Scott Benner 3/1/24 Scott Benner 3/1/24

#1143 Near Arkansas?

Kinlee has type 1 diabetes. We talked about eating disorder, being misdiagnosed and the consequences of starting insulin without proper education.

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Scott Benner 0:00
Hello friends, welcome to episode 1143 of Juicebox Podcast.

Today I'll be speaking with Kinley, she's 21 years old has had type one diabetes for just over a year, we're going to talk about a lot actually there's a misdiagnosis in here, a pod five, body image issues, and anorexia, diagnosis and a lot more. Nothing you hear on the Juicebox Podcast should be considered advice, medical or otherwise, always consult a physician before making any changes to your health care plan. When you place your first order for ag one with my link, you'll get five free travel packs and a free year supply of vitamin D. Drink ag one.com/juice box. Don't forget to save 40% off of your entire order at cozy earth.com. All you have to do is use the offer code juice box at checkout. That's juice box at checkout to save 40% at cozy earth.com. If you're not already subscribed or following in your favorite audio app, please take the time now to do that. It really helps the show and get those automatic downloads set up so you never miss an episode.

If you're a US resident and have type one diabetes, or are the caregiver of someone with type one, the T one D exchange is looking for you t one D exchange.org/juicebox. Take about 15 minutes to join the registry just fill out that survey. And when you've completed the survey, you're helping people with type one diabetes, and you're supporting the Juicebox Podcast T one D exchange.org/juicebox. The T one D exchange is looking for everyone. But in particular right now males and males of color. If you fit the bill or if you have a child who fits the bill, please reach out to one D exchange.org/juice box.

Kinlee 2:10
My name is Kinley Fenton, and I am 21 years old. And I'm a college student. And I have had type one diabetes, or a little bit over a year. Just a year. Yes, I was diagnosed in April of 2022. Recently, okay, so yeah, I got sick though, in 2021, like the fall of 2021. But we didn't figure out that it was only peds until April of 2022.

Scott Benner 2:46
So you think that your first kind of showing of type one happened the fall, but maybe there was a honeymoon and your pancreas kind of picked back up again and kept going a little longer.

Kinlee 2:56
So I got COVID and mono at the same time. Okay, in September of 2021, kissing

Scott Benner 3:04
somebody with COVID.

Kinlee 3:10
I, yeah, I got that in September 2021. And they think that's when it happened. And I continued to get sick. Just constantly, I was constantly sick all the way until April. And then it was like a couple of weeks before I went to get checked. And that's when like my symptoms really started picking up. And I had a best friend in high school and her dad had type one diabetes. And I remember her mom telling me, like all of the warning signs of type one diabetes. And I was like, Hey, I think maybe I might have that. And so that's what I went to go get checked

Scott Benner 3:54
in late. I'm old. But I had mono around the age you had it. And I remembered as an incredibly miserable experience. It was awful. Yeah. And that I had COVID Last year, which was also miserable for me.

Speaker 1 4:09
Yes, at the same time. I had them at the same time I wanted that last for

Kinlee 4:16
I don't think I truly recovered from my mono. Until I was diagnosed like it I was just constantly tired. And like I just could not I just could not get rest. And so I was really sick with mono and then also having diabetes on top of that and not knowing I was just miserable is and I kind of go ahead No

Scott Benner 4:43
Don't Don't worry. I was just gonna go keep talking about is my question when you're done.

Kinlee 4:46
I just kind of like I attributed it to college. And I was like I'm just tired. You know, our dorms are kind of gross. Like, I'm probably just getting sick from mold or something like I don't know, but it. Yeah. Turns out it was not.

Scott Benner 5:02
My son was sick his entire freshman year from how 30 his dorm was. Yes.

Kinlee 5:06
And I mean, that makes sense. Like, and my family, like they didn't know, you know, we all just attributed it to college and just being tired and just constantly going, is

Scott Benner 5:18
mono a thing they can absolutely diagnose like with a test. Where did they just? They did. Okay. Yeah,

Kinlee 5:25
they took my blood and, and they tested it for mom, they

Scott Benner 5:28
were like, who can lay you're kissing somebody like you must be able to get that a different way.

Kinlee 5:37
I was like, man, there's so many different ways you could get that right.

Scott Benner 5:39
Oh, my God, mom. What happened? My parents are like, Oh, my No. And I was like, I don't know. I don't. I don't know why they. I think I got that from a dirty dish towel. Now. You see, get the diagnosis for the type one. Are you a college when that happens? Yes, I was a sophomore in college. But you were actually on campus when it happened. I was on campus. Yes. So you're at the like the little health office going like, Hey, I know you don't know anything, but I think I'm sick. Or you call your parents or

Kinlee 6:08
I went to the doctor. I didn't go to the campus doctor, I went to one in a town close to me. And I had just, I called or I had told my friends and my family. I was like, I just really think that I need to go get tested for diabetes. And you know, everyone was kind of like, oh can lay like, whatever, like shut up. You know, I was like, Yeah, I just think maybe I just I was just so sick and tired at this point. And I was like, even if I don't have diabetes, I just really hope that they can at least figure out what is wrong. Like, I didn't know if I was having another mono flare up. I didn't know if I COVID I didn't know what was happening. But

Scott Benner 6:50
you were driving, you were really tired. And I felt

Kinlee 6:54
so I have not known. Like, they told me when I was diagnosed, they were like you are about to figure out just how bad you have been feeling. Okay. And they were right. Like, as soon as I started trading myself, it I just felt like I had so much energy. And you know, it came with its complications, of course, but I remember telling my mom, she was like, okay, and I haven't I walked into the doctor's office, and I told them that I wanted to be tested for diabetes, and they kind of looked at me funny. And they were like, okay, and yeah, tell me

Scott Benner 7:30
the reasons how you get to that on your own? Because I mean, is there type one in your family? Is it the internet? did you how did you figure it

Kinlee 7:38
out? No, there is no type one in my family. We have some type two, but no type one. And like I said, my best friend in high school. Her dad had type one diabetes. And I just remember her mom telling me some of the warning signs like if you ever have to pee a bunch of you ever super thirsty like you. Those are some of the warning signs.

Scott Benner 8:02
And that's stuck to you. Hey, before we keep going, is there a fan or something noisy behind? You? Know, okay, when you talk I'm hearing a rumble behind yourself. Sometimes it's Oh, I

Kinlee 8:15
hear a mower outside. Is that it? Oh, okay. Yeah, I can move room so

Scott Benner 8:19
well, you can go out the window and be like, Man

Unknown Speaker 8:23
to make. I don't know how much they'd appreciate.

Scott Benner 8:26
I don't care. Are you at school right now or not yet? No,

Kinlee 8:29
I'm at school. But I'm at one of my friend's house right now. Because it's impossible to find a quiet place in the dorm

Scott Benner 8:37
to Yeah, no, I've I I've tried to talk to my daughter on the phone.

Kinlee 8:42
Yeah. Oh, no. Yeah, it just doesn't work

Scott Benner 8:46
was easier with my son for some reason. Like yeah, boys would like they all turn into like little gentlemen. They're like a Hello, sir. Like that kind of stuff. I think that's what they're doing.

Kinlee 8:57
No, I just know that some of them would bust in my room and be like, Why don't you? Have

Scott Benner 9:01
you seen this video? Out the litter box and the packs and then the other cat. I'll be like,

Kinlee 9:11
okay, is that better?

Scott Benner 9:13
You have to talk for me to know. Okay. Yes, you got it. Okay. So what happens is you're wearing noise cancelling headphones. So when you're not speaking, it doesn't matter. And when you are speaking it lets the noise so the more that goes. Yeah, and I'm probably the only one that hears everyone listening right now is like, What the hell are you doing? But it's my my brain just goes, oh, there's noise behind her that I have trouble listening to. So that's okay. Once there was a time when I just told people if you want a low and stable a one C, just listen to the Juicebox Podcast. But as the years went on, and the podcast episodes grew, it became more and more difficult for people to listen to everyone. So I made the diabetes Pro Tip series. This series is with me and Jenny Smith, Jenny is a Certified diabetes Care and Education Specialist. She's also a registered and licensed dietitian and a type one herself for over 30 years and I of course, am the father of a child who was diagnosed at age two in 2006. The Pro Tip series begins at episode 1000 with an episode called newly diagnosed are starting over and from they're all about MDI Pre-Bolus Singh insulin pumping, pumping and nudging variables exercise illness, injury surgeries, glucagon long term health bumping and nudging how to explain type one to your family, postpartum honeymoon, transitioning all about insulin Temp, Basal, these are all different episodes, setting your Basal insulin, fat and protein pregnancy, the glycemic index and load and so much more like female hormones and weight loss. Head now to juicebox podcast.com. Go up in the menu at the top and click on diabetes pro tip. Or if you're in the private Facebook group, there's a list of these episodes, right in the feature tab. Find out how I helped keep my daughter's a one C between five, two and six, two for the last 10 years without diet restrictions. juicebox podcast.com Start listening today. It's absolutely free.

Kinlee 11:20
The mower is just like, he's like going around the house. So he might just like

Scott Benner 11:25
find your site again. Yeah, he might come back up, but don't get too focused on it. It wasn't terrible. Don't worry. Okay. So you walk into the doctor, you're like, Hey, I'm self diagnosing myself with diabetes. And they they really do a finger stick or they

Kinlee 11:41
lie, though. They took my blood. Okay.

Scott Benner 11:44
And and so you didn't get an answer right away? Or you did?

Kinlee 11:48
I did. They checked my blood sugar levels and my agency. And so they knew right then that I had it. But they told me they didn't know what type? Yeah, I didn't know if it was type one or type two. And so I was just given insulin pins and needles and

Scott Benner 12:11
things laughing because how old were you? I was 20. Yeah. And how far from home? Do you is school? It's just an hour. Okay. So you got your your mom's on the way.

Kinlee 12:23
My mom was there with me. She

Scott Benner 12:25
made it there with you. Okay, good. Yeah,

Kinlee 12:27
she she came with me. And I was just sitting there, like bawling my eyes out. They were like, here's all your stuff. And they just kind of gave it to me, and didn't really tell me how to use it at all. Really. I was told to prick my finger, like three times a day. And then I was given a sheet just based off of my blood sugar, how much insulin to give myself, just until they figured out

Scott Benner 12:55
what type it was. I'm a little. So I'm a little surprised you didn't get better direction? Not that. I mean, most people don't. That's not why I'm surprised. I'm surprised because they did a very responsible thing by saying to you, we don't know what type of diabetes you have. So I thought, oh, maybe you found a good doctor. Because that part was uplifting to me. I was like, oh, that's the right way to say that. But then you got like, here's the stuff. Good luck.

Kinlee 13:20
Yeah, yeah. But I have a great doctor now. And this was just my primary care physician. So it wasn't an endocrinologist.

Scott Benner 13:33
Yeah. But still, though, like Kelly, you know, that you can hurt yourself with that insulin. Right? Yeah. Yeah. It's interesting. So all right. So you, you make an appointment, I imagine with an endo, but how long does it take to get that appointment?

Kinlee 13:45
I did not make an appointment with an endocrinologist at that point.

Scott Benner 13:49
Yes, went home with your pens. And you're like, here we go. I went back

Kinlee 13:53
to college, and me and my mom went to Target. And we got a pretty pink case to keep all of my stuff. And just, we were just trying to make it as good as we possibly could. And then she dropped me back off at school. And I was just like, Okay, I had no idea what was happening. And they were like, we'll contact you in two weeks and let you know what time it is. And so during those two weeks, I was just doing the best I could I had a super scary low. Just because I didn't I had no idea what I was doing. Yeah, no kidding. I had no idea what I was doing. And so I had a low and then I ate a whole pack of Skittles because I didn't know what was happening. And then my blood sugar shot up to like 500 And I was like

Scott Benner 14:39
Can I tell you something to look forward to when you get older if you're gonna have children. You said my mom took me to target and got me a pink case to put my stuff in and it made me cry. And now I'm gonna have to explain to you why because you're like, five years old, like you know, in the grand scheme of things. It's because I pictured your mom and helpless, trying to do something to make you feel better. Yeah. And it made me an Elmo weepy This is crazy.

Kinlee 15:09
Yeah, that's, that's what it was because it's like at that point, what do you do?

Scott Benner 15:14
No, I mean, cuz it's her intention to leave you at school. She doesn't know anything about diabetes any more than you do. And the people at the doctor's office are like, here. Here's the stuff. Like they didn't make it sound like you were in trouble. Like, right? So, right? What's your major psychology? Okay. All right. So, do you play any sports at school?

Unknown Speaker 15:34
I do not. Alright. Alright. So

Scott Benner 15:37
you're back at school having low blood sugars than driving your blood sugar up really high. This is just last year, as your some agents are this, it's 16 months ago. So what happens like keep keep taking me on this trip, like, okay,

Kinlee 15:51
so a couple, I just kind of honestly survived those two weeks. That was what I was doing, just trying to survive. And they called me and told me that I had type two diabetes, because my pancreas was still making some insulin. That was their reasoning. And

Scott Benner 16:13
this is the just the general practitioners office. Yeah. Okay.

Kinlee 16:16
And so he told me, and he was great. He, he was very helpful. But he told me that I did not need insulin. And he was going to put me on Metformin. And to do away with all of my insulin, I wasn't going to need to prick my finger anymore. Oh, the motors coming by?

Scott Benner 16:37
I know I heard it. But don't worry. So. Isn't that great? So now, not only is he telling you, you have the wrong kind of diabetes, but now he's giving you bad advice for how to manage type two diabetes. You don't need to prick your finger. Don't worry about it. It's gonna we're just gonna take a pill. Right? Yeah, you were probably relieved. No. Yeah,

Kinlee 16:56
I mean, yeah, I was relieved. But I also felt this whole time, I felt something in my gut telling me that that wasn't right. Okay, good for you. And I have gotten really good at listening to my body and just knowing what's wrong. And that's, oh, my goodness, this mower is making me angry. Okay, sorry.

