but this has got to be 10 years ago, a really long time ago. Arden was on, like, Chief. Four and we had some sort of, like a failure, and we didn't have any more supplies. And I called the company, just like anybody else, I didn't call. I wasn't like, Hey, I'm the guy from the thing. I wasn't the guy from the thing at that point. And I, you know, I got somebody on the phone, and they said, Well, your local rep may have samples. And they gave me my local reps number I called. She said, I'm sorry I don't, but, like, I know that the local rep in the next state over, like, I'm in New Jersey, she calls a guy in, like, Pennsylvania, and he says, I have stuff here, and I'm talking about, like, 90 minutes from my house, right? And he says, This is my home address. You come here. I'll give you one. And no VI, like, later that afternoon, I was standing in his dining room, and he was handing me a transmitter. Oh, that's amazing, yeah. Like, just a really, like, like, a genuinely nice thing that nobody had to do, you know. So I don't know if the world's gotten so big now that that stuff, that stuff like that happens anymore or not, but like, a long time ago, like, that was it just, you know, some local rep that has some stuff in his car. And he was like, happy to like, like, help me out with it.

Speaker 1 41:04
Yeah. I mean, I down here, because down here in Arizona, right, there's, it seems like to me, it's a pretty family friendly state for the most part. And like, the reps at all the companies kind of fit that description that you just said there. Yeah. I mean, I've had encounters before where you're like, This patient's really struggling, and one of them will be, I'm on my way. I'll be right there to drop off a sample, right? It's incredible,

Scott Benner 41:27
yeah, just very, very, very uplifting, actually, I guess, the way for sure, for

Speaker 1 41:31
sure, but yeah, I mean, when you're going through your training there, like you said, You'll coordinate with that person to figure out where you're going to be training. Just make sure, though, during the training, you come prepared to ask questions, and depending on the person's training style, they might try to do everything for you. I would say, go into that training. And if it's not made clear from them upfront, like you should be holding the pump, you should be doing everything yourself. You got to get that hands on experience. Otherwise it's it. You're going to get to your first actual site change or whatever, and no one's there, and you're not going to know what you're doing tactilely. It's not going to be memorable at all. You're not going to be exactly right. So like, if I do a training with someone, I say, Listen, from the get go, you are doing everything. I'm here to help coach you, but you're going to be entering all the basal rates. You're going to be putting the pump on yourself. You're loading it with insulin, you're doing it all. So, yeah, just, can

Scott Benner 42:23
I be cynical for a second, if a trainer is doing that? Is that just them trying to get out of there? Or do you think it just also could be just a style? Like, you know what I mean? Like, are they, like, let me just get this thing set up so I can get the hell out of here. Like, do you think that

Speaker 1 42:36
has I see? Yeah, there's a possibility that, definitely that could be a possibility. There are situations where maybe someone's getting really sidetracked and just really off topic. I got you, and you're like, Oh, hey, let me show you this real quick, and then you do it for them real fast.

Scott Benner 42:52
Are you? Are you asking me to remind people that that you're not there to hear someone's life story?

Speaker 1 42:58
That's for sure. Like, I think people should be personable and have good conversations, but you are there for a specific goal of getting someone going on a pump

Scott Benner 43:08
right? Listen. I'll tell you something. One of the reasons it's so easy to make this podcast is because no one likes to tell their story more than people with type one diabetes. They love this. Yeah, oh my God. They love it. Yeah? Like, yeah, I if I go speak at something and I try to walk across the room, I gotta put my head down and put a bag over my head if I want to make it to the other side. Because everyone who stops you, it's like, hey, it's, first of all, it's lovely. Like, don't get me wrong, but like, at some point they settle in, and if they feel like you're not moving still, boom, here's my diagnosis. Or they they start at a at the beginning, and you're like, Oh no, I gotta go.

Speaker 1 43:43
I know you don't want to sit there being rude or anything. But, oh man. And

Scott Benner 43:48
worse for me, Jordan, and you know, it like I'm really interested. So I'm like, oh no kidding. Before I know it, I'm making a podcast for them and me. You know, maybe, like, No, it wasn't. If no one else can hear this, I you know, can we record this at least? I think it's nice actually, that people are, you know, I honestly, I think it's a community thing. Like, once you get in front of somebody who, you know, understands, like, you're like, Well, this is my chance to, like, open up about this to a person who's not going to look back at me, like, blankly, you know, I get it like, it's awesome, but the trainer's got to go. They got a half an hour, and they got a lunch break too, and like, they got to keep moving get to the next

Speaker 1 44:24
person. Yeah, yeah. And again, this depending on the person, but I usually allow for up to two hours, or

Scott Benner 44:30
they call a mensch, that's nice, yeah. So

Speaker 1 44:36
that usually is plenty of time, like most of the pumps, you can get trained up in about an hour or so, give or take, and then that leaves about an hour to, you know, have some friendly conversation or ask questions and things like that.

