Scott Benner 11/15/23 Scott Benner 11/15/23

#1063 Time is a Construct

Jonathan is 16 and has type 1 diabetes.

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Scott Benner 0:00
Hello friends, and welcome to episode 1063 of the Juicebox Podcast.

Friends I'm going to be speaking with Jonathan today 16 years old has had type one diabetes for five years. He's from a very small town and does a fantastic job on this podcast today. Jonathan's using control IQ, and his mom is a big listener of the show. While you're listening, please remember that nothing you hear on the Juicebox Podcast should be considered advice, medical or otherwise, always consult a physician before making any changes to your health care plan, or becoming bold with insulin, which I just saved 40% off of your entire order at cosy earth.com you can with the offer code juice box at checkout. You can also get five free travel packs in a year's supply of vitamin D when you make your first order at drink, ag one.com/juice box are you newly diagnosed? We're looking to start over, check out the diabetes Pro Tip series that runs between Episode 1001 1026. If you can't find them in your player, I mean you should be able to but if you can't check them out at juicebox podcast.com diabetes pro tip.com. We're in the feature tab of the private Facebook group Juicebox Podcast type one diabetes. This episode of The Juicebox Podcast is sponsored by Dexcom dexcom.com/juice. Box head over now learn about the Dexcom G seven, the G six how to get started, find out if you're eligible for a free trial, and so much more dexcom.com/juice box where the same CGM that my daughter wears were a Dexcom. My

Jonathan 1:55
name is Jonathan. I am 16 year old. And I've been living with type one diabetes for about the past five years.

Scott Benner 2:05
Five years.

Jonathan 2:08
And Lunas small town in Kentucky go to a hot public high school play on the soccer team and the tennis team. They're nice. And there's a few other kids that I know of that also have type one diabetes in the area.

Scott Benner 2:27
Are they friends or just people you're aware of?

Jonathan 2:30
Kind of both? I know a few of them pretty well. And there's others I know have you

Scott Benner 2:36
become friends with them? Because they have type one or do you know them prior to that?

Jonathan 2:39
No, I didn't know that prior. My mom tried to start like a little type one diabetes group here. And it kind of fell apart. But a few people did show up and I've become close to them. John,

Scott Benner 2:52
your mom loves you. She started a group just for you. So you wouldn't be lonely. Did it work?

Jonathan 2:58
It without doing it anymore? Because COVID happened. So that kind of set that back? But

Scott Benner 3:03
yeah, but you held on to some people from it. Yeah. It's interesting. It's excellent. Actually, like small town. Like, how many people about do you know? I

Jonathan 3:14
would say maybe probably around 10,000 ish. Not too many.

Scott Benner 3:20
Okay, Kentucky, like, closer to Ohio or Kentucky like Kentucky.

Jonathan 3:26
We're in the more southern part of Kentucky.

Scott Benner 3:29
Okay. All right. You're 11 years old when you were diagnosed? Do you have any brothers or sisters?

Jonathan 3:34
Yes, I have two brothers and one sister all younger than me.

Scott Benner 3:39
They're all younger than you are. Is there? Is there anyone else in your family even going as far out as like aunts and uncles and people like that who have type one diabetes.

Jonathan 3:48
I have a few great uncles with type one diabetes and one uncle with type one diabetes. The young man there.

Scott Benner 3:56
I'm sorry. It's your mom's side of your dad's side.

Jonathan 3:59
This is my dad's side.

Scott Benner 4:00
Okay. Do you have any other autoimmune issues?

Jonathan 4:05
Not currently.

Scott Benner 4:08
John, you've been doing it? Yeah. You've been doing your homework. You're like not? Yeah. Yeah. So how about again, in the family, celiac thyroid issues, anything like that?

Jonathan 4:17
I'm honestly not too sure. I don't think it's much more than type one diabetes.

Scott Benner 4:24
Anybody run to the bathroom after Christmas dinner? Something could be silly. I don't think so. All right, you know, nobody's ever like wow, packets up real quick after we finished this turkey in the mashed potatoes. Yeah, no, definitely. Okay. All right. And but I'm not making fun of celiac for the people listening or like it's a barista here. I know. It's serious. It's trying to get John comfortable and calm and like so we can talk Jonathan are John would you prefer? I really don't care. You can call me either one all right path and that's what we're gonna do. Let's see. 11 years old. What Have any I mean, if of any, if anything, I guess what do you remember about being diagnosed?

Jonathan 5:08
One of my teachers noticed kind of notice that I was going to the bathroom pretty often she I think she said it was about every hour or so. And she told my mom without telling my mom, if that makes any sense. And she already knew that like, of the symptoms. So she's like, Okay, well just go get him tested. So I suddenly, from my experience, I suddenly got pulled out of school, and I had no idea why. And we were going to the doctors, and we went to see a family doctor that we had no. And they gave us a meter. And they sat me down to get some labs done the primarily test my blood sugar. And then we went home. And with the meter they had given us we tested my blood sugar. And I was like, it read high. And I think with that meter is over 600 or something like that.

Scott Benner 6:00
Wow. Do you remember how you felt? Well, previously, I

Jonathan 6:04
had the flu that December, and this was around February. And so everybody had told mom was getting kind of worried. And everybody told her that it was probably just because the flu and I got hit hard. And I'll eventually regain the way. And then once the teacher had told her about those symptoms that she had seen. Mom was like, Yeah, this is definitely what it is. And so has

Scott Benner 6:28
your mom ever shared with you? Was this something she was concerned about? Always because it was in your family?

Jonathan 6:33
She did have said to me that she knew that it was always a possibility that one of her kids would get it but she never knew like when or No, no,

Scott Benner 6:45
I understand. But it does sound like it was in the back of her mind. And just because she said she made the lead sentence.

Jonathan 6:50
Yeah, in the back of her head. So she was always was kind of watching. Yeah,

Scott Benner 6:55
yeah, she made the leap very quickly, which is great. And probably why you're weren't having a ton of symptoms besides the weight loss and the and the bathroom thing. Hey, maybe that you think that teacher was a creep? She was just watching little kids go to the bathroom or? No.

Jonathan 7:09
Actually, that teacher has a son with type one diabetes. He's older. I think he's a grown adult now. Yeah, I'm just kidding, for sure. But yeah, she had she had also known about those symptoms. And that's kind of the reason she kind of brought it up. Yeah,

Scott Benner 7:29
I'd be interested to hear from a person in that perspective, because maybe she didn't want to be the one to say it directly to your mom. Like maybe it's, you know what I mean? Like maybe some people want to be connected to and people's memories. I wonder, you know what I mean? Anyway? So how do you start? Like, what's the what's the deal? You get injections? First, they give you a pens? And is it a pump? And are you in charge? Or do your parents take care of it.

Jonathan 7:56
So when I first was diagnosed, and we left the hospital, they had us on the pens. And mainly the doctors would mess with the carb ratios and stuff, we didn't change much. And then pretty soon after, maybe a month or so they got us on a CGM. It was the Dexcom G five at the time. So that helped a lot. And that like, after fingers sticking like almost eight times a day, like and then immediately getting onto the every five minutes, you're getting a new reading. That was that was pretty fun for me for the those first few, probably months or so. Yeah, that I had that new experience, you know, making life easier. Yeah.

Scott Benner 8:41
And so that kind of outweighed for you the idea that you had to wait where something? Yes, yeah. Did you have concerns about having to wear it?

Jonathan 8:51
No, not really. I've never really had very many concerns of having having to poke myself with that and leaving it on me every seven or so days was

Scott Benner 9:02
so you don't have a lot of thoughts about what do other people think about this? No? Yeah. Okay. And you play would you say two different sports? Sorry.

Jonathan 9:12
I play soccer, and tennis. Alright,

Scott Benner 9:15
I'm not gonna count soccer as a sport, but okay, you do two different activities. That's I'm just kidding. And and has it ever been a problem for you? Like, how do you find activity with diabetes? Like especially in the beginning, were you able to keep going or was there a relearning process? At

Jonathan 9:31
the time I was first diagnosed, it was like, it was just soccer for the middle school. And that wasn't the worst because I would normally once I actually started playing in starting, I would have my I was a tandem. And I would just unhook it for the games that I played. And so that didn't bug me much. But there was, I think it was last year and The year before the I was in a junior varsity match. And I was wearing the Omnipod on my arm and that got torn off. And I didn't go out the game, I just tossed it to the sideline to fix it later because I wasn't worried about it. But that's probably the most that's happened with the technology and during while playing sports and all those

Scott Benner 10:19
games, that's not bad at all. Yeah. Did you learn to like that there are better places to put them? Well, I guess my question is, which one are you using? Now? Are you on control? Like you are?

Jonathan 10:29
Yeah, I'm on control IQ now. Am I

Scott Benner 10:31
okay? Did you find when you disconnected to play that your blood sugar's would get high afterwards? Or did they not?

Jonathan 10:38
I think it honestly depended. Because obviously, like when you're in the rush of the game, you have those adrenaline rushes, which always normally raise my blood sugar, but like, also, I have a lot of physical activity, like I'm running up and down the field constantly. So yeah, I think it and honestly, I don't remember, but I think in the end, just thinking about it probably ended up balancing itself out and maybe eventually having a load afterwards.

Scott Benner 11:06
Have you learned how to do activity now with? I mean, staying connected and in managing it, like stably? Or do you still disconnect to this day?

Jonathan 11:17
It just depends. Right now. We're in the offseason for soccer. And so I'm playing tennis right now. But for tennis, because it's not such a physical sport. I keep everything on. And that works pretty well, for at least tennis. For soccer, though. I'm not sure what I'm gonna do this next year. Last year, I would normally just kind of flip it and tuck it into my shorts. And have to keep that on.

Scott Benner 11:47
Yeah. All right. I do want to. So I want to ask you about management, like specifically like, do you handle it? Like present day right now? Is anyone involved in your help? You know, is there people helping? Are you doing it by yourself? Or

Jonathan 12:04
mainly, it's mainly me. I carb count I Bolus for everything that I well, I shouldn't say everything I you know, I'm doing all that. But my mom, she, she's a she follows my graphs pretty consistently. And she, she knows like when she sees something in the graph consistently. She knows like, what kind of changes to make, like I'll make a few changes every once in a while. But he or she mainly makes the changes and I do pretty much everything else.

Scott Benner 12:34
site changes, is you you keep track of them. And when like your sites have to be changed in the CGM has to be changed.

Jonathan 12:41
Yeah. I mean, I just keep track of it by the alarms that the devices give me.

Scott Benner 12:48
Okay. Are you paying attention to those alarms? Kind of? How How often do you find yourself going? Oh, my CGM just expired. I, I wasn't, I didn't remember that was gonna happen.

Jonathan 13:02
I normally do the changes in the evening. So it's not the worst when it expires. But I have done that before. We're like, I'll get the, like, 30 minute alarm, and then I'll go start something else. And then it'll expire. And like 20 minutes later, I'm like, oh, I need to change that.

Scott Benner 13:19
Yeah, I said to so my daughter wore a G seven last week to try it. And she's gonna go back in and keep using it when her G six is run out. And so I sent her a text, she's in college, and I said, Hey, you're in a great position here. You can put the G six on, you know, even maybe six hours before the g7 is going to expire. And then you won't have a gap without your CGM. And then she didn't do that. Yeah, I'm looking at a text from her now that says, I'm so busy at school. I don't know how I'm gonna get any of this done. And I responded time is a construct, which is not going to be helpful for her. But I thought it was funny. Anyway, okay, so you're definitely using the G six because using the control IQ, and right now in April of 2023, GS six is the only thing compatible with it. So but you've done both, you've done Omni pod five, you've done control like you. It sounds like you've tried a number of things, but prior to that you were just using a tandem pump. Yes. Okay. What made you try an algorithm at all. Now let's talk about the Dexcom g7. The Dexcom g7 is a small and wearable continuous glucose monitoring system. It sends real time glucose readings to your Dexcom g7 app or the Dexcom receiver. Use my link dexcom.com forward slash juice box to learn more and get started today. You will be able to effortlessly see your glucose levels and where they're headed. This way you'll be able to make better decisions about food, insulin and activity. Once you're able to see the impact that those variables have on blood sugar, you'll begin to make more purposeful decisions and have better outcomes. My daughter has been wearing a Dexcom My daughter has been wearing a Dexcom product for so many years, I don't even remember when she started. But today, she wears the Dexcom G seven. And it is small and easy. And oh my goodness, are you going to love it dexcom.com forward slash juice box, you can head there now and click on the button that will get you your free benefits check or just hit that other button that says Get Started. When you use my links, you're supporting the production of the podcast dexcom.com forward slash juice box.

Jonathan 15:48
Well, the first pump that was on was tandem. And eventually they upgraded to the Basal IQ, which was just it suspended your insulin, when it saw you're going low. And that that was honestly probably the first big game changer with how we manage because we could be slightly more aggressive to keep my numbers and trust that the pump would be able to keep it stable because it would suspend the insulin. And then they upgraded it to control IQ where it pretty much did everything it increased it would give you those auto boluses decrease standard suspended your insulin and then we do know that the pumpkin almost do pretty much everything as long as we had those main settings right like the Basal CF factor, you know? Yeah.

Scott Benner 16:38
Jacqueline, where'd you learn all this? On

Jonathan 16:41
my mom, and she'd probably say the Juicebox Podcast. Oh, okay.

Scott Benner 16:44
Oh, okay. Sorry. Oh, my God, we'll get back to that in a second. Hold on, we just wrote down Am I annoying to you? So because you just explained that so clearly, just I can be more aggressive because the algorithm will try to stop even Basal IQ which was, you know, like you said, just cutting off your, your Basal insulin, if it looks like you're gonna get low, and you can be more aggressive. And that works, right? Like, just Yeah, via getting some of the insulin up front ahead of the food, in a more aggressive manner can sometimes help. What would you describe your eating style as, honestly,

Jonathan 17:18
it's probably pretty unhealthy. And it's with carb counts, it's decently consistent, I'd say normally 60 to 100 carbs for almost every meal. So there's that somewhat consistent range that I eat. But it's normally like the quick processed food, I can throw in the microwave for like two minutes and then just eat it.

Scott Benner 17:45
John, I'm going to have more younger people on the show, because that was the most honest answer anybody's ever given. I'm like, what's your what's your fueling plan? Like Jonathan, you're like, I go with pretty unhealthy. Some people like it's not I'm a pescatarian. I'm like, Yeah, are you so but oh my god. So hold on that really made me you. Got I'm trying to put myself in the ground as fast as possible. Yesterday, I had a Twinkie hot dog. But it was so your is it about quick. Accessibility to food. Is it about that you cook for yourself? Is your mom like a layabout? Is she not helping you with meals? What's going on? Exactly? Well,

Jonathan 18:25
for like lunches and dinners. They normally cook like dinners like my dad, he's kind of the main cook in the family. He'll cook a pretty convenient dinner. That's good. So dinners is usually but you know, we live in America. It's still like all the processed food and stuff. So obviously, it's not going to be the best but for lunches, and breakfasts, lunches tend to be at school and in the schools who just isn't also the best. Also, click Process stuff, they can just click in massive amounts. And breakfasts ends up being like oatmeal or something I can just throw on the toaster. Yeah, don't

Scott Benner 19:04
don't throw me on the toaster. But I hear what you're saying. Yeah. So let me ask you a question. You have a firmer grasp of what you should be eating than many people your age. But you're not. Do you not like, like singular foods, like a piece of chicken or a piece of beef for, you know, like asparagus, like, are you not that person? Or is it about time?

Jonathan 19:31
It's honestly probably about time, like, I could sit down and I could like, learn how to cook this stuff real nice and make it good. But like, I have a really busy schedule, like with school and then all the extracurriculars I do. I ended up not being at home very often where I have that like 30 minutes to an hour to be able to cook some nice chicken or a steak or whatever.

Scott Benner 19:57
Yeah. You know, it's interesting. We Because I think that when most people look at another person's lifestyle, and they, you know, they make a judgement about it, they always say, Oh, they don't try hard enough, or they don't understand me, they don't have money. But it's none of that for you. It's just It seriously is just time and availability to that time. I know what you're talking about, it's incredibly difficult. To prepare a meal, I guess I shouldn't have said that. It's not incredibly difficult to prepare a meal, it's incredibly difficult to find the time to prepare a meal. And then you have to cook it, you have to eat it, and then clean it up. And before you know it, you're an hour, 90 minutes later, and for somebody like you who's involved in activities and going to school, and I mean, you have a are you dating? No, no, yeah, that'll let you try that. And how come you're not dating? Nobody's interested? Or you're not interested? It's

Jonathan 20:56
kind of sort of both. Like, I have had some people ask me out, but like, it's either I don't feel ready or like, I just kind of don't want to at the time, like, yeah, no, I understand that part of time. You know,

Scott Benner 21:11
I guess you do you mind telling me I what I don't feel relat ready means putting

Jonathan 21:16
in that time commitment, you know, like, preparing myself mentally, for the challenges it may bring, you know, because it's a whole new aspect to life. Jonathan, I'm

Scott Benner 21:28
laughing because you have no idea. And you're not going to be able to prepare. So I've been married for like ever, I don't know, like 26 or 27 years. And still twice a day. My wife says something to me. And I think what is she talking about? Why? Why are we talking about this? What's happening? Yeah, man, are you have no idea? Have you considered being a monk? That's not a bad thing to do. And, you know, keep it on the back burner. Let's say people are lovely. And you will get so much out of an interpersonal relationship that is special like that. And at the same time, it it'll be utterly confusing to you. I think it's I think it's growth. But that's if you get lucky and get like a decent person like you could get a wacko you don't I mean, like, Yeah, have you had any your friends like dating somebody that they're like, Oh, my God, I, the one I got is nuts. Does that happen? Yeah, yes. Yeah. Good times. Good times, Jonathan. Yeah, there's plenty of time for that. Don't rush. I like the way you're handling. Do you know it's interesting. If people are really listening, you sound like you come from a really solid families. For Kids, mom and a dad in the house. Your mom put a lot of effort into your, into your health. You play a couple of sports, you're really well spoken and understand everything and yet I have found a way to infer that it's possible your mom is a layabout, and your teacher was a creep. Your friends girlfriends are all whacked out of their skull, which nonetheless, I'm just trying to be entertaining Jonathan, but I just did hit me a minute ago. It sounds like you have a really wholesome phallic life. I'm like, why was that lady watching? You go to the I just got up an hour ago. I'm not really awake yet. Okay, I have to ask you just because of where you're at. A lot of pressure about drugs. Where are you able to stay away from it?

Jonathan 23:18
For the most part, I've been able to stay away from it. The honestly the big thing is vapes, like I've been asked to do vapes, I don't know, like, I know that there are a bunch of druggies all over but yeah, I can pretty consistently stay away from most of the

Unknown Speaker 23:35
What grade are you in?

Jonathan 23:35
I'm a sophomore.

Scott Benner 23:37
What's the harshest drug you hear spoken about by kids? Everyone's

Jonathan 23:40
doing a little probably ended up being like cocaine, but it's probably most commonly marijuana. And

Scott Benner 23:46
when they're vaping, or they vaping weed or they vaping like oils and stuff like that.

Jonathan 23:51
Most of them will probably say it's oils, but I really have no idea.

Scott Benner 23:56
And so you've been able to keep a core people around you who aren't doing that. Yeah, that's excellent. Good for you. I'm assuming that you don't smoke cigarettes, and you don't drink? No, no. Do you think you will?

Jonathan 24:09
Honestly, not sure. But I will try and stay away from it as long as I can. Because I just know the health health benefits from it. You staying away from your

Scott Benner 24:19
parents drink? No. You I think that gives you a better shot, honestly, because it doesn't seem like part of life. I've really noticed that. That people I know who came from households where there's like always beer or something like that, or just wine in the evening. And it's just it's very normalized, which I don't not really making a judgement about, but I think when anything's normalized, then when you get older, you just think oh, I guess I'm supposed to drink coffee now or you don't I mean, like something like that. So alright, yeah. So you play two sports, you're not dating, you're not smoking, and you're not getting high and you're not drinking. What do you do? For the rest of your time,

Jonathan 25:02
like I said, I'm really busy outside of school, because the ball sports almost practices every day, almost to average two to occasionally one and a half hour to two hour practices every day with those sports and I do. I do play the trumpet and that. Are you serious? Yes, in the band. I play the trumpet. And every once in awhile, they'll do an after school practice. For like the whole band, right before a concert or something. So yeah. Outside of school, I'm probably home. I'd say roughly around 530 to six almost every day. I

Scott Benner 25:40
have to ask you, and you don't have to answer if you don't want to. But you're coming off like an indignant to me. I don't know if you know that word, but I'm trying to figure it out. Are you? How tall are you?

Jonathan 25:48
I'm around six, three, you're athletic. I would consider myself athletic.

Scott Benner 25:54
So you're a sixth theory, athletic, soccer tennis playing trumpet player who's not dating, getting hired drinking? All the dots right now, Jonathan, what do you think of that? My kids are gone. I could use a couple more years that are carefree. But with a person in the house. By the way, I called your teacher creepy earlier now like describe your body to me, Jonathan. You're a bit of a I'm gonna ask my last question to put this puzzle together. How are you a decent student? Good student bad student?

Jonathan 26:26
Oh, yeah. I'm an AP student.

Scott Benner 26:28
What do you thinking of doing after high school?

Jonathan 26:30
I've been thinking a lot about electrical engineering, or just something in engineering in general. Really?

Scott Benner 26:36
You think you can pull that off? Your math is strong?

Jonathan 26:40
Yeah, it's pretty strong.

Scott Benner 26:41
Oh, let me Can I say something to you? Sure, you can hold out you're gonna get a good girl. Do you see them saying? Like, you don't have to don't don't don't? Um, yeah. Is that what you're doing? Oh, is that what you didn't say earlier? Has somebody up to your standards not come along it? Not

Jonathan 27:00
necessarily. But, like,

Scott Benner 27:03
what the hell's happening here? How come? Oh, my God, come on. Kids aren't like you. I mean, you understand your diabetes? Like, you're thoughtful. Like, how did this happen? Did your parents do this to you? Or is this natural? Honestly,

Jonathan 27:17
they they have said, like a good example of like, what to look for, you know, like how to act around people. So yeah, I'd put most credit on them. Hmm.

Scott Benner 27:25
Religion a big part of your life for now?

Jonathan 27:28
Oh, yeah. It's a pretty big part.

Scott Benner 27:30
Okay. Is this that have a hand in keeping you in line? Or is this just who you are?

Jonathan 27:35
We have like a small church here. So we're pretty tight knit, you know. So that's probably it's probably also helped. I'm trying

Scott Benner 27:43
to get to the fact like, I'm trying to find out if like, when one of those kids is handy, that vape and they're like, Hey, Jonathan, try this. Are you thinking yes, I'm going to were you thinking? No, I can't because God won't like it. Or do you think I don't want this? It's just not for me.

Jonathan 27:58
It's a little bit of God. Like, you know, and it's like, I just don't want to okay, it's an it's a mix of both.

Scott Benner 28:07
I got you. Oh, listen, everybody needs a motivator. That's perfect. I listen, I'm not questioning this is working. You've never murdered a squirrel and buried it so people wouldn't see or anything weird, right? Jonathan, you'd ever merge? We're all right.

Like, I'm trying to make sure you don't have a mental illness. Jonathan, right. So I checked to make sure you're not torturing small animals. I asked a question. And there's this long pause and I'm like, Oh, we figured it out. Someone watched this kid. But oh, my god, six three is that is a gift. Do you have a tall family? Are you the only one?

Jonathan 28:50
Oh, yeah. My uncle who also has type one diabetes, he's he's pretty tall too. So? Which,

Scott Benner 28:56
which? Which one of these sports are you thinking about in college? Tennis, right? Honestly,

Jonathan 29:01
I'm not sure. Honestly, I'll probably end up trying out for either one. I don't think I'm a get a scholarship for either. So.

Scott Benner 29:09
But Jonathan, here's what you're missing at an engineering school. It's not like Steffi Graf is showing up there. So you really might be able to see what I'm saying. Yeah, there's their standards. What am I trying to say? You are athletic, and smart. Doesn't happen like that. And I don't mean smart. Like, not everybody's like my kid plays But initially, I don't mean that, like Everybody calm down. I mean, like engineering smart. That's a different level of understanding. And an athletic is a mix. Like it is a mix. You don't see often. My son just graduated from college recently. He played baseball throughout school. He got a lot of money for playing baseball. And his, his major was quantitative economics. And you don't often hear somebody who can hit a baseball out of A minor league baseball stadium and understands whatever the hell quantitative economics is. So that's what I'm saying for you. This is you have a nice launch here. Do you don't screw this up? Jonathan, you're gonna have a decent life. You excited? I guess when you put it that way. Yeah, man think big. What kind of car do we want as an adult? Honestly,

Jonathan 30:19
I really don't care something that I can that will work, something that will get me point a point a point A to point B pretty easily, Jonathan, partially destroy.

Scott Benner 30:30
We're gonna talk about your diabetes in a minute, because I want to hear how you're managing and everything and everything you've gone through with the two different systems. But first, we're, we have to continue playing this game. I'm gonna give you a million dollars now. You have a million dollars. You're an adult? They're 23. Okay, are you moving out of Kentucky? Are you staying? Honestly, I'd probably stay. All right. And the kind of car you have not important to you? Not really, what kind of how big do you think you would like your house to be? Do you want some big crazy house or something small and manageable? Does it matter to you if it's new or

Jonathan 31:06
old? Honestly, I'd kind of like maybe an older house, I could kind of fix up and make how I wanted. Jonathan,

Scott Benner 31:15
I think you're gonna have a problem when this comes out. Because every free mom, every mom that hears this, that's gonna try to figure out who you are. And they're going to be sending their daughters to you. Do you see what I'm saying? They're gonna be like, meet that boy right there. You don't want anything a gold chain? A PlayStation in every room? Nothing crazy comes to mind?

Jonathan 31:34
No, not really. Wow. Good for you.

Scott Benner 31:39
I you know what if I hadn't, if I had a bunch of money, all of a sudden out of nowhere. I've said this before on here. So some people won't be surprised by it. I would collect my family up and ask them about their medical issues, and then pay for them to go to boutique doctors to help them. That's the first thing I would do. I don't have any big thoughts, either. It's like, oh, if I had a million dollars, you know what I would do? Like, you know, like, I wear like, I have a sweat shirt that I'm wearing right now that I looked at it the other day, and I thought this has got to be 22 years old. I could afford a better sweatshirt. And just doesn't occur to me to replace it. I was talking to somebody yesterday who might come on as an advertiser. And they sell like, like clothing. It's nice clothing. And they're like, we'll send you some samples. I was like, Okay, thanks. And then I thought like, what am I gonna do with that? Alright, what kind of music do you like?

Jonathan 32:33
Music I generally listen to kind of hard rock music.

Scott Benner 32:37
What does that mean? In 2023? Give me two or three bands that you like.

Jonathan 32:42
Shine down Shinedown upheaval and Alter Bridge.

Scott Benner 32:48
See, we found where it's coming out. It's coming out through the music. Right? See, if you were my age, you would have listened to God would Will you listen to Metallica? Pantera, suppled, Torah stuff like that stuff you probably don't even know about or care about anymore. But it would have been similar. Did you see? Alright, I'm testing you. Did you see the Leonard Skinner tribute at the Country Music Awards The other night?

Jonathan 33:11
I did not. Yeah, that's an old person. That

Scott Benner 33:13
thing I was testing. Okay. All right. All right. Are you been a good sport? Are you are you are you having a good time? Yeah, we're having great time. All right, go. How did you end up doing this? Your mom forced you.

Jonathan 33:25
My mom was like, oh, it'd be such a good idea for you to compare Omnipod five to control IQ because you've done both. I was like, Yeah, sure. I guess I'll do it then. And then because you're so backed up, and she's like, having to schedule it out. This conversation happened? Probably February. Yeah. Late February, honestly. And so she scheduled me out to April. And she's like, well, obviously he'll talk about anything. So if you don't end up talking about that, that's fine.

Scott Benner 33:58
And your mom likes the podcast. Oh, that your mom likes the podcast? Yeah, she

Jonathan 34:05
listens to what's your,

Scott Benner 34:06
what's your one say?

Jonathan 34:08
I think the last time it was like 6.3. That's really

Scott Benner 34:12
good. Good for you. That's excellent. I mean, seriously, you managed that on your own and a six three and you're eating garbage basically hot trash. You just shovel it, you probably eat the box once in a while and don't even realize doesn't doesn't even taste any different? You know? So, okay, so you were on Basal IQ, then what did you do next?