Scott Benner 17:20
No, no, you're fine. Don't worry about I appreciate you caring. What do you think by the way, you didn't notice that before? And then I put it in your head. Now. You're like, the mower is following me.

Kinlee 17:27
I think he just turned it off. So

Scott Benner 17:30
if you can tell what kind of mower it is, we can name your episode that is it. Is it a Toro or I don't know I can see. Okay, so go ahead. You're listening to your body?

Kinlee 17:40
Uh huh. I just didn't really get listen to my body. And it was I just had in my brain that something was wrong. But I had already agreed to do an internship that summer, four hours away from home. And so I traveled four hours away from home with my bottle of metformin. And I just tried to make it that summer. And we were constantly texting my doctor, just saying, my blood sugar is still running in the five hundreds every

Scott Benner 18:12
day, you're living like that. Oh, yeah. Did you ever go in DKA? No. Somehow, in your popping these Metformin is probably eaten very little.

Kinlee 18:24
Oh, ha pawikan. These Metformin is you know, doing all that. I told him, I said, this isn't working, they switched me to Jardiance. That didn't work. And so I said, Okay, I'm gonna do this on my own. And I got my insulin, and I started giving it to myself. And I had, I know, I was miserable. And I was like, I don't know what to do anymore. And no one was telling me what to do. No one was telling me how to do it. And I when I tell you, I had no idea what I was doing. I was giving myself insulin after I was eating. And I didn't have long lasting insulin, it was only fast acting. Yeah. And so I was giving myself insulin after I ate because I thought that's what you're supposed to do. And I remember texting my mom. At one point, I was like, I think maybe I need to give myself insulin before I eat. Like, I think maybe that would work better. And she was like, hey, like, you could try that. You know? And I just had no idea.

Scott Benner 19:26
Yeah, but you're treating yourself like a type two, even though you don't think that's true? Is that right? Yes,

Kinlee 19:32
I was still taking the pills. But I started to give myself insulin. Were you losing a lot of weight? Not at this point I had before I was diagnosed, but not at this point.

Scott Benner 19:48
Okay, so you had already lost? Do you know how much you lost? Percentage of your body weight? No,

Kinlee 19:54
I don't know how much but it was enough to notice.

Scott Benner 19:58
Okay. Well, I mean, listen any insulin that you gave yourself was going to be valuable, obviously, less valuable after you eat and without Basal insulin, you know, still less valuable, but at least it was probably saving you. So how long did you do that for?

Kinlee 20:11
I did that all summer, the whole summer?

Scott Benner 20:15
Oh my gosh, boy, you're off at the thing. Okay. Yes, I felt crappy the whole time.

Kinlee 20:19
Yes, I was very sick and just tired. And I was just so confused. Because I was like, I thought I was supposed to be getting better. They told me that this was what I needed. And like I said, this whole time, I just felt something was very, very wrong with my diagnosis. And I was giving myself 10 shots a day around that. I mean, it was insane how much insulin I was having to give myself because I just didn't know how to use it. Right. And I remember, I texted my mom and started asking about insulin. And my mom was great through all of this. I mean, she didn't know any better, you know, than I did, that she was very helpful. And I read texted her and started talking about insulin pumps. And she messaged my primary care doctor about it. And he said, Oh, I don't, you know, I don't deal with that. And that's when he finally referred me to an endocrinologist.

Scott Benner 21:17
Wow, that's the thing that saves you was asking for the pump, because it gets you to a doctor who might actually know what's happening so that they immediately look at you and go, Hey, we're gonna run some labs here.

Kinlee 21:27
Yeah, I told her kind of what was happening. And before she even tested me, she looked at me and she said, You're type one. And she did test my blood and, and it did genotype one. But before I even did that she just knew. And so I got put on the Dexcom and the Omni pod pretty quickly after that,

Scott Benner 21:52
okay. Basal insulin going and yet doing all the things right,

Kinlee 21:58
until I could get my Omni podium. She gave me my long acting insulin. And I was like, Man, I don't even know what you know. And she taught me how to use it. And she told me what to do. What's

Scott Benner 22:15
the frame of time now from the time, like, not from back in the fall, but when you actually end up somebody telling you you have type two diabetes until you get to the end, though? How long is that process?

Kinlee 22:24
That so I was diagnosed in April with type two diabetes? And then I went to see my Endo. At the beginning of August. Wow. Four

Scott Benner 22:34
months? Yes. Wow. Okay. Well, you're lucky your life. Yes,

Kinlee 22:38
you are correct.

Scott Benner 22:41
Now, how Okay, so how do things proceed after that? Like it because there's a lot of in your notes, there's a lot of talk here about like eating disorders, mental health, stuff like that. So what, what, what started to happen? Yeah,

Kinlee 22:53
so at this point, I was on the Omnipod, in the Dexcom. And I went back to school for my junior year. And I just, I had better control over my numbers. But it wasn't perfect, obviously. And it's not going to be. And that really bothered me. Because I felt like I had no control over my body. I felt like I had no control over my blood sugar. I just, I was frustrated with people not listening to me. And I just felt like I had no control over anything. And also, during the summer, I had gained some weight, just from giving myself so much insulin and not chasing lows with food. And just, I was just all over the place. Yeah. And I've always kind of had some body image issues, but it just really escalated whenever I gained some weight. And, yes, I went back to school, and I just felt very, very out of control. I felt like I was doing everything wrong, even though I was on the Omnipod and the Dexcom. I still didn't know what I was doing. Right? Yeah, so I just still didn't know what to do felt very out of control. I talked to my endocrinologist, and she put me on Manjaro which is basically the same thing as it was a big

Scott Benner 24:20
Yeah, it's a GLP one actually. Manjaro GLP one and GLP two, right. Yeah, I think so. And she did that for you for weight or for blood sugar management or both.

Kinlee 24:32
Yeah, it was mainly for the weight just because I had said I've gained some weight and I just kind of felt like like the insulin was making me retain some weight. I wasn't really sure but what I didn't know was that it's an appetite suppressant. I didn't know that I just thought that it was going to help control my numbers better therefore giving myself lessons one, which it did, right but it also suppressed my appetite. Yeah, no kidding. And I I didn't know that that was gonna happen. And I have always kind of, like in high school and even in middle school, I wished that I had the willpower to not eat, I would always tell myself that meant like, I just, I just didn't have that willpower, you know, because it's normal for a human being to eat. And then all of a sudden, I had that willpower not to, because I was on this Manjaro Yeah. And so that is exactly what I did was I stopped eating. And when I stopped eating, I was able to see my numbers be perfect. Because I wasn't taking

Scott Benner 25:42
any carbs. Really? Yeah, people aren't gonna know. So you and I have a lot in common here because I've I on a GLP one drug too. So I know exactly what you're talking about. Can you help me contextually? You don't have to just say no, if you don't want to, but how much weight did you gain? And how much weight did you think you had to lose? is my question. I

Kinlee 26:01
gained? Probably 20 pounds

Scott Benner 26:05
over the summer. And how much did you think you could stand to lose?

Kinlee 26:09
I lost? I lost 60 pounds. That was weighed I never should have lost.

Scott Benner 26:18
So that was too much. Okay. Yeah. How long did it take for that weight to come off? So

Kinlee 26:24
I stopped eating. I was eating some but I wasn't eating enough. I was. Yeah. That was from September. to January. Wow.

Scott Benner 26:38
September, October, November, December, January. Yeah. Well, that's about what I expect from the drug. Actually. It's I mean, so here's how I would explain it to somebody. Your brain does not know if you're hungry or not. So you're not hungry in your head. Your stomach feels full. So you're physically not hungry. You can go on without eating forever without noticing it. Does that seem about accurate for how you felt? Yes, yes. And then on top of that, you're losing weight in other ways because of the medication as well.

Unknown Speaker 27:15
Yeah. Okay.

Kinlee 27:16
Yeah. But I also found that my blood sugar, like I said, was perfect. And I just felt like I had so much control over my life over my body over everything. I was like, this is perfect. This is exactly what I need to be doing. And it was frustrating. Because I actually went into honeymoon during this time. And I was like, Oh, this is what my body wants me to do. This is what my body needs, is to just not eat.

Scott Benner 27:49
Do you think it was a honeymoon Kinley? Or do you think it was just you had you were so restricted on your intake that you just didn't need very much insulin? We

Kinlee 27:56
still don't know. I talked to my endo about that. And she she doesn't know. Because I asked her. I was like, Do you actually think I was in high energy? Just think that I was restricting. And she was like, you know, I guess we'll never know. I

Scott Benner 28:11
have my guess. Yeah. So what do I want to ask you? So you didn't answer the one question which I kind of need to formulate my next thought. So, you again, you again, 20. You lost 60. But my question is, how much did you think you wanted to lose? The last 60? But you didn't want that much? What was the number you were looking for?

Kinlee 28:32
I wanted to go until I couldn't anymore. Oh, okay.

Scott Benner 28:36
So you had that mindset? I'm wondering, like, where? Because if you just needed to lose 20 pounds, for example. I mean, GLP. One is, I mean, I'm not a doctor. But that seems like overkill to lose 20 to lose 20 pounds, because you are, if it works on you, and it worked on you. You really, I mean, I'm 17 or 18 weeks into using Rico v. And I'm still like, every time I eat, I'm eating because I know I have to I am not eating because I'm sitting there thinking, Oh, I really have to eat something.

Kinlee 29:09
Yeah. And I think in that sense, it can be good for people. I think I just had a very, very different mindset. And at first it was, oh, you know, this is great. Like, I just want to lose a few pounds, you know, nothing wrong with that, whatever. And it suddenly turned into I want to have this control over my life over my blood sugar. I want my blood sugar to be perfect. And I'm going to do that by not eating.

Scott Benner 29:36
Would you consider that an eating disorder or did you were you consider it? You do?

Kinlee 29:41
Yeah, okay. Yeah, I was diagnosed with anorexia. I went to the doctor in December, and they diagnosed me and I got off of Manjaro and nothing changed.

Scott Benner 29:53
Oh, I see. Yes. So you did you ever have. Okay, so the question is, did you have have an eating disorder ever prior to the type one or two, you know, so you think that the GLP medication stops you from being hungry, your insulin needs go down, it sends you all that feeling of control. And then you get lost in the idea of I have to keep losing weight for this to keep happening. Is that right? Yes,

Kinlee 30:19
it was. It was just a series of things. I think. I think like I said, it started out as just want to lose a few pounds. And then it turned into, and I think for a lot of people, that's what it is, you know, and that's all that it is. But mine just continued to go down this rabbit hole you snowballed, right? Yes. And then suddenly, it turned less physical and more mental. And I just crave this control when I was really completely losing control.

Scott Benner 30:51
Yeah. So listen, I have a very, like limited understanding of this never happened to me, but I had this one experience. I had this one experience years ago, where my this is gonna sound weird. My dentist told me you have type two diabetes, because I peed a bunch of times while I was having a long procedure. And, and I was like, I would definitely know if I had type two diabetes. I'm like, I, I, you might even I might be the guy you asked if you had diabetes, like I think I think I would know, you know. Yeah. But anyway, but nevertheless, I had drank a lot of water that day. So I kind of was like, No, that's not right. But once he put it into my head, I went home and I thought, well, I'm going to, I'm going to get a doctor's appointment. So I called and I made a doctor's appointment for a physical, but I couldn't get there for like, four or five days a week, right? And for those days, I had real trouble eating. Because I thought, Oh, what if I'm driving my blood sugar up. And I have doubt, I'm testing my blood sugar, because I've meters all over the place. My blood sugar is not high. But I'm still it's in my head. As soon as they put it into my head. Type Two diabetes. I had trouble eating. And it was really, I don't know that I'll ever find a way to articulate how manipulative it was. To my actions. Yeah, yeah. So.

Kinlee 32:17
And the more I've talked to people since going through this, the more common I found that it really is, yeah, because it's just you. You just have this sense of like, Oh, I just feel out of control. Like when my blood sugar is high. Like I just want it to be perfect all the time. So it's frustrating. And I just found that my blood sugar was perfect when I wasn't eating but I I pretty quickly found out that that was not sustainable.

Scott Benner 32:47
Yeah. This just for context, this 60 pounds off your frame left you like very thin. Um, yes. Yeah. Okay. in an unhealthy way, visually even. Yeah. Okay. So when that's happening, you don't see it though, right?

Kinlee 33:05
No, I did not. Yeah, I was also diagnosed with body dysmorphia. And so I looked in the mirror, and I saw what I was 60 pounds ago. Wow,

Scott Benner 33:16
I have to tell you. So again, my only other frame of reference for this is I start taking weak Ovie. And I'm like, overweight, like absolutely overweight. And I lose first five pounds, like why I lost five pounds, you don't really notice much. And then suddenly, I could see my stomach shrinking, right? That was the first place I saw it. Like, like, my stomach wasn't sticking out as far and I was like, Oh, wow, this is crazy. I looked different. But then when my face changed, it was a big leap for me. Like, I looked in the mirror and I thought my face is thinner. I look different. I'm happier with how I look in my face. And I went on, I've lost 30 pounds so far. I'm nowhere near like, I need to lose more weight, right? But I've lost 30 pounds. It's a big deal. I mean, even if I don't lose weight one week, I maintain that weight. So I'm doing well. Like it's a very slow process. I'm happy with the speed of it. Like none of that. But the craziest ass thing happened like two weeks ago. I looked in the mirror and I thought my face looks fat. And then I looked at a picture of myself versus three or four weeks ago, and my face is thinner now than it was three or four weeks ago. So my face was round and, and Turbie I lost weight. I recognize that but I got used to that so quickly. That the next time I looked at it again, I thought oh my face is fat. And that that's I'll tell you was was really like an impactful moment. For me. I was like oh Oh my God, I don't see myself right. And I don't think I have body dysmorphia. I think your brain just for me, I think my brain is just getting used to what I'm looking at, like, and then it, it tells you either you're okay, this is what you look like, or this is what you look like, and this isn't where you want to be. And then that's it. It's difficult to break free of that. For me, yeah.