Scott Benner 44:49
You have a list here of things to be prepared for. Can I Can I read the list? Yeah, go ahead and read the list, because I'm amused the pump. Have you shown up at trainings where the pump wasn't there? Absolutely. Absolutely okay. The charger. Have you shown up at locations where the pumps not charged? People who don't have their infusion sets or their pods with them? Yes, yes, they brought the pump, but not insulin correct? They have the pump, but they don't have their CGM, yep. Okay. They don't have the transmitter for the g6 but they have the sensor. Yes. So now, here's the here's one I'm interested in. Now, I know professionally, I think you have to say what you want to say, but I have other thoughts. Alcohol swabs, if you, oh, if, if you want to use them, you put it there. Okay, all right, yes, you are not carrying alcohol alcohol swabs with you. For them, not at all. Gotcha. And then, and this is a great tip, like, bring a notebook so you can write stuff. Now,

Speaker 1 45:41
yes, yes. Okay, so everything on that list that's all coming from experience. I've been doing pump trainings going on about five years now, professionally, and everything on that list has been forgotten, misplaced, or something like that, to where you either have to reschedule the training, or, you know, we're getting a delay where, while somebody drives home real quick to go get it. Listen, I don't want

Scott Benner 46:05
to be critical, as the person who has left my house 1000 times in my life and walked back in two minutes later going, I'm just gonna remember to take my wallet with me this time. Exactly this list hit me like, like Jordan, when my wife and I rented our first apartment after we were married, we were sitting down to sign the contract on the apartment, and there was, like, this highlighted, like something on the page had like, highlighter through it, so it drew your eye to it, and it said, No swimming in the pool with open wounds. I gestured to the rental person. I was like, this isn't just the thing a lawyer thinks of, like, what is this? She goes, Oh, you have no idea how many people try to get into the pool with open wounds. I was like, Oh, that's a problem. She goes, it's a massive problem. And I was like, oh, okay, that your list reminded me that I'm like, That's not just things people write down. Because why would you have to remind people to bring a pump to their pump training? But yeah, I

Speaker 1 46:55
can't tell you how many times they're like, Oh, I thought this was just an educational session. It is about the pump. Where's it at? Yeah, right. Okay, just a quick side story here, but I went to a training once, and this was for a tandem pump, and we get there, and this was also back when I went to people's houses. So I'm at this guy's house, way out, way out, far away, and we're talking and all that stuff. And then i All right, well, why don't you get the pump out? And he gets it out, and he's like, whoa. Like, what is this? My dad, that's your pump. He's like, No, I wanted that tubeless one. And I you mean, the Omnipod? Is like, Yeah, I thought I was getting Omnipod. I'm like, Dude, this is the tandem pump. And, like, when did you get this? He's like, it, well, it's been here for

Scott Benner 47:36
a month, yeah, in a box that says tandem on the front

Unknown Speaker 47:39
of it, right? Yeah.

Scott Benner 47:41
Oh, my goodness. And for clarity, you mean you're out in the desert, is what you're trying to say, right, literally, out in the desert. You're like, oh, I don't want to get buried out here. So, like, so

Speaker 1 47:52
I was like, All right, well, I might have to either reschedule, or he ultimately, was like, I got to send this back. We're not, I can't do this training. I was

Scott Benner 47:59
wondering. I wondered, like, did he just, like, put the other pump on? But no, he sent it back and went and got the one he wanted. It's awesome story. I don't

Speaker 1 48:07
know how that actually worked out with his insurance. I kind of was like, All right, I'm gonna wash my hands of this

Scott Benner 48:11
one. Here I go. Now, goodbye. Yeah, he didn't ask if you want to stay behind and shoot cactus for a while or anything like

Speaker 1 48:18
that. No, he just asked if I wanted to stay for a couple of glasses of whiskey, but, oh, that's, that's lovely. It was very polite and kind. But I was like, you know, I've got to get home to my family. Thank

Scott Benner 48:27
you in one piece. Yeah, understand how a CGM works. Go ahead. What do you what do you want people to know?