Jonathan 34:30
Once control IQ came out. It was right to control IQ.

Scott Benner 34:36
And then at some point, you tried Omni pod five? Yes, but you're back on control IQ. Yes. Okay. So I know what I think the differences in the system are so I think I'm, it's gonna be very interesting to hear what you say. So first, tell me about the experience on control IQ and how you find it, what you use as far as its capabilities and how you might you know, monitor yourself And then how you kind of implement your ideas.

Jonathan 35:03
Well control IQ that like it can do the audibles and stuff like moves your Basal up and down as you need it. Least put

Scott Benner 35:15
Now Jonathan, you broke up this your your hillbilly to hold on, your hillbilly Wi Fi just broke up there for a second. You have like either like goats outside running on a wheel or something like that you have to go feed them or what? What makes that I'm just teasing. You just broke up for a second. So intro like you got it again. So

Jonathan 35:34
control IQ, like it raises your blood sugar and stuff. And you're not blood sugar, basil. And we keep our mind in sleep mode 24/7. So that tightens the like, in range time of what the pump thinks is in range. So it will try and keep it a more steady line because it's not expecting like the activities and stuff of regular day. And so that seems to help. Also in sleep mode, it doesn't do the auto Bolus is so it's not in the auto Bolus is are just the correction factor. And then I think it takes it's only 60% of what it actually would be. Yeah. So honestly, I don't feel like that would be it's too much of a difference without it.

Scott Benner 36:23
Have you? Have you ever tried running it out of sleep mode?

Jonathan 36:25
We did at the beginning, and we just decided that it'd be better on sleep mode. And and we just haven't changed it.

Scott Benner 36:32
Okay. Yeah, you know, it's interesting. I literally interviewed a person yesterday, who said the exact same thing. Like I know, I think the way they said it was I know you're not supposed to do this, but I run control IQ and sleep mode 24/7. And I've also had people on who are like, you don't have to do that. Like I have a couple of really good episodes about control IQ. One of them's called control IQ ninja. And I think one of them is called lazy control IQ ninja. But they were they're pretty helpful if you want to check them out. Anyway. Okay, so you're running it out of like, not really in the automated mode the way they I mean, the company is hoping I guess you will. But you're using it like that. You're I mean, you're a six, three. And he, you know, that's astounding. And it works for you. Do you use a lot of extended bonuses or things like that?

Jonathan 37:23
Not really, like, for some meals, like I know, like when I snack on popcorn or something I know that's always gonna hit me slightly later. So I'll Bolus just a little bit up front for that. And then do the rest extended. Sometimes I'll deal with pasta when I remember. But yeah, that's

Scott Benner 37:42
Ctrl. Like you lets you do an extended you don't have to Bolus the second time.

Jonathan 37:46
Control IQ lets you do it to our extended Bolus, and it'll let you switch the percentages however you need it. Okay. Okay.

Scott Benner 37:54
So then, what makes you try on a pod five? Is it just the idea of like, Oh, I could go back to tubeless.

Jonathan 38:02
Yeah, two plus was the main thing that drew me to Army part five. And part of it was also the algorithm and with the algorithm like we were doing decently well, obviously, we couldn't we put in our original settings, and then it would just learn from there. The reason we came back to control IQ was that, for us, it felt like that, it wouldn't stay consistent it like every time I switched upon, like, it would be good. And then I'd be low all the time, and then it would be good again. It's like it couldn't stay. You know,

Scott Benner 38:42
how long did you try it for?

Jonathan 38:43
I think it was a few months.

Scott Benner 38:46
Did you hear my episodes about setting up on the pod five before you tried it?

Jonathan 38:51
Like Bob may have but I personally didn't know him. Yeah, there's so

Scott Benner 38:55
it's, it's incredibly important when you set up on the pod five, to really, really know your total daily insulin and and to give that to it, and it wants you to I'm speaking generally here, but it wants you to be about 5050 on your initial setup, 50% Basal 50%. Bolus, and then it wants you to that then it sort of makes the decisions after that it figures out what it's doing. And it goes from there. I know that people who start that way, have a lot more success with it than not. But you're also manipulating the control IQ to a large degree, you're leaving it in sleep mode. So it doesn't make Otto Bolus is like you're you're adapting, control IQ to your life the way you want it to you're not just letting it run. And so when when you were letting on the pod five run, you were getting lower. Yeah, it tended to push me low. Was that around activity or any specific time or just generally? I

Jonathan 39:58
think it was just generally Why, like I'd be stable for a little bit, it would go. And sometimes I'd cracked it. Sometimes I wouldn't. But I'd always end up going back up to be studied for a little bit. And it ended up just being these kind of hills.

Scott Benner 40:12
Did you ever use an omni pod before the algorithm? No,

Jonathan 40:18
Omni pod five was the first time the first I had did you

Scott Benner 40:21
try throwing it into manual mode to see what happened.

Jonathan 40:25
Um, I can't remember if we did or not, we may have put it in manual mode for a little bit. Okay,

Scott Benner 40:30
I have a ton of episodes about on the pod five, that people should check out if they want, including a three part series, overview settings and connectivity 736-730-7738. There's an episode was somebody who set up there on the pod, but then heard the the series and they did a reset. So on the pod reset is 794. One what I'm what I'm going to tell you is that first of all, you should use whatever works for you. That's I mean, I want your life to be easy. So obviously doesn't matter to me what you use, but algorithms, you know, not even algorithms, diabetes, you said it earlier settings, everything settings, right your, your carb ratio, you have to have it right, your Basal needs to be right, your correction factor needs to be right, you need to understand the difference between you know, how, I don't know a piece of chicken with some beans and a potato are going to affect your blood sugar versus you know, a pizza that comes out of a box at two o'clock in the morning that even though maybe the pizza slice says it's 36 carbs, and the potato and the chicken and everything seems like 36 carbs or whatever, it's not going to hit you the same way that settings. It's so important throughout diabetes, but really, when you are setting up an algorithm if your settings are off, like nothing's going to work, and what happens to a lot of people doesn't sound like it happened to you. But what happens to a lot of people are, they are also they're kind of getting lucky or having good results by mistake. Sometimes, like some people over basil themselves and then eat to the insulin. And they'll say oh my onesies good. It's low and you know, blah, blah, blah. But that's not really right. Like your Basal shouldn't be set in a way where you have to eat or something's gonna go wrong. And that's just one example of classically how how people with diabetes have sort of, I don't want to say cheated, but you know, like, they've got their settings wrong, but it's still in the end working for them, like, quote, unquote, working for them. So you can't put bad settings into an algorithm and expect it to work. Because it's, it only knows what you told it. And if what you told it's not right, then your outcomes are going to be wrong. So anyway, I but I'm happy that you found something you like, the tubeless nature of it. You do prefer that over wearing it to pump? Yeah, yeah. I think you've ever tried again,

Jonathan 42:56
probably just depends on the futures got a bunch of crazy new technologies. So just honestly, depends on what comes out next. Yeah,

Scott Benner 43:05
man, there's gonna be a lot of cool stuff that happens in your life with diabetes. It's your you got diabetes, the right time, Jonathan. Do you ever think about it in terms like that? Do you ever think this isn't fair? Or I don't want this to? Do you have any psychological burdens from it?

Jonathan 43:23
Not really, like, honestly, the most psychological burden I've really had from it is like, just not wanting to deal with it. But other than that, it's not been like, too mentally hard on me.

Scott Benner 43:36
Would you describe yourself like that in other aspects of life?

Jonathan 43:41
Probably kind of a, there's definitely things in life where like, I just don't want to do it. But like, you know, it's a responsibility that you just kind of have to do and get yourself to do. So.

Scott Benner 43:55
Would you describe yourself as would have been anxious or nervous or any of that stuff?

Jonathan 44:01
No,

Scott Benner 44:02
no? Do you worry about low blood sugars?

Jonathan 44:04
Not at all. I trust the pump. You could say with my life, but that's kind of what it is. Yeah.

Scott Benner 44:11
Have you ever had a scary low?

Jonathan 44:13
No, not too crazy. When

Scott Benner 44:17
do you start feeling your lows? At what number?

Jonathan 44:21
So it depends on like, kind of the blood sugar's prior, like if it was a drop from like 200 that we just kind of kept pushing and it just started ticking almost straight line down. On the graph, I can, I can feel myself dropping fast like, I'll get like the hungry sensation and stuff. But when I like, if it's kind of more cruising, and then I just start going low. I can, like, I'll also like the main symptom is like I get hungry when I'm not normally hungry. And then sometimes I'll sweat like that's more of a nighttime symptom is I'll wake up sweating and my blood sugar will be low. I

Scott Benner 45:01
mean, is there a number where you're dizzy or disoriented or anything like that?

Jonathan 45:07
No, not. Normally. If it's like low low, like I'd say 50s 40s. Maybe. But like, if it's just 60s and stuff, just kind of, I'll be more of the hungry and wake up sweaty sensations. So

Scott Benner 45:21
how often were with what frequency? Do you think you see a 50? Blood sugar? Honestly,

Jonathan 45:27
not too often, it'll normally be like, with an off day where either I've been super active or like, I've been cruising high for a while, just some out of the ordinary.

Scott Benner 45:39
Yeah. And something. It's not usually a falling 50. It's kind of like a glide to 50. Yeah, okay. That's great. Well, I mean, how would your blood sugar fall with all that crappy food and you're right. I will share this with you. Like I said, my son is 23 just turned 23 Now, and he played baseball, since he was four. So in the spring, in the summer, in the fall, it was in the wintertime is the only time he wasn't on a baseball field. And there were normally winters after he hit probably, like, I'd say probably 1213 years old. Even in the winter, he was in a cage swinging back constantly, or throwing or you're working out or lifting or something like that. And he could eat rocks. Like if you fed my son rocks, he still looked like, like standing muscle. Do you know what I mean? Yeah. And then he graduated. And he kept working out for baseball for a while he was thinking about going to grad school, he got a few grad school offers to play baseball. He didn't want to do that. He thought about going down south to a pitching clinic cuz his fastball was up to like 93. And he's like, maybe I'll take a shot at this. But then in the end, he just decided to take a job. And he and he went and took a job. And inside of like, three months, he said to me is like, wow, I really have to be more careful about what I eat. And he didn't realize like he was eating a lot just to maintain, like, he was six feet 200 pounds while he was playing. He's like, I can't I can't carry this weight. He's like, first of all, I hate eating all this food. And he's like, he's like, I don't want to be this big. He's like, I'm gonna get like, I'm gonna get soft and five seconds. So he, he dropped 10 pounds. And he's, he's happier now. But he's also cooking for himself and making meals and because he's he's also trying to save money, you know? So he's, he's preparing meals on the on the weekend and taking them to work with him during the week and stuff like that. But yeah, my my point was, Jonathan, your body won't let you do that forever. So be careful. Yeah. Okay. And you would use less insulin if you ate cleaner foods, too. Yeah.

Jonathan 47:52
But, you know, tends to be more expensive because America convenience

Scott Benner 47:58
is that is is expensive part of the issue. I mean, for our kids, there's a lot of kids to take care of. Yeah,

Jonathan 48:05
I don't think expense really is like, I know, my parents follow like a budget stuff. So I don't think expense is too much of an issue. We have good insurance. So like we get most of my stuff for free. So cool. Well, that's not something we have to worry about.

Scott Benner 48:22
Jonathan, that's interesting. If you said to me, what do you pay for insulin? I don't think I pay probably like $20 Every time we get insulin, right. But I also have insurance on myself, my wife, still my son for a little longer. And my daughter, and out of my pocket, I think that cost like $8,000 a year just for the insurance, then I have co pays and deductibles to reach and probably by the end of the year. I'm guessing my insurance costs me 12 $15,000. But when you the day you buy the insulin, you're like, oh, look, it was free. So it's not free, Jonathan, is what I'm saying. But you'll be an engineer, you'll be able to pay for it. And you're getting helpful as it goes, right Jonathan? If you listen to me, you're going to be an engineer with what I'm going to say is like a 511 Volleyball playing wife who also has a good career. So all you got to do you want her to be blonde or do you not care? I honestly don't care if she plays volleyball, she's gonna be blonde, Jonathan, so maybe maybe we'll get away from the volleyball that if you don't care, because you're gonna get what do you think? What do you think about generalizing? Jonathan? Are you a fan of it? Or do you find it repulsive?

Jonathan 49:34
I don't really care. Like, it's a good way to describe it.

Scott Benner 49:38
So I have a, I have a group of people ever real question for you here that you don't I mean, seriously, think about it for a second. You don't have to answer. Okay. How much of political correctness it touches you at 16. Do you feel it the way older generations Do or do you Not? What's my question here? If someone wants you to refer to them by a pronoun, or if someone wants you to do something that seems just not how it would occur to you. Like when that happens in my, my family, my kids are just like, oh, yeah, whatever, that's fine. And that's, I think, a real generational thing. Like there's no, no judgment. No, like, well, this is what I think like, I find kids your age to just be like, yeah, man live and let live, whatever. And I don't just mean about pronouns, but about everything. Do you find yourself? Just going with the flow? societally? I don't know if any of that made sense to you? Because you're 16

Jonathan 50:44
Yeah, I guess, like, kind of just like, going with, I guess you could say the crowd like, just kind of chalant Lee moving with them. You know, personally, I don't take like aside either way. But like, if somebody asked me to refer to them away, I'm like, Cool. I'll do that. And it's like, not a big deal. To me. I don't really care that much about that kind of stuff. Stuff

Scott Benner 51:08
like color and sexuality, like just as meaningless to your generation. Right?

Jonathan 51:13
Yeah, I guess you could say that. Yeah. No, look at it. Yeah. It's

Scott Benner 51:17
terrific. Actually, Jonathan, I just, like I grew up in the 70s. Like, when I was 16. It was, Geez, 8687. Maybe. And, like, if somebody said, anything like, like, oh, Bill is gay. Everyone be like, Oh, my God, Bill's gay. Like, like it would be it would be like a whole thing. Do you know what I mean? Like this? Yeah, it really the world was like just an incredibly different place. Not that long ago. And I'm, I'm very, like, heartened by how well your generation and the generation Nish before you two has just decided like, and I don't even know if they've decided, I think it's just the way it is. But all that crap is gone. And I'm thrilled it's gone. Like so. Um, it's very night. I think it unburdens you to just live and not be running around. Taking your opinion or your judgment or like meanwhile, nobody even has an opinion. They just they form one because it's asked of them. That's what you guys don't do anymore. You just go right on. Like, that's what that's what they said. And then good. And I think that's really terrific. So, I mean, we just got to keep you off the math, right? I mean, it's Kentucky in this right. I mean, we're not we're not lying. Are we here? Jonathan? I gotta keep you awake. Yeah, right. Like, so. That's cool. You want your teeth. Jonathan. I just want to say that right now. Seriously, so what have I not asked you about so far?

Jonathan 52:45
You've hit like everything.

Scott Benner 52:47
Do I talk too fast for you? Or you were okay.

Jonathan 52:50
No, yeah, I didn't understand you. Understand me.

Scott Benner 52:53
I didn't mean like I was from Mars. I was like, like, I was like, people.

Jonathan 52:58
I know that like some people, the deep south they like talk really slow. And it's hard for them to understand people who generally talk faster.

Scott Benner 53:07
In a million years, like I would not have, you have no accent that I can discern. Like, I don't hear anything at all. Like, do you feel like you're like, sound like you have a piece of straw on your mouth and you're wearing a hat or no?

Jonathan 53:19
I don't think I sound like

Scott Benner 53:22
no, you don't. You could have told me you were from Connecticut. I would have been like, Alright. Sounds Why did I pick Connecticut? Oh, I'm doing a speaking thing in Connecticut. The end of the month? That's fine. That's in my head. It's a private thing. I can't tell you if I don't think the group wants it made public. So I won't tell you about it. But it's really interesting. That was nice for me to say it was really interesting. But I won't tell you, Jonathan, I'm doing this really culturally interesting thing that I will not be telling you about. I'm going to tell you after the recording is over because that was not fair to you. The rest of you are screwed. You're not going to get to know Him. Have you ever listened? Has your mom ever said like, Hey, you listen to this episode. Not

Jonathan 54:00
really, like she has like, because we're in a small town. We go to endo and Lexington, Kentucky so that's about an hour and a half drive or so and she'll put the podcast.

Scott Benner 54:15
I hope that I hope the radio in the car works better this internet connection today.

Jonathan 54:18
Listen to those episodes. Okay. Yeah.

Scott Benner 54:20
Alright, so back to my question that I wrote down from earlier. Are you annoyed by like, how is your mom like one of those moms who's like the guy on the podcast? Or does she talk about me like I'm a person in your life or anything like that?

Jonathan 54:33
Not really. She's just like, I heard this on the podcast and like, you would maybe we could try it out like Okay, sure. Yeah, I don't really find it annoying.

Scott Benner 54:42
She seems like a really good mom. Do you think she is? Yeah, she's

Jonathan 54:46
a great mom. Yeah, but

Scott Benner 54:47
I mean, are you saying that because she's your mom. Or have you witnessed other mothers and you're like, I got a better one. I haven't really? Yeah. Not willing to. Not willing to out any of your friends for having a wacky mom. Okay, that's nice. That was nice.

Speaker 3 54:59
I just like there's some times people come on and they're like, oh my like, like, it's constant like the podcast, Scott, I don't who's the host? Scott? Like, your dad hasn't said anything. Like, stop already. And that is, and I'm gonna let you answer that. Then I have another question.

Jonathan 55:14
Hi, dad. He's kind of more on the sideline with the diabetes, but like he, he also follows my index card numbers. So, and he he roughly knows, like what I have to do. And so

Scott Benner 55:27
yeah, so that was gonna be my next question. Your dad's not that involved with all this? Not

Jonathan 55:32
really, because he, honestly, most the time he's at work. He works like eight to five. So he's at work a lot of the time. So he's not like always at home having being able to, like, kind of hover over me.

Scott Benner 55:48
Yeah, he should get a podcast, it frees up all kinds of time in the middle of the day. So you think your dad, what kind of podcast would your dad had if he started one? He

Jonathan 55:58
is a he was a history professor. Now he's the department chair at the college. So very cool. I'd say that either something like with history or education is

Scott Benner 56:09
excellent. Are you as you come from an academic but what's your mom do?

Jonathan 56:13
Oh, she's an aide at the local elementary school and an adjunct at an online adjunct at a community college in Mississippi. Very nice.

Scott Benner 56:27
Ice. Excellent. Wow. You're used to you have younger brothers and sisters. How old are they?

Jonathan 56:34
The youngest just turned nine. And my sister is 11. And my brother is 213. Do

Scott Benner 56:46
you think that they have any impact from your diabetes?

Jonathan 56:49
They definitely see it. Like, there's no doubt about that. And they like know about it. My youngest son, my youngest brother sometimes says that he wishes he has diabetes, so he can eat snacks whenever he wants, but that's not true.

Scott Benner 57:05
Yeah. Do you think? Do you think any of them have ever? Like confided in you or are they scared? It's gonna happen to them?

Jonathan 57:13
It's probably one of the thoughts. That's like the very back of their head. They did. They don't seem like too worried about it or anything. So

Scott Benner 57:22
you've never spoken about it with them though.

Jonathan 57:24
Not really.

Scott Benner 57:25
Gotcha. Are they all like you? Are they like tall and smart and nice?

Jonathan 57:30
Most of them have good. They all have good grades. Yeah.

Scott Benner 57:35
You don't understand yet. Six. Three is a it's a pass like you won. Like you know that Willie monka ever know the Willy Wonka in the Chocolate Factory? Where? Yeah, and they commonly give a golden ticket to somebody. That six three is a golden ticket. You have no idea. Ah, Jonathan, I'm jealous. Do you understand? The girls are gonna line up at college to go out with a six three, Jonathan. They're just gonna be like, Oh my god. He's so tall. They how's your face? Is it okay? You know what I mean? Yeah, sorry. Yeah. All right. So you got a good face and you're tall and you're athletic. How much you weigh at six, three?

Jonathan 58:12
around 170 or so.

Scott Benner 58:14
All right, we'll put a couple pounds on you. Right like just gonna fill it because you're not at the age. You're still growing. Your dad bulky. Is it going to be okay.

Jonathan 58:21
Are you going to be like, oh, yeah, yeah, my dad's pretty bulky.

Scott Benner 58:24
You got the world by the balls. Do you know that term? Do you know do you know? Yeah. I hate you. What do you think of that? Oh, man, if your dad was my son's dad you'd be watching my son play centerfield on a professional baseball field. Right and I was the thing hold my kid back. I held it my wife my wife is five nine that's tall for a lady you don't know that. But it is. And. And every guy in her family nice and tall. Over here. Here I am five nine. My son grows up to six feet and stops. I know he's pissed at me. He's like, I'm telling you if you have no idea if my son was two inches taller, he literally would be playing baseball right now. And I if he ever hears this, he's gonna be like, yeah, you son of a bitch. Use me up. Hey, that's a good question. You guys curse.

Jonathan 59:14
My friends do a lot but I keep it more moderate.

Scott Benner 59:17
And around the house. Anything around the house? What's the harshest word you hear around the house?

Jonathan 59:23
like dang it or something? They don't curse very much.

Scott Benner 59:26
Dang it. I'll be darned. Yeah, it's something else. Yeah. What's your favorite curse word? You don't have to say you can just allude to it.

Jonathan 59:34
The one yeah, like I don't know honestly. Know

Scott Benner 59:37
how it happened when you're angry. trying to be funny.

Jonathan 59:43
Like I said, I don't curse very much. That is

Scott Benner 59:48
Jonathan, there's a lie in the situation. There's a line of women and their daughters outside of your house right now. I swear to you like as soon as this goes up, just they're going to be out there like locust. You're gonna have to call the cops like Aaron You're really amazing. I would um, I feel like talking to you. I feel like I've done a bad job with like, it was like, Oh my God. I mean, unless you snap and shoot a bunch of people, you and I don't think it's happened and you seem like you're together. Hey, if I said to you of your friends which one's going to snap this one jump into your head right away?

Jonathan 1:00:23
Probably.

Scott Benner 1:00:28
My good stuff, man. i You're terrific. Tell your mom she was right. I usually I get notes like her note says, Let me read it to. Here's a question you fill out when you're coming in about topics you want to cover. She says I'm filling this out for myself. But I think but I am thinking maybe it would be best to have my son Jonathan on who has type one. He will be 16 years old when you record it. She goes on I read this Jonathan and from my perspective, I'm like, oh, here we go. Proud. Mom's gonna put this kid on. It's gonna be a marble mouth and I'm gonna say anything. I'm going to be dragging questions out of them not going to be able to joke because he's not going to understand and you were just terrific. Like really good. Tell your mom she was spot on about this. And every and everything else and I definitely think she's not a layabout. Just so you know. About is that a word people use? Where did that even come from? Let's look it up together for a second lay about who derogatory British term a person who habitually does little or no work? Yeah, I was right. And I think we all know what creep is. So we'd love to look that up. Yeah, but um, alright, so. I don't know what to ask you. I do. Wait. I'm sorry. I do know what to ask you. Can you just hang for just a couple more minutes? Yep. All right. Err, I heard the South that time. You were like, yep. That I got it. There are movies to kids your age care about going to a movie theater? Kind

Jonathan 1:01:57
of sorta like, it depends if there's a good movie. Like it won't. It's not the most. Like here. We don't have that crazy big movie theater. Yeah. It's like, I think it's six or seven, maybe six or seven theaters? I'm not sure. Honestly, because it's been a few. It's been a while since I've been. Yeah. So you don't

Scott Benner 1:02:17
go to movies frequently then? No, not

Jonathan 1:02:20
frequently.

Scott Benner 1:02:21
Your generation is ruining something that I love. It's okay. Don't worry about it. I mean, how about rap music? Like rap music?

Jonathan 1:02:28
Oh, yeah. I like yeah,

Scott Benner 1:02:30
let's be like, go to let's let's be alright. We'll be controversial. For a second though. Kanye is terrific, right? Yeah, he's gonna get me Oh, my God, just it just pumps he is. appears to be a terrible person. But, but the music is ridiculously good. Did you see the other day that he tweeted? That he saw a movie with Jonah Hill in it. And he's now doesn't have a problem with Jewish people. Anyway, I

Jonathan 1:02:56
did see that out of his mind.

Scott Benner 1:03:00
I was like, What are you saying? Like, just not ironically, he meant it. He I saw 21 Jump Street and all that stupid stuff I've been saying for the last six months. Forget it. Like, I'm like, Oh my God, you need help front. But those songs are I mean, my God, you could put Kanye on forever. And it just you could put on his first album and not know any of the songs and listen to it straight through. It's fantastic. Yeah, yeah, man. But no, I mean, just really like he's a genius. And they say there's a thin line between what madness and genius and he's, he jumps on both sides of that line. That's for sure. Anyway, I am not buying a pair of $200 plastic shoes. I don't give a crap how good the music is. But that's neither here nor there. All right. And I you know what's happening right now. I'm out of stuff to ask you. But I don't want you to leave. I'm enjoying your company. Oh my god. Hey, you don't know how to edit audio do I could hire you want to edit? My God? teach yourself how to use some editing software. I'll hire you to edit the podcast. I would love to talk to you every day. How did you? How much did you hate me? Or how did this go for you?

Jonathan 1:04:18
I enjoyed myself is fine. Good.

Scott Benner 1:04:20
Good. I'm glad. I want to tell you like I'm obviously not your parents. And I have no no right to tell you. I'm proud of you. But I for a person I met an hour and 10 minutes ago. I'm very proud of you like the way you're handling your blood sugars. And you know the responsibility and the pressure seems to roll right off your back about it. I'm very impressed. It's really something you should be really, really proud of yourself. I hope you are.

Jonathan 1:04:48
Thanks, man. I do appreciate that. Of course. Do

Scott Benner 1:04:52
you feel it ever? Do you ever look up and think man I'm doing more than kids my age people are adults too. Uh, like, you know what I mean? Like being?

Jonathan 1:05:01
Yeah, you know, I'm saying, kind of like, I just kind of see it around me like, I wish somebody else would kind of know and like, step up kind of,

Scott Benner 1:05:12
you know, tell me what that means you need help? Well, no, it's

Jonathan 1:05:16
not that I need help. It's just like, if more people like realized if they just did this that would like, less than somebody else's burden just like this much or something like that, like, I see that stuff.

Scott Benner 1:05:28
You're worried about other people.

Jonathan 1:05:31
Kind of, like, oh,

Scott Benner 1:05:33
wait a minute, you have friends, you have friends with type one who aren't doing as well as you are?

Jonathan 1:05:39
Or it's not that they're doing is not doing as well. But it's like, I know, like, I don't want to be overbearing on like, this huge group of people that I know, like, I could help. So like, I kind of stepped back, but not really. And I'm like, I just see something and I'm like, I know, such such and such did this, they would help this or that, you know, just just like a group that whole or whatever. Do

Scott Benner 1:06:05
you think it's kind of a lead by example thing? Do you think that them seeing you? You know, take bolusing seriously, when you guys are together and you're eating or something or testing your blood sugar once in a while, if you're like, I'm not sure if my CGM is right, let me check. Like, do you think that makes it easier for them? to maybe do it themselves?

Jonathan 1:06:22
Yeah, I feel like if you just like, do something around people more, it's, you know, lead by example, they're gonna see that and they'll be like, Oh, it's, it's alright, to do this or that, you know,

Scott Benner 1:06:33
I will tell you like,

Jonathan 1:06:36
it's also like doing it around other people like just being confident about who you are, you know? Yeah. Like, you don't need to be embarrassed if something you can't control.

Scott Benner 1:06:44
I think it's a big deal. In general, but around diabetes, specifically that you don't hide your diabetes, I think it's, it's very important for you psychologically, I will tell you that I I've spoken to a lot of adults who have friends who have type one, this is a common message from people. You know, I'm in a group, you know, I have four or five friends who have type one diabetes, and I see them not taking care of themselves, and it breaks my heart. And I don't know what to do. Like, that's not an uncommon thing to have happen. And I know you're not saying your friends are just ignoring it. But you're seeing little things where you're like, Oh, if they just did this, or, you know, man, that's 30 carbs. It's not 20. Like that kind of stuff, right? Yeah. Yeah. Well, that's nice of you to be concerned. And I think it's incumbent upon me to tell you that you are not responsible for other people. So don't let it burden you. But don't let it stop you from caring either. You don't need me to tell you this. You're parented. So Well, I'm sure you're sure your mom has that embroidered in a pillow somewhere? You don't I mean, the other one's going to turn out good to the younger ones, or is one of them getting off the rails? They all seem

Jonathan 1:07:52
on the rails right now. But they're not in high school yet.