Kinlee 35:23
I mean, it was just I would, you know, people would tell me, my, my parents will tell me, You look sick, you know, you don't look good. And honestly, at that time, that's what my brain wanted to hear. For me. People telling me that I looked sick was what I that's what I wanted. That meant then. Yes, that. And when people told me they were worried about me in my head, it was like, yeah, like, this is good. You know. And I remember even when I was diagnosed with anorexia by a doctor, and she told me that I could die. My brain was like, yeah, like, this is

Scott Benner 36:01
good. I'm getting there. But you want yeah. Wow. Isn't that crazy? You felt empowered by them telling you, you look like you were gonna die? Yes.

Kinlee 36:10
Wow. That is what my eating disorder. That's not what I wanted. Sure. It's not what Kimberly wanted. It's what my eating disorder wants. And since since then, I've gotten good at being able to tell the difference between the two, then I thought that is what I wanted. And I was happy when people were worried about,

Scott Benner 36:31
okay. Do you think the diabetes brought the eating disorder on? Or do you think the weight gain and then watching it come off? Brought it on? What do you think?

Kinlee 36:41
I think I think it was both combination, because I got very addicted to seeing the weight fall. I mean, I was weighing myself up to 10 times a day, you know, just constantly watching that scale drop.

Scott Benner 36:54
Are you really? Yeah, 10 times.

Kinlee 36:58
Yeah. But then, when it came to the diabetes, and I just felt so out of control of my numbers. And I found that not eating, control by numbers. My body, my body went into honeymoon or whatever happened there. And it was very confusing for my brain. Because in my head, I was like, This is good. This is what my body needs. This is what my body wants, like I can, I can take care of my diabetes by not eating

Scott Benner 37:33
and never thinking about anything like nutrition, or minerals, or vitamins, or any of the things that your body actually needs to keep going. No,

Kinlee 37:41
I didn't care at the time, just how it looked.

Scott Benner 37:45
Where your blood sugar was, and how you looked physically.

Kinlee 37:48
And I remember I would, at the end of the day, I would look at my Dexcom graph. And I would just see it like, a complete straight line. And I would just be like, yes. Like, that is what I want. That is good. Didn't

Scott Benner 38:01
matter that you weren't eating or, or that somebody told you you weren't going to be alive much longer. Right? Yeah.

Kinlee 38:08
I mean, my eating disorder became became my best friend. How

Unknown Speaker 38:16
would you say how was that?

Kinlee 38:18
It just promised me and I, I always tell people when they asked me about my eating disorder, that it's like a person in my head, it's a voice in your head. And it just told me that the things that I was doing the things it was telling me to do were good. And that people would love me, if I did them, people would find me attractive. If I did them, I had all the control in the world. If I followed all of its rules, and it just became something. And and

Scott Benner 38:52
it paid, it paid you back to write like it promised something, and then it gave it to you. Yeah.

Kinlee 38:57
And like, if I would restrict, or if I would purge, or exercise. It would congratulate me. And it was so nice to me in my head, and it would tell me how beautiful I am how skinny I am, how in control I was of my life. But if I would eat something I wasn't, quote unquote, supposed to or said something. It would just beat me up. I mean, tell me the most awful things. And so it was just easier to do what it wanted. And I just didn't know how to fight that voice at the time.

Scott Benner 39:36
Wow. That sounds good. And how are you feeling now?

Kinlee 39:41
Um, so after I was diagnosed by a doctor, I decided to go to treatment in January. And so I did a PHP treatment program for 11 weeks. And then I did an IOP program. For, I think, seven, six or seven weeks. And now I'm out of treatment feel. And during that time, my diabetes came back or, you know, obviously, my blood sugar was racing again. And that was really, really, really tough to work through. Because I just felt like I was doing something wrong to my body. I felt like, this isn't right, this isn't what my body wants. But working with my dietician and my therapist, we found ways to control my blood sugar. And to help me feel like I had control over my body without

Scott Benner 40:36
restricting. Can you tell me some of the ways you accomplish that? Well,

Kinlee 40:40
I got back on my pump while I was in treatment, because I had gotten off of it, because I just wasn't eating enough to even need it. So I got off my pump and got back on it. And we just would dose for everything correctly. And I honestly still, like at that point, didn't really know how to like carb count. And does myself, Greg did. And so correctly, so we worked on that, and just worked on like, how to control my blood sugar with insulin. And that was when I really learned, like, Okay, this is what I need to do. And I also switched to the T slim during that time. Okay, and I like it a lot more than the Omni pod. So that was very helpful.

Unknown Speaker 41:27
What did you like better about it?

Kinlee 41:29
I just think it's more aggressive. Like when my blood sugar's high, it just always, like gets me down pretty quickly. Because the Omni pod Yes, algorithm, I love it. And it just helped me feel more in control. Alright,

Scott Benner 41:44
so now I have a difficult question for you that and by the way, you've done a really lovely job of talking about all this, I hope I've been as sensitive as you need me to be i This is not a subject I know, like a ton about so. But I'm gonna ask you a question that you may or may not have an answer to, but really give it a second. Let's go back in a time machine to the day you think you have diabetes, and you're gonna go to the doctor. Are there things an alternate reality that could have happened? That would have avoided all this? Yeah. What do you think those things are

Kinlee 42:19
being sent to an endocrinologist right away?

Scott Benner 42:22
You just think those four months what got you messed up? Yeah, go ahead. Good tell me

Kinlee 42:27
to do during that time was when I gained quite a bit of weight because I didn't know how to dose myself correctly. And I'm not saying that insulin makes you gain a whole bunch of weight. But the way that I was doing it did

Scott Benner 42:39
well, you were to be clear to people, you were randomly giving yourself insulin at meals based on like, you're like, hey, I think this may be as a thing because my blood sugar's 500. And then you were making yourself low at points and taking in a bunch of carbs. So you're taking even more carbs and your blood sugars are bouncing all over the place, you're throwing insulin here and there that yeah,

Kinlee 43:00
that is what I was doing. It was not controlled by any means. And it was hard for me when I was in treatment, when I got back on my insulin to believe that I wouldn't just gain all that weight again. And I still struggle with that sometimes, just because I've experienced that. And in my head, I'm just like, oh, that's gonna happen again. But it hasn't. And I'm still teaching myself that. And now that I have, and it's not perfect, obviously, some days are really crappy. But now that I have the means to control my blood sugar is a lot better. But yeah, I believe that I should have been sent to an endocrinologist right away. I think that whether you're type one or type two, you should see an endocrinologist. That's just my opinion. I think that that should have happened pretty quickly. And I think a lot of this could have been avoided, possibly,

Scott Benner 44:04
what and isn't it? I mean, interesting. This is the impacts that got you the eating disorder, like that kind of stuff. But it very easily could have been a different impact. Or you could have actually had type two diabetes and been scared of food, like I talked about before, and like there's just, you know, a number of, I guess there's one good path. And there are so many possible bad paths, you know, and it's not. It's not, it's not poor intentions. It's not, it's just that if the doctor doesn't know what to tell you, if they don't tell it to you in a way that you can understand if it isn't information that's actionable, if they don't, I think one of the biggest mistakes that all doctors could make is giving you like a step. Like say you're in a three step process. I don't know what the step is. We're going to start with Basal insulin. and these are your settings. But they don't tell you, these settings are going to change. And so I've seen people get lost and I don't know what I'm doing wrong. Like I've done everything I was told but my blood sugar's are higher than they should be like that pain, that kind of psychological torment that you go through minute by minute, day after day is unnecessary and could have been stopped by just saying, Hey, these are your settings, but we expect these are going to change pretty quickly. So if you don't start getting what you expect, let us know, we'll change the settings. All right, that's all you have to do, just say the rest of it, you know, right. And otherwise, people end up in just a myriad of different crappy situations. Yours is one of them. But I've heard a ton of others too, you know, and it's all about how it starts. In that beginning with what you understand and what you expect. That's my opinion. So,

Kinlee 45:57
and I don't blame anyone. I don't blame my daughter. I don't blame my parents. I don't blame anyone. We just didn't know. You know, and now that I do know, I want to make it known for other people.

Scott Benner 46:10
We can leave your very nice, but I knew you just didn't know me. There are other doctors that knew you just didn't know them. Like, I'm not saying anybody, like willfully messed you up, right?

Kinlee 46:23
I know, right? I

Scott Benner 46:24
know. And I and you're very nice. Of course, you're very nice to protect people. And that's lovely. But I'm saying that there's a base amount of knowledge that if any doctor had wouldn't have led you down this path, and I don't want you to be mad about it. Or I You sound very kind of, like healthy about it, honestly. Which is nice. I don't understand. You're 21 Why are you so nice? I don't know. Because you're not mad? You're not angry? You're not blaming anybody mad?

Kinlee 46:51
No, I? If I think about too, I get frustrated. Um, but I just have to get past it. Yeah, I mean, that's how it happened. I have a great doctor now. She's awesome. And I'm good. Now,

Scott Benner 47:09
when you talk about it in treatment, for your eating disorder. Is there talk like, this is a thing you get past? Is it a? Is it a thing you always look for? Are you living with it? Like, what's the phrasing around? Does that make sense? my eating disorder? Yeah. Like, you know, when somebody will tell you like, it's not like you're a cured alcoholic, you're an alcoholic who's not drinking currently? Like, is it like that? Or how does it go? Right?

Kinlee 47:35
I think for me, the voice of my eating disorder, I don't want to say is always going to be there, I'm pretty fresh out of treatment, you know, I had the summer to be at home and stuff. But the voice is still there. And like, when I eat something that maybe I wouldn't have eaten in my eating disorder, or I lay in my bed instead of exercise or something like that. The voice can get loud, and can tell me things that just aren't nice. But I have learned in treatment, how to battle that voice, and how to stand up against that voice. And so I would say the voice has gotten quieter, but it's still there. I just know how to stand up to it. Gotcha. And so it's still struggle. And it's still you know, I consider myself still in active recovery. And every day is different. Some days are a lot harder than others. And people tell me, people that have had an eating disorder or work with users, that it can go away. And it can

Scott Benner 48:40
be different, like in the past. It could feel it's possible that one day, it'll feel like a thing that used to happen to you doesn't have.

Kinlee 48:49
Okay, yes. And I haven't experienced that yet. Right. It's definitely it's gotten so much better. And I'm at a point where, like I said, I consider myself in recovery. But I've heard that one day it can go away. And so I hope that is you know, and when I keep fighting it and just keep doing what I can to stand up against it. Hopefully one day it can go away. Until then I'll continue to fight it. Yeah.

Scott Benner 49:19
And you handle it the way you're handling it right now. Is it? Is there maintenance, like mental health maintenance? Do you go to meetings or see somebody with frequency? How does that work? Yeah,

Kinlee 49:29
I still see a dietitian and a therapist. And I meet with them every other week.

Scott Benner 49:35
Okay. Very cool. Are you um, how did you find the podcast? Like why do you know about this?

Kinlee 49:42
Oh, my mom wasn't do it all the time. She loves this podcast and she told me about it. I listen to it started listening to

Scott Benner 49:52
it. Cool. So do you actually listen or does she listen and bug the crap out of you about it?

Kinlee 49:56
She listened more than I do. But I do Listen. Yeah, I like she always she's like, I went on a walk this morning and I listened to your podcast like, let me tell you what it's about. Oh, and she, she loves it.

Scott Benner 50:09
But yeah. Tell her I said, Hello, thank you.

Kinlee 50:12
I will let her she'll be thrilled.

Scott Benner 50:16
It's funny to me because I don't feel that way. But because like, I know what I'm doing after you and I record. Like, I don't know what your mom thinks happens after I get done doing this, but

Kinlee 50:27
she probably thinks that you go,

Scott Benner 50:30
like getting laid off the road. Yeah, go probably jump in like a gold Mercedes and drive around and talk to like J. Cole and stuff like that. Yeah, none of that happens.

Kinlee 50:40
Oh, we'll just let her continue to believe.

Scott Benner 50:41
Let her have that that fantasy that's good for everyone to think that I'm a very famous and happy person.

Kinlee 50:48
Yes, I agree. I agree.

Scott Benner 50:51
Kinley, tell me about the role of friends in this whole process? did you enlist people to support you? Or do you go by yourself? What happened there?

Kinlee 51:02
Oh, my goodness. I'm just like smiling when you said that, my friends. Were just amazing. And I love my friends so much. And I'm just I'm so happy to be back with them this semester, because I took a semester off of school to go to treatment. And that was a really, really, really tough decision. Because I love college. Like, I just, it is just my thing. I love it so much. And I lived with all of my friends, you know, and I had to leave them all because I couldn't eat, you know. And it was more than that. But like, I would beat myself up a lot about having to leave them. But they were just the most supportive. And I would come home sometimes on the weekends and visit at school. And they would make a point to come and see me and they would text me and call me. And they were just so ready for me to get better. And I'm and it was hard to take the semester off. But I knew it was either stay at school be miserable, get worse. I mean it all honestly possible, honestly, possibly die, or go get better and have an awesome senior year.

Scott Benner 52:09
And you handle it with a lot of honesty. Like guys, I'm leaving for a while I'm gonna go work on my eating disorder. Like that kind of stuff. Yeah,

Kinlee 52:17
I mean, they, they kind of noticed some things. But I didn't really open up about it until like November, December. And I told some of my closest friends kind of what was going on. And then yeah, I was just very honest with them that I needed help. And I needed to go somewhere. And they accepted that they were sad, obviously. But that they saw me they knew that I needed help. And they wanted me to get help. Interesting. And so I went to treatment. And like I said I would visit them we would call you have a talk and it was really hard being away. But they made it easy. They, they just made it. I couldn't have done it without them. I'll be honest. Yeah. Getting to come back this semester. And everyone's like moving in yesterday and today and just getting to see everyone and everyone's just so excited that I'm back. And I'm so excited to be back. It's just I'm really happy that I got treatment when I did.