Speaker 1 48:34
Yeah. So just just understanding, similar to, like, what we touched on a little bit up there earlier, but like, for example, CGM do not read blood glucose. They read interstitial glucose. And so if you're not aware of the difference, interstitial glucose is really the glucose just outside of the blood. So think about getting to that open wound discussion we had, if you scrape your knee and you clean off the blood and then it's kind of oozing a clear fluid that is interstitial fluid. And that fluid there contains glucose in it. It's going kind of back and forth a little bit through osmosis. Yeah. So anyways, it's just, it's just glucose outside the blood, the easy way to think about it, right? But because it's measuring that the changes of your actual glucose levels that are going to impact you are happening inside the blood. There can be a slight delay in that interstitial glucose there. Yeah. So as an example, let's say you look down at your CGM. It says that you are 150 with two arrows up. There's a good chance by that point there, maybe you're like 170 actually, if you pull out a glucose meter, a reliable glucose meter, and checked, because the CGM is going to lag behind when there's these rapid changes. So you just got to be aware of that, right? That's all I meant by that. Okay,

Scott Benner 49:54
I've tried to impress upon people forever, and I sometimes I feel weird about, I'm not going to lie like, because. You know, like, ever since Dexcom, they're sponsors, right? And then I see somebody online, they're like, This thing doesn't work, and blah, blah, blah. And I'm like, and you want to say, like, are you hydrated? Like, you know, is it this? Is it that? Like, I'm always afraid people are going to be like, he's over here apologizing for them. The fact that people aren't wowed that a little, tiny wire gets inserted under their skin, and then they know what their blood sugar is, which direction it's moving, and how fast it's going that direction. Yeah. Like, yeah. I don't know how you're not wowed by that constantly, but Okay, and how you don't see that like this, this static piece of metal and plastic, which is being run by like, an algorithm that's actually taking that measurement and then doing a bunch of gesenters that you and I do not understand, to come up with how much glucose is in this interstitial fluid, and how does that translate to how much we'd find in the blood right now if we did a finger stick like, that's magic, okay? It is magic, absolutely and not to understand that like you and your body or your kid's body, and that person's body, or that person's kid's body, are not the same. They're not in the same state, and that somehow this company has made this thing that still works for most people exactly like, that's beautiful, right? And yet, but we always act like, I don't know why this doesn't work, like it's not a doorknob, like it's not, like it doesn't just work or not work, like there's a lot going into it. And I find it valuable to remember that when you're using it Well

Speaker 1 51:31
absolutely. And I love the points that you brought up in other episodes where, like, if you really look down or look at like, what's going on a situation, I think you could probably dive down and get to the root cause of pretty much every issue with diabetes. It just seems like it's a mystery to some people, but if you actually took the time and looked into it, you'd find out, like, oh, that's why this happened, right? And so you can look at a CGM also, and like, you brought up the individual biochemistry of people, right? And so, like, think about, like, you could be taking even different medications than someone else, yeah. And that could, that could play a role into the into the CGM readings there. So it's not that the the CGM itself was not working. It just could be a different situation going on in that person's body. Again,

Scott Benner 52:15
it's a piece of plastic and metal and algorithm that, in 2025 is talking to a human body and coming back with this information. It's pretty awesome, and it's not going to be perfect for everybody. Like, you know, the same idea with the with adhesive. Like, one person will say, this thing falls off all the time. The next person will tell you, like, I can't get the damn thing off of me, right? Why don't they make it this stronger, weaker, better? Like, because it's they're trying to make it work for as many people as possible, right? Not specifically for you. So, like, if you have greasy skin and it falls off a lot, then you're a person who's like, I wish they'd make this stuff stickier. So they make it stickier. And people go, I can't get this thing off, right? People with dry skin are like, oh, and then, or like, you know, listen, I don't There's few things that break my heart, like medical adhesive rashes. Like, I just It breaks my heart to think that, like, you're already in this situation, you already need to wear this thing. And like, oh my god, now this is happening. You know what I mean? Like, and I take people's points, like, Well, why don't they make a hypoallergenic one, the one that like this, the one like, I'm like, because if they started doing that, they'd have to make 7000 of these things. And then, like, I don't know how they could do that, you know what I mean, or how would even figure out which ones for you, you know what I mean. But at the same time, like, I'm not again, I'm not unfeeling to people who put it on and four days later, they're like, oh, this thing doesn't work already, right? But at the same time, I'd like to be able to say to those people, could, could you drink a bunch of water and make sure it's working. You know, first, like, before you just announce it, the thing doesn't work anymore, right? Absolutely. Listen, it's tough for everybody, but like, you know, this is what it is. This is the best you have. So you know, understand what interstitial fluid is and how you can help to make sure that your CGM is working as best as possible, that's all. And we absolutely put out episodes about it. So it's out there, if you want to know, no,