Scott Benner 1:07:57
When in that's when the pressure comes, do you think?

Jonathan 1:08:01
I think like, middle, like middle middle school, I guess? Sounds weird. No, it does then, like high school? You know, I feel like that's when they start like getting almost like the end of the real world. Not like it's not necessarily real water. But you get it's a whole slew of like, new things you have to deal with to stay away from and stuff. You know,

Scott Benner 1:08:26
you saw weed in middle school? You did, right. vaping is

Jonathan 1:08:30
probably vaping. I didn't see vaping in middle school.

Scott Benner 1:08:35
Do you think your mom would be surprised by any of this stuff?

Jonathan 1:08:39
Honestly, probably not. Now, obviously, like when she was in school and stuff. It wasn't like as bad as it was. It was more of cigarettes and stuff. But now it's the vapes. So it just kind of changes over time. Yeah. Do

Scott Benner 1:08:54
you think she'd be shocked that you said cocaine earlier?

Jonathan 1:08:58
Maybe, yeah,

Scott Benner 1:08:59
my kids tell me it's everywhere. Like, like, just everywhere. My son was like, it was in college. Like it was. My daughter talked about, like you hear people talking about in high school, you know, a college again, friend groups, you gotta you have to have a really my daughter had a pretty small my son to like a pretty small friend group to avoid stuff like that. Yeah, yeah. Well, man, I don't know. You're terrific. Like, I know, it sounds weird, but you really are, like, go forth and prosper or whatever. And I will. What did I promise to tell you when we got off here? Oh, where I'm going to speak. It's not that exciting. But I'll tell you in a second. I thank you so much for doing this man. I

Jonathan 1:09:42
really appreciate it. Yeah, no problem. Cool.

Scott Benner 1:09:44
All right. Hey, how great was Jonathan, thank you so much, Jonathan, for coming on the show and sharing your story. I also am going to thank Dexcom Dex comm.com/juice box you can wear the same CGM that Arden is wearing the Dexcom G seven, or you can go get the G six doesn't matter to me whatever you want they got at dexcom.com/juice box. Don't forget to check out the diabetes Pro Tip series at juicebox podcast.com diabetes pro tip.com or between Episode 1001 1026 In your audio player. If you're looking for community look no farther than the Juicebox Podcast, private Facebook group Juicebox Podcast type one diabetes, but it's for everybody really you have type one type to adda gestational, I don't care. Come on over, meet one of those 43,000 members and get started today. If you have type two or pre diabetes, that type two diabetes Pro Tip series from the Juicebox Podcast is exactly what you're looking for. Do you have a friend or a family member who is struggling to understand their type two and how to manage it? This series is for them seven episodes to get you on track and up to speed. Episode 860 series intro 864 guilt and shame episode 869 medical team 874 fuelling plan episode 880 diabetes technology episode 85 GLP ones metformin and insulin and an episode 889 We talk about movement. This episode is with me and Jenny Smith. Of course you know Jenny is a certified diabetes care and education specialist. She is a registered and licensed dietitian and Jenny has had type one diabetes for over 30 years. Too many people don't understand their type two diabetes, and this series aims to fix that. Share it with a friend or get started today.

#1062 Texture

Jessica has type 1 diabetes and an interesting job.

+ Click for EPISODE TRANSCRIPT

Scott Benner 0:00
Hello friends, and welcome to episode 1062 of the Juicebox Podcast way to find out why this one's called texture

today on the pod Jessica, she's 32 years old diagnosed with type one diabetes a few years ago. I'm excited about two things in this one for you to find out what Jessica thinks caused her type one, and why the episode is called texture. Hint, it has something to do with her. Sorry about that. It has something to do with her job as a dog groomer. And for those of you wondering, Arden's blood sugar is 136 diagnol up looks like she just ate she's weight school still. Let me take a look. No, yeah, she ate bad about an hour ago. Getting a little drift up. We'll look at the algorithm trying to get it back. Just put in a nice Bolus. Oh, when I just watched it push up or basil at the same time. We'll be killing this spike in no time. Speaking of spikes, I have no tie in for that just Forget I said that. Drink ag one.com/juice box get a free year supply of vitamin D and five free travel packs with your first order at drink a G one.com/juice box. And don't forget those diabetes pro tips are remastered and waiting for you from Episode 1000 to 1026. This episode of The Juicebox Podcast is sponsored by cozy Earth. Cozy earth.com. Just go there, pick out your towels, your sheets, your Comfies like these sweatshirts I'm wearing today sweatpants I worry the other day, so much oh my god pajamas, you'll see there's a ton of stuff@cozier.com. Anyway, go there, fill up your cart, then use the offer code juice box at checkout and you will save 40% off of your entire order. It's that easy. The show is also sponsored today by touched by type one that's touched by type one.org. Find them on Facebook, Instagram, or go to their website and see all the great things they're doing for people living with type one diabetes. Today's show is also sponsored by the contour next gen blood glucose meter, contour next.com/juicebox head over there right now and find out all about the most accurate meter we've ever used. The contour next gen. Using my links supports the show those links are in the audio player you're listening in right now. Right in the shownotes. They're also a juicebox podcast.com. All right, believe in your site. Okay, so this is gonna start a little differently. Sure. Give me a second here to get everybody into it. Okay, so guys, this is Jessica and Jessica and I have been talking for 20 minutes, and I was not recording her voice. And so we're starting over again. And I apologize because we are never Jessica going to be able to remake the joy that I had in my voice when I found out that you tried Molly from your ex boyfriend without knowing what it was. And that that upsets me more than anything.

Jessica 3:23
I'm glad I could give you an existential crisis. really

Scott Benner 3:27
upset about that specifically.

Jessica 3:28
Me too.

Scott Benner 3:30
It was the way you honestly, because you were like, you know, I just trusted him.

Jessica 3:35
Well, I had no reason not to up until that point. So. So let's,

Scott Benner 3:40
let's do a little bit of a fast forward, and then I'll find my rhythm. So you are Jessica, you're 32 years old. You were diagnosed right around the time you're 28, almost 29 years old. Yes, yes, type one diabetes. Your cousin has type one. There's no other autoimmune in your family. And you were experiencing some anxiety at the time. And I think that's the core of it. So let's go back to that you had a triggered by what tell people again.

Jessica 4:04
So I took Mali, and the trip itself was fine. But after that, for about a year and a half or two, I had a lot of anxiety, which is not typical for me. And during that time, I started to suspect that I had diabetes, maybe I had a lot of type two diabetes as a family history, so I was worried about it. And then I started to have blurry vision issues to maybe look into blood sugar as issues as the cause of my vision issues. So I went to the doctor was misdiagnosed at first with type two, but eventually was diagnosed as type one point

Scott Benner 4:43
and how did the timelines line up for the doing Molly having anxiety getting diagnosed like where were they how do they run together? Are they concurrent? Are they one happens before the other?

Jessica 4:56
Well, one happens before the other so I I think I remember, February of 2017 is when I took Mali. And then I was diagnosed in 2019. In

Scott Benner 5:08
September, but you think you live that entire time under a level of anxiety that you had not previously had?

Jessica 5:14
Yes. Wow. Absolutely. Yeah.

Scott Benner 5:18
It is not a from what the Google tells me substance induced anxiety disorder after one dose of Malia case reports. Interesting. Wow. Okay. All right. All my jokes about you taking Mali and not knowing what it was. You said the ex boyfriend? Yeah, they're all gone now. But you said the ex boyfriend was like, trust me. And you said, yeah, right. On, I trust you.

Jessica 5:41
Yeah, yeah. I been with him at set with for seven years at that point. Right. And he was good at other like things, you know, having a job paying his bills, being generally responsible for the most part, you know,

Scott Benner 5:54
so why not this?

Jessica 5:56
Right. Why not that I said, oh, like, Oh, I've tested already. Like, it's fine. You

Scott Benner 6:01
know, what's really disappointing is that I made such an earnest joke after you said that earlier. Because I really have known my wife, my wife is like, you know, in her late 40s. I've known her since she was 20. And I honestly, like, I can't get her to do anything. Like so. I mean, I'm a reasonable guy. I do other life things. You don't I mean,

Jessica 6:23
I'm not sure. I know. Sounds maybe slightly more reasonable than I was at the time. I'll see.

Scott Benner 6:29
Oh, I see. You're thinking she's smart to say no, every time I say something silly, and you're probably making a mistake. Alright, fair. Yeah, I

Jessica 6:38
effed up for sure. Yeah.

Scott Benner 6:39
Okay. So anyway, we just did a pretty good job of encapsulating our 20 minute conversation in the last three minutes. So let's move forward from there with me just feeling stupid for a couple more seconds. Sure. I'm like literally looking up under sound waves in front of me like like, vit like visual representations of sound. And I'm looking and thinking, I'm not talking more than Jessica is like, Why do I have so many more sound waves than she does? That I looked closer, and I was like, Oh, it is because I am not recording her voice. Anyway, apologies. Very, very many apologies. We learned that you are an MDI and Dexcom. So let's kind of pick pick up right there. You took care of yourself right away. You said you had a couple of moments where you were like, I cry and then you went right to it. I wanted to ask you at that point. Is that your personality? Like are Yes. Are you just like, I'm going to just take care of this kind of person? Yeah. So you didn't see a difference in in one to the other? Like something bigger life like health wise, or, like my apartment needs to be painted? Not

Jessica 7:47
Not really, I guess. Yeah, I just treated it like something that, you know, like, Okay, well, what do I need to do? I'm going to do it. Yeah.

Scott Benner 7:56
Yeah, that's pretty, pretty admirable. Honestly, I guess you don't have any other options. But also really no, yeah. But also your now like, your breakup happens right around there as well. So you're, you're on your own?

Jessica 8:09
Well, my dad was kind enough to let me move in with him for a while. So that was really nice.

Scott Benner 8:13
After the diagnosis, or after the breakup, after the breakup. Oh, wait. So you live together in an apartment with a boy? Yeah,

Jessica 8:21
for a long time for five, five years. We live together? Yeah. But

Scott Benner 8:25
when it ended, it was his apartment? No.

Jessica 8:29
We were kind of trying to figure out what to do with it. He had a friend who was trying to get him to move in with him. So he moved in with this friend. And he said, I could have kept the apartment and maybe gotten a roommate or something. But I didn't want to do that. And I wasn't sure if I could afford it on my own. So then I ended up moving in with my dad for a little bit. I think my dad felt bad for me. Probably rightly so. Because it kind of sucked at that time. I mean, you know, when you break up with someone you've been with for a long time. Yeah. No, I diabetes. Like, was not. I wasn't struggling a lot with that specifically, just like, you know, you

Scott Benner 9:07
see, you think you're the focus of your dad's like, you know, compassion was more about the breakup and less about the diabetes.

Jessica 9:16
Oh, I don't know. Actually, I haven't reflected on that. I think more about the breakup.

Scott Benner 9:21
Yeah. It's very nice to

Jessica 9:24
look at. Yeah. It's a nice guy sometimes. He's got a really dry sense of humor, which I inherited. So yeah, he can be you know, but ya know, I think you know,

Scott Benner 9:39
the dry sense of humor is not always fun. That's always what a dry sense of humor is not always fun when you're on the other side of it. Oh,

Jessica 9:47
no, it's fun. It's fun. I find more people that don't know me very well. Just think I'm Can I you need to bleep Okay. People prop initially I think think I'm kind of He, if they don't know me super well, just with the dryer sense of humor, so oftentimes it's more of a problem for other people than it is for me.

Scott Benner 10:08
Because you're like, I'm not really being bitchy. I'm just yeah, like, it's just a joke. Sarcasm. Yeah, yeah, I see that I saw somebody make a joke online the other day. And it was so clearly a joke. And to watch people be mad was fascinating. You know,

Jessica 10:25
I think I remember seeing that poster. Maybe I don't remember what it was about. Oh, you

Scott Benner 10:29
have a thought the thing I'm thinking of is ridiculously not about diabetes. But tell me what you saw that you wonder about? Oh,

Jessica 10:36
I don't remember specifically what it was, but it was it was on a diabetes page. It might have been on the juicebox. One. Okay. Maybe it was a different Facebook page. I'm not sure.

Scott Benner 10:46
I see. My thing was much crazier. Like, the whole thing with the Dalai Lama and his tongue and the little Have you seen all this? Know what, I don't know if I have this completely. Right. So I think that, okay, I think that in their culture, you stick out your tongue when you meet somebody. Because of some like, old idea that there was this, I don't know, ancient leader who had a black tongue in if your tongue was black, then you had been taken over by his essence or something. So I'm probably getting this very wrong. So you show your tongue to prove that you haven't been taken over or something like that. But he's very close with a boy, like a young boy. And the tongues out. And it's all just kind of really creepy. Yeah, and I don't know, like, I don't know more about it than that. What I know is that is that I saw something online where somebody posted the picture and said, I don't see the problem. And it was clearly sarcasm. Like there's, it's not not a picture you would look at and go oh, you know, and, and it was just interesting to watch that nobody would assume that somebody could be dry and making a joke about something that was you know, it mean, serious. So yeah, I get your point. Like, sometimes when you have that sense of humor, it misses people pretty significantly.

Jessica 12:03
Yeah. Especially if you don't I feel like if you know someone and you know what to expect it from them, then you can just assume, and you know, everybody's good with it. But yeah,

Scott Benner 12:13
it's a little easier. So the one aspect of our of our conversation that there's really no way to bring back is that you play Dungeons and Dragons, and I just sucks because we had

Jessica 12:28
I was thinking about that. I'm like, Oh, d&d stuffs gone.

Scott Benner 12:31
Oh, dungeon masters in a polyamorous relationship. And I was just like, Ah, I might call this episode Dungeon Master. I was so excited. Oh, yeah. We learned about your character, and then I screwed up. Alright, well, we have to find our footing now. This is my fault. We do. Yeah, we have to we have to move forward. What made you want to come on the podcast. As you heard earlier, this episode of the podcast is sponsored by the contour next gen blood glucose meter. But when you get a contour meter, what you're really getting is their test strips. Contour. Next test strips feature remarkable accuracy. As part of the contour next blood glucose monitoring system. They're the number one branded over the counter test strips. And they of course have Second Chance sampling. Second Chance sampling can help you to avoid wasted strips, contour next one.com forward slash juice box. Near the top of the page, you'll see a Buy Now button, it's bright yellow. When you click on that, you'll get eight options of places online to buy contour meters and test strips walmart.com, Amazon Walgreens CVS pharmacy, Meijer, Kroger target Rite Aid. These are all links you'll find at my link linking the link links blink blink blink link. I'm just getting head over there. Now once you please listen to contour meters are incredibly accurate. They are simple to use. They're easy to hold, easy to read, and they have a bright light for nighttime testing. Part of me wants to say that the second chance sampling is the biggest deal, but honestly, it's the accuracy. These meters are accurate. And I know a lot of people like to think well I have a CGM. I don't need a meter. You do. You need a meter. You need to be accurate. You deserve it to be accurate contour annex.com forward slash juicebox. Take a look at the contour next gen and the other meters available from contour. We use my links you're supporting the production of the show and helping to keep it free and plentiful. You guys got me on a good day. I just spent my very own money on some cozy Earth items. I'm wearing them today because they are well cozy. Today I got on brand new joggers and a new sweatshirt. Why did I have to buy new ones? Well, I've lost a little bit of weight. And I didn't like looking sloppy in my other ones. So I treated myself to some new joggers and a hoodie and they fit like a glove and they're super Coffee and a warm all day. And you could tell now, did I pay full price for them? No, I did not. Do I get some special deal that you don't get? No, not at all. I took my money I plunked it down at cozy earth.com And then I use my very own offer code juice box at checkout. And I save 40% off of the things I'm wearing. And a couple of other things that are in the other room. This will work for you too. Cozy earth.com Get sheets towels, hoodies, sweatshirts, pajamas, anything you can think of. And it will be soft, soft, and beautiful and temperate, temperate, not hot, not cold, perfect. In the sheets in the hoodie, that this morning, I dried myself off with the waffle towel. What an experience. I'm not even kidding, you get the shower, you know, you're all wet. I don't know about you guys, I do a little squeegee on myself. It's like little guys push off a little bit of the water. I don't know if you guys do that or not. Then boom, hit myself with the waffle side of the towel. First, all the absorption happens. And then I flip it around to the other side. And just ooh, a little buffing and shimmy. You don't I mean a little Shammi shake. And I am crisp and clean and ready to go. Cozy earth.com use the offer code juice box at checkout, save 40% off of everything on that website, use my links, use my offer codes, support the podcast, dry off your bits and your pieces and then lay them down in a smooth, silky bed of viscose bamboo. You will not be sorry.

Jessica 16:35
I'm not sure. I don't know. Maybe free therapy. Mostly joking. But yeah, I don't know. I just thought I had a unique experience with my diagnosis. Not that it's necessarily necessary or super valuable to like blame the onset of type one on something but I just thought it was a interesting. You

Scott Benner 16:56
really you really believe in the timeline of this. You? Yeah, you do the Molly, you have a like an anxiety you've never experienced before in your entire life for a couple of years. And then you get diabetes.

Jessica 17:06
Yep. And I had. Yeah, and I definitely had, I think it was like a slower onset starting around that time. Because I was six months before diagnosis. I had a yeast infection every other month and I tried a different birth control. And I felt like I could feel like tingling my legs. It was similar to what I thought was neuropathy. Maybe that symptom went away when I changed birth controls. But there were like a lot of things around that time right before I was diagnosed. Looking back, I was like, oh, yeah, that was a sign and I didn't know what to look for birth control

Scott Benner 17:38
pill.

Jessica 17:38
I tried the NuvaRing or the NuvaRing.

Scott Benner 17:44
The reason I asked is because

Jessica 17:46
I'm on pills, and I've been on pills except for a time when I was trying to figure out something if I wanted to try something else. Yeah,

Scott Benner 17:54
I'm trying to see if if NuvaRing has any blood blood sugar impacts.

Jessica 17:59
It does. It says it may increase blood sugar in diabetes. Oh,

Scott Benner 18:04
okay. But here's his health care providers often suggest hoovering for diabetic women because it does not pass through the digestive system. Instead it is absorbed directly through the vagina. There's words you don't hear often spoken out loud. This Yes. Not often.

Jessica 18:20
In many things you want to absorb through through there. No, honestly, no. I

Scott Benner 18:25
mean, obviously really take that sentence in your mind and say, Where would I use this? It is absorbed directly through the vagina, there's nowhere

Speaker 3 18:34
I go, I try to work it into a conversation. I dare you. This is beneficial for women with diabetes, because the body does not have to metabolize the medication. I don't see why that makes a god damn bit of difference. But okay,

Jessica 18:44
mean either, because it's still going directly into your bloodstream. So, and it's not like the pill has sugar like, you know,

Scott Benner 18:52
that's a strange carbs in it. That's really strange. I mean, if if it says there's a reason maybe there isn't just I can't imagine it. That's all. Well,

Jessica 19:02
the, my ex at the time, like read the packet and somewhere on the packet, it says me increase blood sugar in diabetics or don't use the pre diabetic or something like that. Okay. All right, since this made an impact, probably for sure. Okay. Do

Scott Benner 19:17
you find that an oral contraceptive helps you with your blood sugar management?

Jessica 19:21
I'm not sure because I've only had that was the only time I've ever switched. I just switched back to oral meds. I don't have anything to compare it to. So I see. I don't know. Yeah.

Scott Benner 19:30
Where are you? What are you find your blood sugar's different to manage different times of the month?

Jessica 19:36
Absolutely. Yes. It is harder to manage the second week specifically like around the time when I normally might be ovulating and then it tends to I tend to go low, the week of and or the week prior, the event itself and the week before Yeah. Which is strange. I don't really have much. Sometimes I don't have any bleeding at all. I went to an OB GYN and he the vibe was do you want to be pregnant? Oh, no. Okay, you're fine. So he didn't seem to care much about that. But I do have more blood sugar fluctuations. If the period if I actually get a period or if I'm, hey, you have more PMS symptoms or something like it's a heavier, that's interesting cycle. I do have more issues. Hmm.

Scott Benner 20:23
I wonder if you have less of a hormonal impact than then what you're what you'd be expecting? Because if it's not like, yeah, because what are we calling like an impact on your blood? Sugar's is that like a percentage of insulin more that you need when it's difficult to manage? Yeah. You think it's 10% 20? What do you think? Oh, I

Jessica 20:44
don't know. Honestly, my strategy has been take 14 units of long acting the first week or three and things if I start going low more than I'll take one less unit. And then if that's if I'm still going low, maybe take two less units.

Scott Benner 21:01
What Basal are you using?

Jessica 21:02
vs. Not vs. Sorry, that's my Yeah, that's

Scott Benner 21:07
true, Siva?

Jessica 21:08
Why can't Joseba Yes,

Scott Benner 21:10
look at that. I was like, huh, which 1am? I guessing. Okay, and so true interest SIBO overlaps itself. So you adjust it, you adjust it down just by a unit if you're noticing a low blood sugar. Okay, interesting. So, there has been no anxiety since this two year period? Or did it? Did it persist?

Jessica 21:34
Oh, no, it just kind of went away. And now I just have, like, you know, you have like things in your life that make you temporarily anxious, you know, like normal reactions to things. But I haven't experienced severe what I would consider for myself severe anxiety like that

Scott Benner 21:51
sense. That's really interesting. Any other like mental health issues?

Jessica 21:57
No, I don't think so. I'm usually pretty easygoing, probably tolerate things longer than I should.

Scott Benner 22:06
That's such an interesting, more modern response to that question. Like, do you have any mental health issues? And you went? No, I don't think so. Like, well,

Jessica 22:16
I mean, that you there's a we have a lot more. Like in media, there's a lot more people talking about their issues. So it's like, okay, am I fine? Or? Because, you know, the the impression is, like, turns out, I wasn't fine. I had like bipolar disorder, or whatever the thing is, where people are like, Oh, my God, I didn't know I was living with this until I put it together.

Scott Benner 22:38
Yeah, it's kind of it's kind of fascinating, isn't it? The? Yeah, because there is I'm trying to think of what I heard recently. Oh, eating disorders. There was there was a therapist talking about in this article, that when, when we first you know, as kind of a culture of mental health people started understanding eating disorders more, they thought, like, well, let's make this public so people understand and can get helped. And then the incidence of eating disorders went up significantly. Now, is that because people now know what to call it? So it's being diagnosed? Or is that because you're putting it in people's heads? And they're like, oh, I have that. But they don't really? i That's such an interesting kind of social question. I find, like, I tend

Jessica 23:29
to lean towards that people are suffering with these issues, and they just didn't have a label for it. Yeah. Yeah.

Scott Benner 23:38
I'm so interested in that idea. Like, is it like a mass psychosis? Or is it just like, Oh, wow. I mean, because Could there have been that many things going wrong for people? And we just were unaware of it? You don't? I

Jessica 23:51
mean, I think so. Yeah, I think so. Something like when my grandmother was growing up, she she grew up in Oklahoma on a farm. And like her childhood sounded kind of not great. And I'm sure she has what we would call probably anxiety now, but you know, when you're growing up around that time, and it just is what it is, and nobody talks about it. And you just

Scott Benner 24:17
do you think she had a bad life because of it?

Jessica 24:19
But because of her upbringing? Yeah. She was the 12th child. And Bife, like, much younger than her other siblings, and they lived on a farm. And so she, you know, grew up working since she was really young, like on the farm. And she wanted to get the heck out of Oklahoma. So she was pen pals with my grandfather. Okay. And then she moved to Wisconsin with him, or he lived in Wisconsin, but she lived. That's where I live if you couldn't tell from my accent. No. Yeah.

Scott Benner 24:51
I got it. Yeah, yeah. But so your your grandmother was like, I need to get out of here so badly. I met a man through writing on paper and I'm gonna go to Wisconsin to marry him. Exactly. Wow, the world used to be a different place. And it

Jessica 25:06
did not work out for her either. I feel like my grandpa had a really tough upbringing. And he was born again, Christian, I guess at the time, right. And my grandma thought like, Oh, perfect, just what I need. You know, appearances can be deceiving, I

Scott Benner 25:22
guess. Yeah. Yeah. So your grandmother thought, I'll take some Jesus because I gotta get away from this giant family where I'm probably being ignored. And I'm anxious because I'm not even like, I mean, you know, people used to have kids just to work their land. Yeah, I wonder what that's like when you realize you're only here. Like as a as a farm animal. They don't I mean,

Jessica 25:44
I mean, kind of, and she didn't her mother wasn't super affectionate with her, either. So even though she was the baby, she just didn't get a lot of like, it sounds like affection from her mom. Yeah.

Scott Benner 25:58
That lady was probably exhausted. Oh, yeah, for sure. She probably had to carry her uterus over shoulder with a strap, like 12 kids. Oh, god. Oh my gosh, you just say?

Jessica 26:10
Oh, yeah, because I think like prolapsed uterus, and I'm a dog groomer. And there's, you know, some grooming groups where people post stuff and I went to school for a little bit. So like, I've seen pictures of what that looks like, and it's not great. No.

Scott Benner 26:26
sides coming out through your outsides. Yeah, yeah, not good. No, no, no, not good at all. The opposite of absorbing the absolute opposite of being absorbed by through your vagina. It's it's your it's being rejected through your vagina. Yeah, that's I'm just saying like, I don't know how you have 12 kids and then like, bounce the 12 foot on your knee and are like, Hey, sweetie, I'd be like, Oh, my God, I can't believe what have I done? You don't I mean?

Jessica 26:52
Yeah, I'm sure the as at least a few years younger than her. youngest sibling. Oh,

Scott Benner 27:00
my gosh, that's just crazy. Oh, all right. Okay. So you but you ended up in Wisconsin? Did she end up divorced?

Jessica 27:07
No, they stayed together. She She almost left him like three months into the relationship. She went back to not three months in I'm sorry. She had. I think she had had two kids by them. And she moved back to Oklahoma for like four months.

Scott Benner 27:25
Hey, Jessica, I don't know why you're breaking up. So

Jessica 27:28
a couple years into their marriage, that she did end up going back? I don't know why. Okay.

Scott Benner 27:35
I don't know why she went back. I say no, I don't. Well, you know, stability

Jessica 27:43
out here. And the first winter. Her husband and somebody else like they just left her alone in the middle of winter. She had to cut her own firewood. We Yeah, like she like it sounded really messed up. Like our first winter here was horrible. And Wisconsin winter isn't fun. It's really cold. There's a lot of snow. Like he just went to work or something I think, I don't know. About what year do you think this was? Woof. Probably in the early 60s.

Scott Benner 28:16
So he Penn powered his way to a lady to make babies for him and then just took off and went and did his own thing. Yeah.

Jessica 28:25
Like I said, she she thought like born again, Christian meant he was probably a good person and had his stuff together. And then he didn't.

Scott Benner 28:34
Yeah, I mean, I don't know a ton about it. I don't know a ton about it. But I I've always had the feeling that born again was was something that people were attracted to when they had had some fairly significant problems in their life. And they were looking for a reset.

Jessica 28:47
I don't know, maybe I've never really talked to my grandfather about it. Interesting. I never had a chance when I I don't know if he would have really had an answer for it. I don't know if he was super introspective. My grandmother is she's very intelligent, very introspective. But I don't think he really is. Or was, ya

Scott Benner 29:08
know, I mean, I don't know how much room would you have for that in your life? And you know, if that's how you're living like to really think about your motivations. Yeah, yeah, that's a fairly new thing for the masses to be doing over the last maybe 3040 years.

Jessica 29:23
So our benefit or No, I

Scott Benner 29:26
don't you know, I can't tell sometimes like maybe, maybe ignorance is bliss, right? It

Jessica 29:31
sometimes it feels like maybe there's a joke, you know, like Millennials know what, we know what's wrong with us, but we still can't really do anything about it.

Scott Benner 29:40
You know, well, that was kind of my point earlier like, I wonder I wonder what why does it matter? Like if you're okay, why does it matter? Oh,

Jessica 29:49
I think it's more people that feel like they're not okay. Maybe that it's more valuable for

Scott Benner 29:55
Oh yeah, well feeling okay. And being okay, I think are two different things like the I mean, there's nothing anybody who would like say like, oh, yeah, everything's perfect. Like, like, I guess maybe my expectations are just super low.