Speaker 1 53:18
That's a big year for you to tell right? Your senior year. Yeah, it's my senior year.

Scott Benner 53:22
Cool. What are you going to do after school?

Kinlee 53:24
I want to go to grad school is my plan. But I want to be a therapist. That'll take a little bit of schooling. But I want to work with girls with eating disorders. Yeah.

Scott Benner 53:38
This is something you wanted to do prior to all this. Is that right?

Kinlee 53:42
Yeah. Yeah, I've always wanted to be a therapist. My dad is a therapist. And so he kind of inspired me growing up to want to do that. And so and I, I had had friends in high school and a couple in college that had eating disorders. But it's something that you don't really understand until you go through it. Because I remember them telling me things. And I was like, I don't really understand that. But you know, I'm here for you. And looking back. I'm like, oh, that's exactly how I feel, you know. And so I believe as sucky as it was. I believe that I've been given a gift to be able to help other people that deal with the same thing, and maybe not right now just because I am still in recovery. But once I'm done with grad school, I believe that I'll be ready to be able to help other people.

Scott Benner 54:33
Oh, good for you. That's wonderful. Yeah, very nice. Is there anything we haven't talked about that we should have? I don't think so. Did Okay. Excellent. Very nice. What about do you have any other autoimmune issues?

Kinlee 54:50
I do not.

Scott Benner 54:52
How about other type one in your family line on either side? Nope, nothing. About Nothing. Grand moms with tyroid problems. My

Kinlee 55:02
grandma. Yeah, my grandma has a hypo, which was the one. I think it's where it got. There's too much or goes too fast or

Scott Benner 55:10
something hypo and hyperthyroidism. Yeah. Does she have Hashimotos? Do they say? I don't think so. Okay. Yeah, it's not a thing you would really know until this stuff starts to come up. How about anybody have celiac gluten allergy? Oh,

Kinlee 55:26
yeah. My grandma also has celiac. I

Scott Benner 55:28
think we're figuring this out. She's great. Yeah. Give her a call and tell her she might be she might have given you type one diabetes. She's too old. Let her lift. So

Unknown Speaker 55:43
she's so sweet. Yeah, I'm

Scott Benner 55:44
sure. No, it's just you'll often see other autoimmune issues, like somewhere in family lines. Yeah.

Kinlee 55:51
I mean, we have some type two, but there's no type one. Just

Scott Benner 55:55
the celiac and the and the thyroid. Yep. Which are autoimmune. So. Okay, that's interesting. Do you? This is such a weird question, because you're young. But do you think about having kids?

Kinlee 56:07
Yes, I do. Okay.

Scott Benner 56:11
Eventually. Okay. Here's the thing you're interested in doing? Okay. 21. That's how old you are. Right? Yeah. It's weird when the when the thoughts come to people different ages about having kids. It's weird to think about that. Yeah. Right. Because like, Are you dating? No, no,

Kinlee 56:31
I mean, I'm not dating someone right now. Yeah. But I think

Scott Benner 56:35
you're saying you're like, can listen, I've had people. But not at the moment. At that moment. I don't have somebody but like, it's not like I couldn't. And yeah, no, I got you. anybody

Kinlee 56:48
listening? Like no.

Scott Benner 56:51
Don't think that? No, I understood. I understood what you meant. Wow. So like your plan. Just go back. Learn. Hang out with your friends. Have fun. Try to get to grad school. Do you think you'll go to grad school in Tennessee? Or do you think you'll leave? I

Kinlee 57:06
think that I'll go to grad school in Tennessee. Yeah, right now I'm interning at a church in the town next to my college. And I'm the Youth intern there. And so hopefully, maybe at some point that will work out for me to be there while I'm in grad school, or something like that. So I definitely want to have some sort of job either in youth ministry. Or in counseling while I'm in grad school.

Scott Benner 57:37
My son's in Atlanta with his first out of school out of college job. And I'm like, What? What is it? You don't like Atlanta? He goes, Man, it's so hot here. It's so hot and it's so humid. And it is really like it just rains here constantly. Like I know anyway, all right. So you're attending Tennessee girl you want to stay? That's

Unknown Speaker 57:57
fine. Yeah, I would like to stay. I

Scott Benner 57:59
think western Tennessee. Is that like, I don't know the map that well. Ken Lee, I don't know where you're at. Oh, I

Kinlee 58:06
don't either. Oh, whatever you're about to ask me. I probably don't

Scott Benner 58:10
take a look. I was gonna say you're like, more towards I was gonna say Missouri. But am I about right about that, like Arkansas? You don't even know. I love that.

Kinlee 58:26
I don't think that's close to me.

Scott Benner 58:27
Are you? But you're in western Tennessee? Yeah. Closer to Kentucky or closer to

Kinlee 58:33
Mississippi. Closer to Mississippi. I think

Scott Benner 58:37
honey, you're real. You're close to Arkansas. No, I'm not. You gotta get a map and look at it.

Kinlee 58:46
I don't think Arkansas is like four hours away.

Scott Benner 58:48
All right. Okay, that's still that's pretty. I mean, Tennessee is a pretty wide state. I don't know where I am. It just looks like Tennessee looks like I can't describe this to you. Because you're not from around here. But it looks like the way like artists and people cut their pizza in square. It's like long and you would understand. And so but but if you were okay, so you're not if you just went south, just south would you end up in Alabama or Mississippi?

Kinlee 59:15
If I went south, I would end up in Mississippi and then I would end up and

Scott Benner 59:23
I swear you do not understand Do you want to do you have Are you in a phone with me or a computer?

Unknown Speaker 59:28
Computer but I have my phone? Alright,

Scott Benner 59:30
I want you to pull up a US map just go to Google. together and then we're gonna stop. Okay, well, I swear I'll let you out of this in a second. But we got to make it fun for your mom who loves the podcast and is gonna be like, Oh, I love that. He did this to her.

Unknown Speaker 59:42
He's gonna be so embarrassed. Oh, no, no shit. Well, yeah,

Scott Benner 59:45
I mean, listen, she probably could have done a better job teaching you about geography, but that's too late now. Okay, tell me when you have a US map up. Oh, I didn't know. Okay. Seriously, go to a browser type in Google US map. Click on it. Okay. All right.

Kinlee 1:00:00
Oh, wait. It's making me dumb.

Scott Benner 1:00:03
You don't have to download anything. What are you kidding me what's happening? There's a map right at the top when you google US map.

Unknown Speaker 1:00:13
Do you see? When I click it, it makes me download. Oh, you got it? Yeah. All right.

Scott Benner 1:00:20
Do you see now where you're at? In relation to other states? Tennessee?

Kinlee 1:00:28
Yeah, I see Tennessee. Alright, so

Scott Benner 1:00:29
if you're West,

Kinlee 1:00:30
I'm kind of close to Nashville.

Scott Benner 1:00:34
Okay. Oh, really? That. Okay, so that's dead center. Are you more towards the west of Nashville? You are first of all, do you know which way west is left? Do you know never eat shredded wheat? Have you ever heard that? Yes. Okay. So North is at the top and East. Like at three o'clock on the clock. And then south isn't six o'clock.

Kinlee 1:01:01
I'm catching your judgment. All right. All right. So

Scott Benner 1:01:03
are you west of Nashville?

Unknown Speaker 1:01:04
Yep.

Scott Benner 1:01:06
Are you closer to Kentucky or Mississippi? Your mom just died inside. She's on a walk. Think about this. She's out walking right now. She's like, Oh, Kelly went on the podcast. She was talking about her eating disorder. And everything's so cool. She's trying to share with other girls. And now she's at the end and she's like, Oh, my God. Everyone's gonna hear this. And

Kinlee 1:01:30
wait, I'm looking at Kentucky.

Scott Benner 1:01:32
You're closer. No, no. Closer to Mississippi. I think yeah. You see how close you are to Arkansas then. How far are you from Memphis?

Kinlee 1:01:45
Like an hour.

Scott Benner 1:01:45
So you're an hour from Arkansas.

Kinlee 1:01:48
I really just want to tell you where I live.

Scott Benner 1:01:52
Oh, bleep it out. Where do you live?

Unknown Speaker 1:01:53
I live in. Okay, so hold on. I had to get a map. And I'm gonna go

Scott Benner 1:02:03
by the way, Rob, edit out where she lives. Please. I'm not talking to you right now. I'm talking to the person who's going to edit the show. You're welcome. I appreciate I was I was at Tennessee once as a child. Really? Yeah. Or like a vacation. I think we were vacationing I don't know. I was young. They made me go there. I don't get to go to Gatlinburg probably probably went to all the like, you know, you go to the mountains tours traps. Yeah, the Smoky Mountains. Right. That kind of thing. That's in Gatlinburg. Okay, so I see where you are in. Okay. Yeah. i It's possible that if you worked out a little bit, you could throw a ball from where you are at Arkansas. That's the first thing.

Unknown Speaker 1:02:48
I'm not close to Arkansas.

Scott Benner 1:02:50
World. Do you not think you're close to Arkansas?

Kinlee 1:02:54
How close are you thinking that I well?

Scott Benner 1:02:59
I mean, there's like a river. Right.

Unknown Speaker 1:03:06
I'm getting this. Give me a second.

Scott Benner 1:03:09
You are you are? You are closer to Arkansas. If you went dead west than you are to Memphis

Speaker 2 1:03:15
Ah, yes, you are. I go I go through Memphis to get to Arkansas. You

Scott Benner 1:03:22
go through Memphis to go to Arkansas. Yeah, but you don't have to. I'm saying if you if you were to able to drive just do West and not have to follow whatever highway you're accustomed to following? You're like distance wise, closer to the border of Arkansas than you are to Memphis. Well, okay, I think you need to spend at least 20 minutes on Tiktok figuring out where you live. Okay.

Kinlee 1:03:43
I know where I live in. That's all that matters. You should

Scott Benner 1:03:45
go up to girls that you know in like your dorm and go hey, do you know we live near Arkansas? See what they would probably be like

Kinlee 1:03:52
yes. kindling. We do know.

Unknown Speaker 1:03:55
Yeah, really? Okay.

Scott Benner 1:03:56
Can we I appreciate you screwing around with me at the end of this. Thank you very much.

Unknown Speaker 1:04:00
You're welcome. Hold on for me for one second. Okay. Okay.

Scott Benner 1:04:11
I can't stress enough how important it is for you to go to T one D exchange.org/juicebox. and complete the survey. It's super simple to do. I've done it myself took me fewer than 10 minutes. They say on the website, 15 minutes, maybe my clicking fingers faster than some people's. I'm telling you, you're going to do a lot of good. You're going to support the podcast support people with type one diabetes support diabetes research, and you're going to feel good about yourself in just 15 minutes p one D exchange.org/juicebox. A huge thanks to a longtime sponsor touched by type one please check them out on Facebook, Instagram, and at touched by type one.org. If you're looking to support an organization that supporting people with type one diabetes, check out touched by type one If you're looking for community around type one diabetes, check out the Juicebox Podcast private Facebook group Juicebox Podcast type one diabetes, but everybody is welcome type one type two gestational loved ones, it doesn't matter to me. If you're impacted by diabetes and you're looking for support, comfort or community, check out Juicebox Podcast type one diabetes on Facebook. If you have type two or pre diabetes, that type two diabetes Pro Tip series from the Juicebox Podcast is exactly what you're looking for. Do you have a friend or a family member who is struggling to understand their type two and how to manage it? This series is for them. seven episodes to get you on track and up to speed. Episode 860 series intro 864 guilt and shame episode 869 medical team 874 fueling plan, Episode 880 diabetes technology episode 85 GLP ones metformin and insulin and an episode 889. We talk about movement. This episode is with me and Jenny Smith. Of course you know Jenny is a Certified diabetes Care and Education Specialist. She's a registered and licensed dietitian and Jenny has had type one diabetes for over 30 years. Too many people don't understand their type two diabetes, and this series aims to fix that. Share it with a friend or get started today. Thank you so much for listening. I'll be back soon with another episode of The Juicebox Podcast. The episode you just heard was professionally edited by wrong way recording. Wrong way recording.com

#1142 Preach

Dana is the mother of a 15 year old daughter who was diagnosed with type 1 diabetes just a little over 2 years ago. We talked about food issues and miscommunication at diagnosis, depression, eating disorder and DBT therapy.

+ Click for EPISODE TRANSCRIPT

Scott Benner 0:00
Hello friends, and welcome to episode 1142 of the Juicebox Podcast.

My guest today is the mother of a child living with type one. Our topics are going to include food, depression, eating disorders, and we're going to talk a bit about a really not great diagnosis story. Please don't forget that nothing you hear on the Juicebox Podcast should be considered advice, medical or otherwise, always consult a physician before making any changes to your health care plan or becoming bold with insulin. When you place your first order for ag one with my link, you'll get five free travel packs and a free year's supply of vitamin D. Drink ag one.com/juice box. Don't forget to save 40% off of your entire order at cozy earth.com All you have to do is use the offer code juice box at checkout that's juice box at checkout to save 40% at cozy earth.com. If you're looking for community around type one diabetes, check out the Juicebox Podcast private Facebook group Juicebox Podcast type one diabetes, but everybody is welcome type one type two gestational loved ones. It doesn't matter to me. If you're impacted by diabetes, and you're looking for support, comfort or community check out Juicebox Podcast type one diabetes on Facebook. Did you know that men and men of color particularly are the least likely to sign up to participate in research. In order to make advancements in diabetes treatment to address the needs of everyone with diabetes, it is important that all people are represented in research. The T one D exchange is seeking males of all ages and backgrounds to sign up for the T one D exchange registry. Once enrolled, you will be notified about other type one diabetes research opportunities like surveys, focus groups and clinical trials. So if you are a US resident male or the caregiver of a male US resident, the T one D exchange is looking for you t one D exchange.org/juicebox. US med is sponsoring this episode of The Juicebox Podcast and we've been getting our diabetes supplies from us med for years. You can as well. Us med.com/juice box or call 888721151 for use the link or the number get your free benefits check it get started today with us med this show is sponsored today by the glucagon that my daughter carries G voc hypo pen. Find out more at G voc glucagon.com. Forward slash juicebox

Dana 2:51
Hello, I'm Dana. I am the mother of a type one diabetic. It's our daughter who just turned 15 and will be entering her sophomore year of high school.