Speaker 1 54:05
it's definitely out there. Yeah, I just, you know this is coming off my head. I just forgot to mention this. But like, back to where I talked about doing the research for the pumps. There's some things that your fingertips that you could do right now to look into pumps. There's there's simulator apps. Oh yeah, go ahead and take a look at the pumps. So go on the App Store the Google place or whatever, and type in simulator for whatever pump that you want to try out. And there's a good chance you'll be able to try it out on your phone there, just getting a feel of what it would be like to push the buttons and all that. No kidding, yeah. So there's some cool things

Scott Benner 54:38
I'm telling you. As you're talking I really feel like I'd like to reach out to every pump company and just say, like, look, you know, give me a web page worth of information that you'd like people to have and like, I'll put it on my website. Yeah, yeah. You don't need to be an advertiser for that. Like, I mean, the truth is, I haven't looked into it in a couple of years, but I get better traffic than the companies do. So like, yeah, my. My site does really well. Like, I'd be happy for that stuff to be there and to help somebody. I just, I'm a one man show. Like, I can't, you don't mean, like, if I did everything that I was thinking of doing, I'd never get done. So I just prioritize stuff as best I can. Absolutely, yeah, I would love to do that. Like, I mean, yeah, I don't know, like, I hopefully you could get somebody to do it, but it's hard, man, it's difficult because you don't realize, like, you think, like, oh, call the company. You're not calling the company. You're calling a person who works in, like, my connections are in like, media or PR, and right, they don't work on the medical side. Like, you know what I mean, like, so then they got to put you in touch with another person, and now I'm in touch with another person who doesn't know me anymore. I'm like, You know what you should do? You should give me your content to put on my website. They're like, who are you? Because they don't know me. The PR people know me. I don't know like you just it's hard to get things done. I guess is my is my statement?

Speaker 1 55:49
Yeah, no, it is. And like you said, you're a one man show, so it's, uh, that makes it harder to, yeah, there's,

Scott Benner 55:55
I'm out of time. Did we cover everything you want to cover? Yeah, we did. We did. And we had a nice conversation. I thought, too. Absolutely, yeah, I'm all jacked up. Jordan, I've You are my third recording today.

Unknown Speaker 56:06
Man, yeah, you gotta take a break after this shot out of a

Scott Benner 56:09
cannon. I'm running on adrenaline right now, but I really appreciate you doing this with me. It's been a lot of fun. You'll be back again, right? We're gonna do more.

Speaker 1 56:17
Absolutely, yeah, there's always topics there, like I'd said the previous one like, I want to at some point cover some things on nutrition, yeah, yeah, there's lots of things to talk about. So I'll be back. Awesome, excellent. All right, I'll talk to you soon. Sounds good.

Scott Benner 56:34
Thanks so much to Jordan for spending his time with us. If you're enjoying Jordan on the podcast and you'd like him to come back. Go find him on Instagram, the diabetic murse, and let him know how much you enjoyed him on the show us. Med sponsored this episode of The Juicebox Podcast. Check them out at us, med, Comm, slash Juicebox, or by calling 888-721-1514, get your free benefits check and get started today with us. Med, the podcast you just enjoyed was sponsored by tandem diabetes care. Learn more about tandems, newest automated insulin delivery system, tandem Moby, with control iq plus technology at tandem diabetes.com/juicebox there are links in the show notes and links at Juicebox podcast.com thank you so much for listening. I'll be back very soon with another episode of The Juicebox Podcast. If you're not already subscribed or following the podcast in your favorite audio app, like Spotify or Apple podcasts, please do that now. Seriously, just to hit follow or subscribe will really help the show. If you go a little further in Apple podcast and set it up so that it downloads all new episodes, I'll be your best friend, and if you leave a five star review, ooh, I'll probably send you a Christmas card. Would you like a Christmas card? Check out my algorithm pumping series to help you make sense of automated insulin delivery systems like Omnipod, five loop, Medtronic, 780, G twist, tandem control, IQ and much more. Each episode will dive into the setup, features and real world usage tips that can transform your daily type one diabetes management. We cut through the jargon, share personal experiences and show you how these algorithms can simplify and streamline your care. If you're curious about automated insulin pumping, go find the algorithm pumping series in the Juicebox Podcast. Easiest way. Juicebox podcast.com, and go up into the menu, click on series, and it'll be right there. Hey, what's up, everybody? If you've noticed that the podcast sounds better and you're thinking like, how does that happen, what you're hearing is Rob at wrong way, recording doing his magic to these files. So if you want him to do his magic to you, wrong way. Recording.com, you got a podcast. You want somebody to edit it. You want rob you?

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