Jessica 30:08
My expectations tend to be low as a strategy. Yeah, like, not really low, but I don't expect everything to work out perfectly. And then when it works out fine, I'm really happy.

Scott Benner 30:20
Yeah, like, I opened my eyes the morning, I'm like, I've already won, like I'm alive. And then you know, like, the day goes, how it goes, I don't judge it. Like, I don't care. I can never carry one day to the next. Like, I don't I agree, never been like that. Like I just like yesterday, I had, like, a long day yesterday of thinking about the podcast and trying to like it was doing a lot of background stuff that you guys don't see, like invoicing and like having conversations with people about ads and like being upbeat. And meanwhile, I'm just in the back of my head, I'm just always thinking about how to grow the podcast, right. And I took this whiteboard in front of me, and I wrote big ideas on it. At the end of the night, I had a whiteboard, I didn't whiteboard, it said big ideas on it. I was like, ah, and you know, at the end of the day, I was disappointed. I was like, I really did not, I didn't come through today the way I thought I was going to. And then I woke up this morning and never thought of it again. And nice. Yeah, I am of the mindset, like my wife will make a list of things. When I first met her, she'd be like, this is the to do list, right? It's one to 10. And all the sudden Number four would become very important. And her thought process was, well, we have to get one, two and three done. So we can get to number four, it's very important. And I would just reorder the list and put forth the top. Right? And yeah, it was interesting how that didn't work for her. She's like, No, all these things are important. And that facilitated a conversation where I ended up finally saying, I don't think anything on this list is important. Unless it is unless it becomes emergent. Like it's it's just not important. Like I had a weed growing in the back corner of my yard for a while. Right. And it was behind the shed, and I couldn't see it. And it grew for so long that it got Woody, like it turned into like a tree, almost, you know, yeah. And I see it once in a while. I'm like, I should cut that down. And then I just didn't have time. I didn't have time, I didn't have time. And it had and before I knew it, it had been there for five years, this little four foot tall little tree thing that never got any bigger and nobody ever saw. And it didn't matter. Like it doesn't belong there. And it should go away. But grand scheme, it has no impact on anything. And, you know, I wonder how often we get focused on things and treat them like they're super important, but they don't really have an impact on anything. Other than it's on your list. I don't know. There's a deeper conversation there. I don't think I'm prepared for

Jessica 32:52
Yeah, I, I don't know if I have that experience. Always. Like if it's a random thing like that, that I've just forgotten to do forever. And I come to it. When I end up completing the task, it's satisfying. But I'm not upset that it took me very long. But it's really nice to just get it done though. Like once it's done,

Scott Benner 33:13
right? No, I know, people feel that way. I'm even thrown off by that idea. Like it's satisfying. Like I did eventually cut the weed down. And I have to be honest with you. I did not feel accomplished or satisfied. I

Jessica 33:25
was so sad. Yeah, it's Yeah, I think I'm somewhere in the middle where like, you know, something's in the back of my mind, and I can just take care of it. And it's gone. Yeah, that's nice.

Scott Benner 33:38
I also didn't get to grow up, like, expecting to like my work even. Oh,

Jessica 33:43
yeah. I don't know if I grew up that way. But I ended up sort of living my life that way. And that's nice. You

Scott Benner 33:51
do think you do something for work that you enjoy? Yes. Yeah, it would never occur to me.

Jessica 33:58
It didn't when I was growing up. I just stumbled into it and realized, Hey, I like this, I'm gonna keep doing it. Even if I could get a job that maybe pays better. I don't want to be, you know, upset with you know, I don't want to live most of my, you know, a lot of my day doing something that I don't like doing.

Scott Benner 34:17
Did you have a lot of like, financial support? Like if you didn't work? Would you have been okay for a little while?

Jessica 34:23
I don't know. I went to school for a while. And I lived with my parents. Kind of until I was almost done with school. But if I hadn't have gone to school, I would have just started working. Yeah,

Scott Benner 34:36
I I took my first job because it was available to me. And I had I had to have money.

Jessica 34:42
I didn't have to have money, but it was like, I mean, kind of, but like I said it would have been either or either go to college or start working. And I well, I did both kind of but I was working part time.

Scott Benner 34:54
That's interesting. Okay, we should probably talk about your diabetes. So maybe a little Huh. So let's talk about it then. So it's been three years, your MDI, what are your goals? Are you reaching them? How are you doing it?

Jessica 35:10
I'd like to have an agency of six. I've been at 6.5 pretty consistently, which I'm a little disappointed by, but it's fine. It's okay. I did get a spy point seven, my second to last day when see, but I was trying to be more aggressive, and I ended up feeding insulin all the time. Okay, so that wasn't like, I didn't reach that number. Honestly, the way Yeah, obviously, way I would have liked to so. So what's

Scott Benner 35:41
the difference between 6.5? And six? What are you not doing at 6.5? That you probably are doing it six.

Jessica 35:49
I think it's, I'm not dosing for meals maybe correctly, because I do end up correcting often after I eat. Okay. And maybe Pre-Bolus Singh, I do Pre-Bolus. But it's not always exactly the same time, every time. And for lunch, I often can't Pre-Bolus Or I'll go low. If I'm working. My insulin needs are different for lunch that it would be any other day. I say. I'm usually about eight to one. But for lunch, I'm 12 to one and I typically don't Pre-Bolus Or I'll go low.

Scott Benner 36:21
Okay, so it's a little bit of timing and a little bit of a mount that. And that when that shifts the wrong way you lose about a half a point and a one say probably that makes sense to me, by the way. Yeah. Yeah.

Jessica 36:34
It makes sense to me. I'm just having a hard time fixing it, which is frustrating.

Scott Benner 36:37
So is it a you're having trouble fixing it? Because you don't know what to do? Or you can't bring yourself to do it?

Jessica 36:47
It's more like, I don't know what to do. I guess I would do it if I knew it would work. Okay. I've had it happen a couple times where I've made a change and it went too far in the other direction. And it was like a minor change. So it's like, you know, I'm suspecting meat. I don't know. It's just figuring it just fine tuning it figuring out exactly how long do Pre-Bolus For or like, do I need one more unit of insulin? Or do I need to follow up with like a fat or protein adjustment or what

Scott Benner 37:22
you think lunch is an example it does that only happen when you're at work? Or does it happen lunchtime no matter what, only at work? Right? So so you're more active at work so you don't need as much insulin and because you're MDI you can't change your Basal rates while you're at work in like you would if you had a pump so you're trying to impact it through your carb ratio. But the truth is it's not enough insulin for the food so you get you have a spike at lunch that you don't see it other meals Is that about right?

Jessica 37:52
Oh no I don't spike I tend to spike before breakfast. And sometimes after supper lunch usually I don't spike unless I just messed up my dose

Scott Benner 38:02
No. So okay, so then so then you are managing it well with the different carb ratio at lunch but the activity is that important to you? That it changes your carb ratio by a third.

Jessica 38:14
Oh, by a third. Yeah, yeah. Oh, it also could be that I don't dose correctly for breakfast. And I'm often you know what I totally forgot to mention, I do often correct after breakfast. Nevermind, so I've got probably some act of insulin in my system that I'm forgetting to make like a conscious notice. So maybe that's why I don't need a Pre-Bolus for lunch.

Scott Benner 38:35
At work because if you didn't eat lunch, would you get low do you think? Yeah. Well, that's interesting. So okay, so go back to breakfast then you spike you get feed on the floor. Like your blood sugar goes up before you eat in the morning.

Jessica 38:48
No, it's only when after I eat if you

Scott Benner 38:52
eat. Okay, so you shoot your trusty bed in the morning? No, should you face the bed at night you get up in the morning. You eat and

Jessica 39:01
usually more often than not I'm I tend to be a little bit lower in the morning. Okay, and too high. I have tried my no one wanted me to and I've tried backing off my Joseba by unit. I just had a harder time in general with my blood sugar's and I was running higher at night than I'd like

Scott Benner 39:20
to. So you need the trustee with that level. So So what happens in the morning, what are you eating for breakfast?

Jessica 39:26
I usually eat oatmeal. It's like overnight oats. Kind of like oatmeal and milk, put it in the fridge overnight. Okay, take it out and eat it. I do probably overcorrect at breakfast when I get that spike after I eat. I probably am overcorrecting. I'm just incredibly impatient. And I hate to be at 200 Does

Scott Benner 39:48
that happen every day? Yeah. Can I ask you if you're seeing a spike after the oatmeal consistently, and then your bolusing for that spike? Why don't you take some of the insole On for the correction that you're using for the spike and just move it into the Bolus for the oatmeal.

Jessica 40:06
I've tried that. And sometimes it works. And sometimes it doesn't. What happens when it doesn't? Sometimes I go low,

Scott Benner 40:15
a little low. So through through kind of fear, you're waiting for the spike to happen before you add the extra. Yeah, I've

Jessica 40:23
been working on this for a while. Like I tried lowering my high, not too low. I was really aggressively correcting at the 160. And then I found I was running low a lot of the time. Okay. So sometimes I will go up to 160, maybe 170. And I'll come back down. So sometimes I shouldn't correct at that level. And other times I need it. And I'm just haven't put it together exactly when, yeah, I need to correct at that time. And when I don't. So

Scott Benner 41:00
it seems to me and not that you couldn't figure this out. But

Jessica 41:05
there's no I've been, quote unquote, working on it for a while. So you know, what, let me know what you got?

Scott Benner 41:12
Well, what I was gonna say is that I think it's partially because you're on MDI, that, okay, that you're having that you're having an issue, because you can't be as reactive to it as you would be with a pump. And like, you're like, you're waiting for numbers like, well, I waited till I was 160. But that was too aggressive. So now I have to wait till I'm 180s that I don't get low. And like, you know, with a pump, you wouldn't think twice about hitting 140 and using a fraction of the insulin to see if it worked. But when you're injecting, you're waiting for a moment when you can want like inject full units, right? Yeah, so instead of like waiting for a number and then putting in the full unit, you could be doing a quarter of a unit or a half of a unit for the pump, you could be bolusing a little more aggressively for the food and adding Temp Basal increase overtop of the oatmeal a little bit. And that way, if it was too much, you could just shut the Temp Basal increase off. If it was too little, you could be more aggressive with it. If you started to look like oh, I might get low, you could shut your basil off for 15 or 20 minutes. And like, there's more stuff you could do there with a pump that you can't do with with the MDI. I think that might be why you're not finding an answer, because it's a more of a fine tuning problem in a sledgehammer world.

Jessica 42:27
Yeah, that was kind of my suspicion. Was

Scott Benner 42:30
that what you were thinking? Yeah.

Jessica 42:32
A little bit.

Scott Benner 42:33
You should get a podcast. You should get a podcast. Tell people?

Jessica 42:37
I should, right? I already. Yeah. Right. So yeah, I was toying with getting an omni pod and getting the algorithm. I'm trying to buy a house right now, though. So I'm kind of worried about doing that and getting a pump. And I didn't really know how much of an impact I would see with it. Like if I got a pump. And I was getting about the same results I have now I don't know if it will be worth it necessarily.

Scott Benner 43:03
I see your point that because because the end, I was just looking at the number. Like they're probably saying six and a half. You're doing great.

Jessica 43:10
Oh, she thinks she told me to calm down. My last appointment, which was like last month, she was like you're doing fine. My other clients like, you know, Aaron, eight, nine, it's your fine, calm down. Yeah,

Scott Benner 43:23
well, two things. You can't measure your success against somebody else's lack of success. And that's, you know, yeah, my mom used to be like, you're doing great. And I was like, You're literally holding me up against my cousin who's been like jailed. I don't know how well you're doing. But But the other thing is, maybe if your doctor had like a little more anxiety, they'd be more focused. Maybe you could suggest Molly to them, for example, and maybe get her.

Jessica 43:50
I mean, you know, I'll get to know her for a couple more years. We talked about her dogs, she trusts me. So jump off for it, right?

Scott Benner 43:57
No, I mean, I just think it's a common. I think that's a great example of why people don't get help from doctors sometimes. Because they're like, Well, you're in range. Who cares? Let it be baby legs. What are you worried about? You know, you did? Now, you know, 10 years from now when the ADA lowers their target to six. She'll say, well, the ADA says their target six and, you know, maybe we should be trying something else. It's just kind of meaningless. Why people say things. Sometimes. If you're trying to get your a one C under six, then that's important. If that's what you want, you know, yeah, I think pumps the answer, but but it doesn't agree. You know, I don't know if it needs to be an algorithm right away or not. But you know, what? An algorithm like an on the pod five. I heard you bring up. Yeah,

Jessica 44:46
I would really like an algorithm. I think. It seems like it would be a little bit less work. Once you figured this system out, then. Yeah.

Scott Benner 44:53
No, it's not. Hey, so you, is this an insurance issue for you? Well, I

Jessica 44:59
haven't even looked into When I'm not sure my insurance does cover Dexcom, and it's not super expensive. I've had a couple of changes since I've been diabetic with my insurance. And they all cover it about the same. Yeah,

Scott Benner 45:11
you're getting insurance through. I'm sorry, this will sound. I don't know how it's going. It's just like,

Jessica 45:17
you know, I tend to be conservative about wanting to spend money on large things like like that. So I'm just nervous about, you know, the cost. And Sure. Well,

Scott Benner 45:27
I mean, maybe you look into it and find out it's not a large cost. Maybe your insurance covers it, it's almost the insignificant amount. That would be nice. Be I have to ask you if this will sound wrong, and I apologize, but you get insurance being a dog groomer?

Jessica 45:42
Well, no. I buy marketplace insurance.

Scott Benner 45:46
Oh, okay. So you're kind of paying out of pocket for your insurance? Yes. I was like, how was that? How, like, what amazing place? Do you work where they're like, You're a dog groomer. And we would like to give you full benefits. Yeah,

Jessica 45:56
well, you can work at a corporate store and get insurance through them, but I would not recommend it. How come? Because I did that for a while and it sucks. Just I feel like in general, the animal industry can can be stressful. It like by its nature, and then you throw, like your managers telling you need to do more work for the same amount of money or enact extra policies and have no extra time for it. Things like that. It's not great. Everybody's stressed. And it's, you know, yeah. Not the best environment. No,

Scott Benner 46:30
my wife works in a corporate environment, and she will absolutely die sitting in a chair worrying. Oh,

Jessica 46:35
yeah. Yeah, it's like, and, yeah, I feel sympathy for anybody at any stage. I was at like, the bottom of the totem pole. But it's like, it's not, it's probably worse being my manager, and I was probably worse being her manager, and so on and so on. You know,

Scott Benner 46:52
I am really, like, pardoned by, like, grooming animals, and you're thinking of buying a house. And I thought, well, that's, that's terrific. Like that. Like,

Jessica 47:04
it can work out. Yeah, yeah. Well, you know, I'm not rolling in dough or anything. No, no, maybe a small house. But but you know, that's still

Scott Benner 47:12
pretty impressive to me. You're just generally like, I wouldn't have expected that. And I'm absolutely like, like, oh, wow, that's fantastic.

Jessica 47:21
I get a lot of people asking me how many days a week I do this. And I'm like, Oh, this is full time. Maybe? Like, five days a week. 10 hours a day. All

Scott Benner 47:31
the all the days. And please, please, please, please, tip? Yes, please. Please do. Are you selling the dog hair for like some nefarious thing? No,

Jessica 47:40
I don't think there's a black market for dog care. Unfortunately. Oh,

Scott Benner 47:44
if there was, can you imagine? Yeah,

Jessica 47:46
I would be down for it. Yeah, that's

Scott Benner 47:48
really kind of, you know, I don't know if I'm sounding like stuck up here or something? I don't I don't I don't I don't mean to like, I'm just like, wow, like, to me. That's the thing people do. I think of it as a cash business a little bit. But obviously, yeah, you know, and I don't know, just like, it's, I don't know, I felt good. Because you're in here's why. Cuz you're a single person. You described, I don't want to work in a corporate setting. So you're not, you're doing something that's not exactly like, you know, commonplace that people don't like when they're 16 Go, like I'm gonna grow up and be a dog groomer. So you're doing something you're enjoying, I imagine. And, and, and you have health benefits enough to manage your diabetes, which I think is the thing people worry about. And

Jessica 48:34
it's a crazy place. I didn't really know dog grooming was a thing until I sort of stumbled into it, basically. So it's just one of those things that you don't think of as, like you said, you don't think of it as like a career. I guess. In that way I imagined

Scott Benner 48:49
it is I just wasn't like, you know what I mean? Like, you're like, you don't hear people say like, when I grew up, I'm gonna be a dog groomer. You hear people say like, when I grew up, I think I'm gonna be an accountant or something. You know?

Jessica 48:59
You're like an electrician or Yeah, or whatever.

Scott Benner 49:02
Hey, do you ever have to express the dogs? anal glands? Yeah.

Jessica 49:05
Okay, it's less gross. The longer I'm doing it, and I'm starting to equate, like, every dog has got a different texture and like consistency and smell weight of their buttholes not their buttholes but like the anal gland, just like okay, liquid. Okay, keep going. Sorry. Okay, so I'm gonna be really gross. But if you're a dog groomer, you get used to it and you forget how gross you are and how much people hate this.

Scott Benner 49:34
Just guy gotta regroup for a second.

Jessica 49:35
I understand. I get it.

Scott Benner 49:38
Can I tell you the word that got me? What texture? Texture? Yeah, I I can't even begin to tell you like my whole self crunched into a tight little ball on like texture. There's texture to the liquid that Wait, hold on.

Jessica 49:54
I mean, I'm not touching it but like you know when it comes, that it can be varying. levels of viscosity like sometimes it's it's like runny and sometimes it isn't.

Unknown Speaker 50:04
Okay, stop. That was

Jessica 50:08
I know. Yeah, I went too far. That's it's gross. Yeah. Oh, you just kind of get used to that kind of stuff though.

Scott Benner 50:16
But I think it's fair to say that if you meet a new boy ever and he's into buttstock you'll just be like, whatever. I'm good. Oh,

Jessica 50:22
no. Okay, now. I'd be sad. Take some talking, talking me into. Yeah.

Scott Benner 50:30
Well, that's interesting. Like, I'm now I'm like, I thought for sure you were just like, Yeah, whatever.

Jessica 50:37
It's different when you have to do it for your job on an animal that isn't a person and doesn't have a lot of thoughts about it.

Scott Benner 50:43
I'm sweating. I just want you to

Jessica 50:48
and people don't have like have anal glands? I don't think so. It's like,

Scott Benner 50:52
if it's possible, I don't know what a needle gland is. Wait, you don't it's possible

Jessica 50:55
that you don't explain I can give you the rundown. How do you do it? Well, I maybe not but so that they have a little sacks on the inside of their like rectum, like, around the anus. And when they go to the bathroom, it like puts pressure on the sacks and they like a little bit of like, in a land fluid gets on the like feces. And that's what dogs are smelling when they're like smelling all the dogs poop. That's like they're smelling that, that has like all sorts of information about the dog. So that's what anal glands are. If

Scott Benner 51:26
they hold that stuff, then why do they need to be expressed? Sometimes

Jessica 51:30
they get clogged. So if your dog all of a sudden his butthole starts like, like if he's got too hard lumps, like four and eight o'clock on a clock, or if his like, it just looks swollen back there, that might be the issue. If they're scooting a lot or licking their butt a lot. It happens with small dogs pretty often, where they they just have issues with or if your dog isn't going to the bathroom regularly, or it's really runny or something and they're not getting expressed on their own then they can have issues. Okay, Jessica,

Scott Benner 52:01
I just below whole thing. Or is that upon? It's a whole thing.

Jessica 52:08
No, it wasn't meant to be it could be so.

Scott Benner 52:11
So I the entire time you were speaking. I'm just I'm waving air into my face. I'm like, I don't know. Nauseous is almost the word. Oh,

Jessica 52:22
I'm sorry. Don't be sorry. I

Scott Benner 52:24
asked you to do it. I wanted it done. Yeah. And that's it. Yeah,

Jessica 52:29
that's it.

Unknown Speaker 52:30
What's that cost?

Jessica 52:31
$10 Oh, no.

Scott Benner 52:33
We're not charging enough money for that. Probably

Jessica 52:37
not. So the the way the vet expresses them and the way I do it is different.

Scott Benner 52:43
Up Play music. No,

Jessica 52:46
I do it externally. And the vet will like do it internally while they're like, kind of assault your animal a little bit to express them that way.

Scott Benner 52:53
Oh, so if I want buy stuff, I gotta find a vet.

Jessica 52:56
Yeah, if you want like serious about stuff, you gotta go to the vet for sure. Because they're

Scott Benner 53:00
used to putting their fingers in there working around a little bit. Yeah,

Jessica 53:03
yep. And I just pushed from I feel from the outside and like, push up and out.

Scott Benner 53:07
Oh, usually work. So you're wearing gloves up your shoulders when you're doing this or me? Let's say yes. My God, not always gloves. Well, I'm

Jessica 53:17
doing it in the bathtub, right? Because I'm gonna wash everything in there, including my hand. You know?

Scott Benner 53:30
You should be medically sealed outfit when you do.

Jessica 53:33
I don't think there's like zoonotic diseases that can be passed on with AnnaLynne fluids. So I think it's good. I think it's

Scott Benner 53:39
okay, but they all smell different.

Jessica 53:42
Um, there's like, you know, three or four different smells. It's all bad.

Scott Benner 53:48
Yeah, I mean, it all sounds really bad you Rach in the beginning.

Jessica 53:52
I've only gagged once. It was really weird. Like I haven't. I think I have a pretty strong stomach. Obviously, because I talked about anal glands for how long like 10 minutes?

Scott Benner 54:02
Not not long enough if you asked me.

Jessica 54:07
But I was work when I was working at PetSmart I was working with a coworker and I asked her for help because I wasn't eight. I wasn't just not getting it. And she came over and for whatever reason the smell made us both gag. And that's not typically the case. Usually I can handle it. Every once in a while though. It's bad.

Scott Benner 54:28
Okay, and dollars. Yeah,

Jessica 54:30
yeah. It only takes you know, a minute. It takes like 10 seconds. I

Scott Benner 54:36
don't care. My minimum is 200 bucks. If you want that done. That's just to get me out of bed for it. I'm not doing it for less than that.

Jessica 54:42
Well, if you need that done on your dogs, then you know you can well you probably I don't know what you probably don't take into a groomer I imagined they're they're like bully breeds or something. Yeah,

Scott Benner 54:52
they're short haired dogs think they don't Yeah, so they don't need much bigger they get a bath once in a while. Like when they stay if they bored somewhere. Unlike do their nails, give them a day, you know? Yeah. But there's no hair cutting. The hair is just all over my house.

Jessica 55:06
Yeah, it's a trade off either you have to deal with the dog matting or there's hair everywhere. My good one or the other. Wow,

Scott Benner 55:14
this is absolutely horrifying. Jessica, thank you for sharing that. You're welcome. You were being underpaid?

Jessica 55:21
Probably. No.

Scott Benner 55:22
Stop it. You were being okay, I had to take a sip. I need to I need to center myself. Yeah, if you need a minute, are you kidding me the minute. Wow, I really my brow got sweaty. And like oh my god, I was really like, upset.

Jessica 55:42
That is the the grossest thing I have to deal with nothing tops. Like, how gross that is. Oh, I lied. That's a lie. But routine day to day. That's the grossest thing.

Scott Benner 55:52
Wait, wait, wait, what's the grossest thing if that's not like

Jessica 55:55
bad teeth, or like a wound that an owner didn't know about until I shave the hair off and find it? Like, that kind of stuff happens occasionally. Yeah, that's, you get Ben. Sometimes they bite you. Yeah, sometimes often, it's for nails or something like that. Some dogs really, really hate their nails done. Or they're not used to grooming and they're really anxious. I've had people I had somebody who had a ciaochao They're like, really independent dogs, and they don't like strangers. And this guy kind of had a hard time grooming his dog, but he thought he would take it to me to see what I could do. Which didn't work out. And that dog would bite at me for sure. You learn to see it coming and you know, you get fast. And then obviously, if it's really bad, you you know don't groom that dog anymore. Scott,

Scott Benner 56:47
my fast twitch muscles are just out of the way. Boom. Cool. Snapping Jaws going all over the place. They bad teeth can smell right.

Jessica 56:56
Oh, really bad. Yeah. Okay. And they can get like abscesses and stuff, too. What's

Scott Benner 57:01
the best way when you cut a nail too far and it bleeds? What's the best way to stop it from bleeding?

Jessica 57:06
We have quick stuff that we put on it. So it's like a powder that will? I'm not exactly sure, but I think it helps the blood clot. Yeah, so you put it on the nail. And usually I don't click them too bad. It's just like, you know, one little. You just put a little quick step on them. And they're fine.

Scott Benner 57:24
I had somebody tell me recently a moist bar of soap. Just drag the nail through it to clog it up. And I was like, Ha

Jessica 57:30
that's never heard of that. Yeah. Cornstarch works. If you have cornstarch at home.

Scott Benner 57:34
I've seen that too. Cornstarch baking soda. That kind of stuff can help too. Okay. Do you think you're gonna date again?

Jessica 57:43
I'm working on it. Yeah. Yeah. As of recently.

Scott Benner 57:47
I mean, what do you put on your profile? I can take harsh smells like that would?

Jessica 57:51
Oh, god. No. That's exactly the opposite goal. Yeah, right. Right. Clean, please. You're

Scott Benner 58:00
learning from your great grandmother. She I guess she was like, she had her bar set too low. And you're like, No, no. Yeah.

Jessica 58:08
Ah, man. So yeah. So yeah, I'm working on I've been on a couple of dates. I have a, I think a little bit of a commitment issue. So it's interesting, I'm trying to like push through that. And kind of just from the last point out there, from the last one, and maybe the first one, I've only dated two people. So the first one I was with for a really long time, nine and a half years. And the second one I was with for about a year and a half. But I got into that one too quickly. And then I waited a while to break up with him. Because he had some mental health issues. And I wanted to make sure he was like, set up in life better than when I got to him so that when I left him, hopefully he wouldn't destroy it all.

Scott Benner 58:50
How do we find a boy for you? Who doesn't have mental health issues? I think that's a good first step.

Jessica 58:54
I don't know. And I don't know what the bar is for like, what is probably behavior that they can work with themselves and what isn't? How many

Scott Benner 59:09
people do you meet that are like, not whatever quote unquote, normal would be like, get up do a thing? Well,

Jessica 59:17
I don't know. Well, the second one, I got into that relationship too quickly, too. I mean, he was, you know, generally like get up, go to work go home, but he definitely had like some alcohol issues that I kind of knew going in and I should have just not messed with it.

Scott Benner 59:35
That's the constant. Jessica that's the West. That's the Wisconsin

Jessica 59:39
is too I don't know if it's the Wisconsin per se it definitely is.

Scott Benner 59:43
It's too cold there.

Jessica 59:45
It's it is cold. It's like 80 degrees today, though. Yeah,

Scott Benner 59:50
I know. But in the winter, I'm saying you're stuck. You're inside the Packers have sucked for years. What are you gonna do?

Jessica 59:55
You can play d&d Instead of going to the bar every day. Yeah,

Scott Benner 59:59
but I don't know. Also, we need we need somebody in your relationship that can handle a corporate environment. I'd like to see, I'd like to see you on some good insurance. You don't

Jessica 1:00:08
I mean, maybe help me super duper. Yeah, I would love that. Like, maybe

Scott Benner 1:00:12
you're thinking a baby or there's that no plans?

Jessica 1:00:16
Not in the plan.

Scott Benner 1:00:17
Can you tell me why?

Jessica 1:00:17
I just have never wanted them. And I've I know, I'm not too old to start trying. But I it feels that way to me. But it's mostly I just never really wanted kids.

Scott Benner 1:00:27
You know, I mean, in early 30s, like, I take you at your word. Like, if you were like, right, if you were, if you were 21. And you're like, I don't want a baby, I'd be like, Well, hang on, let's wait and see what happens. But, like, in your early 30s, I figured this is a like a conscious decision. So

Jessica 1:00:43
well, I felt this way forever, basically.

Scott Benner 1:00:47
So I don't want to screw a kid up. No, I just don't want to do it. Just don't want you don't want the responsibility. Maybe? I

Jessica 1:00:56
don't know, I think I'd be a good mom. If I wanted to be like, I don't think I would do a bad job

Scott Benner 1:01:00
afraid of passing on diabetes.