Scott Benner 3:01
Okay, your 15 year old daughter was diagnosed with April of 2021.

Dana 3:05
Our first kind of getaway vacation post COVID. Okay,

Scott Benner 3:10
so a little over two years ago. Yes. All right. She's 15. Now you said, yeah, she

Dana 3:15
just turned 15 over the weekend.

Scott Benner 3:17
Was there any indication that diabetes was in your family or that this might happen? No,

Dana 3:22
not really, although Oddly, the great aunt that she's named after. I do remember stories that you know, she takes insulin. But no one ever said she has diabetes or she has type one diabetes, or she has type two diabetes, she would just sit in a chair and drink gin and apparently she had insulin in her refrigerator.

Scott Benner 3:45
You and I are gonna have a lot of fun. I said, Is there any indication that this would happen? You said no. Except for the fact except her diabetes and took it? Yeah,

Dana 3:53
but we don't know if it was type one. I don't know. So long ago, we bought her sugar free candy. And she had she had insulin.

Scott Benner 4:01
Did she mix the candy to the gin? I possible makes it sweeter.

Dana 4:09
Why wouldn't she right? Yeah,

Scott Benner 4:10
I mean, honestly. Okay, so nothing that you were on the lookout for. So what were your indications that your daughter had type one.

Dana 4:19
Nothing was really on the radar. And so we went on this spring break trip in April, and we went down to the Dominican so we live in New England. So of course we've been bundled up, you know, all winter. And come April we go to the Dominican. It's our first getaway after COVID and we see her in a bathing suit and she is skin and bones like every little bit of muscle is off of her and she was a she was an athletic kid with a very solid, just good build, you know? And we start in a bathing suit and there was not much there. It was scary. And my husband actually noticed it first and he said do you think she's too thin? And I didn't even look Got our I just didn't know, kind of like, Oh, can you be to fin and then and then I looked at her and I was like, Oh my God, she's really sick like something stairs going on. And I immediately jumped to she must have an eating disorder. Okay, so we spent that whole vacation like, cramming her full of doughnuts and surely temples and just, you know, me questioning her like, do you ever throw up after you eat? You know, do? Do you ever you know, are you ever hungry and you don't eat and, you know, I was just leaning all into my teenage daughter has an eating disorder. But I do remember laying in bed with her and trying to like, go through the possible list of things that it could be. And she says she remembers me,

Scott Benner 5:48
can I so before we move forward when you were when you were talking to her about like eating disorder stuff, right early on, where you saying to her, I think you have an eating disorder? Are you being very slick and talking about it?

Dana 6:00
Fully remember, I'm pretty direct. So I probably wasn't beating around the bush a lot. I was probably saying, you know, I am concerned that you may have an eating disorder, she

Scott Benner 6:10
respond to that saying I do or I don't.

Dana 6:14
She responded and mom, I promise I don't mom, I promise I don't get sick after I eat. I promise I've been eating. Okay. And then I said, Well, then, you know, then what else could it be? You know, and we're kind of Googling and she says she remembers me saying diabetes. That's one of the possibilities. I don't even remember considering that at the time. But you know, I remember being, you know, in a stall next to her in the bathroom in the Dominican and like looking underneath to see which way her feet were going because I was just so convinced that she was binging and purging or something.

Scott Benner 6:44
Is that something you did as a child? No, no, no. Okay. Yep. From an after school special. You saw like, what do you think put you on that? So probably

Dana 6:55
probably isn't, you know, she was just, you know, she's a string bikini kids. So she's a kid that would have cared about how she hurt her appearance and how she looks then.

Scott Benner 7:04
Did she know she was skinny? Had she like, then tar? Like, it wasn't something she was aware of. Okay,

Dana 7:11
I don't think she picked up on it either. I think it was so gradual. And we were so bundled up over winter. And looking back. I do remember coming down for school one morning, you know, here in the winter, and she had these tiny, tiny leggings on and I thought, wow, she's thin, you know, but I was I was a very skinny teenager. So I just assumed she's a skinny teenager, I was a skinny teenager.

Scott Benner 7:35
Yeah, I gotcha. Okay, so we get to the point where we're now looking into other things. You're just throwing whatever comes to the wall. But I mean, you go to a, do you start thinking about going home? How does that strike you?

Dana 7:47
Well, not really. I mean, she was exhausted, she slept a lot, she did not enjoy the vacation. But we've never thought we need to like get out of here immediately. So we finished the vacation, we came home, I started kind of rummaging through her room a little bit. And I did find a drawer beside her bed that was packed to the gills with food wrappers and juice box wrappers and, you know, things that to me just increased my suspicion that there was some type of binge disorder going on. So I was going to call the pediatrician anyway. But I think I don't know if I found the drawer food first or I called the pediatrician first. I think I think we got home on a weekend and I found the drawer food. And then Monday morning I called the pediatrician and I said, I think you know, our daughter has an eating disorder. And I explained the scenario and they said, I think you're probably right, bring her in Monday morning, we'll probably refer her to the Walden center in Eating Disorder Center up here. And that was the plan. So you know, Monday morning, we packed our bags for school and work. And we had like an ATM appointment with a pediatrician. And we talked for a few minutes, and then they did urine. And I guess her ketones were just spilling over. And her glucose was off the chart. And the pediatrician came back in the room and said I don't know how to tell you this, but your daughter has type one diabetes and you need to go to the hospital immediately. And then I needed to juicebox because I almost passed out. Got a little lightheaded. Did you? I did they laid me down. And then they were like, Okay, now you really need to go to the hospital. Even don't stop for food, don't do anything go straight there. They're waiting for you.

Scott Benner 9:27
You know, in the in the 50s or the 40s they would have said you got the vapors that would have been nice.

Dana 9:33
Even better than crappy juicebox

Scott Benner 9:36
that was very big and black and white movies. They would have sat you down and put a parasol over your head it would have been lovely. Yeah, so you pulled yourself up. And yep, do we drive do we take an ambulance what do we do? We

Dana 9:49
drove we drove wasn't far we drove like 20 minutes to our Children's Hospital. Okay, and they were waiting for her. It was perfect. They just brought her right in. You know she was in TK obviously and And they kept her in the ICU overnight

Scott Benner 10:02
but she was tan nice and tan we were all saying you guys probably looked a little ridiculous like glowing like Hello. So okay, Did you apologize to her in the car on the way to the hospital. If you take insulin or sulfonylureas you are at risk for your blood sugar going too low. You need a safety net when it matters most be ready with G voc hypo pen. My daughter carries G voc hypo pen everywhere she goes because it's a ready to use rescue pen for treating very low blood sugar and people with diabetes ages two and above that I trust. Low blood sugar emergencies can happen unexpectedly and they demand quick action. Luckily, G voc hypo pen can be administered in two simple steps even by yourself in certain situations. Show those around you where you storage evoke hypo pen and how to use it. They need to know how to use Tchibo Capo pen before an emergency situation happens. Learn more about why G vo Capo pen is in Ardens diabetes toolkit at G voc glucagon.com/juicebox. G voc shouldn't be used if you have a tumor in the gland on the top of your kidneys called a pheochromocytoma. Or if you have a tumor in your pancreas called an insulinoma visit G voc glucagon.com/risk For safety information. diabetes comes with a lot of things to remember. So it's nice when someone takes something off of your plate. US med has done that for us. When it's time for art and supplies to be refreshed. We get an email rolls up in your inbox says hi Arden. This is your friendly reorder email from us med. You open up the email. It's a big button that says click here to reorder. And you're done. Finally, somebody taking away a responsibility instead of adding one. US med has done that for us. An email arrives we click on a link and then next thing you know your products are at the front door. That simple. Us med.com/juice box or call 888-721-1514 I never have to wonder if Arden has enough supplies. I click on one link. I open up a box. I put the stuff in the drawer. And we're done. US med carries everything from insulin pumps, and diabetes testing supplies to the latest CGM like the libre three and the Dexcom G seven. They accept Medicare nationwide, over 800 private insurers. And all you have to do to get started is called 888-721-1514 or go to my link us med.com/juicebox using that number or my link helps to support the production of the Juicebox Podcast for thinking she had an eating disorder you don't remember do you don't remember any of this.

Dana 13:00
I don't remember that. I remember sitting in the backseat with her but I don't remember everything I said but I do know that, you know eventually at some point I apologized for for missing it because, you know hindsight 2020 All the signs. I mean, I had even taken her for an eye exam because her eye her vision was fuzzy. And you know, we knew that she was chugging water. I mean we all every single possible sign was there.

Scott Benner 13:28
Yeah. Hey, you were in the backseat. Are you a fancy lady? Do you have a driver?

Dana 13:31
I'm not a fancy lady. But I have a husband and he was driving together. Wise all three of your non fancy. Like, oh,

Scott Benner 13:41
look at her. She's in the backseat. Amazing. We're going to the hospital now. Bring this talk, please. Then come back and carry mother to the car. No, how long? Have you guys in the hospital for

Dana 14:01
only a night. I mean, she rebounded pretty quickly. I mean, they didn't start us off in the ICU but they they put us up there hurry when he was high. She was 16.6 and we spent the night in the ICU and the next morning. She was coming around and she was hungry. And I think you know we were waiting forever for them to give her allow her to have some solid foods or applesauce or something I don't remember but um, they discharged just that next afternoon to go to like an off site location about a half an hour away to get our you know, five six hours of education that we probably end up leaving the hospital around one of the next day packed with up a sandwich to to go practice with

Scott Benner 14:46
Wow, that's crazy. Just one day from from what was there anyone see

Dana 14:51
16.6 I

Scott Benner 14:52
don't understand. What did you feel like you got the bum's rush? No, not really.

Dana 14:58
We everybody kind I wanted to get out of there. And she she was, you know, chatty, and, you know, feeling better. So we can, I'm sure, but I didn't feel like we were being rushed out. Did

Scott Benner 15:11
you feel like you understood what you were doing when you left? No, not at all

Dana 15:16
that they sent but but they sent to us for five hours on IG. So that's the deal, like you get discharged at the Children's Hospital. And then you go to, you know, the endo center that's associated with a children's hospital. That's, you know, like about a half an hour away. And they're all there waiting that you know, the team of educators and so it's a whole class that you do immediately before they actually let you go home. I

Scott Benner 15:38
say, like fantasy island when you pull up, there's a bunch of people out front and white coat.

Dana 15:43
There was no red carpet. Well, we had a really dry turkey sandwich in a bag of pretzels.

Scott Benner 15:46
There's no chance anyone listening to this has ever seen Fantasy Island, by the way.

Dana 15:52
There might be some people I don't know. I think we're

Scott Benner 15:55
those of us that have got to be few and far between at this point. Anyway. Okay, so you do your five hours of education. Tell me what that yeah, what that was like to absorb all that? Because that seems like a lot of talking about diabetes on dates. Oh, it

Dana 16:10
was brutal. And I'll tell you, there was a defining moment, I think in that day, that really set her on kind of a sideways course. We have a physically a two diabetes educators, but one was primary. And that, you know, the deal was the hospital packed a lunch for us to take with us to us as the kind of counting carbs exercise. So you know that she's in a wheelchair, they give her a box, like a turkey sandwich and like this tiny, you know, not even the 100 Calorie bag or pretzels, like this tiny little airplane bag of pretzels, and a little bottle of water and she ends up dropping it. And we're like, you know, then we have to wait for them to make her another one. And we felt like finally we're getting out of here. You know, we're headed to the outpatient center. And we have our lunch in front of us and in the girls like now, what do you have for lunch? Like a turkey sandwich and some pretzels. Okay, so the turkey sandwich, let's look it up, how many carbs are in each slice of bread? And you know, she's teaching us how to do the math. And then she said, Okay, know how many carbs are in the bag of pretzels. And maybe it was 12 or something? And then she says, Now, are you going to eat that whole bag of pretzels? And I remember my daughter, I think that can use her name. No one's gonna know who she is. They kind of looked at me like, am I not supposed to eat this whole bag of pretzels? Like, I'm absolutely starving, I haven't had food. I could eat 12 of these bags of pretzels, you know. And so she said to the diabetes educator, maybe I'll eat half. And she was like, okay, so half. So that'll be six carbs. And so we did kind of our carb count. And I just remember Sadie like, almost like the blood draining from her face, you know, like, oh, everything's going to be different. Like, my food is going to be restricted. I'm not going to be able to eat the things I want to eat. Why? Why can't I have the whole bag of pretzels? You know, but we went through the process of, you know, the carb ratios and the correction factors. And you know, of course, we were in di and finger sticks. And you know, you know, I'm