Jessica 1:01:02
No, because I, I kind of made up my mind about kids. By the time it was like, you know, 25 if

Scott Benner 1:01:09
you wanted to do it, you do a good job at it. Yeah. Like,

Jessica 1:01:13
you know, as well as you can do I know, it's, you know, like, you go in thinking like, I know exactly what to do with this is gonna be awesome. And then you're like, Oh, I screwed up their website. You shouldn't have done that. You know, like, I know, it's not easy.

Scott Benner 1:01:25
Do you have any of those feelings? Like, oh, the world's not a fertile place to bring children into give those thoughts?

Jessica 1:01:32
Yeah, like, there's too many of them. And they don't nobody needs mine.

Scott Benner 1:01:37
Oh, wait a minute. Oh, selfesteem. No, no, it's not

Jessica 1:01:41
my kids would be so smart. They would be amazing. But nobody needs like, we don't need more. I could just adapt. If I wanted. You

Scott Benner 1:01:48
might not get a good work with that. Like, look, my parents adopted. Look what happened to them.

Jessica 1:01:52
I mean, it's a shame. But you know, you just got to take a risk. And having your own kids is a risk to like you don't know. You don't know what how it's Well, yeah.

Scott Benner 1:02:01
Can I I'm gonna ask a different question. This obviously, this whole conversation got like, bummed puzzled by what happened in the beginning, but I'm still having fun. So I don't care.

Jessica 1:02:11
Oh, it's fine. As long as everybody else isn't hating this like cluster, but it is. I think it's good. I think we're doing okay, yeah, we're

Scott Benner 1:02:20
fine. You're, you've only chose two boys so far. And they've both kind of had the same vibe.

Jessica 1:02:29
I know. That's the scary thing.

Scott Benner 1:02:31
Are you bad at the picking part? Probably right.

Jessica 1:02:34
I gotta be bad at the picking thing.

Scott Benner 1:02:36
Why? What are you attracted to? That ends up not working out? I'm not sure.

Jessica 1:02:41
Well, the second time around, he had some qualities that I really liked that were different from the first one. But they kind of ultimately had the same core issues with like, emotional vulnerability. So as much as I would like to think that I'd like to pick someone who is emotionally like capable of sharing with me, it doesn't seem like that's my MO, which is annoying when

Scott Benner 1:03:06
they don't share. How does that hurt your experience?

Jessica 1:03:10
I feel like they don't trust me enough to share their life with me like their mental struggles and stuff. Like if you're not willing to share that with me, then why are you bothering your time with me? Like, and I understand it's hard to do that I probably struggle with that a little bit. Like, that's the point of having a relationship is having someone to share with

Scott Benner 1:03:28
Yeah, no, I understand. I just I'm trying to understand further. If someone's not as open with you as you want them to be it makes but the the part that I got tripped up on was if I'm not, if I'm not honest with you, then you think why, like, what's wrong with me that they don't want to be honest with me? Whereas I would think there's something about them that keeps them from being that way?

Jessica 1:03:53
Well, yeah, it's there is something about them that makes them want to be not to be honest. Yeah. And I can't like fix that. I can't just flip a switch and make them feel like they can be honest.

Scott Benner 1:04:06
And all that it's, let's say ask like a fan smash me. Let's just ask I have big like, made up thing. Let's say I have an underlying problem. You and I get together. Okay? I never share this problem with you. And it never becomes obvious to you through our entire relationship. Did it matter that I didn't share it with you?

Jessica 1:04:24
It depends on if it's having a major impact on you or not. I guess it would bother me a little bit if you're like, oh, yeah, I've been terrified of heights this whole time. Every time we walk on a bridge, I want to cry. And I had no idea like that would make me feel a little upset. Because

Scott Benner 1:04:43
I kept it from you or because I didn't share it with you. Probably

Jessica 1:04:47
more the sharing.

Scott Benner 1:04:51
Do you worry that you're not a person people want to share with Hmm,

Jessica 1:04:54
this is why I need therapy because I'm not introspective enough sometimes. Yeah, I don't know. Yeah, I feel Like I'm a good listener, and I'm a better listener than I am at getting people to listen to me,

Scott Benner 1:05:05
I guess. Because what I'm hearing is that you want things from people that they don't give you. And that makes you feel bad. It makes you feel bad, because why would they not tell you?

Jessica 1:05:18
Okay, yeah, I see where you're going with. Yeah, right.

Scott Benner 1:05:21
But what if they just can't tell you? Like, what if they couldn't tell anybody? It has nothing to do with you? I

Jessica 1:05:26
mean, there's varying degrees of it, right? I mean, it would still like, I wouldn't say it wouldn't bother me at all. It's it's more of like if it becomes an issue and their mental health and their daily life, and then they're freaking the heck out over there. And I have no idea what's going on.

Scott Benner 1:05:40
You don't like the uncertainty? Yeah. Do you have thoughts that you didn't share with your boyfriend's? Probably?

Jessica 1:05:48
Honestly, I don't. It's hard to remember exactly what I was feeling at any time. May

Scott Benner 1:05:54
I May? I guess you do. I think everybody has thoughts that they don't

Jessica 1:05:58
share. I mean, probably Yeah. Yeah. Well, the first one, we were together for a really long time. Too young. Yeah, too young went into it too fast. Again, that's, that's the thing I'm working on that doing. I don't know, he just never shared very much to begin with. So I didn't share very much, I guess. And he wasn't super like, I don't know that he didn't, there was something up with the first one for sure. Like he had his own stuff going on. I'm gonna

Scott Benner 1:06:24
tell you something that I've been thinking about lately. Sure. I grew up, my father left my mom when I was like, 13. So I was mostly raised, you know, in a family together when I was younger, and by a single woman when I was older. And the message from my mom was Be nice, be kind, be caring, be gentle. This is what women want. And I look back now and I realized that's what my mom wanted. It's not what women want. It's what my mom wanted. And bass, and my mom was plenty happy being with a guy who kind of took control and like, did like Guy things. Right up until she realized that he was cheating on her and then their relationship broke up. But prior to that, she was very happy that way. And so I think I modeled myself towards compassion and being concerned with other people's feelings. When sometimes, you know, your interests are not interesting to me. Like you don't I mean, like, it's, which is fine. But I put myself out there, and I do that. And what I've learned over the years, is that the women I find that's not really what they want. It's interesting, like, like, everybody says, like, be nice, be kind, be gentle. And not that there's not a space and time for all that. I'm not saying I'm not saying certainly like I'm not saying like, I have a club in my hand and I, you know, dragging people by their hair, like a caveman. Like, I'm not saying that. I'm just saying that. Like, there's more like, classically masculine traits, that sometimes I think guys can hide thinking that's not what you want. And then they feel like they're hiding themselves. And then you can feel that they're hiding something from you. Hmm, that's all.

Jessica 1:08:13
Yeah, I get the vibe a little bit. Yeah, i i Do you feel like I don't? I don't know if I'm getting a read on somebody until I've hung out with them a lot. And then you start to figure it out a little more. Yeah.

Scott Benner 1:08:27
No, no, it's hard to be yourself. Because yeah, yes, expectations of what you think people expect, except you might not be expecting the same thing that I was told to give. It's very interesting. Yeah, I find it I find it interesting. I think you'll not you, but in general, you're part of a generation of people who want things to go right. And you want to check in you want something to be comfortable for you. Like, you know, like, I very easily could still be working in a sheetmetal shop. I swear to you, like that could very easily be happening. And I hated it. Like, I Well, that's unfair. I didn't hate it. I just didn't like it. But I didn't have any expectation that I was supposed to like it. So it was okay. Like I got ya toil bidding,

Jessica 1:09:12
I think my parents working experience is probably similar to like, you just get a job and you do the job. Yeah.

Scott Benner 1:09:17
And then that's then that's that. But yeah, you know, it's, um, as far as that reflects on relationships, about, you know, I want the thing I want. I don't know it's a stranger in a world where people don't actually share how they feel until you get very intimate with them and then sometimes not even and but you want honesty and clarity and which is absolutely. Like, I'm not saying you shouldn't want that. I'm just saying that. I don't know if you can get it from people all the time.

Jessica 1:09:48
Yeah, that's the difficult thing. And you know, I'm still working through like, okay, like, it's kind of hard for me to read people like I can't go on one date with someone then decide like, this is it you know, It takes me a while to, like, get used to people and figure it out and stuff. So

Scott Benner 1:10:05
yeah, I can't imagine anywhere where that would be, like, accurate. After a date or something like that, or a couple of dates to really know somebody, I think you have to get into pressure situations a little bit. See how people react to? Yeah, kind of Yeah, you know, it's just interesting, because when, when my wife and I were first together, like I'm an I'm an action oriented, get things accomplished person. And then as you're together longer there, you know, you'll somebody will say to you, like, you know, you don't always have to fix things. And I'd be like, well, when, you know, for the first five years of our life, you were standing there waiting for me to fix things. And so like, that's my expectation of what you want. And then what you want shifts, and it's very interesting. I don't know, you should probably just go date a bunch of people with no expectations. Yeah, probably. That's all or don't I don't give it. To me. Just it's

Jessica 1:11:01
it's tricky, because I don't know, how many people is appropriate to talk to at the same time, and like yada, yada. Oh, you're

Scott Benner 1:11:09
worried about all that? Yeah, it's awful. Oh, what I worry about trying to put myself in your position? Yeah, I don't think I'd worry about that.

Jessica 1:11:18
Yeah, probably not. I do have an issue with obviously I the last relationship. I stayed with somebody for too long, because I was worried about their feelings. And I did learn a little bit of a lesson from that, but I haven't learned it completely. So you know, I don't want to be like, unfair to someone, I guess. But I guess that's just how it is. Would

Scott Benner 1:11:38
you be comfortable sharing with me? What it's like to have already decided that this is not the person for you, but you're still being intimate with them?

Jessica 1:11:49
I guess in what risk? Factor? It's not fair to them, because I think he could probably tell that I was sort of checking out. Right? I don't know. It's a weird. It's a strange situation it like, in some ways, it feels like, you know, it's probably it's probably better when you've decided enough is enough to just leave, you know, and like, there's some ups and downs. And you're like, Okay, maybe, maybe just just, it's just a down spot, and it'll get better. And then you wait a little bit. And that's not the case. And

Scott Benner 1:12:25
so just like little signs you can look for, like, yeah, and it's just it's just tough to like know, because because even when you spot them, the other person doesn't go Oh, yeah, you're right. I am not taking my bra off in front of you anymore. Because I'm not comfortable being like, topless in front of you. And like Nobody says that. But But somebody will be like, well, you know, why did you never get changed in the bedroom in the bathroom? Like what's going on there? Like nothing? Like it's always that like, nobody ever has the nerve to like, just go the rest of the way with it. And be like, Yeah, you're right. I'm, I'm Yeah, trying to keep you from seeing me because I'm not into this.

Jessica 1:13:00
Well, then he was never forthright about, like, I think when he started to have concerns, he never asked me directly about it at all. Yeah, it's so hard. So I mean, yeah, it's hard. That wasn't good for anybody. Yeah.

Scott Benner 1:13:14
You don't want to you don't want to make that mistake again. No, do you think it's possible that it's just not possible to be with somebody for that long and not have those feelings? Like, like I've been, I've been in a very long relationship, I can tell you like, it ebbs and flows. Well,

Jessica 1:13:31
this know that the second one, I was for sure, like, pretty, you know, early ish, you know, like, eight months or so I was like, Yeah, I think we're done. But I didn't want to sabotage his life by leaving, I guess, which is not the correct way to look at it. But I knew it would be really tough. But no, for sure. What the first one? Like there's definitely, you know, nine and a half years into that one. There's definitely ebbs and flows. Yeah, for sure. Like, that's just how it goes. You know, you have times where you're not feeling emotionally, like connected for a while. And then for whatever reason, it kicks back up, things are really good. Like, I expect that to happen. Yeah. For sure.

Scott Benner 1:14:14
How much of your diabetes Did you share with with these guys? The

Jessica 1:14:19
second one, a lot. He was really good. He paid a lot of attention. I think he would have been really good at potentially caring for me if I needed it. He was really thoughtful in that way. He really paid a lot of attention. The first one it kind of freaked him out. He was, I think concerned about what it would mean and he didn't know how to like help me with it. Yeah, and, and then it just stressed him out. Gotcha. But then you didn't you didn't ask any questions or anything at all even.

Scott Benner 1:14:53
Ya know, I've often wondered how crazy that must be to be with somebody for that long not actually be like you guys are together, but you don't own anything together, you're not actually married. And then this big thing comes in, and it's not hard to go, I wasn't expecting that, like, I'm not, and you're already not. It's not like you're like, you know, having a fairytale existence and just like, Oh, it's fine, whatever baby like, you know, it's almost like lose another thing. And you're and you're, then he doesn't respond to it. And you're probably thinking, well, there's another thing. He's not even showing any interest in this diabetes thing. And massively

Jessica 1:15:29
Yeah, I wasn't expecting it to be sure. Super. I never expected him to be super emotionally supportive when I was when we were at that point. Yeah.

Scott Benner 1:15:39
It's very interesting. If you stop and take the whole story here, and like, think back to your grandmother, your great grandpa going to Wisconsin, and then leaving and coming back. And, and the idea of like, what's right for people? And what, like, what makes them happy? Like, there's just times where, I don't know if this is an unpopular feeling? But like, I don't think you're supposed to be happy every day.

Jessica 1:16:02
No, you're not I there's days where I'm in a bad mood. And it's for whatever reason, it's like, well, that's it for today, I'm just going to be in a bad mood, tomorrow will probably be better. And you just you just kept like, live with your feelings for a minute. You know, they're temporary always. And then it's going to be fine. Later,

Scott Benner 1:16:22
I heard somebody say recently, don't say you have anxiety, say you're experiencing anxiety. And that that's an important distinction. I'm gonna look more into that. I'm not sure if there's gonna be there or not. But

Jessica 1:16:36
I think it depends on whether maybe whether you have chronic anxiety or not. Yeah. But it might help with the way you think about it. Maybe you're someone that has chronic anxiety, you know, it might be easier to think like, this minute, I'm having issues, but maybe, you know,

Scott Benner 1:16:54
well, later, I won't sort of part of what I was talking about earlier. Like, you know, there's I don't doubt at all there are people who are under like, constant crippling anxiety. I'm not saying that. There are also people who just get the anxious situations and then say things, like, I have anxiety, like, Well, okay, yeah, cuz you know, you're walking along the rim of a volcano, this is gonna be an anxious situation, but you're gonna walk away from it eventually, and not feel this way anymore. It was first put to me by somebody who said, I have PTSD, like a diagnosed PTSD. And I don't like it when people say, Oh, that gives me PTSD. Because it's not really giving them PTSD. It's making them remember something unfavorably from their past. And they can walk away from it. I can't walk away from my PTSD. And I think that about like anxiety, to like, you know, there are obviously people who have it to the degree where they can't get away from it. But then everybody else sort of like jumps on the bandwagon. I'll tell you what I'm hearing a lot lately that absolutely, like boggles my mind to some level, adults who appear to be living 100% Fine, who are all of a sudden comfortable saying, I think I have a little bit of autism. Have you heard people say that? No, I haven't. Like God, I'm fascinated by like, I think, I think I might be autistic. I'm like, well, your blood is that mean, you're 45 you own a home, you got three kids, you go to work every day, you don't have trouble doing any of the things you're, you know, that you know, relating to people or anything. And like, I get the idea of like, I see that people will say, Well, there's a spectrum and I'm, I'm certain that's true. But my point is, is that there's a spectrum and you're all the way on the one side of it, where you have a character or a character trait that that can relate back to a thing doesn't mean you have the thing. That's

Jessica 1:18:41
the issue with like, it's a spectrum. The problem with the spectrum is you can put any spectrum in front of you and you could pick out a couple of things that you sometimes display, right?

Scott Benner 1:18:52
Yeah. Yeah. Like, like if Yeah, yeah, like if you're completely calm person who? I don't know, just goes off the handle. If one specific thing happens, I don't know that you have an anger issue. I think this thing makes you angry. And I don't know, I've just I've just seen people lately, say like, oh, like, I rub my leg when I'm nervous. Like, is that autism? Like? Is it autism? Like, like, why? Okay, like, Hey, Jessica, what I'm saying is, I think I've been dancing around it for like an hour now. I feel like everybody wants to have something.

Jessica 1:19:28
I feel like everybody wants to identify with a group of people,

Scott Benner 1:19:32
right? Oh, that's what I meant. But yes, yeah. Like everybody's trying to like pick a team. They're like, Oh, I'm Team autism. I'm Team anxiety. I'm team like, I have a thing to like I belong. And that's some, you know, as an older person, that's strange to me.

Jessica 1:19:48
I'm like, caught in the middle of it. It's like I sort of get it but I wonder. Like, General, things in life tend to be like, You swing back and forth. It's between things like, one extreme reaction. And then there's another extreme reaction that kind of goes back and forth like that politics is a really good example. Especially in the US. Like, it's like, everybody like Republican in the whatever branch. So I wish there was like a middle ground that we'd settle on, but there isn't, are just going to swing from one extreme to the other. It

Scott Benner 1:20:24
just it makes, it just makes me wonder if like, like, are you really any happier than your father? was? Was he really any happier than his mother was? Like, you know, like, or is this all just, like variations on a theme? And the theme is that everything's not always perfect. When you involve other people in your life, they have things you don't have, you're not always going to, like mesh together perfectly. We have this idea that we're going to, which I don't think is true, and you know, are we all reaching for something? It's not attainable? And Couldn't we just like, let it go and be happier? If we were just like, so not worried about everything fitting correctly? Or being 100%? Right, or whatever? I don't know. I just these are my thoughts today. You're getting them Pretty Unfiltered. Jessica. That's it.

Jessica 1:21:13
That's fair. That's okay. Yeah, I don't know I struggle with trying to place my opinion on things like that. It can it just can depend on the day, honestly, or who I talked to last? about it. Like if someone has more of an issue with a particular issue, like anxiety, I tend to feel a little bit more sympathetic, I guess, of course, but I understand what you're saying. We're like, at what point is it actually an issue and

Scott Benner 1:21:44
you just get up and go to work? And yeah, take care of yourself and love the people around you and do your best. And that's it. Like, why are we judging ourselves constantly.

Jessica 1:21:53
My only drawback is that I don't know what it's like to experience that. So it's hard for me to say, what is right or wrong about it? Because I, you know, I have a pretty laid back attitudes. So I just get up and go and do the thing. I don't struggle with it. Yeah, see that much.

Scott Benner 1:22:11
That's a newer, a newer concern, like social concern. Yeah. Like for other people, like, well, I don't want anybody else to feel XYZ because I'm, blah, blah, blah. And like, I'm gonna tell you that I grew up through a time where that was not the no one give a shit about other people. Like they and not that they didn't care about you. They cared planning and people were lovely. But nobody, I didn't work with anybody who thought, well, I won't be me so that you're not uncomfortable. Like that. That never was a problem. Like people just live their lives and everybody just dealt with it. You know? I don't know. Like, I don't know, it just feels like we're trying to fit something that doesn't fit. I don't know what it is yet. I haven't been able. That's

Jessica 1:22:51
life. No. Like, we don't live lives that our bodies are probably made to live in. And as a result, we get like, anxiety because, you know, yes, things that don't really matter. Because we're we're supposed to be just in constant worry all the time about not getting eaten. Or finding food.

Scott Benner 1:23:12
Yeah, yeah, we've definitely changed the landscape of what it means to be human. And our our bodies and our brains haven't caught up to it yet. That's

Jessica 1:23:20
for sure. No, and they never will.

Scott Benner 1:23:22
I don't know. I won't be I don't think it really engineers.

Jessica 1:23:26
I don't think we'll be around that long. Jessica. Why? I mean, how many how many species live for millions of years? We're

Scott Benner 1:23:35
gonna do it. Jessica. Don't you worry.

Jessica 1:23:37
I don't know. I'm

Scott Benner 1:23:38
gonna be fine. It's gonna be nose. Well, not if you don't make a baby. We got

Jessica 1:23:44
more out there. It'll be fine. We need more like you though, don't

Scott Benner 1:23:48
you think? Well,

Jessica 1:23:49
probably just a really egotistical thing to say.

Scott Benner 1:23:54
Just because like what the world needs is my spawn, but I will not be giving it. Yeah, it's fine, by the way, right? Sounds good to me. Yeah. Does that make it harder to date? Because your gift to find a guy who doesn't want a kid?

Jessica 1:24:06
A little bit? Yeah. Like the one guy went on two dates with is going okay. I did put on my profile specifically, like, I don't want to start a family. Like, you don't have kids and you want them. I in it. Like it's that's not I'm not for you, right. But I ended up going on a couple dates with somebody and he said, like, oh, yeah, I want kids. I'm like, Oh, you didn't read my profile? And I guess we're done. Trust

Scott Benner 1:24:30
me. You wouldn't be surprised how many people sign up to be on this podcast. And don't read the little tiny paragraph that explains to you how to do it and what you'll need when you get here. And I'm like, did you not read that? Like, I didn't see that? No, like, yeah,

Jessica 1:24:40
that's the thing. It's like, I don't know if anybody's reading this. And I'm putting on the profile. I don't know. You know, it's just,

Scott Benner 1:24:49
I bet you they're not.

Jessica 1:24:50
I bet you're probably not.

Scott Benner 1:24:52
There's just something about your bone structure and your hair color and your skin color. And a guy's like, oh, I find that. Uh huh. Yeah. Yep, that's it. That girl. That's yeah, legit. Yeah. And you're over there thinking like maybe I could build a life with him and he's like, I wonder

Jessica 1:25:12
if I could just hit that. Can I just exactly, you know? Yeah, so that's fun.

Scott Benner 1:25:18
Hold on You broke up. But did you say that's fun?

Jessica 1:25:20
tend to be you know, I filter out like, you know if he looks like a boy No, I'm not gonna

Scott Benner 1:25:28
wait if he looks like a if he looks like a what? You know, say that again? If he looks like a what?

Jessica 1:25:35
Like a boy like some of you just, you know, like, like he's taking Oh god, I got one. He said he was a doctor. But he only had like five pictures, but they were all from the chin down. Like, oh section. No Face pics, like nothing. I was like, that's creepy. Okay,

Scott Benner 1:25:54
was it an attractive midsection?

Jessica 1:25:56
Yes, it was. Oh, so

Scott Benner 1:25:57
he's trying to get you with his abs?

Jessica 1:25:59
I guess right. I don't know.

Scott Benner 1:26:01
Did he show you like down past the hips? No,

Jessica 1:26:05
it was like hip to hip to neck.

Scott Benner 1:26:08
Well then, so let me ask you something then then cuz we talked about the boys who probably just were like, oh, like she's pretty. I'll do that. Like, did you look at him and go, maybe I don't care. This face looks like for

Jessica 1:26:19
a hot second. And then I was like, I don't want to waste my time with like that. This could be a catfish or something. I don't know.

Scott Benner 1:26:25
Yeah, Dr. Abs. Dr. ABS

Jessica 1:26:29
Dr. Abs. Yeah.

Scott Benner 1:26:32
He was also kind of far away. Which Oh, distance.

Jessica 1:26:35
I'm lazy. I don't I don't really want to move. And I don't really want to drive a lot.

Scott Benner 1:26:42
I got a radius. Yeah, I don't leave this radius. No. That's funny. Oh, my gosh. All right. Jessica. Is there anything we haven't talked about that you think we should have?

Jessica 1:26:51
I don't think so. Maybe the d&d again, but I know we did. Dragon. It's done and over.

Scott Benner 1:26:58
Yeah. Yeah. Well, I mean, being a d&d player, like, you'd probably don't see a lot of ABS, right.

Jessica 1:27:04
Probably no. Well, a lot of the people I played with are women. There's only one man and he's got two ladies. So yeah, you know, yes. A little busy. But yeah, we just play, just play with women. We had a guy that was in our group, but he left and I don't think he's ever coming back.

Scott Benner 1:27:20
Have You Ever Have you ever thought about going and playing for the other team? I know, that's a weird thing to say that people would only say to girls and not the men but no,

Jessica 1:27:28
yeah. No, I did. No. Okay.

Scott Benner 1:27:31
It's fine with me. Yeah, I was just wondering, I catch

Jessica 1:27:34
a lot of from the two people who like are definitely bi or lesbian, but I'm like,

Scott Benner 1:27:40
No, for not giving it a world.

Jessica 1:27:43
I guess. Yeah. Local casino you, you know, gripe a little bit like man or girl sometimes or whatever. And they're like, it really sounds like you don't like men like, Oh, no. There's always something about the thing you like that you don't like?

Scott Benner 1:27:58
There's parts of it. I really likes to just calm down, basically.

Jessica 1:28:01
Well, you know, it's, yeah,

Scott Benner 1:28:04
well, listen, I'm gonna say this. You will probably save a lot of heartache. Not expecting boys not to be boys. Like, you should probably just expect that they're gonna I mean, be themselves to an extent. Yeah, right. I mean, there's a level of it that you could go like, that's too much for me. But I'm sure yeah, I just don't like I honestly don't think that I was really mature until I was like, in my mid 40s. Probably.

Jessica 1:28:32
And here I am thinking like, oh, people in their 30s Like, yeah, so mature. Wow. I mean, everybody's been nice. I haven't had like a bad experience with

Scott Benner 1:28:42
no, I'm a fine person at all. I just like my actual maturity level. Like and I pretty responsible person. I raise kids like I you know, diabetes, like, you know, pay for things like stuff like that, you know, get up go to work, like all that stuff. Like, I'm very faithful like that. All that stuff. But like, yeah, like still my my silly reactions to things still happen.

Jessica 1:29:02
Like, I mean, that's fine. Right? You gotta have a little humor.

Scott Benner 1:29:06
I don't know. I walk into the room and I go, Kelly, Kelly. And she's like, what? I'm like, nothing. I'm just sounding a Kelly alarm. It's just like, your 50 I'm like, Yeah, I know. But Kelly, just like shopping. I can't stop myself. I don't even like her. Yeah,

Jessica 1:29:24
I mean, that kind of stuff. Like, as much as I hate to say it. Your poor wife, but like, you know, you got to keep that kind of stuff up a little bit.

Scott Benner 1:29:32
I came in the room very exuberant the other day, and I said, Oh my God, how have we never tried the nicknamed Kelly bean? And she goes, No. And I'm like, you don't like it like jelly bean? And she goes, Yeah, I get it. And I was like, Okay, I was like, well then let it go. And she goes, Yeah, I will. I was like, Alright, so then a couple days later, I'm like, Hey, I

Speaker 3 1:29:51
just want to revisit this again. And she goes, What am I Kelly been thoughts and she goes hasn't changed and I was like, okay, and that was it. But I don't know where the I held that thought comes from, or why I said it out loud or why I revisited it because I literally just thought it was funny two days later to say it again. And she clearly is not amused by it.

Jessica 1:30:11
I don't care for it. Honestly.

Scott Benner 1:30:13
Can I be honest with you after I've gone over it a couple of times? It's off my list too. I don't like it either. Good.

Jessica 1:30:19
Yay. No, I'm glad I'm happy for her. That you finally decided it's not a good idea.

Scott Benner 1:30:25
I'm just trying to point out that I'm still an idiot. And I'm 51 and I'm reasonable about many things. And probably,

Jessica 1:30:31
I mean, I wouldn't say that being an idiot. A little bit. I think I'm gonna know but you're not like, I don't know.

Scott Benner 1:30:41
Well, what are you guys doing? That is so reprehensible. Oh,

Jessica 1:30:44
I haven't spent a ton of time yet around them. But like, I don't know, like drinking a lot things like I like I said, it's Wisconsin. Like I get it. It's a thing. Yeah, you're, like doing stupid stuff with their friend like really stupid stuff with their friends and you know,

Scott Benner 1:30:59
cutting holes in ice and going fishing. Yeah, maybe I don't get it making their tires too big on their truck.

Jessica 1:31:06
Yeah, that's a no go for me. Yeah,

Scott Benner 1:31:09
I see. Maybe you need to move. I

Jessica 1:31:11
probably should move. Yeah,

Scott Benner 1:31:13
I don't do things. I don't understand. I don't understand. Like, you buy a car. Like that's the car like you're done. Yeah, like I could care less. Like, I like I like my car. But still like it came with what it came with. That's it. I'm done. No, I don't need a different wheel on it or something like that. Yeah,

Jessica 1:31:30
same. Interesting. Okay. Yeah, a lot of there's a lot of like, you know, just

Scott Benner 1:31:34
my, here's my, here's my, my out of left field hot take. You're gonna have two kids by the time you're 38.