Scott Benner 18:28
gonna stop on this point for a minute, because I'm in the middle right now, of going through this massive document where I'm trying to kind of plan out the next series that Jenny and I are going to do, which is going to be for doctors around diagnosis. Hmm, good. It's just so interesting, because what I keep coming up with over and over again, one of the bigger problems, I don't want to say the biggest problem but one of the bigger problems is that people's communication skills are terrible. Yeah, like just, they're not good at talking. And for me, if I go through the whole rigmarole of them, making me this turkey sandwich or packing this thing up and going through the thing of possible where this is what they're going to use to teach you about the ba ba so it's really important that drop it on the ground. I make me another one. I drive over there. And then I get there and some bright eyed phony lady looks at me and goes so what do we have to lunch? Like? My answer to you is, you know, damn right, well, what's in this bag? Why are you talking to me? Every kid comes here with the mother. Like why are you starting this off on this bowl? Three year old stance is what I would have been my even as a kid I would have been like, no, no, no, it let's not do this. But instead like to me, that's an indicator. It's all fake. And it's pretend and she's going to do the thing. Oh my god. And by the way, the question she asks about the pretzels. She just wants food shaming immediately, immediately. Personally, all the woman wants to do is indicate, look, the bag of pretzels has 12 carbs in it. But if you were just need half of it, that would be six carbs, you would use six, right? So let me explain to everyone listening who doesn't know how to talk, instead of making up a pretend scenario to get your point across, which, by the way, is what most of you passive aggressive people do while you're talking over and over again, just say this. If you're going to eat the entire bag, then give insulin for the carbs for the entire bag. If you think you're not going to eat all of it, then do the math like for say, I don't know, here's half the pretzels take six, or hey, while we're at it, in case you want to know spill the pretzels out for a second look, there's 12 Little pretzels in here. And there's 12 carbs, that must mean that each one of these pretzels is one. So you want nine of them. It's nine carbs, Hey, I'll tell you what, like, if you want eight of them, it's a like you can make your point a different way other than to put your daughter in a false scenario and make her choose. Because this is the possible outcome for some people. Yeah, you put into her head. Oh, am I not supposed to eat all of this? Yeah,

Dana 21:15
immediately felt judged for wanting to eat the whole bag. There was judgment. And just, I guess, you know, almost food shaming, like, well, I guess it would be more of a judgment. You know, she just felt like, I'm not supposed to eat this whole bag of pretzels. You know, and that's kind of how our first grocery store trip when and that that you know that? Sure. That takes us to a whole new problem that we are, you know, had to deal with off

Scott Benner 21:41
a cliff. And my point, my point is, just be direct. And be last. That's all. I am here today to explain to you how to look at carbs on packaging. Yeah, these pretzels, if you eat the whole bag are 12 carbs, D two bags, it's 24 cars, he half a bag, it's six, the sandwich? We don't know because we don't have the package here. So what I'm going to tell you is that a slice of bread is probably around 20 carbs. And you know there's protein in this turkey. We're not going to initially Bolus for it because we think it'll be okay. Because it's a low fat meal. By the way, I'm now giving them credit for understanding fat and protein rises, which I'm sure

Dana 22:23
they did not write right now. But we learned that here. Thank you.

Scott Benner 22:28
And now like, you know, and here we go. And we're going to put the insulin in. And you know what we can eat right away because they wait for it to work and wait for it to work a little bit. So I'll tell you what, why don't we test your blood sugar here, and then we'll put in the insulin based on you know, I'm sure they taught you the math of the correction factor and everything right there. And then pay I'll tell you what, let's wait for 10 minutes and test again, just so you can see that your blood sugar hasn't magically fallen through the floor in 10 minutes. And I've never considered how to teach somebody to do this. And I think that if you gave me three solid minutes to think about it, I could have ended up doing a better job than they did for that song. And that lady stands there all day. And does that for people. Yeah. And she has a really

Dana 23:13
squeaky voice. So it was well then

Scott Benner 23:17
let's drag her out in the street and beat her. No, just kidding.

Dana 23:21
What she should be fired, not

Scott Benner 23:23
very least you don't hire.

Dana 23:24
He was lovely. She was lovely. But she was lovely. And it could have been much better. Right?

Scott Benner 23:30
It's just so listen, my point is this. Obviously no one knows who she is. So whatever. But my point is this is that the way you speak to people needs to be thoughtful. Because everyone's going to absorb these things a different way your daughter took it the way she took it. You might have said that to me. And I might have done the math I might have went okay, what she's saying here is the bags 12. But I paid half I do six which by the way, it makes sense. And I don't really think anyone needs to explain that to me. But I'm glad she said it out loud. I don't know. Like there's just so many opportunities. As I as I like I said go through this document of what people said they wish their doctors would have told them in the beginning that I got feedback from the Facebook group. And then I'm applying what I have learned talking to so many people and trying to I'm trying to build a framework for how to have a conversation about it. And over and over and over and over again. All I see is that people are bad at communicating. Yeah, that's true. Almost every one of the problems could be solved by someone better communication, just doing a better job at that. So anyway, okay, so now we're on our way we're at the grocery store. She's wondering if she could have half of everything like what's going on? Yeah,

Dana 24:46
no, she's we're looking at labels and everything that she wants to eat and she's drawn to, you know, we flip the bag over or the box or whatever, and she's like, Nope, it's not worth a shot, you know, not worth a shot not worth a shot and we end about buying a bunch of really horrible non tasty foods, you know, I mean, we bought like the fake spaghetti like that's like rubber bands and a little bag. I don't even know what all

Scott Benner 25:13
of that spaghetti. So but she's under the impression at this point that she can limit the amount of time she has to do injections. Yes,

Dana 25:20
that that is that is, you know a focus of hers, like, I don't want to have to take, you know, a million shots or get large doses of insulin. So let's try to shop for things that will make this easier. But that's kind of what we walked away with. Yeah,

Scott Benner 25:38
but there she is now 13 years old. And she's standing in a grocery store trying to reimagine everything that she eats.

Dana 25:45
Yes. And she's like, I can't have any of this anymore. It was awful. Yeah,

Scott Benner 25:49
we all know how good kids aren't picking things they want to eat to begin with. So eliminating everything they enjoy, really probably a lot easier. Yeah. Well,

Dana 25:57
it certainly did backfire. No

Scott Benner 26:00
kidding. And on top of all that, and I'm gleaning from your note, you might have been feeling some pressure about this as well. Yeah.

Dana 26:09
Because, you know, I'm the one wants to get this right. You know, and I want to get that a one C. Down. And I want to be, you know, for lack of a better term, kind of the, the control freak or the micromanager, you know, and so, you know, when she would look at the box of, you know, junky cereal, you know, I was gonna write going along with it saying, I don't think that's a good idea. You know, like, I think we should look at keto granola bars. You know, like, I mean, I was definitely part of the problem and that grocery store trip based on kind of my experience in that educational, you know, as well,

Scott Benner 26:55
everyone's freaked out. So you're telling me that it might have been valuable? If someone said to you, listen, yes, you may be making some adjustments to how you eat, but we're not going to make them all today. So don't go to the grocery store and freak yourself out. You know, but I listened even I would say, like, let's not start with Lucky Charms. But like, the way you Bolus for Lucky Charms is not much different than how you're going to Bolus for some really heavy girl like, I don't know, crunchy, like, yeah, healthy cereal either has a ton of carbs in that as well. So yeah, yeah. I mean, it's. And

Dana 27:33
they said, you know, they said in the education, you know, you're not gonna have your Friday night pizza nights anymore. You're not gonna have pasta every Wednesday, like, they were basically telling us, this is going to change the way you eat. So we went to the grocery store with that mentality. You

Scott Benner 27:50
know, what's fascinating about that? Is that again, that's passive aggressive, because these are the same people who meet people every day at their regular appointments, who are coming in there with eight nine a one sees and going, I don't know, my blood sugars are all over the place. I eat pasta. My I don't know. So instead of teaching someone, hey, pasta is going to be a difficult thing to Bolus for. But don't worry, over time, we're going to get your Sass good, we're going to figure it out, you know, like that. It's not going to go likely very well in the beginning. Instead, they tell you, this is so interesting. Everything is set up like this, like the way people avoid things that are hard. Yeah, yeah. Things that are difficult or things that that aren't good for you. Like, here. Here's, here's my best example of this. Do you think drinking to excess is good for people? I do not know. There's an entire billion dollar industry built around it. Here's another one. Dana, do you think cocaine is good for people? I don't think it is. No, you know, we have world wars over the movement of drugs around the planet. It just really surprises me that saying it out loud to someone. Hey, you should really stop with your cocaine. didn't fix it. Yeah. That's yeah, that's amazing to me. Like no more pasta and pizza. Really? You think that did it you got her all straight now good for you. People are idiots. I'm sorry. Yeah, that's all I have. Two days, and I've been going through this document I am so mad at. I'm so upset about the way that this space, tries to address things that by the way, are are very, very manageable. If you understand how your insulin works, like unbelievable that we would jump through all of these hoops and send people down all of these backwards paths in their lives. Instead of just saying, hey, you know pasta is going to take more insulin than Yeah, right says right? Yeah, unbelievable. And

Dana 29:51
there are features like extended Bolus and Temp Basal. So there are strategies that you can use to be able to eat the foods that she as a 13 year old enjoys, you know, yeah, but anyway did it didn't take long, I would say within a month, month and a half she had a binge eating disorder. It was pretty quick. That's pretty

Scott Benner 30:09
quick. Yeah. So, so Is that how that starts, she restricts, restricts, restricts restricts and then can't do

Dana 30:17
it anymore. Awful. Yep. So, you know, she didn't stay out of school long I think she only, you know, we only kept her home for a couple of days. And then we're like, Alright, let's go, we're back at it. So she was back on track, she was back in soccer, you know, back to like walking with her friends after school. And I just remember we would like drive up to Dunkin Donuts, to meet her to give her a shot in the parking lot. So she could, you know, get something at Dunkin with our friends. But it was like, she was diagnosed in April, I would say it was probably May or June, you know, we started picking up on these really, really, really resistant highs. And there were I just felt like I was just pacing the hallway from, you know, to her bedroom pouring insulin on her just, you know, it's so just dumbfounded, like, why can't I get this down what's going on, you know, and she was she would come home from school and grab four or five protein bars and cheese sticks and packs the cookies. And she was binging after school and hiding the wrappers and, you know, wrapping them up in little tissues under her pillow under her bed to avoid injecting, not injecting, she just didn't want to inject. She didn't know then. And you were honestly, we're still kind of dealing with her being in denial of all of this even, you know, over two years later, yes, she, she did not want to deal with it. And she, you know, at that point kind of turned to, to food or, or as a coping mechanism just to kind of feel normal again, I think or to mourn the loss of her normal, quote unquote, normal life prior to diagnosis.

Scott Benner 32:04
You know, it occurs to me, I don't even know that what happened at the education is what did this like, maybe this is just her wiring, this

Dana 32:11
would have happened anyway,

Scott Benner 32:12
I was gonna happen anyway. But it certainly didn't help anything.

Dana 32:15
It didn't help, it didn't help because it, you know, it affected my mindset as well. And you know, and I'm, I'm driving the bus for the most part, you know, I'm, I'm, I'm doing the majority of the grocery shopping and trying to counsel her on, you know, what we're going to eat and how we're going to have for dinner, and you know, what the options are for breakfast, you know, so I was trying to be somewhat low carb and you know, restrict some of these, you know, more typical foods that we had pre diagnosis as well. So, you know, I take, you know, a huge piece of that.

Scott Benner 32:48
I'm gonna take the opposite side of this argument for a second. Because I think that I think that can what can happen sometimes, is that because the, I don't know, the perspective I bring to this is that I'd like people to understand how to use insulin for whatever they're going to eat. Because I don't feel like I can tell the world how to eat, right, like, and bye bye. I could I could stand up and bang a drum if I wanted to. And I could yell and scream and no one would listen to the podcast, and that'd be the end of it. But but I'm not saying I couldn't say it. I'm saying that. I don't think that's how you get through to people. And if you're waking up every day and eating a bowl of Lucky Charms, if you want my personal opinion, take me out of this podcast for a second. I think you're making a health mistake. Yeah, sure. Regardless of your diabetes, no diabetes, I don't even care. Like you could be seven feet tall and look like an Adonis. If you're eating a bowl of cereal every morning, I think you're probably making a long term health mistake that your body is in such good shape and is compensating for in the moment. That's my personal opinion. Okay, now, to say that I won't eat a bowl of cereal this year. I mean, may or may not happen. But if some were to bring like some like crunch Berry, Captain Crunch in here or something like that, I got to think one day around two o'clock in the afternoon in between editing podcasts, I'd might throw a bowl. That can happen to me. Okay, if you put it here, are you asking me if I would buy it? I wouldn't buy it. If it ended up in the house. I would 1,000,000% Eat it. Okay, now, I as a matter of fact, I might be one of those people who like a week from now it's like that whole box at Crunch Berries out that happen. Like, you know, like, I'm not saying that. But if you're using insulin, that's more difficult than if you were to eat something else. And by the way, most low carb people would make the example like you know, in the morning have bacon and eggs because like, who wouldn't get sick every single day. And by the way, nothing over and over again is great. But I mean, for my money. I think bacon's terrific. If you gave it to me three days in a row, I'd be like, Oh, this is crazy. and making me upset. And so like, I couldn't do that either. My point has always been know how insulin works, adapt it to your lifestyle, then once this whole diagnosis periods over and even that you could be years into it, like now you've got managed blood sugar's stability, health on the diabetes side. And now you can address if you want, the way you eat, but trying to trying to on the same day, tell a person, let alone a 13 year old person trying to tell a person, hey, you have an incurable disease, you're gonna have to inject yourself with needles all the time. And bonus, you can't eat any of the food that you enjoy. Well, I don't know, what are we doing? Like? Who thinks that's going to go? Well? Or, you know, and for people who would yell, we'll eat keto, you go grab me 513 year olds off the street? No, don't give them diabetes. Don't tell them their life has just changed. Don't have them start thinking about like the oatmeal man from the commercials and had the diabeetus and oh my god, what am my friends gonna think and blah, blah, blah, I don't want to stick myself to take don't even give them all that. Grab a bunch of 13 year old kids and tell them they're only eating keto from now on, and see if you don't get kicked in the middle of the street by a bunch of 13 year old. Yeah, so I don't understand the thinking. Like, again, I know, I'm not supposed to be shooting heroin. But yet, here we are. And the whole world is shooting heroin. So like, like, like, what are we acting like just telling people the right thing is how is how you fix? It's effective? Yeah, Jesus Christ. Everyone knows that's not right. Right. Like

Dana 36:47
every, but thankfully,

Unknown Speaker 36:50
I will say good, where we

Dana 36:52
did find the podcast early on, like, you know, when I was doing scrolling, the one night in the hospital, I found it somewhere in some thread. So I would say it was I was pretty quick to get, you know, educated on the whole philosophy here of just insulin at the right time, the right amount for the right food, like you know, so it wasn't long in our house until we realized you can have the chicken tenders and french fries. You can have the Chinese food like we can have these normal things on occasion, as we normally would on occasion. And we can Bolus we can do this. You know, we have strategies. We have extended Bolus we have Temp Basal. And so you know, we didn't live in this like hell of like we can only have eggs and you know, rubberband, spaghetti, we that we that that phase was short, thankfully. And we ended up you know, using Jenny did a six month retainer with Jenny, who was absolutely phenomenal. And we learned so much. And you know, really, I was all in on, you know, let's, let's Bolus for fat protein. We do Basal testing, like, you know, I zoned right in on let's let's use these strategies to the best of our ability and allow Sadie to kind of eat what she needs to eat as a teenager wants to eat and it makes us work. But I would say it didn't, it didn't fix what had already started, you know.

Scott Benner 38:27
So, so let's let's kind of get to it. Now she has been diagnosed with depression. Now she has

Dana 38:36
Yeah, so that came a little bit later. So the eat when we found the wrappers, we did go, we did decide to do an eating disorder intake. So during that intake, we learned that Sadie had had some feelings of self harm and suicidal ideation. So that that was news to us, you know, sitting at that intake. So then she was given, essentially, you know, taken her to pediatrician and given a diagnosis of depression as well. So, you know, now and she's got Hashimotos that was given at the hospital. So, you know, now we're looking at type one, how she, you know, binge eating disorder, depression, feelings of self harm, and suicide.

Scott Benner 39:22
Hey, when did they diagnose the Hashimotos in

Dana 39:26
the hospital? That was that was part of what came back and the whole, you know, routine blood work that they did in the hospital, and I have hypothyroidism and so there's my mom. Now, no one's ever checked our antibodies. I would just assume it's probably Hashimotos.

Scott Benner 39:40
But did they start medicating that right away?

Dana 39:43
You know, the doctor offered to and I hadn't looked at the bloodwork enough to think about that for like a week or two. And then I circled back with them and said, Yes, I would like to start

Scott Benner 39:57
that. Okay, I don't want that pretty much yeah. Because depression can be like untreated, thyroid issues could lead to it. Yeah, that's why it was right. Okay. Yeah.

Dana 40:06
No, she started treatment pretty early on with Leivo. Okay,

Scott Benner 40:10
where did they keep her? TSH?

Dana 40:12
They do a pretty good job. Actually. It's always under three. Usually under two. I keep mine under two. Yeah, mine was recently up to nine. I didn't know it in the blood work showed it and he bumped me up and then we rechecked and it was under two. Interesting

Scott Benner 40:24
under two is where I vote. But I interesting about yours jumping up. Arden got home from college. And she didn't seem like herself. Yeah, this last time. And you know, we she was she had been gone for six months. So she was going to that the doctor anyway, when she got home, and her TSH jumped up to over five. Wow. Yeah. So and the doctor was like, Look, I don't think this is a thing where we're going to, like, need to raise up your medication forever. So she did this thing. Like, I don't want to, like tell people like this is not something you should do on your own. But you know, she did some calculations and hit her hard for 10 days with a large a larger dose of something and then put her back to her other thing. I'm okay, you know, and he's a kind of a wizard. So, yeah, we the thyroid stuff. So actually, she has to go back and get another blood draw before she goes back to school to see where we're at. Yeah,

Dana 41:23
see where it is? Yeah.

Scott Benner 41:25
Anyway, what was your symptoms when your TSH I'm

Dana 41:30
done? Never had any I've never had any and neither to my mom. We never gained weight. We never felt tired. We're like wired. 24/7. So, like, if anything, I have trouble relaxing and going to sleep. So you would almost think I have hyper, you know? Well,

Scott Benner 41:45
you're very cocky. So no. And you're from New England. So

Dana 41:51
just adapted very well. I grew up in Virginia, and I went to college in Georgia. I just moved up here for work.

Scott Benner 41:56
Gotcha. I have to tell you that so far. The most surprising thing in this conversation is that the internet exists in New England that I didn't know for sure. Oh, yeah, we got it. Yeah, we sure do. Get the wires to do all the trees.

Dana 42:08
Very consistent. Now. It doesn't always work. Yeah, yeah, I

Scott Benner 42:12
got you. You don't have to. I said you're very Caucasian. When you were like, I'm I'm wired. And I'm like, my DNA back. It's the most boring DNA in the world. I'm just looking at your photo. And like if I went to Google right now and typed in white lady, it's possible you would?

Dana 42:29
Yes. And I was told that I had Native American blood and when I was being raised and why those

Scott Benner 42:35
people idea? Yes. So how do you address when the mental health stuff comes up in the eating disorder intake? How does that all get addressed? So we went

Dana 42:49
on the waitlist for the eating disorder center, because it was like a six month plus waitlist. So we just went to the pediatrician and the pediatrician, thankfully, who's a nurse practitioner, but she's phenomenal, agreed to start her on Zoloft. Because at that point, we were still kind of in COVID. Land, it was nearly impossible to get in with a pediatric psychiatrist. So she started on a low dose 25 milligrams and got us on the waitlist with like an adolescent medicine specialist that was going to be a doctor that could kind of help us with the, the eating disorder, the depression, and maybe kind of the self harm piece. So eventually, when we got on with her, she bumped the dose up. And then it was around that, you know, maybe we were with her for a little while, eventually got in with a psychiatrist.

Scott Benner 43:39
Did she actually hurt herself? Or was she just having thoughts about it?

Dana 43:43
She eventually did. Yeah. So you know, it became very routine that she was very depressed. Not showering, not doing your hair, not putting makeup on not doing your homework, spending time in bed, not wanting to be with friends, which is very different from me. And she prior to diagnosis was the kid and we are the house that has friends over right? The door's always open. The pantry is always full. There's a pool, there's a volleyball net, there's a trampoline. It's the funhouse. Right? So that started to go away, you know, and it felt weird. And Sadie would just spend a lot of time you know, at home alone kind of living in that, that depression and then I being the kind of type a control freak that I am. I have trouble understanding that even though even though I do from an intellectual standpoint, understand that, you know, I still would say things like, Come on, let's get up. Let's go for a walk. Let's, you know, you know, we got to we got to do something, we got to feel better. We got to, we gotta move our bodies, you know, and that was being met with significant resistance. And my husband and I were constantly fighting about it because you know, you She would come home from school and he would be working from home and she would take all these snacks up to a room. And he would be oblivious to it because he was in the office, you know, basically with a headset on working all day. And I was out working all day. And I would just see these blood sugar numbers, you know, 303 50, and I'd be texting, I'm like, more insulin, please. You know what's going on over there, you know, driving them all crazy. And I think, you know, at one point, I guess we kind of reached, we did reach somewhat of a boiling point. And we were like, I think I would be better off if I didn't live here, because you guys are driving me crazy. And I'm driving you crazy. Then I ended up in a hotel for a couple of nights, just to kind of let everybody decompress, maybe and think about what what are we doing here? And what's our goal? And what do we need to do for safety? But you know, I would be, you know, trying to do the Warsaw method, you know, won the fat and protein and my husband is still like, how do I do it Temp Basal. And, you know, I would just get very, very frustrated, you know, you know, I would spend a lot of time talking about the podcast, they were like, Would you shut the EFF up about the podcast? You know, like,

Scott Benner 46:07
I hear that sometimes. So you're in one direction, 1000 miles an hour, and they're in the other direction? Not not moving at all. Right? Exactly. She's not Bolus thing for her food. Your husband doesn't grasp the necessity behind it. How is that possible, by the way,

Dana 46:22
or the complexity? Okay. Yeah, I mean, I understood the necessity of like, okay, if you're going to have a plate of spaghetti, you need the Bolus for it. But just the complexity of what this food means and what this glycemic glycemic index will do. And you know what this cheese is going to do four hours later, and you know, that that just wasn't that just wasn't there for him, you know, and he, he struggled to grasp it, Sadie didn't care, right? You know, she wasn't gonna take the lead with that. And I was all in. So it just created a ton of conflict

Scott Benner 46:57
with your husband, like, before you went to the Marriott. Like, you sit down, you explain, like, hey, her blood sugars are high. This is gonna really hurt her. We're shortening her life significantly, like you say those things. And he goes, what?

Dana 47:14
Um, it basically sounded something like, I know that. And I'm working, I'm in my office, I'm working. I'm on the phone. What do you want me to do? You know, and kind of like you want to you want to deal with it. You work from home, you deal with it? You know? And I'm like, well, the job I had at the time, I was like, I can't work. It's not an option. I'm on the road. I'm in sales. Yeah.

Scott Benner 47:34
But let me let me let me keep going with this. So do you think he really understands what we're talking about? Like, do you think he really understands that she's going to like, not like, she's gonna start losing her vision in her 30s That her like, like her kidneys are gonna stop working, that she's going to have gastroparesis, like, I'm naming a bunch of things that I've had people on here, tell me have happened to them, when they grow up through their teens don't pay attention to their blood sugars and get up in their mid 20s or early 30s. Like, do you think that? Or do you think that he just didn't really think that was going to happen? Because I'm trying to imagine you're still together, right? Yeah, yeah. So I imagine you're married to somebody who hopes and expects your daughter to live a long time to be healthy. So when when people are met with the idea, like I understand the kid, like she's 13, even if it happened to you, and you were blocking it out as an adult, I don't understand that. But the people around you who are adults, who are have been informed. I just don't understand. Like, to me, it's like holding a lighter under your arm, like I get if you're doing it. I don't understand if your dad doesn't swap the lighter out of your hand. That's right,

Dana 48:45
right. Yeah. And I think, you know, it's still a little bit of that, well, it's not gonna happen to her or it's not that bad. Or, you know, she's a teenager and teenagers are going to go through, you know, difficult periods. And this is still new, you know, just a lot of kind of excuses. Meanwhile, really, her agency had gotten quite good. Okay. Because I was the insulin. I mean, I drove everyone crazy, but I got her down to a 6.1 you know, pretty quickly.

Scott Benner 49:18
Yeah, you're running around like crazy yelling Bolus every five seconds crazy.

Dana 49:22
Yeah. Crazy. Night crazy all day. Crazy out of the house. Crazy. Yes. Yeah.

Scott Benner 49:27
So you're holding, you're propping up the whole thing?

Dana 49:30
Yes. And it was terrible. Sure. For everyone.

Scott Benner 49:35
No, I for different reasons.

Dana 49:36
Yeah. And then I will say like, you know, my, you know, I would just be full of a lot of rage and anger because I felt like I was kind of trying to do all this on my own.

Scott Benner 49:48
No one's listening. No one seems to care as much as you do. The pressure of her staying alive and healthy, false solely on you because nobody else is paying attention to it. Like that kind of stuff. That's how it felt you Oh,

Dana 50:01
gotcha. And then she started cutting.

Scott Benner 50:03
Perfect. Yeah, you were probably like, I don't know why I didn't know what I was doing before. Now I really don't know. Yeah. Now we got more problems. I mean, the six month waiting list, by the way for the eating disorder centers. I mean, confusing. I understand how it happens. But I mean, again, it's like calling the fire department being like, my house is on fire. Like we have a slot for you. And I know you're gonna, on Tuesday, do you? Would you prefer if we came in April or May? Because I can do the third week of April, the second week of May you let us know?

Dana 50:36
Yeah, it was that bad. And it was still virtual only and she was just like, forget it. I will zone out. 100%. Don't even put me in there. You know. So we actually never did it. We found other resources. Okay, but we did not go into that program. Where

Scott Benner 50:54
are we right now, Dana? Like how do things stand today? Right now we

Dana 50:59
are in a DBT Dialectical Behavioral Therapy program. With a psychological group that's about an hour away from us, we started there at the advice of her psychiatrist. Because the multiple things right the eating disorder, the self harm, the binge eating, and then what we didn't touch on, but just briefly, a loss of friendships, she really lost her friends. And she started going down with the wrong crowd. So much so that we changed her school, so that the psychiatrist looks at us at our second visit, and said, I think you need DBT therapy. And DBT is there to kind of help with emotion regulation. And really, apparently, it's shown to be effective for many of these things, self harm, eating disorders, not type one diabetes, but you know, all the emotional stuff that she was also dealing with. So we are deep into that program they have, we have a group every Tuesday night for an hour and a half. She's in a group of teens, we're in a group of parents, and then she has a one on one with her therapist on Thursdays. And I think that we don't get a lot of feedback from the therapists because there's a lot of they do keep things very confidential between Sadie and her, her therapist, but we can tell that there's the disordered eating is a lot better. We're not fighting, you know, I'm not fighting highs all night that I can't explain. I'm not finding rappers in a room. For the most part. Now I do occasionally. But for the most part, that's a lot better. We're not seeing cutting if it's happening. I'm I'm just not aware of it. But when I have, you know, I'm told that that's better. So that program is going to be coming to a close in about five weeks.

Scott Benner 52:50
Because she's graduating or because they're moving out of town.

Dana 52:53
It's it's it'll be the end of the program. It'll be graduation for all the teams. However, they did spring on us yesterday that she's not really ready to graduate. And they want us to keep her in what they call the grad group. So kids that have completed the program, but still need need to be in the program, essentially.

Scott Benner 53:11
Can I ask, is there any indication of these ideas? If she doesn't get diagnosed with diabetes? Did you see her I know, it's tough because she was just 13. But were we moving in this direction?