Jessica 1:31:44
Oh, I doubt it.

Scott Benner 1:31:44
I know why you say that. Why? Because I think because you seem like a very. I don't know, I think there's a world where you could meet a person where you would have like a pretty big shift in your expectation for your life. You're possibly not flighty and you're not weird. Like you're not a party girl. Like you're not like, you're not shallow, like like not to say that you can't not have kids and be those things. I'm not saying that. I'm just saying that. Like if I had to bet and by the way, I could be completely wrong. This is literally an up or down. But like, I think it's possible you bump into somebody who you really jive with and it makes you rethink things.

Jessica 1:32:21
I could see that happening. I'm like, if I had met somebody that I liked a lot better when I was younger. Oh, you

Scott Benner 1:32:27
think this is an age? Sure.

Jessica 1:32:30
No, not an age thing. What will the children think kind of at this point? Yeah, a little bit.

Scott Benner 1:32:36
Now. Your stuff still works will be alright. It still works, but

Jessica 1:32:39
I don't know. Then I then I have to. I don't know child rearing doesn't sound super duper fun. Oh,

Scott Benner 1:32:46
no, it's terrible. Oh, did you think it was fun?

Jessica 1:32:48
Oh my god. No. And I don't want to do it when I'm like, 40 that? Yeah.

Scott Benner 1:32:54
That I take your point. I'm like, I miss my kids being here. But like, my god, like, I don't think I could like, I don't think I could hop through it again. Like it's no, it's a long, so. All right. Well, we'll see you. I'll try to keep the podcast going for like, I don't know, six or seven more years so we can find out. Yeah, sounds good. I'll let you know. I appreciate this. Hold on one second for me. Okay. Sure. First, I'd like to thank Jessica for the hard work she puts in for those dogs and for coming on the podcast and sharing her story. We also want to thank cozy Earth and remind you to use the offer code juice box at checkout to save 40% off of everything in your cart. And last but not least the contour next gen blood glucose meter contour next.com/juice box head over there. Now check out those Second Chance test strips get yourself a beat or you can buy them online. There's a Buy Now button. You can just check it out. Just use the website. Trust me. Oh, did I forget touched by type one? No, I did not touched by type one.org Find them on Facebook, find them on Instagram. Check out the good work they're doing on their website touched by type one.org. Thank you so much for listening. I'll be back soon with another episode of The Juicebox Podcast. Once there was a time when I just told people if you want a low and stable a one C just listen to the Juicebox Podcast. But as the years went on, and the podcast episodes grew, it became more and more difficult for people to listen to everyone. So I made the diabetes Pro Tip series. This series is with me and Jenny Smith. Jenny is a certified diabetes care and education specialist. She is also a registered and licensed dietitian and a type one herself for over 30 years and I of course am the father of a child who was diagnosed at age two in 2006. The Pro Tip series begins at episode 210 with an episode called newly diagnosed are starting over and from there all about MDI Pre-Bolus Sing insulin pumping, pumping and nudging variables exercise illness injury surgeries glucagon long term health bumping and nudging how to explain type one to your family. Postpartum honeymoon transitioning all about insulin Temp Basal. These are all different episodes setting your Basal insulin, fat and protein pregnancy, the glycemic index and load and so much more like female hormones and weight loss. Head now to juicebox podcast.com. Go up in the menu at the top and click on diabetes pro tip. Or if you're in the private Facebook group, there's a list of these episodes right in the feature tab. Find out how I helped keep my daughter's a one C between five two and six two for the last 10 years without diet restrictions. juicebox podcast.com Start listening today. It's absolutely free. Hey, I forgot this at the beginning I apologize. Nothing you hear on the Juicebox Podcast should be considered advice medical or otherwise, always consult a physician before making any changes to your health care plan or becoming bold with insulin.

#1061 Celiac Shock

Kathryn’s son has type 1 diabetes and celiac.

+ Click for EPISODE TRANSCRIPT

Scott Benner 0:00
Hello friends, and welcome to episode 1061 of the Juicebox Podcast

Welcome back everybody today on the podcast Catherine is 36 years while I just use more English than that, I start over Katherine is 36 years old, a school teacher she's married the mother of three, and her four year old son has type one diabetes and celiac disease. She actually just had a baby a few weeks before we made this. Her son was diagnosed pretty early on, and the story of how they found out about the celiac is crazy. What do you hear it? While you're listening? Please remember that nothing you hear on the Juicebox Podcast should be considered advice, medical or otherwise, always consult a physician before making any changes to your health care plan. Were becoming bold with insulin. Want to save 40% off of comfortable things like this beautiful sweatshirt I'm wearing right now go to cozy earth.com and use the offer code juicebox at checkout to save 40% off of this sweatshirt, actually off of your entire order. And you get a free year supply of vitamin D and five free travel packs when you get your first order of ag one at drink ag one.com/juice box

this episode of The Juicebox Podcast is sponsored by Omni pod makers of the Omni pod dash n the Omni pod five, learn more, get a test drive and get started today at Omni pod.com/juicebox. podcast is also sponsored today by us med us med.com/juice box or call 888-721-1514 Why would you go to that link or call that number? Well to get your free benefits check and to get started today, receiving your diabetes supplies the same way we do from us met.

Kathryn 2:13
I am Katherine and I am a mom to three. my eight year old daughter, my four year old son who is our tea Wendy and celiac. And then we have a seven week old son.

Scott Benner 2:27
You just had a baby. Yes. So I that's why

Kathryn 2:31
I'm not working right now. I'm a teacher, but I am home for the rest of the school year with the baby.

Scott Benner 2:34
Get back to work. Katherine, that's enough. Three weeks.

Kathryn 2:39
It's finals week next week at our school. So as like Why Why go back at this point for finals?

Scott Benner 2:44
Yeah, yeah, no, I understand. Okay, so eight for three weeks. Wow. Eight for three weeks. Which one's the type one?

Kathryn 2:52
The four year old? Boy right for your little boy? Yep. Okay.

Scott Benner 2:58
All right. And you're married?

Kathryn 2:59
Yes. Yeah, I should say that. I've been married for 10 years. Next month.

Scott Benner 3:04
You should say that. You want to leave him out?

Kathryn 3:08
No, he he's very important. And like I said a big part of this story, too. So married 10 years next month.

Scott Benner 3:13
Okay, great. So, just for context, how old are you? 36

Wow, look at you. Think about that. You did all the things now. I mean, threes. Three, you're done. Right? Three kids?

Kathryn 3:23
Yes. Yeah. 99.9%. Sure. Right. Probably done having sex not just having kids and has well husband's gonna go take care of business.

Scott Benner 3:32
Well, look at him doing the doing the best big boy thing to do. Hmm,

Kathryn 3:35
yeah. Hey, if I have to have three kids then, which I should say I'm very happy that we had three kids. But you know, it's a lot of work and pain so he can have a couple yet. couple moments of pain.

Scott Benner 3:48
I just heard your brain say I don't want my kids to hear this one day when I say if I have to have three. Your brain was like be nicer about that. But I take your point. So Geez, how long ago was your type one diagnosed?

Kathryn 4:03
He was diagnosed March 23 of 2020. So literally the onset of COVID School got shut down like a week before and it was what was supposed to be our spring break. Nobody obviously went anywhere. And he was 17 months old when he was diagnosed.

Scott Benner 4:24
Oh wow. That happened while you guys were like while we were all still thinking we should wipe our groceries off.

Kathryn 4:29
Oh yeah. We when we noticed something was up with him. He was like leaking through his diapers up to his armpits. It was it was beyond the point where we're like, oh, maybe he just needs a bigger diaper at night. It was like he took a bath and I we have no diabetes in our family like this was a complete shock and I have no idea why I knew warning signs of diabetes. I used to read like ridiculous medical novels when I was a teenager and that's probably something you know, stuck in me but we call this pediatric Shouldn't we're like, do we even come in? We don't know what the situation is anymore. And yeah, she had us come in and his blood sugar was and I heard this through the, through the wall. I heard her on the phone with the Children's Hospital. And I don't even didn't even know what a good blood sugar versus a bad blood sugar was. But I heard like 483 I was like, Okay, that sounds bad. If she's on the phone with the hospital before she even comes back in to talk to me.

Scott Benner 5:24
That's a horrible way to find out where your your head wasn't up against the door or something. Right?

Kathryn 5:29
Like, apparently it was just a really thin door in the pediatricians office.

Scott Benner 5:33
I just had this feeling like you up against the door just listening and listening. She's calling the hospital. She packed the bag up. We're leaving in a minute. This is right.

Kathryn 5:41
Yeah. And then she came back in and she's like, normally in this situation, we would send somebody in an ambulance and put you on put him my son on, you know, an IV, but she's like, I don't know what's in the ambulance. I don't know what's in the emergency room. We don't want to expose you to any more unnecessary germs. So she's like he's stable. How you caught it this early. No idea. He was not in DKA or anything. He just really high blood sugar and p and a whole lot. So I drove we're in the far northwest suburbs of Chicago. So I drove into the into the city and Oh,

Scott Benner 6:14
wow. And then yeah, Geez, how long were you in the hospital? Which they got you out of there quicker? To

Kathryn 6:20
two nights. So three days, two nights. Yeah, pre pre masks and everything. But they gave us two options for hospitals, one out of the city, and then the children's hospital in the city. And she said maybe not the one out of the city because they started accepting COVID patients and the, at the time, the children's hospital didn't have any known COVID patients. So

Scott Benner 6:41
that is right, right at the beginning. Oh, yeah,

Kathryn 6:44
right at the beginning. So we were lucky my husband was still allowed to come down. And at that point, we're like, okay, we hadn't seen the grandparents were like, We don't know if you're diseased or what's going on. But we're like, We need someone to watch the Our older daughter so grandparents were like, Okay, you're in our bubble now.

Scott Benner 7:01
Disease. I love that part of it. When you look back on that that moment, right where I took one of the best flights of my life because of COVID Because everyone panicked. Before people were really sick, which was, by the way, good. I guess they were going home. But I flew a Me and four other people flew from Georgia to New Jersey, in a jumbo jet was amazing. Like, like, laid across the all three seats and like, you know, the stewardess is willing to give you extra pretzels they'd like kind of flip them to you.

Kathryn 7:37
Probably 12 bags because it's an empty airplane. And we don't need

Scott Benner 7:42
them. We're not even have to clean the bathroom after this. They were just like, like, it was insane. Like a big like, I don't know, what is it yet? Hold? Three, three of the standard ones are like three on each side, just like 30 rows. We can do this six times, like 180 people, right? Something like that. Yeah. So there were five of us on there. And then it was really terrific. It was also frightening in like, first 30 minutes of a zombie movie kind of way to

Kathryn 8:08
show like it's the world coming to an end like this very,

Scott Benner 8:11
it was it was somehow oddly relaxing and off putting at the same time. I

Kathryn 8:16
definitely know co workers that just jumped a plane to Florida and taught the rest of the school year on a beach. So

Scott Benner 8:22
I know what to do. I'm getting out of here. Oh, and what my one of my daughter's teachers did that. They left and just every day she said she turned the camera on. He was he was this close to going outside and enjoying the weather just had to get through whatever thing they were pretending to teach them that. Yeah. Okay, so, three days, two nights did it feel right. And I was gonna ask you if it felt rushed, but how would you know? I

Kathryn 8:45
felt like I took a crash course like in medical school on diabetes and you know, what would have been a semester a year I don't know a lifetime at college. I just even my my head like I said, my husband came down. I spent the first night there alone with my son and my husband came downtown the next day. And we just felt like, overwhelmed. Like, can you say in a good way like overwhelmed, sad for you know what our son's going to live with for the rest of his life. But the staff at the hospital was so amazing, like, trying to educate us as much as possible, and trying to like meet us where we were in understanding things and whatnot like overwhelmed with support I guess so good support. So I guess felt rushed? Yes. In the sense that we're trying to learn hey, here's here's everything you need to know to keep your son alive and healthy and happy. Now go home and keep them alive. So yeah, overwhelmed there. But like I said, they we still work with the the Endo, his endocrinologist who's out of the hospital to and they've been nothing but amazing anytime we need anything or have questions, so overwhelmed in a good way.

Scott Benner 9:48
Now, what about technology and like, where did you start? Did you start with a meter and a syringe or?

Kathryn 9:57
Yes, so I'm here He was actually MDI until about two weeks before our son was born. This, like the one that we just had, oh, so we were doing injections until about, I mean, less than two months ago. And he went home with just a meter, but we got the Dexcom like two or three weeks after diagnosis, they just pushed it all through insurance. So we were Dexcom and MDI until under two months ago, and now he's on Omnipod. Five,

Scott Benner 10:28
who brings up the Dexcom to you, the hospital

Kathryn 10:31
did the nurse educator at the hospital did. That's good. That's excellent. Yeah, yeah. It that was definitely amazing. Because it felt like having a newborn again, going into his crib. I mean, he was still in a crib when he was diagnosed, and like poking him at two o'clock in the morning and be like, Can I squeeze enough blood out of your little finger. So having the Dexcom was fantastic.

Scott Benner 10:55
My daughter, Arden has been wearing an omni pod since she was four years old. And she is now 19. That is every day wearing an omni pod for the last 15 years. I think what we love most about the pod is that it doesn't have any tubing. But I don't know is that the thing you love most about it? You don't have to take it off to swim or bave you can leave it on for activity and exercise. It's small. I don't eat I mean, it's so easy to put on right to fill it and to put it on. It's just it takes us no time at all. Yeah, I guess it's hard to figure out what my favorite thing about Omni pod is. I guess I'll just say that my daughter loves it. It's easy, and it's worked for her. For so many years. It's just such a friend at all this Omni pod.com forward slash juice box. You can check your coverage there for your insurance. Or take a test drive right? Would you like a free trial of the Omni pod? You can do that there as well. And you can just get started on the pod.com forward slash juice box. Now you have a decision to make. Do you want the Omni pod dash, which is an insulin pump? Where you make all the decisions? Or do you want the Omni pod five now the Omni pod five is the first and only tubeless automated insulin delivery system to integrate with a Dexcom G six. And it's available for people with type one diabetes ages two years and older. It features smarter just technology, and it's going to help you to protect against highs and lows both day and night. That's an algorithm based system making decisions about insulin given it and taking it away. It's pretty damn cool. Omni pod.com forward slash juicebox links in the show notes links at juicebox podcast.com. When you use those links, you're supporting the production of the podcast and helping to keep it free and plentiful. Everybody who has diabetes has diabetes supplies, but not everybody gets them from us med the way we do us med.com forward slash juice box or call 888721151 for us med is the number one distributor for FreeStyle Libre systems nationwide. They are the number one specialty distributor for Omni pod dash, the number one fastest growing tandem distributor nationwide, and they always provide 90 days worth of supplies, and fast and free shipping. That's right us med carries everything from insulin pumps to diabetes testing supplies, right up to your latest CGM like the FreeStyle Libre two, n three and the Dexcom G six and seven. They even have Omni pod dash and Omni pod five, they have an A plus rating with the Better Business Bureau and you can reach them at 888-721-1514 or by going to my link us med.com forward slash juicebox. When you contact them, you get your free benefits check. And then if they take your insurance, you're often going and US med takes over 800 private insurers and Medicare nationwide. better service and better care is what US med wants to provide for you. Us med.com forward slash juicebox get your diabetes supplies the same way Arden does from us med links in the show notes links at juicebox podcast.com. To us Med and all the sponsors. When you use my links, you're supporting the show. I don't meet a ton of people whose kids were diagnosed earlier in life than Arden was. But yeah, you've got me by by a little you've got her by a little bit when he's 17 months old. Is that right? 17

Kathryn 14:32
months? Yes. His pediatrician said he won a a not so great award for her. She he's the youngest patient. She has referred to the hospital for diabetes diagnosis.

Scott Benner 14:45
Does she get something like a plaque?

Kathryn 14:48
I know right like terrible, terrible award to win. But yes, he was the youngest and I his pediatrician was great too. She called us in the hospital is like is everything you know are you getting what you feel like you need to How's he doing? So it's been it's been a great team. But yeah, he wasn't anybody and a big surprise.

Scott Benner 15:05
What did he way before diagnosis one of the way at diagnosis?

Kathryn 15:08
You know what I don't even know. stepdad I don't know how much he was. Looking back at pictures, though. You can see in his facial expression, things changed from the week leading up. I mean, he looked to me still like a chubby toddler. He, I mean, he was walking back way before 17 months and running around, but he was just lethargic. His face, looking back at the pictures was all flushed. He looked pudgy. He wasn't like, you know, super skinny. Like you hear a lot of a lot of kids.

Scott Benner 15:36
You figured it out quickly. Yes, yeah,

Kathryn 15:39
they were Everyone was surprised. Even at the hospital, we figured it out as quickly as we did. And maybe that was because of COVID. I was, I would have figured it out eventually. But I wasn't running to work. I was staring at my kids, you know, all day, every day. That's such

Scott Benner 15:52
a good point. I feel like that's why a lot of people are diagnosed around holidays, and vacations and things like that. Because they their life slows down and they don't have as much to do and then they somebody looks up and gets in bed one night and goes this the kid looks skinny to you. You know, like, it just sort of gives you a moment to reflect I think, oh, yeah, I actually believe that after hearing enough stories. You know, a lot of people would figure it out sooner if they weren't running around living, you know, doing all the things.

Kathryn 16:22
Exactly, exactly. So I guess we're fortunate that COVID happened and the fact that it made us slow down and take a look at what was happening. Yeah,

Scott Benner 16:30
well, he didn't go into decay. And that's a big deal because I can tell you Arden our didn't look like our didn't look like a runway model on a heroin bender. By the time we figured out she had type one because she had lost so much weight. And she was so speed spacey in her face and everything and can see your ribs like it was the terrible like scary, like, look back and you think, how did I like we knew she didn't feel well. But you never like we never, like you said like, I don't know anybody weird to say like, I don't know anybody in my family with type one, which is what people say. But we didn't know what that means. Like, my best friend had type one on when he was 18 or 19. But I mean, I didn't watch him get diagnosed, not like I was there when it happened or anything. So

Kathryn 17:13
no one tells you as a parent like, and by the way, look out for X, Y, and Z because that might indicate your kid has problems. You know, no one tells you what to look out for. Because why would you look for it? You know,

Scott Benner 17:25
I always think to look, can you imagine you had a baby, it's your first one. And you're still in that, like, it's gonna be great. Like, oh, and for those of you who are younger, it's gonna be great. Don't worry. But for everybody else, who knows what we're talking about. You imagine if you had a baby, and you were still in that it's gonna be great. Everything's exciting. And I just got married. We just bought a house like that vibe. And a doctor sat you down and said, Okay, we just need about six days. We're gonna go over it in two hour chunks. I'm going to explain everything that might possibly happen to that kid that will make them really sick and you have to bring him to the hospital. You just, you know, that's not first of all reasonable and second of all, I wouldn't be I wouldn't be healthy. You didn't nobody

Kathryn 18:07
would have kids anymore. You'd have one and be like, Okay, this is too scary. I'm done. Well,

Scott Benner 18:11
I mean, I don't know. Katherine, if the coming out of the vagina thing doesn't stop people. I don't know what else is gonna get them. Honestly. Seriously, think back to when you like my daughter's 19 right now or 19. Anytime you ask her about a baby, the only thing she says is, Hmm, seems like a bad idea the way it happens. Fair enough.

Kathryn 18:32
Yeah. The two of the first two came out the the normal way. The third this last one though. They got cut open. So I'm like, Okay, done. I don't need to be cut open anymore.

Scott Benner 18:41
We're just going to do just to make it just open up your abdomen. Don't worry. We do it all the time. We hardly lose any other moms. Like just what is happening. All this? And you're gonna be I don't understand. Like, I mean, as a person. I don't have one. You understand what I mean? But I've seen I've seen one close up, and it doesn't see them like, I just didn't seem like a good idea. You would think very surreal experience. Nature would like install, like a zip lock or something like that. The nice zipper with a look like some kind of lock on it. It seems poorly thought out to me as all I'm saying. ticular we're watching cow have a bit of calf. Yes, yes. Those long legs.

Kathryn 19:23
Uh huh. Who's there is a there's a farm in Indiana. We went on vacation last year in my now eight year old daughter was fascinated. You can watch cows have birth, like give birth live and she was like, eyes wide open staring just like we wait a second to come out. Now. It's like, I don't know if you should be seeing this at seven years old at the time. But hey, that's nature. Let

Scott Benner 19:46
her say she's going to adopt. So that'll be she's like I don't know. I just strongly feel I feel strongly about adoption for some reason. I just you know why if I put an engineer in charge of getting a baby calf out of a mother calf, and that's what They came up with, I'd be like, who hired this guy? That's what you came up with ridiculous. Get out of here. Anyway. Okay, so I guess I'd like to commiserate with you a little bit. Now you had to CGM. So fair enough. But what's it like taking care of a 17 month old with insulin? The

Kathryn 20:20
beginning is such a blur. Like I said, it felt like having a newborn baby. And in the fact that we were always awake and always tired, because we felt like we couldn't sleep and especially me, I took a lot of the I took a lot of the care upon myself. And I'll, I'll keep talking about like, I keep saying My husband's a big part of the story. I don't think at the time he was capable of taking care of our son he is now it was overwhelming. His blood sugar was mountains and valleys like high, low, high, low, high, low all the time, finding your podcast, which I didn't even find until last summer, when somebody on our town square saw my son's Dexcom and was like, Hey, I have type one, two, and then we got to talking. But it was up, down up down. I'm like, I felt like I was doing nothing right at the time. The CGM was a blessing. But eventually it got better. I mean, obviously it did. Because otherwise, why would we be doing multiple daily injections for? I guess he's had, what three years he's been diagnosed. So yeah, for almost three years, we did daily injections, but we figured it out. You

Scott Benner 21:21
figured it out, you were using syringes that were like had half units on it. Yes. And not even not even using the whole half

Kathryn 21:28
unit. Exactly. The endocrinologist would be like as close to a quarter of a unit as you can get it. But of course, nothing, no syringe goes that low. Just probably in the last couple of months, before we switched over to the Omni pad, we finally could use the pen and twist it up to one unit because his insulin needs were growing as he was. So it's like, oh, this is amazing. We don't have to stick a syringe into the pen needle and pull out this teeny tiny bit. His his long acting was still in a syringe, though, until we switched to the pump. Yeah,

Scott Benner 21:58
I taught myself how to inject drops of insulin. So So I took, I took some insulin, and I squirted it into a dish. And then I put food coloring in it so I could see it. And then I drew it back up in the syringe. And then I would sit and practice pushing on the plunger slightly to see a drop come out. I wasn't doing this obviously in art. And I was like visually looking at it. And I colored it so I could see it better. So once I taught taught myself how to press on it enough to get a drop out. Then I started doing that to Bolus her because she knew she didn't need anything you don't I mean, so that would

Kathryn 22:39
have been super helpful. If had I thought about it, that I can't even imagine how long that took to fit, you know, to be able to do that consistently enough to I just

Scott Benner 22:47
sat at a table over and over again, just practicing and practicing until I got it right. And then of course, once the needle goes in, you know the non insulin, the non fruit colored insulin goes in. Then as soon as that happens and you do it you think well I did it the way I did it before that's probably right. And then you realize I don't know. I don't know if it went in I don't know if enough. When does everyone have that panic? Where you you're so bad at injections in the beginning that you put it in you push it and then you go Did I push it while it was in the skin? Or did I not? And then there's that horror that falls over you're like well, I guess we just have to wait now and see if what happens because I don't know what I did. And there's like a little moisture on the skin. It's just the whole thing is a panic.

Kathryn 23:32
good handful of times our son especially at the beginning would you know jump or try and run away and it's like did he get enough in or did he run away before it all came out of the syringe? Yep. Oh, totally. Totally remember that feeling? They're

Scott Benner 23:45
running away and the syringes in them and you're like

Kathryn 23:50
the nice part now is he it's so normal to him. Even if he goes to the doctor you know for for a shot. It's like it's a needle whatever. He's he doesn't even flinch anymore. Yeah. Which is amazing and sad all at the same time.

Scott Benner 24:05
I think there was a moment in that time where my wife looked at me and she's like she was kidding but she goes Do you want to get married? Well have us in kids she's like thanks a lot Yeah, no problem sorry. Apologize for that. Oh my fault. Anyway, so what are your goals? Like I You said you were like bouncing up and down up in hindsight, why was that happening? Um,

Kathryn 24:35
overwhelmed overwhelmed with his care overwhelmed he is celiac also so after when he got admitted they you know, ran all the tests and then we get this phone call that oh my gosh, he needs to have an endoscopy and you know, get them diagnosed for that. And for whatever reason I feel like that diagnosis hit me harder. I remember I don't cry a whole lot but crying in the basement, to my husband and the kids were down airs after we got the official call that he was diagnosed celiac, but the the blood sugar, the peaks and valleys are overwhelmed. And then my husband ended up in the hospital, like five times starting in September of 2020. I found out he and I did not know this, my husband, I guess, is an alcoholic or a recovering alcoholic at this point. And that probably would not have been figured out had our son not been diagnosed. Diabetic and celiac. Well, my husband would probably be dead if, which is we're very sad to say out loud, he'd probably not be with us anymore if our son hadn't been diagnosed. Okay,

Scott Benner 25:38
so let me finish up the one thing before we move on. Yeah, no problem. Way to drop like a like just the bomb in the middle of the conversation. Yeah, thank you. By the way, Kevin, thank you. Someone said something on a recording recently, that was so shocking. And told the told that part of their story. And afterwards I just said, I really appreciate you sharing that I was like, I'm like, it's horrible. But boy, people are gonna love listening to that, just like this is not on that same level. And I don't want to ruin it for people because it'll come out before yours. But anyway, they found out can I just tell you, they found out that her father was bipolar? By figuring out that he was going to dungeons to be dominated by a dominatrix. And well, he's a pastor. It was the like, as she was saying it I just all I could think was Thank you. Thank you so much. I really do appreciate you sharing.

Kathryn 26:36
I'm very much anticipating that episode. As the my I haven't

Scott Benner 26:39
even edited it yet. I want to wrap my brain around the fresh eyes. So but overwhelmed. That's why the blood sugar's go up and down. But like management wise, what were you not doing or doing that was making it happen? I'm

Kathryn 26:53
probably overcompensating on both ends, like giving insulin and then giving carbs to, you know, when he was low, bring it back up. I feel like everybody's told 15 carbs at the at the beginning. Like if he's low, give him 15 carbs. And looking back on it. Now, that was way more than he needed to bring him back up at certain, you know, when he was hitting low at certain, certain levels, like if he's only sitting at 70, he didn't need 15 carbs to put him back into, you know, around 90. So I'm sure that contributed to it and then not being good at pulling insulin into that little syringe. Had I've been able to give him one or two drops, it's probably all he needed versus the half a unit or eyeball, what a quarter unit would be, was probably too much insulin that he was being given to drop him back down. You're

Scott Benner 27:41
just always chasing the blood sugar. You're flying up. You're hitting it with insulin, it crashes down, you hit it with too much. You're just rollercoaster and all over the place. Exactly. Okay. Exactly. Did his size when he grew? Did that make it easier?

Kathryn 27:56
Yeah, it did. And I think experience, you know, every day I learned a little bit more. But yeah, as he got bigger, he needed more insulin. So it helped with the peaks and you know, the peaks and valleys and helped not eliminate them. They still happen. He's fighting a fever right now. So we're back to it. It made them better. It made less of them. We got a little bit more of the the nice rolling hills. Yeah, I his Basal insulin at the beginning, his long acting was so minut that it was he probably only needed one or two drop. So as he got bigger and needed more it. Yeah, it helped.

Scott Benner 28:37
I tell people all the time, and they're like, we're struggling with this, we're struggling that I'm like, the great thing here is they're gonna grow, like keep eating, keep growing. It's the best thing to make this feel easier. At some point. It's just the ability to put in a measured amount of insulin that you can count on doing a thing and not being too much or too little. And it's a big part of it. Okay, so you've, you've got me interested now, how does your son's diabetes diagnosis help you to learn that your husband is an alcoholic? So

Kathryn 29:09
call me naive, like, I mean, we should drink drink. I don't even know the proper word anymore. Socially.

Scott Benner 29:17
I see your red hair. I know what's happening. Don't worry. Yeah.

Kathryn 29:19
My Type One is a fiery redhead, too. Yeah, I grew up in a household that we didn't like my parents didn't drink a glass of wine, maybe for a special occasion. I didn't grow up around drinking at all, as I you know, went to college, studied abroad, you know, grew up had my own my own place, you know, drink a little bit more, but I've never been a big super heavy drinker. Definitely drink socially, way back at the beginning of our relationship when we were dating, like I remember my husband drinking straight out of a bottle and I was like, Ooh, that rubs me the wrong way. And he stopped doing it. He still was you know, acting like a young 20 something year old. So I didn't know any I didn't know anybody. You that I knew of anyway, that was an alcoholic. I didn't know what, what to look for. I didn't know what signs there were of alcoholism. And looking back. I'm like, oh, yeah, X, Y and Z. Hindsight is always 2020. Right? But anyway, my husband hates doctors hates doctors never takes himself to the doctor. He is also wish in a chef. He's in the culinary industry. And so insurance like, yeah, right. So he never went to a doctor because he didn't have insurance. I mean, it was as far as when he went to go ask my parents, if he could marry me nice and old fashion. I said, What did you do today when I came home from work, and he's like, I went to the doctor, and I freaked out because I was like, something has to be wrong. If you went to the doctor, no, he was trying to lie that he went to my parents. But anyway, when our son got diagnosed diabetic and then the celiac diagnosis, the his gastro, highly recommended that our daughter older than him get screened for celiac, and that my husband and I got screened just to see if, you know, our daughter had it, not that she was showing any signs, if we possibly had it. And so I called the doctor and we did not have a primary care doctor for my husband and I at the time. So we were switching to a highly rec, or we were going to we were going to start with a highly recommended doctor in the area. And because we hadn't been to the doctor, not only she wasn't going to just run the celiac, I guess the the blood panel right away. She wanted to do a physical for my husband and I wanted

Scott Benner 31:36
to get paid Catherine, I understand exactly

Kathryn 31:38
exactly. Which I was like, okay, not a bad idea when the last time I went to the doctor was when our son was born, and my husband never goes to the doctor. So I remember going in for the physical and of course, I made all the appointments, and we walked into the doctor's office and my husband realized we weren't at the lab to just pick out we were just going to draw blood. And he liked the look of panic on his face was like, he's like, You didn't tell me we were actually going to a doctor's appointment. He just thought we were gonna go get a blood draw. And I said, Well, we're gonna go do the blood draw. But we're gonna go see this doctor first. It's our first time seeing her she wants to do a physical and he visual look of panic on his face. Really. Which I again thought it was just, he doesn't like doctors. He hates going to doctors rarely does it. But looking back it was she's gonna figure out something that isn't, isn't right. The alcoholism.

Scott Benner 32:31
Wow. By the way, you're so nice. If I walked into a doctor's office and looked panicked. I know my wife would think and say out loud, I made a mistake marrying you. You really have to toughen up. Like, please, please pull yourself together. We're at the doctor's office. But that's what so he thought something in I don't go to doctors. I don't even know what they're gonna do. But he's betting in his mind that something's gonna happen. It's gonna sniff him out on this. Yeah,

Kathryn 32:59
exactly. I mean, of course, I'm not in his mind. But I'm sure that's what he was thinking in my head. Looking at him at the time, I was just oh, he's panicking. Because he doesn't ever go to the doctor. He hates doctors, they freak him out. Just Medicine freaks people out some, you know, but just, she had us to do. I mean, when we were in, in the doctor's office, he elevated blood pressure, which can be a sign of so many things. But she, when she ordered the blood test to screen for celiac, she did like, you know, whole general gamut of blood tests just again, first time at a primary care, she wanted to have a baseline. And she's also the primary care for my parents. So she knows that she knew what my parents are, you know, as in their older age. So for me, you know, screening to see, you know, whatever if I take after my parents, but when those tests came back, No, we weren't showing any signs of celiac, but she looked at my husband was like, there is something else going on here. And

Scott Benner 33:59
liver enzymes, where did they where did she figure it out?

Kathryn 34:02
You know what, I don't remember exactly that test. But she was recommending I remember she was recommending that he go. I don't remember he sees so many doctors now and has seen so many doctors since I don't remember exactly what came out of seeing the primary care. But shortly after seeing her, we ended up in the emergency room. Really.

Scott Benner 34:25
Were you together on that follow up visit the two of you were together. Yeah, yes. Okay.

Kathryn 34:32
And, again, I don't remember exactly what happened and she didn't send us to the emergency room but wanted to do follow ups with him or send him other places. He ended up in the emergency room mainly because of me and his parents and our parents. He was at the time curled up on our couch and couldn't stand up and we're like something is not right. This has been lasted a couple of days knowing that the doctor did saw something where like, we gotta we gotta go.

Scott Benner 35:02
He tried to quit cold turkey. Is that what happened to him? No, not at the

Kathryn 35:06
time his. What turns out after we found out once he did get admitted to the hospital, his liver and his kidneys were shutting down and how old was turns out? Let's see, he's I would have been just about three years ago. He was 38.

Scott Benner 35:20
Wow. Yeah, that's impressive. In a bad way. Yeah, okay. Definitely.

Kathryn 35:27
And, again, we would never, I don't think we ever would have ended up in the emergency room, when we did. Had the whole ball gotten rolling with our son's diagnosis, the celiac that, you know, don't get screened as adults. My husband would probably be dead because we wouldn't have gotten there that quick. Where are

Scott Benner 35:47
you? When a physician is in the room explaining this, and you start doing the math and you say, Oh, my God, he drinks like, does he drink way more than you thought he did? Was he drinking Private 100%? Okay, privately

Kathryn 36:01
100% If we had you know, friends over it was the summer at the time and you know, have a glass of wine or a seltzer outside. Most of the time, I didn't even see him drinking. He's like, I'll just have water. I'll have a you know, a Lacroix or something. I'm like, Okay, I, you know, I'm having one Seltzer and I drink more than I drink more than my husband, who, previously, you know, when we started dating, was drinking all the time. So, yes, it was mostly in private, he would be adding things to his drinks, not in front of me. And I didn't know. And once he got admitted to the hospital and was in for a stay, and we, I found out I mean, they called me in the morning, and we're like, hey, we had to move him to the you know, to a different floor because he's in withdrawal. And I'm like, What the heck does that even mean? I grew up so naive, it took me a while, but then going through cabinets. I was like, oh, empty liquor bottle, empty liquor bottle empty liquor bottle, as like, I didn't I didn't even know that it was happening. That's fascinating.

Scott Benner 36:59
Shocking, I imagine. So But where does your brain jump to? Do you jump to? I've been lied to? Or do you jump to he needs help.

Kathryn 37:10
Both like, there was so much hurt, anger, and please save my husband, because they told him 8% chance of getting out the hospital alive. Original, like there was talk when the first time I went in to see him. When he was going through withdrawal, talking to a doctor, he was in a procedure and talking to a doctor, she was talking like maybe transplant list if we're lucky enough to get one. And my head's going. I can't be a widow at what was I 33. At the time, like we have two kids, we have a diabetic that I'm overwhelmed. Like I'm teaching remotely, which is a different kind of overwhelmed. Thank you. COVID. But then also the anger, the hate, like how could you do this to me? How could you do this to yourself? How could you do this to your kids running through my head of how many times did you put me or the kids in danger? Like how many times were you drinking behind the wheel? I don't know. It was the biggest mix of emotions.

Scott Benner 38:06
Yeah, I can't I can't I can't imagine that. I can't imagine. So if this this part where he's in the hospital, and they're like, he might die. That's insane. But how did he tell you? I bet you telling your parents wasn't easy. No.

Kathryn 38:19
My mom, we're very fortunate that our parents, both sets are nearby and very, very supportive. And when I took my, my my husband to the hospital, he got admitted I came home to spend the night I was like, I have a I have a newly diagnosed diabetic. My parents at the time, hadn't learned how to fully take care of him. So I couldn't spend the night at the hospital. And so my mom was there in the morning, because she was going to watch the kids so I could go back to the hospital for my husband. And so she was there with me, actually, when I got the phone call that they moved him to a different floor because he was going through withdrawal. Yeah. And so she heard it right there with me. Wow. And I'm sure there there were disappointed in my husband, but they're super supportive. My parents are very religious too. So my mom saying prayers, all of her friends saying prayers. Did

Scott Benner 39:12
you go tell Moscow? Don't worry, my mom's praying, you're gonna be fine.

Kathryn 39:16
I don't think he would have even known he was so out of it. I mean, at him going through withdrawal like I was when I was there helping him pee in a cup because he couldn't get out of the bed like going through the convulsions, the shakes. The whole thing he went to he probably didn't even know what happened until after it happened. Wow, that, you know,

Scott Benner 39:34
how long did that go on for the withdrawal in the hospital. The first

Kathryn 39:38
hospital stay was almost a week, I think almost a week. And that was the beginning of September. And he had ended up four or five hospital stays between September and November because of retention, water retention. He had a lot of abdomen taps to release the fluid buildup

Scott Benner 39:59
because his kidneys weren't functioning well,

Kathryn 40:02
exactly. And they found when they were releasing the fluid out of his abdomen, paracentesis, I think is what it's called, they ended up finding a blood clot to his portal vein in his to his liver. So he wasn't also getting blood flow to his to his liver. While all this is happening,

Scott Benner 40:18
his body was like, we can't filter out any more alcohol, we gotta block it from coming in. That's

Kathryn 40:22
exactly and so well, finding the clot was great. Yeah, I mean, eventually getting rid of the clot and getting the blood flow going. He has cirrhosis of the liver, but he is if for anybody listening, he is alive and functioning. He's a medical miracle. Really?

Scott Benner 40:43
Is he on a transplant list now? Or no? No, no, no,

Kathryn 40:46
he has. He has a small amount of cirrhosis. But what is the liver and the kidneys? I think both can regenerate to a certain extent, in his functioning. I mean, because doctors he's on a what every six months. Now he sees them. He's a medical miracle. He's like everything that they do. He got his body responded the most idealistic way that could possibly happen. I mean, they told me his bilirubin level because of the liver and the kidneys was at a 20. And at a time they tell you it's a 50% chance of life. Yes. Did you ever was at a 20? Yeah.

Scott Benner 41:21
Did you ever consider leaving him?

Kathryn 41:24
II? I don't think really seriously. I mean, like I said, in, in all of the emotions going through me it was like, Well, I hope he doesn't die, because that would be terrible for everybody. Him, me, the kids, our families, but I definitely ran through my head, if he comes home, and lives through all of this, which he did, if he can't give up alcohol, if he relapses, maybe leaving him as an option. Thankfully, we haven't. We haven't had to deal with that. There were about three nights that I made him go sleep at his parents, because I was I was in the very angry stage. And I was like, I can't take care of you take care of me my mental and emotional state and take care of our kids. Like, I'm still learning this diabetes stuff. Like, I can't trust you to take care of our diabetic because I there was a lot of trust lost at the time. So there was never, we never hit the point where I was like, seriously, like, move out and you know, stay out. Like, like I said, he slept at his parents like two or three nights. But that's about it

Scott Benner 42:28
for me. I know, I would have a lot of trouble with the line, that that would really hit me hard. I'm almost impressed that he was able to get into this poor shape and hide it like that, like a ninja level move. How was he doing it? And did he ever tell you when he started drinking or why?

Kathryn 42:46
I think it in the story also changed over the course of those six months, like His truths got truthy or came out slowly. Slowly over time, the truth came out. And therapy has been a wonderful, wonderful thing. Like I saw therapist a couple times we went together, he still goes not that mean, he was going twice a week after he got out of outpatient. You know, outpatient therapy, like the therapist has helped a whole time with the truth coming out. But I don't know how much he was drinking in a day. But the number of minis that I found like, we always had an extensive alcohol collection, I guess you could say at our house. And a lot of it came from him working in restaurants. So we're a restaurant closing and it's like, Okay, I'm gonna just go take it home and throw it on the shelf. There was so much that I thought sat there, and we just never touched. We just had this abundance of stuff, cleaning out the house later on, that one's watered down, or that one's completely empty. And there's like the storage area in our basement where a lot was I just never go into that's my husband's area. You know, there's his sheet pans for cooking. And like, why would I go in there and it turned out tons of empties in there. But again, I didn't go in there. So why would I? Why would I know?

Scott Benner 43:59
Well, so far, the least shocking thing you've told me is that he's a chef. Because everybody I've ever spoken to who works in a restaurant just describes the battery. So Oh, yeah. Yeah.

Kathryn 44:13
Lots of lots of stories from in there. And I think lack of work when COVID hit, gave him more time. He wasn't in a restaurant at the time. He was teaching, culinary and working. He's got friends with food trucks and catering business, you know, he be working with this person and that person. And I think the lack of work he if he felt and later on voice, he felt a lack of purpose. And he tried to cover up or find a purpose, I guess, and increasing his drinking exponentially from what it was before then, I mean, I don't I don't blame COVID It was still his choices. But I think COVID and the lack of work definitely did not help anything I think had COVID not hit we probably still would have dealt with the alcoholism at some point in time. Like just or

Scott Benner 45:00
autoimmune on one of your sides of the family are both? Nobody else. Nobody else has celiac or a thyroid thing? Nothing.

Kathryn 45:08
No. So yeah, everything. Everything was a big shock. And now of course, the nervous part of me is eagerly anticipating, you know, we'll our brand new baby that we have now. Well, will he show any signs of anything? But now that's always going to be stuck in the back of my head. But yeah, there's nothing on either side. Alcoholism does run in the family. So I guess that shouldn't have been too much of a, I shouldn't say it shouldn't be too much of a shock. It still was a giant shock but ya know, autoimmune in the

Scott Benner 45:37
family, the alcoholism on his side, or both sides. His side. I wasn't sure if your parents found Jesus after they shook drinking or something like that could happen.

Kathryn 45:47
No, no, that's just Catholic military parents is what happened. So everything was very strict, regimented, and we follow the rules again, your

Scott Benner 45:55
red hair tells me almost everything I need to know about your background.

Kathryn 45:59
I'm not Irish, if that's what you're thinking.

Scott Benner 46:01
Trust me here. It's okay. I knew you were Catholic. I'm not a redheaded

Kathryn 46:05
Irish Catholic.

Scott Benner 46:07
Wow. She's that's a lot. So this is the overlapping with the diagnosis. Yes, he might die. He lied to me. He's an alcoholic. Is he gonna be okay, is this gonna get better? Are we gonna stay together? Is this I mean, when do you start thinking? I mean, you just said, I wonder if my little one might get type one. Do you think I wonder if my kids are gonna be lean towards alcoholism, too? Like it all hits you at once? Yeah. Yeah,

Kathryn 46:36
we have my husband. I have both said Now, in some ways, not that you can't drink alcohol when you're type one and celiac, but the celiac reduces your choices of what you can drink safely. So I have said to my husband, I said, I'm kind of glad that for the celiac and the fact that it reduces his choices when he's older, and our kids are still so young, that we'll have to talk as we get older about how we you know how we're going to talk about alcohol with them. How much do we tell them of their dad and what he went through as far as they understand right now? Because let's see, our daughter was only five

Scott Benner 47:16
because you don't want us all went down. Don't want them? Cursed? Right? Like it's gonna happen. Right? Right. Yeah, I see that and

Kathryn 47:22
trying to explain to them when it was all happening like daddy's in the hospital like he was in the hospital. Like I said four or five times for a week at a time between September November. He was in the hospital a lot. And if he wasn't in the hospital, he was at a doctor's office. They knew daddy had a tummy ache. His tummy wasn't working right and drinking daddy juice or mommy juice as they called it wasn't helping his tummy ache because we don't want I don't want to scare you know, scare them Daddy might not come home. Daddy has a big problem. Yeah,

Scott Benner 47:51
Mommy didn't choose well, and we're all on a storm. Now. How did that boy trick you? By the way? One of the when you got back? I know how I tricked my wife into marrying me. She should have not done that. But she really should have been smarter about it. But what did what did what? Well, who did you think? Like? I mean, you said like you just felt naive about drinking in general. Right? But like, did you just never think, oh, this could be more than I think it could get worse it could like I'm trying to think of I guess my question is Who did you think you were married to? That's my question.

Kathryn 48:28
A social I mean, a social drinker. As far as the drinking is concerned, like, I love my husband, he's, he's very much a people person and super charismatic people. People love him, he can engage you in conversation for hours on end. And I'm sure that's a trick of you know, he's been a bartender and all of his different aspects of the culinary world. And being a bartender, you're like, somebody's therapist at a bar. So he cracks everybody up. Everyone loves talking to him. It's really easy to be drawn to just his charismatic personality. And that's that's who I thought I was marrying, you know, at the time. Well, you had the alcoholism never didn't see it. Yeah, let's know. And at the, at the time, we got together. His dad, like I said, it runs in his family, his dad was sober. And that didn't even strike me at the time. Like I knew his dad was sober. And I was like, Oh, my husband could end up with it because it it you know, it does run in families. That my naivete naivety, I don't even know the right word to say it. I'm a math teacher, not an English teacher. I it didn't even faze me like that could be something I might deal with later on down the road. Has he

Scott Benner 49:39
figured out why like why he drinks is it just the the gene like the alcoholic gene, is it is he anxious and he's masking something like do you know what he was trying to save himself from with it?

Kathryn 49:49
I think the anxiety was a slow build over time. The the inconsistency in His work which He loved work, but the inconsistency of just that industry didn't help anything. I think there was always a part of him that worried that he would end up like his family. And I mean, his. Everybody in his family is alive and doing very, very, very well. But I think he knew that it could be it could be a hereditary thing, or it could, you know, run in his bloodline. But I think, yeah, the anxiety builds with the inconsistency of work, but also the work industry that he was in didn't help. Yeah, no, I understand. didn't help at all. If he was working in an office, he wouldn't have alcohol in front of him. Like, like, all day, but when you're working in a restaurant, or you're working as a bartender, Hey, you want a shot? I'll take a shot to you know,

Scott Benner 50:44
did you guys have a movie moment where you dumped all the bottles down the sink? We did.

Kathryn 50:48
I did that with his parents and his best friend on on his parents anniversary while he was in the hospital. Oh,

Scott Benner 50:55
wow. What a what a lovely remembrance of the of their union. Exactly.

Kathryn 50:58
Exactly. And yeah, there was there was a lot of uncovering of, you know, watered down bottles, empty stuff. But yeah, I didn't do it with him. I was like, I had that angry part of me. And I remember talking to him in the hospital. He's like, we don't have to get rid of everything. Like you can still drink. And I was like, No, it's all going like, no. Sigh It's all going. So I did it while he was not

Scott Benner 51:21
home. Yeah, this wasn't fun. We're not doing this twice. Wow. And oh, gosh. And then on top of this, this, this diagnosis did does he does your husband have clarity? Does he ever mentioned the the pressure he felt from the diagnosis of the type one? No.

Kathryn 51:38
I and looking back, I he obviously knew what was happening with our son like he now like he was in a fog from March till, you know, November when he finally came out of the hospital for the last time, but I think he was so about him at the time, you know? Yeah, this alcoholism is building and how can I hide it? That he wasn't he very easily let me take the reins on everything with our son. And for me at the time, it was well, he hates doctors anyway. So I take our son to the doctor's appointments, I make the phone calls. He was trying to help at the time as much as I think he was capable of at the time me not knowing what he was going through. But I took the reins of everything with our with our son. I don't think he he was he was too busy thinking about himself looking back on it then really worried and that sounds so bad to say out loud because he loves our kids and the kids love him. But I think he was too wrapped up.

Scott Benner 52:41
Listen, I've gotten the flu before I've gotten the flu before and for three days. I tell everybody just stay alive because I can't help you. And he's probably just in that situation. Hey, my last my last kind of question about this. Did you have any experience with any friends come to you privately and apologize to you for not telling you? No, that didn't happen.

Kathryn 53:03
i He like was a master at hiding. It's not like he was out drinking with his best friend. You know, if he went out with his friend, it was a beer. It was like nothing. It was all secretly in the privacy of our home. There was one time that my mom has said she saw like an empty mini in the recycling bin. And not my parents because they like the fact that they even have any alcohol in their fridge is usually because one of us five kids is you know, one of their kids is coming into town or something. So I remember her telling me she saw a mini in the fridge when he was coming to our in the recycling bin when my husband was coming to pick up our son because the grandparents are thankfully our babysitters when we're working. And that's the only like, the only person who said anything, but she told me when she saw it and that didn't really

Scott Benner 53:56
know I meant or anything. There was an apology tour at my house of God about my dad's cheating. Like so guys that were single and involved in the what was going like what these guys were doing. Like, you know, who knew my dad was cheating on my mom and they came to it was very, actually I found that unpleasant. They were unburdening themselves like they were. It wasn't helping my mom. They just they felt bad. And they were trying to get trying to get rid of that burden. I didn't know if that happened. If you had any by people like I'm so sorry, but it sounds like he was very private about it. Is he? Oh, yeah. Was he embarrassed at the time? Has he told you like when he was drinking? Was he? Like he's he hide? Why? Like, Why do you hide it? Like, that's my question. You're hiding it because you don't. Because you're why you don't. I mean,

Kathryn 54:50
I think he was embarrassed that he was drinking so much and he didn't want it to seem like he had a problem. He didn't want anyone to know we had a problem and yeah, I mean, I guess I I get that to a certain extent, why would you want people to know if you have a problem? And that kind of problem is not one where most people say, Hey, I have a problem, please go get me help, you know, thankfully, the help he's gotten has definitely helped him a whole heck of a time.

Scott Benner 55:13
Cool. That's amazing. I'm trying to put myself in his position, like, how do I approach you? And say, this is what's happening to me. I don't know, though. It seems difficult to me. Like it's one of those things like a therapist would tell you, like, reach out to friends and Bob. Oh, my God always sounds good. When people say it, I'm like, how do you? How am I supposed to do that? Like, how am I supposed to walk up to the person who I, you know, is trying to trust me for my whole life? And I'm just like, hey, I need to tell you something. I'm having like a significant issue here. Yeah. So I

Kathryn 55:42
think it was really on his literally on his deathbed. He had to have that, like, come to Jesus moment. Like I need to do what I can to stay alive and then go get some help to, you know, combat this, this issue.

Scott Benner 55:56
That's good. It's good for him. It's amazing. Honestly. Yeah. Yeah. Good. It's got to be hard work.

Kathryn 56:01
It's yeah, it's always still hard work. And it took a long time to trust Him and trust Him to take care of our son and not like, give him way too much insulin or let him go too low for too. Like. Yeah, that was all

Scott Benner 56:14
you see. Even the chef Catherine. I mean, he was so good at hiding the other thing, maybe it's an international spy, you have no idea who it

Kathryn 56:19
could be. Maybe there'll be a movie made out of his life. You know, he was just really, you know, like a what is it Mr. And Mrs. Smith kind of moment. Just

Scott Benner 56:27
just comes in the house with a gun with a silencer on and he's like, listen, I did get the kids together. We're gonna have to find our way out. Exactly fell me. Oh, my gosh. Well, that's really something. Oh, you are? Hey, are you okay? Yeah, yeah. Are you sure?

Kathryn 56:44
I am. I'm, I'm as good as I can be as good as I have been in the last three years. Good

Scott Benner 56:51
for you. That's excellent. Is there a whole rebuilding? Like if I asked you to describe your personal relationship now versus I'm not asking you to, but if I was asking you to describe it now versus then is it a completely different relationship now? Yeah,

Kathryn 57:04
yeah. 100% win trust gets destroyed as bad as it did. It took a lot of rebuilding a lot of therapy, discussions, fights. Everything. I mean, and yeah, it's complete. It's completely different. Like, I feel like I'm married to the person that I thought I was married. And didn't get at the beginning. Yeah.

Scott Benner 57:27
Well, I also would assume that this probably feels exactly like being cheated on. Right. Yeah,

Kathryn 57:32
it's I mean, it is I guess, a type of cheating not with somebody else. But he was you know, not with a person. But with a bottle. You're

Scott Benner 57:39
doing a thing. It's unknown to the to your spouse, it would hurt them if they knew. You're hiding it. It seems very similar to me. Yeah. Wow. That's like, hey, this. I'm sorry. I know you have little kids. But Did Did he just drink or were there any drugs?

Kathryn 57:56
No, just drinking. Okay. No drugs unless there's more hidden secrets but I trust there's there's not more hidden secrets. So no, just drinking. Well, you

Scott Benner 58:04
have to trust if you don't trust you make yourself crazy. But yeah, is he what they call California sober? Or is he sober sober? Like, is there weed? is my question. No, yeah, is

Kathryn 58:14
sober, sober. He has found a lot of he genuinely likes the taste of alcohol, a lot of alcohols. And he has found some brands of anaise that he really likes that are that are hard liquor alternatives that are like, you know, zero proof. Yeah.

Scott Benner 58:31
That was my question. Like, how do you like because he still got the anxiety, right? It

Kathryn 58:36
is way better. Like he would have shakes that I thought was just his crippling anxiety probably alcohol induced. But he would have shakes when he would get really anxious before like if he like I said, we are in the burbs of Chicago if we drove closer to the city and he grew up way closer to the city like closer burbs than where we live now. So he's used to the traffic like he would, you would see him on the wheel shaking, and I just thought it was anxiety, but that has virtually all disappeared. Now that is now that he is sober. So he

Scott Benner 59:11
couldn't he was like, having withdrawals just on a drive somewhere. Because he isn't true. He was checking constantly. It sounds like, Wow, geez, that's something I don't know. I'm glad not to understand it. But it's terrible. You know, every time somebody tells me about it, hindsight,

Kathryn 59:30
like the number of times that this was part of my anger, like the number of times he put myself in our two kids at the time in danger is like, How could you even do that? But yeah, we've come up. Yeah, yeah.

Scott Benner 59:45
Well, that sounds good. Oh, wow. Hey, thanks for telling me about that. It's not it's not a pastor in a dungeon, but it's pretty good.

Kathryn 59:54
It's I mean, I never thought I would say I'm thankful that my kid has diabetes, but But had that diabetes diagnosis never happened, the ball would never have started rolling to what

Scott Benner 1:00:06
it would have been. It would have been COVID. And he would have probably, like, doubled down on what he was doing in that COVID time. Oh, yeah, I would have been bad and

Kathryn 1:00:15
he would not have I had he not gotten into the hospital in September when he did like that blood clot that he had, like, yeah, he would be dead, because

Scott Benner 1:00:26
they wouldn't have taped because if he came in just saying, like, look, I'm, I'm an alcoholic, like that probably would have got pushed real down on the list once they weren't admitting people in hospitals anymore, ya know that the timing really worked out for him. He's gonna get crazy. Because one day, one day when your four year old is a is a man. He's gonna tell him. Did he mean? Like, he's gonna He's gonna pull him aside and tell him like, I'm here because of you. And, you know, like, that whole thing? That's gonna be crazy. Yeah.

Kathryn 1:00:56
Wow, the whole everything happens for a reason, like whether you're religious or not, or however you want to believe it. Like, I guess the reason that my son had to get diagnosed was so my husband could live.

Scott Benner 1:01:07
It would have been nice if your kid just got like a nice, like, I don't know, simple virus that would have cleared up in a couple of weeks. So yeah,

Kathryn 1:01:12
like a broken bone or something would have

Scott Benner 1:01:14
been would have been terrific.

Kathryn 1:01:17
Exactly. I mean, he is super, super proud. He's the cutest four year old. He's super proud of all of his machines on his body. And he shows everyone he's like, look, I'm like the bionic man. But which is cute to see. Like, I'm glad he's not fazed by anything happening to him. But yeah, would have been nice if it was just a virus or a broken boat. Yeah, that

Scott Benner 1:01:34
would have been better. I take your point. I do. Take your greater point, though. Are we have we covered everything, I want to make sure we don't miss anything. And then I want to ask you a little more about how the diabetes is progressed for him. And no,

Kathryn 1:01:45
yeah, that I mean, we got that. That's in a nutshell how my how my, my son saved my husband's life.

Scott Benner 1:01:52
To go back to when you were 19 and find you and be like, Hey, tell me the story of the next 20 years of your life. Just

Kathryn 1:02:02
just how I thought it would all pan out. But well,

Scott Benner 1:02:06
I guess you're all here. That's good. You know, exactly.

Kathryn 1:02:09
Okay, we brought another kid into the world since then, too. So I guess we have to be doing pretty decent.

Scott Benner 1:02:14
Listen, I just assume your husband is very handsome after you told me you had a third kid. After all, that just must be such a handsome guy must make you dizzy. You're like, Alright, one more. Oh my god, I just I don't think my wife would drive in the car with me again. So I like pretty impressed. Actually.

Kathryn 1:02:36
A lot of things of, you know, getting in the car of like letting you in the house taking care of our diabetic son putting a needle in his body took a long time before I let him do say have you know? And you're not like I had another kid for a while with my husband? Like you can or can't do this. You know, I imagine

Scott Benner 1:02:53
and you you're not um, I don't know the way but you're not sure about it. Like, how come you don't seem like the kind of person who like walks out the door in the morning goes, Hey, don't get drunk drunky and leave like you're not pet you don't seem passive aggressive or, or, like giving me

Kathryn 1:03:08
I feel like when all of this happened, I I'm very much a people pleaser. And I feel like I became more frank with my husband and more direct in how I was feeling and what I needed and what I came to a point now where I'm like, I don't care if how I'm feeling or what I think or what I need you to do is what you want to hear or if it's going to make you feel good, or if it's going to make you feel bad. Like I gave up the people pleasing to a certain extent, you know, with especially my husband after all of this went down. I was like, I need to make sure that I'm okay. In order to make sure my kids are okay in order to make sure my my husband's okay, like, I don't care anymore. I mean, it sounds really bad. Like, I do care what I say to my husband, but I don't care if me sharing my feelings makes you feel good or feel bad. Like there were a lot of discussions, especially early on where what I said is not what my husband wanted to hurt, you know, here, but I'm definitely more frank with my husband now than I was three years ago. His

Scott Benner 1:04:09
emotional maturity is doubled, tripled, like exponential, exponentially.

Kathryn 1:04:13
It's it's continuing to grow. Definitely. And our conversations or discussions or disagreements are far more productive now and in attempting to resolve them than they were three years ago. Like, like I said, it's a he's a he's the person I thought I was going to. I thought I was married. He's that person now versus you know, three years ago?

Scott Benner 1:04:39
Yeah. And I'm sure he always was that person just with the alcoholic just, he didn't have any time or space to be that person. So okay, you mentioned a while ago, I'm sorry, this one this this a lot. I get the feeling sometimes like you're you're you and I are looking each other which I don't usually do but I'm like warm. I'm like oh my god. I was terrible. Turn up the air conditioning? Well, it's just it's a, I mean, it's a triumphant story really, when you when you see it through to the end, but when you're living, like through the, the retelling of it, it's like, wow, like, there's so many moments where, like, no one would have blamed you, if you would have just been like that said, Well, I'm not doing this with you.

Kathryn 1:05:21
There were definitely times in in all of that, to that. I felt like, Okay, this is the low point of my life. Like I honestly I did. I taught school and did work meetings from a my husband's hospital room, like the point where my principal goes, Hey, that's not like, we didn't have to be in our classrooms. I did go into my classroom a couple of times, just because I'm very thankful my parents were watching the kids. But when my principal finally goes, you're not in your house, or you're not in the school, like, where are you? And I'm like, I'm in a hospital room right now. Like I am. I missed one day of work and all of that, because I had to take our son to an appointment to see the nutritionist at the hospital downtown, and my husband was in the hospital, so he couldn't take him. But yeah, teaching teaching from a hospital room might kind of felt like it was my low point. I mean, I wasn't the one in the hospital bed, but will not

Scott Benner 1:06:13
be in the hospital room. But when you use the empties to show them how to add that was probably upset. You're like, if you have five vodka bottles, and you put four whiskey bottles together. That's nine. Let's count them together. Kids. It's sorry. This is all I have on my hand. By the way. Does anybody do glassblowing? Because we have a ton of this? Yeah. Wow, that must have been humbling for your husband to I mean, honestly, like to see you having to do this thing. Like to do your job from a hospital room? You don't even Yeah, he must have felt like a soul. Yeah, so yeah, yeah.

Kathryn 1:06:45
I mean, he's finally come to term to terms with everything enough, you know, looking back to where he can admit, oh, my gosh, I was an asshole. Yeah, that's

Scott Benner 1:06:53
terrible. I'm sorry for him. I addiction of any kind is it's terrible. I mean, there's part of me that's like, well, thank God, it wasn't gambling, and you didn't like, learn you were losing your home or something like that, you know, or something, but there's no good. There's just no good outcome here. It's it's a scourge, like for people and you know, of any kind of food and alcohol and drugs and gambling and sex and all the other things people get addicted to and ruins their lives.

Kathryn 1:07:23
And it's a lifelong battle. Like he might be sober right now, I guess we're going on going on three years come September, but it's still a lifelong battle. It's not like you can make alcohol disappear from your life, you know, visually, you know, unless you become a hermit. So how long

Scott Benner 1:07:39
after all this? Does he look at you and say, or do you look at him and say, I need you to understand the diabetes now? Like, did he say I want to learn or do you say it's time you learn? When

Kathryn 1:07:50
I the therapist, helped me realize I need to give up a little bit of control because I was I was going insane. I remember sitting and you know, crying on the therapy at the therapist. And as like, I just feel so overwhelmed between my son my daughter who's in Kindred, starting kindergarten on a computer, work my like everything going on, I just felt so overwhelmed. And she was, you know, trying to help me find what can I give up? Or what can I slowly allow my husband to pick up and even small things like our son's long acting, he took a small dose in the morning and a small at night and we would pull the morning syringe at night. And we had a certain location you know that we put it like, we started small with me finally allowing my husband to pull the syringe naughty that way I could double check it before I gave it to him. Yeah. But it took the therapist, you know, what control can I give up? To make me slightly you know, slightly less insane. So we started vaping I'm still insane. No, but

Scott Benner 1:08:55
my wife's like, it's making me sad. My wife because this is making me crazy. I'm like crazier. Stop it. But yeah, no, by the way, I wish I was your age and I would have met you a marriage because you are so forgiving. And I don't even know I like like, not the Kelly's sorry, that hold your feet to the fire thing that you do. Now. I've been dealing with that since I met my wife. And as I just like, it sounds, there was a moment I'll share something with you. Where you describe being a people pleaser. And I for a moment just didn't think of you as a person I thought of you as like, like a spouse. Right? And I thought, wow, he screwed that up. Like I had that real thought in my head like, like, like, like you mean she was like making excuses for you and telling you what you wanted to hear and being overtly kind when it didn't need to be and you like you. My only thought was like why would you ruin that? Like seriously like I know that's not I don't know if politically correct is not the right thing to say. But I just I've never I kill for a couple of years where people just nodded at me and went yes got that makes sense. Yeah, I would like one year where nobody argues with me. whether I'm right or wrong, do you see what I'm saying? Katherine like,

Kathryn 1:10:05
no. 100% 100% I mean, our relationship is a million times more healthy now that I'm not as much of a people pleaser. Yeah, no,

Scott Benner 1:10:15
I That's my point. It's not that that would have been good for you. Like I literally like I have to like dehumanize you for a second to have that thought. But I was like, wow, you screwed that up. Like, like, almost like you. I don't know. And, but then bring it back together again. That's so unfair to you. And you really have gained, you've gained something from this because you would have spent your whole life half head down being like, alright, I don't think that's right. But okay. And that's no way to live either. You know, no,

Kathryn 1:10:41
no, yeah, we're we're sounds crazy. We're we're all in our family better off. Now that my husband's, you know, gone through what he's gone through. And our son's going through what he gets to live with, you know, we're all better off.

Scott Benner 1:10:56
I have to agree. Yeah, I have to agree with that. Although I'm thinking just my birthday or one month, like you don't I mean, like, what if there was just a month where Scott was right. And then there could be a month where Kelly was right. Yeah, I mean, like, I would

Kathryn 1:11:06
start with a day of it's every yesterday, one yesterday, by the

Scott Benner 1:11:11
way, I don't think that's a bad idea. I'm writing down yesterday. I'm bringing this up at the next meeting. And then the meeting, where's the Father's Day? You can say you want to yesterday, the meeting, by the way is when we go over everything I do wrong. What's that bill burr joke? He says I've been married for a long time now. And all I'm really sure of is we're still working on me.

Kathryn 1:11:33
Always. It's always. It's always work. We're always

Scott Benner 1:11:37
working on me. She seems to be fine. And he says, anyway, Bill Burr stand up is great. Okay, so diabetes, every once in a while I should write down in front of myself. This is a diabetes podcast, just so I remember. You get a CGM. You've had it for a long time you do MDI for a very long time. But you said you just went to Omni pod five, is that right? Yes. Okay. And

Kathryn 1:11:59
he's actually still in, we see his Endo, next in like two weeks, next month, beginning of June. He's still in auto mode, they wanted him or not in auto mode, manual mode. They wanted us to get used to using one, like the dash, we initially looked at the dashboard, we're like, Well, might as well go to the five and so we're actually still in manual mode, which is still nice. He can be running past me to go you know, go play something it'd be like, Okay, I'm gonna give you insulin now. Like it's still so much easier than the daily injections. But yeah, we are, we are on a great time, like okay about to give birth, let's switch to let's switch to an insulin pump. Let's learn that, you know, and his he's in preschool now and his nurse at at his preschool is amazing. We email multiple times where she's not hesitant and at all to call me call my husband called grandma. We're like, okay, just double checking. This is right, like, and she was so open to learning the learning the pumps, she hadn't had a diabetic in two years. So she had to kind of like, relearn some things. But yeah, oh, everybody's been great with taking care of our son.

Scott Benner 1:13:02
Well, did you listen to the episodes about setting up on the pod five? Yeah,

Kathryn 1:13:06
and I'm really listening to him now that that we have them too. And I'm like, Okay, I finally feel like we have our basil dialed in. So when we switch to, when we switch to auto mode, I'm like, fingers crossed. It's

Scott Benner 1:13:19
beautiful life restraint. I would just be like, it's work. And I'll turn it on now.

Kathryn 1:13:23
Why not? You know, what are they when we first initially went through the training and set up our son settings based on what the endo recommended, the first time that I thought something needs to be tweaked. I emailed the team and they're like, yeah, do XYZ. I've totally tweaked things since then. So I'm gonna go back to the Endo. And you know, ask for forgiveness, not permission. But the yes, I've restrained myself from turning it into auto mode, but I stopped asking for permission to change other settings for you.

Scott Benner 1:13:52
Yeah, just get it get it super stable. Where that where that basil is doing its job, you're not seeing a lot of lows, you're not seeing weird rises for no reason. And make sure your insulin to carb ratio is really rock solid. I just I've had people say to make it a little more aggressive when you put it into like, just so the auto mode like is a little more aggressive. But I mean, young kid no hormones, probably not eating a ton of like, fatty greasy like that kind of stuff. Right? So you should I don't know. You should love it. And it should work really well for you. So the

Kathryn 1:14:26
first couple of nights that we saw that like pretty straight line overnight. I was like, Oh, they lujah like we finally hit that hit that correct? You know that

Scott Benner 1:14:34
crazy that? That's just from getting your Basal right in the pump. It's so

Kathryn 1:14:38
awesome. I'm like, I'm not fighting a low I'm not fighting a high like finally I feel like the basil is right. And then now he got sick. So I'm like, oh, hit the fan. And I don't know if I can swear on here, but

Scott Benner 1:14:50
we already have a couple times. It's fine. Don't worry about it. You said so once I said this whole. Like, don't worry, it'll be okay. I mean, you're not cursing that I don't understand people who, like you should be walking around just like sons of bitches every month. Chris trying to kill me.

Kathryn 1:15:09
So I would not that bad, but it is bad when our our four year old is our little Spitfire and the redhead, and he'll be like, welcome to the show. Like, do you ever add that to your house? When

Scott Benner 1:15:20
things are crazy? Your husband does something that's just regular stuff like not like, but not like, hey, like, don't forget that thing you did with the alcohol thing or any like big stuff? Do you ever look at him? Like, you're? You still owe me Just shut up? Like do you ever do you have a look that says, Not yet, buddy, for you?

Kathryn 1:15:39
knows when he's tip toeing the line like, I mean, and we still do a lot of what some people perceive, I guess crazy stuff or I can't believe you just let him do that. Like, you know, my husband literally came in the other day and was like, I'm gonna go get another tattoo now. Is that okay? You got the kids Sure. Have fun like, whatever. That's not going to hurt anyone. But yes, there is. He knows when he hits that point. Have I went too far? Yeah, I'd

Scott Benner 1:16:04
be like, I'm still like, I'm still trying to get back to even here. I definitely can't do whatever I just did. I need to stop. Like I always I usually. I joke that every time I do something wrong, my wife takes a point away. But I don't seem to get a point when I do something good. He

Kathryn 1:16:19
seems pleased you've not zeroed out you still have points to give away? I

Scott Benner 1:16:23
honestly don't know if that's true or not. But hey, not about anything. But because you and I are looking at each other. And you're so honest. Do you see this discoloration in the top of my cheeks? It's from Sun from like, watching my kids play sports out in the sun. Do you think I shouldn't say can you see it though? A little bit? Yeah. Do you think I could get that taken out by like a, like a plastic surgeon or somebody? I'm just looking at myself and I'm like, I'd like that to be lighter.

Kathryn 1:16:50
See what I see your face. See if that does anything. You

Scott Benner 1:16:53
have ideas that I have this could happen. I

Kathryn 1:16:55
literally rubbed some. I mean, the ice will make your face read first. But and it's

Scott Benner 1:16:59
always like this though. Like it's this color. Like I always think I'm gonna get like, I mean, honestly, when I was younger, I'm like, I'm gonna get skin cancer from being out here watching so much baseball. But it just it discolored over time as I got older. You see already I have like dark. My eyes are dark. That's like normal. By the way. I don't appreciate that a lot. I don't know if that can be fixed. I don't know if they can bleed. You know, they bleach souls. I wonder if they can bleach your eyelids? You know what I'm talking about? Right? And then I

Kathryn 1:17:26
mean, you can ask I don't know if it's a

Scott Benner 1:17:28
thing where you ask about that.

Kathryn 1:17:30
Great question. A dermatologist. I don't know. That'd be a strange dermatologist. Maybe? I don't know.

Scott Benner 1:17:38
And then my eyes are too squinty. Just a little bit of surgery didn't I mean like, what would have little Botox to do you think it's both? I don't know.

Kathryn 1:17:47
I don't know. I don't I don't even do all of the the cosmetic fixes.

Scott Benner 1:17:53
If your life wasn't so screwed up. I would have spent this last hour looking at myself going why is this camera on? But I couldn't focus on that. I don't like how squinty My eyes are. I sound like a so I don't know what I sound like right now. But anyway, I would definitely get let me just be clear, people are listening. I would definitely get like the coloration if that can be lasered out of my cheeks. And I would do a little eyelift if somebody

Kathryn 1:18:19
I mean wanted to offer analogy and medicine can do anything these days, right? I'm just saying

Scott Benner 1:18:23
like if you have a if you want some free ads, if you lifted my eyes, I would definitely do it. I just don't want to look like the Hamilton guy, George Hamilton. I don't know what that is. You're so young. You wouldn't know I

Kathryn 1:18:39
am. I'm a baby. And I was I'm a sheltered baby too.

Scott Benner 1:18:43
Yeah, we we heard we heard Catherine Don't worry. Seriously, were you just like a, like a fawn in the woods when your husband scooped you up?

Kathryn 1:18:54
Pretty much. Yeah, I was a totally innocent, you know, high school math teacher. And I saw a cute guy in the in the in the foods room, the culinary room in our in our high school. They had the height the college he teaches that was using I was like, Oh, he's cute. And somehow we ended up together. So

Scott Benner 1:19:12
yeah, like fix that check. I bet you that won't happen to you again. You're probably just like, so like suspicious. Are you did it ruin you? Or did you hold on to like that feeling?

Kathryn 1:19:23
I'm not suspicious about everything anymore. I asked me a year ago if I was suspicious about my husband's every move. Yeah, yeah. But I hadn't like you know, forgiven and now you're

Scott Benner 1:19:35
either lying to me or you've done a remarkable job of moving forward.

Kathryn 1:19:39
I sometimes looking back I'm like, at what point did I just say, Okay, I can't hold this against you forever. I don't even know what when I hit that point. But I'm definitely not lying to you right now. There's definitely moments where I look back and I'm like, so pissed at you that this was our life. But at the same time, like I have a husband and I now have three kids like I can't I can't Hold the grudge forever. Otherwise, I'm not going to be happy.

Scott Benner 1:20:03
How about that? You're not Irish? I'll be damn. Okay. I'm

Kathryn 1:20:06
not. Yeah.

Scott Benner 1:20:09
For you. For the Irish listening right now, you are you people hold grudges like, like it's an Olympic sport. It's amazing. I'm sure not every one of you. But I mean, it's a skill. So and they definitely have and trust me there Irish people laughing right now who were still pissed about something that happened 35 years ago. Let it go. Do it. Do it. Catherine did just move like what do they say? Don't fight back fight forward? Is that the same? It makes sense. Yeah. Doing Good job. That makes sense. You're pretty aggressive. Catherine. Seriously? Thank you. Yeah, I would have to give it up like six times. Like that. I'm good. That's fine.

Kathryn 1:20:48
I mean, there were definitely times in the building to forgiveness part that I thought about all the things in my life, that would be harder if I didn't have a husband, like, it's simple and stupid is lawn maintenance, or he cooks really good food. And if I say, like, being pregnant and having food cravings, it's great. When you're married to a chef, like, please make me this dish, and it's on the table in 30 minutes. There are definitely really stupid, stupid, trivial things. I was like, my life would be harder or not as great if I had to give that up. So that helped me work to the forgiveness that I didn't have to lose the, you know, the good stuff.

Scott Benner 1:21:23
That's amazing. I cannot thank you enough for doing this. You were really terrific. Seriously, I wish. I wish we were friends. We're not going to be by the way. But I really thought that you would want to be you're probably like, I don't want to know you after this. But you're a very cool person.

Kathryn 1:21:39
So thank you. No,

Scott Benner 1:21:40
it was fun. Yeah, did.

Kathryn 1:21:42
It's different hearing you like through my computer versus my car. So yeah, cool.

Scott Benner 1:21:47
Do I sound the same? Yeah,

Kathryn 1:21:49
you sound exactly. Like you do on the I mean, I guess we're recording a podcast, but you're not exactly like you do on the podcast. Okay.

Scott Benner 1:21:57
I wasn't sure if like my voice changes, like, because I level it out. Like later on. I'll put this through a process that will make sure your your voice and my voice are on the same level. So one of us, okay, like we're screaming and stuff like that. There's a

Kathryn 1:22:11
weird part of me that feels like I'm talking to my car, because I only I only listen to podcasts, usually in the car, because that's when I was, like I said, I'm not working right now because of the baby. But when I was working, that was the only time I had to listen to it. So you sound like my car is talking to me right? Now. Imagine

Scott Benner 1:22:25
if I was really famous. Like it was like Jason Bateman. You're like, you're the guy from smartlace or something like that. Like that would be insane. Right?

Kathryn 1:22:31
I mean, you're pretty famous in the diabetes world. Like I said, I was on a town square last summer. And somebody was like, hey, that's this this podcast? Have you heard of this stock guy? And I'm like, that's cool.

Scott Benner 1:22:42
In certain settings. I am. I am incredibly famous. Like I spoke at something recently. And someone came up to me and said, Do you want me to run interference for you? Do you need to go to the bathroom? Or get a drink of water or something like that? And I was like, Hey, could you do that? Like, I have to have people walk me places. So it looks like we're doing something so that I can like, but then the minute I leave that room, you're surrounded, if I got hit by a car, no one would look up, like but in a diabetes space. It's, it's actually kind of astonishing. Like I have trouble walking from one side of a space to another. Like it's, it's, it's very, it's nice. Like, don't get me I really do enjoy it. Like I don't like I don't mean I enjoy it. Like, like it's good for my ego. I mean, like it's it's lovely to meet people. And they some some people just want to tell you successes they've had some people think that maybe you could help them with things they're struggling with. A lot of people just want to tell their story, a lot of questions. But it was nice. I did an event a couple of weekends ago. It's actually three days in a row was really interesting the way it was set up. Like I gave talks that were scheduled like onstage talks, but then I was also scheduled just to be on the floor and just in like mingle with people and have conversations I found that really, like valuable for me. You know what I mean? That's

Kathryn 1:24:02
cool. See how many how many people you and your podcast have? reached, influenced helped.

Scott Benner 1:24:09
It's really crazy. I honestly like still some days don't like it's hard to, like process all of it. You don't I mean,

Kathryn 1:24:17
I mean in as well, I should say thank you, because in a year since, I mean, it's not even been a year I guess since I started listening to the podcast. We were stuck a one C in the nines is last one was 5.8. Wow. So I mean, we've we've come a long way. So thank you.

Scott Benner 1:24:33
It's amazing. That makes me feel like I don't know how to explain the feeling. But I almost feel like I'm going to cry for a second when you say that. Like I'm just happy for you like in him like your son really? I mean, because he did not. He didn't feel as good at nine as he did it.

Kathryn 1:24:49
I'm sure he didn't. I mean, I don't even know what we were at diagnosis. I think like 14 or something. We've come a long way. I've learned a lot and I'm happy I'm comfortable. Like I said, asking the endocrinologist and his team which are wonderful. But I'm comfortable asking them for forgiveness instead of permission now, because I've learned a lot from listening to the podcast or reading other people's comments on the Facebook group and things like that.

Scott Benner 1:25:12
So you mentioned it's weird to hear my voice. And I, earlier you said that phrase earlier, and I thought, Oh, she's repeating something I said on the podcast. Like, the, it's better, it's better to ask for forgiveness and permission, like, um, like I said, that like, and maybe it's, maybe it's a vibe that like the podcast gives, I honestly think sometimes my job is just sort of like a coach, like the, like, pat you on the ass and be like, get out there, you can do it, you don't even have that you get run over a couple times, and I come back and I go, don't worry, get back out there, you're gonna be okay. You know, like, I think sometimes that's what this is for. So

Kathryn 1:25:48
and I think it helps people realize, like, we're with our kids or ourselves, if you're the tea, Wendy listening, like, you know, your kid, like, I know my son better than his endocrinologist does, unless you're living with your endocrinologist or, you know, the diabetes nurse educator, whoever, like, they're looking at his stats from, you know, the clarity reports from Dexcom. Like, I can tell them as much as I can, but I'm living with it every day. So if I feel like something needs tweaking, I feel like I have the ability or the right to do that. I mean,

Scott Benner 1:26:22
100% Don't Don't turn back into a people pleaser now. Your kids got diabetes. But it needs you to make

Kathryn 1:26:30
sure he's happy. And that's, that's the person I want to please make sure he's happy. Well, to an extent every once in a while when I hear I don't want the Dexcom on, we're going to put it on, I'm not going to make you I'm not going to please do that. Mommy has

Scott Benner 1:26:41
a small list folded up in her pocket of things that have happened to her. She didn't want to happen, but we're still all here. So let's, let's get it. I've said to Arden, like when she was younger. She'd be like, I don't want this and I go, that's fine. If you don't want that, then this is what we're gonna do. Do you want to just pick one? Tell me which one do you prefer? Do you want to go back to testing your blood sugar 15 times a day. It's alright with me. Like, you know, but I can make that work. I've done it before. And she'd be like, No, I just think it's path of least resistance and their kids like they're looking to. I mean, to be honest with you, I'd ask every day if I was looking at, like, I remember myself, I would have been like, Hey, how about today? We don't do this. And yeah, you know, you just have to keep re explaining until one day they don't ask anymore.

Kathryn 1:27:25
Exactly. Exactly. Our son gets really excited when he gets to have like device free bath time, because it happens to be changed night. We're like, hey, device, free bath time have fun. But yeah, we've definitely done the he doesn't like that tick, tick tick boom of the Omnipod. When it goes in. It's like the anticipation. It's like once it's on, it's fine. We might get one hour from him, but it's fine. But he'll ask Can I can I not have it on? And then it's Yeah. Do you want to go back to have like eight shots a day? Now? Okay, put it on? Yeah,

Scott Benner 1:27:55
I listen, I've said it before. I'll say it again. I don't know another world where we let four year olds make medical decisions, but and I get that it's their body. But they are going to get accustomed to it at some point. And it's a huge benefit for them. And you're going to be happy you did it. I think also, are you the kids a big spider verse fans, because you just quoted a song from the spider verse movie. Did

Kathryn 1:28:17
I if I did, I did it by accident. I mean, he watches like Spidey and His Amazing Friends on Disney Jr. But we're not up to the I don't know how close that is to

Scott Benner 1:28:24
Yeah, yeah. No, he hasn't seen it. It's by accident. Arden met Tom Holland once. Oh, that's cool. He was so excited. Like stupid acts. I have to get her to tell that story on

Kathryn 1:28:36
here. Like accidentally ran into him somewhere, like perfectly ran into him somewhere forced

Scott Benner 1:28:40
us to take her to a thing where she could stand in a line and get her picture taken. And she was younger. But she had all worked up about what she wanted to say. I think she was trying to, like, marry him. You know what I mean? Like, I just feel like, it's like 16 And she's like, like, What can I say in this 30 seconds is definitely gonna get this guy to like, you know, ruin my life. Boy. Ever wonder mothers and so many other men to their wives. Instead, she just like, she got all flustered, like, just ran up to him. And she's like, I have diabetes. And like, she never she never tells anybody that like like, I've never heard anybody I've never heard I'd walk up to someone and introduce yourself as I have. She just blurted it out. And then like, like, you know, took the picture and then walked out the curtain in the back and she was just like, what? starstruck Why did I, what? Oh, my God, that her friends screaming they're like, ah, like I always thought about like, he's only on the other side of the curtain. And every five I mean, every 20 seconds. A different little girl is walking away from him and screaming. And He must feel like, I don't know must he must feel amazing. I don't even know how he possibly stays grounded. Like where everybody's just like, Oh my god. Oh my god. Oh my god every time they see him and blurting out stupid stuff, but anyway,

Kathryn 1:29:57
all right. It's probably funny what some of the people I'll say, I mean,

Scott Benner 1:30:01
Arden. Still to this day, if you ask her, she'll be like, I have no idea why I said that. Like, I was like, it's not a huge selling point. If you're trying to if you're trying like

Kathryn 1:30:12
it's a small percentage of the population, so it makes you stand out what makes you a little bit more memorable? Maybe?

Scott Benner 1:30:17
I don't know. I can't I'll ask her about it. Like, you know, like, it's a wonder she didn't start off like, do you have medical insurance because I'm, I'm gonna need insulin pumps, when we obviously get married five seconds from now. But anyway, he's very short. By the way. I just want to say that he does look at Yes, he's a teeny tiny person. I'm looking at about right now, in case how tall is these? Five eight? Yeah, he's on the short end for a guy I that's got it. I mean, if he's really five, eight, then okay, but he's look smaller to me any slight too. So it's got like that, like your your son's friend came over to the house vibe about him. I'm sure as he's getting older, he doesn't look by the way I really liked those movies. I'm not not much on them or anything like that. Just he's a tiny guy. Katherine, you were terrific. Thank you for doing this hold on one second.

A huge thanks to Catherine Omni pod and US med Catherine of course, for sharing her story on the pod of course, for supporting the podcast, Omni pod.com/juice box greet yourself and only pod five right now, speaking of Omni pod five, there's new Omni pod five. Who should I tell you this? Yeah, I'll tell you. There's new Omni pod five content coming very, very soon, he says in early November of 2023. Thanks also to us med 888-721-1514 or use the website us med.com/juicebox. Thank you so much for listening. I'll be back very soon with another episode of The Juicebox Podcast. A diabetes diagnosis comes with a lot of new terminology. And that's why I've created the defining diabetes series. These are short episodes, where Jenny Smith and I go over all of the terms that you're going to hear living with diabetes, and some of them that you might not hear every day, from the very simple Bolus up to feed on the floor. Don't know the difference between hypo and hyper will explain it to you. These are short episodes, they are not boring. They're fun, and they're informative. It's not just us reading to you out of the dictionary, we take the time to chat about all of these different words. Maybe you don't know what a CU small respiration is, you will when you're done. Ever heard of a glycemic index and load haven't doesn't matter. You will know after you listen to the defining diabetes series. Now, how do you find it, you go to juicebox podcast.com up top to the menu and click on defining diabetes. You'll be able to listen right there in your browser. Or you'll see the full list of the episodes and be able to go into an audio app like Apple podcasts or Spotify and listen to them at your pace. Download them into your phone and listen when you can. The defining diabetes series is made up of 51 short episodes. That will fast forward your knowledge of diabetes terminology.