Dana 53:22
I don't think so. No, I really don't. I mean, she had such a fun adolescence, so many friends so active, you know, sports, and they would get on their bikes and ride down to the river. And they would have, you know, swim parties here late at night and sleepovers. And she would get invited to do things. I mean, all that neck came to a grinding halt. She hasn't she didn't get was I didn't do anything. Do

Scott Benner 53:49
you think she's changed in a way that other people are like, I don't want her around? Or do you think? Okay,

Dana 53:55
sadly, sadly, I do. Yeah. Yeah. Because I think she's, she's, she's pissed. And I think she has lashed out at friends. And she's also very much still in denial of her diagnosis. So, you know, we still struggle a lot with her novels before she eats. You know, we're about to send her back to school and sports. And she's 15 she's going to be a sophomore. We're not sure we can have the doctor write up the orders to make her independent at school. Because last year, we tried that. As a freshman, we thought okay, freshman she she can be independent. She can Bolus before her lunch. That's what she wanted. But the endo thought was appropriate. And within a few months, it was it had gone sideways like I you know, we see our numbers get up over 300 You know, practically daily. So we changed the order, so she had to go to the school nurse but then she still wouldn't go or they snack and not have insulin. We'd have to call the school nurse three, four times a day every day. Please Just call her down. She needs insulin, please call her down, you know? And so we're, we still haven't we're not we're really not much of a better place for that.

Scott Benner 55:07
Yeah. Do you have other kids? Yes, the neglected

Dana 55:10
one, Charlotte, she's turning 13

Scott Benner 55:16
I was gonna ask what it's been like for her as well,

Dana 55:18
often, because he's a worrier. So she worries about safety. And she feels left out a lot. We've spent so much time and energy and focus on safety, all these appointments and these therapy programs and just that's been so consuming, that, you know, he or she has, like, could somebody just play Uno with me, you know, with somebody just like, um, read a book with me, you know, it, like my heartbreaks for her because she was, so she was, you know, 11 when this happened, and her life got turned upside down to

Scott Benner 56:01
Yeah, so yeah, that's terrible. I'm sorry, awesome. Stress for her. How are you? Okay, thanks. That's not sound very

Dana 56:14
just kind of charge on. Yeah. Wow.

Scott Benner 56:16
It's a lot. I'd go back to the hotel if I was you.

Dana 56:21
I'm doing Monday night, but they're coming with me do it.

Scott Benner 56:25
Do you see a path out of this yet? Or is it not obvious yet?

Dana 56:30
My hope is the path out of this is through this DBT work that we're doing. They it is a phenomenal group of psychologists. Additionally, Sadie's going through a battery of testing right now for ADHD, OCD, learning disorders. And I suspect that they will pick up on something, it's possible that if she has ADHD that is contributing to forgetting to Bolus there, you know, there could be something else going on. It's not just Sadie being negligent, you know. But, you know, we had a terrible school year last year in terms of the homework not getting done. And I forgot that I forgot this. No, I forgot that. She plays sports, but she wouldn't pay attention to her blood sugar. So, you know, she'd be on the court at 300. Or she'd be on the court at 50. You know, she, she doesn't, did not and, um, I fear this year, she still will not want to deal with it enough to manage it through another sports season. Okay.

Scott Benner 57:36
So we got a couple of things going on. You're worried she's gonna start playing sports, too? Well, she,

Dana 57:41
she loves volleyball. So I don't think that she would make an active decision to not want to play. But I think if she doesn't get a handle on how to manage this through the season, the coach can't rely on her inner team can't rely on her. She's of no help to them if her blood sugar is 300 or 50.

Scott Benner 58:02
I have a question. So how does she manage? What is she using?

Dana 58:06
Oh, she's on the Omnipod five. And we recently switched to the G seven. We actually have a couple of G sixes left. But we recently switched to the G seven just to try a smaller device for her because she is so self conscious. And she wants to hide it all and you know, the closed loop? I guess, you know, everything would every alarm would go off when she would get an urgent low and any little beep and barristers are in a little clique associated with the micro Bolus was embarrassing when she was in class. So anyway, moving over to the g7. She actually surprisingly wants to go back to the GS six, but that's how we manage

Scott Benner 58:41
Hold on a second. You're not using Omnipod five, but G seven. They don't work together yet. So well.

Dana 58:46
We they're both attached to her body. But it's obviously it's it's not a loop. We're in manual mode.

Scott Benner 58:51
So you're wearing it on the five five running it in manual while she's doing g7. But she does she missed the automation. Do you think?

Dana 58:59
I think a little bit a little bit. Yeah, I think we'll probably let this g7 script run out and go back to the G six. Because yeah, it was certainly a little bit handier for like going into activity mode. And it could certainly tackle the rise from you know, ice cream or a cheese stick or something, you know, so it did help in certain aspects that I was up three times last night given her corrections that I wouldn't have had to do if she was on the G six.

Scott Benner 59:27
What's her agency

Dana 59:29
right now? 6.2 So it's been as low as five eight, but

Scott Benner 59:32
you're but you're constantly involved.

Dana 59:35
I'm crazy. Yes. 100% Yes. And

Scott Benner 59:38
what's your standard deviation? Is that bouncing Is it high? Oh,

Dana 59:43
I wish I had repeating me in front of me. Yeah, it's it bounces a lot. It's probably 3540 Like if we if we let her contract like sleepover with friends for birthday 350 overnight, they just had a bunch of candy and didn't do anything. You know, she was a forage camp and they had a bunch of candy are constantly over 300. So if if I wasn't the crazy person on the sidelines trying to correct everything, day one C would be so horrendous.

Scott Benner 1:00:11
Listen, I'm gonna I'm gonna ask you a question. Did you listen to the episode about the eyelet? Yeah, okay. Oh,

Dana 1:00:17
yeah, I was totally on top of that. I saw the news. But you know, before you got him on, we would never go to a two pump.

Scott Benner 1:00:26
Okay, so the tubing would be the issue for her. But would ya to take a break for a second? If you told her look, all you have to do is say, large meal, medium meal, small meal. would she do that? Or you think she probably wouldn't do that either.

Dana 1:00:40
We talked about it yesterday morning, I think there's a good chance she wouldn't do that either. Because it's still just changing gears, you know, and admitting that you have to deal with something that you don't want to deal with.

Scott Benner 1:00:52
I think there's just a large interesting piece

Dana 1:00:54
of denial though, going on there. It's just it her preference would be to avoid this and pretend it's not there.

Scott Benner 1:01:02
Okay. No, I completely understand. Okay. So Dana, I think we've done a good job of going through all of this. I'm going to try to end on an upbeat note. Okay, what did you tell me right before we started recording?

Dana 1:01:16
Oh, that I'm the main person that's responsible for getting rid of talking about religion on the Facebook page.

Scott Benner 1:01:22
So the Facebook page now has had a rule for like, I don't know how long now that just says it says no religion or politics. Right. That's it right. And well, yeah. And I, by the way, I don't really stop people from talking about stuff. It's just that if it gets out of hand, I can point to that. I can point to that rule as to why I have to shut the thread off. If it happens. It doesn't happen very often. But I don't remember what you're talking about. So can you please, like, relive it with me?

Dana 1:01:50
Yeah. Well, there's, I remember there being a political post one time and I comments. And I was like, Hey, I thought we were going to talk about politics. And, and then it occurred to me then I was like, that's funny. We have no politics rule, but we don't have no religion rule. But I didn't really think much of it. And then one day, there was one of these posts. And it was lovely, but it was all like, Thank God, or thank Jesus, you know, my son is alive or my daughter's, you know, if it weren't for God, or Jesus, I wouldn't, you know, unlike unlike, and then I just wanted to, I think we have should have a no religion rule, in addition to the no politics rule. And then you actually commented and respectfully, they and I disagree, because faith is a large part of people's lives. And I shut up I didn't, I didn't, I didn't say another word on the whole thread. But my philosophy was, or maybe I did comment on one person on the front, because my philosophy was mechanically, your faith has nothing to do with blood sugar. Mechanically speaking. It's it doesn't it does not play a role. Your faith may be important to you, but this is about managing blood sugar and working with insulin. And I don't know sometimes I just religion just is a turn off for me. Personally, just,

I'm not a non religious person. Don't get me wrong. She got my daughter to go to a Catholic school. We are not anti religion.

Scott Benner 1:03:15
I want to just tell you, Dana, I know you're a Catholic, even though I never asked you but go ahead.

Dana 1:03:20
Catholic, Protestant, my husband was raised Catholic.

Scott Benner 1:03:23
Somebody is it? I could tell for sure. But yeah, but so Okay, so here's my thought on it. Yeah, I, I don't just not have a problem with it. I'm completely unencumbered by the thing that you're upset by. So if somebody if somebody wants to say, I pray that this happens, or I want to thank Jesus for like, I not only do I not have a problem with it, it doesn't. I don't rub up against it at all, like so it doesn't make me upset. I wonder what but it did you and it does for other people as well. Yeah. And I think I think that if I'm paying attention correctly, it is really the difference between the brain that says that there's a higher power and the brain that says that there's not a higher power, and for the people who say that that's not in existence. Then when you say things like I need help with my health, or I hope this blood sugar I praying with this blood sugar comes down your brain goes don't pray Bolus. And by the way, my brain says that to my brain says don't pray Bolus, but I also am not upset that they're praying for it. I would just say, Hey,

Dana 1:04:32
I am not either. And listen, somebody asked me to pray for their dog the other day and I told them, I would pray for their dog. I'm not anti prayer.

Scott Benner 1:04:39
Do you know let me go with you on that for a second. I would not do that. If you asked me to pray for you. Well, I do love dogs. No, no, it's not the dog park. at the dog park, if you said to me, can you please pray for whatever I would say I will absolutely keep a good thought for you. And I

Dana 1:04:58
generally say I I will send my goodbyes I really do generally. And

Scott Benner 1:05:02
I would honestly throughout the day think about you. Oh, yeah, but I would say my goodbyes, right. But that that request wouldn't send me into a private room bedside, where I would decide that I'm going to pray for the dog. Wherever we

Dana 1:05:18
disclose. I did not pray for the dog. The dog, my good dude, I sent the dog my good

Scott Benner 1:05:25
lady that you would pray for her dog. Is that right? I did. Yeah. I hope she hears this. I hope one day she goes, Oh, my God, I was I really I thought that's why that dog lived.

Dana 1:05:37
Here. No, I just, you know, I find a lot of religion to just be a little bit. What's the word? It's like? I don't know, the the overall the the I don't know that. Some people are just so focused on religion that I feel like some things aren't very genuine and kind of underneath. Why does

Scott Benner 1:05:58
that? Why does that matter to you? Because because there are people like, I'm not saying that. There's not genuine or kind. I'm saying that if that's your assessment, there are other people who you would assess that way who aren't religious? Why does it matter? When it comes from religion? Something happened to you when you were young, they turned you off?

Dana 1:06:16
Well, I would say that nothing specific happened to me, I was young. I mean, I was raised in a church that didn't have a bad experience or anything. I just find that some of the people that proclaim to be followers of Jesus followers of Christ, are some of the more judgmental closed minded people that I have ever encountered.

Scott Benner 1:06:35
Well, I don't know about that. But they do have a lot of rules they're trying to follow. So

Dana 1:06:39
just something rubs me the wrong way. And there are people within my own family that, you know, proclaim to be, you know, followers of Jesus and born again. And you know, they go to church every Sunday, they wouldn't stop and buy a sandwich for a homeless person, they would say, why does that homeless person have a cell phone? You know, there's judgment. So

Scott Benner 1:07:00
Dana, we're getting to it. So in your personal life, you know, people who proclaim religion, but are not very religious minded.

Dana 1:07:07
They're not very good people. When it comes down to

Scott Benner 1:07:10
it. Oh, yeah. So that's been your experience. Yeah, that's in that is my bias, right to call it colors that you think about. But now, extrapolate that all out. And put me put yourself in the position of me, who is running a Facebook group with 40,000 people in it? I don't care about I have some regret after I made it. I don't care about what you saw your uncle do. Okay. Or, or your biases, I don't care about them, just like I don't care about the other ones. You have to understand that, from my perspective, it doesn't matter. If Jesus is a walking talking person living in a cloud, or if it's a Buddha Meister that somebody made up 4000 years ago, I honestly don't care. I'm running a place where both people, right. And their beliefs exist at the same time. And so it doesn't matter to me, if you say, like, we just had a situation the other day situation made it sound like a lot more than it was. But somebody said, I'm praying for this. And a person came in and was like, there's no religion in this group. Like didn't just say it, they dropped a photo of the of the rose, like, oh, that person's looking for a fight. So I step in, and I remove his comment. And I sent him a private note. And I'm like, Look, I don't know what you're doing here. But stop. Like, that's literally what I said. So then I had a private back and forth with that person, where they said, I'm just going through a lot right now. I have a couple of family members with health issues. I'm stretched too thin. And in all honesty, I got online to get posts to make myself feel better. And I feel bad about that. I'm sorry. Right. So that's mostly my consideration when I'm moderating is that even the day that you did it? Something was and listen, you just spent an hour explaining in a way that I think everyone listening could understand if you were having a bad day, and you wanted to go pick something that you were sure you were right about to feel good about for a second. That's my anticipation when I see that I don't think anyone is a bad person. Like I don't think people set out to harm people. I think I think that people get in bad situations, they have bad days, they have bad days to turn into bad weeks, they need a release, and they pick something where they can kind of just get it out a little bit. And I think that happens online a lot. And so it's my it's my job to step up and go, ah, doesn't matter to me. Like yeah, you can't say that to her. And, and so I'm not going to let you I don't and people are like, well, you agree with her? Not me. I'm like if you're confused. I don't give a flying fuck about either your opinions. I'm not friends. You're misunderstanding my job. I'm moderating the space. I'm not making it. argument about whether you're right or they're right, I couldn't possibly care less. Although I do care when people use that phrase wrong when they say I couldn't care less. Or I could care less if you say I could care less than you actually could do less. So the phrase is I couldn't care less, which means I care so little. There's nothing below that. Anyway, nothing left. Here's my sound. That's my, my language.

Dana 1:10:31
About like, praying. There's just that that one and egg issue, right. It was like at the right moment, the right time. It was a very knee jerk react response on my part, but I don't go down that I do not go down the thread and have comments and get roped into any drama whatsoever. But I see that stuff all the time. And I don't I don't say anything. Because, you know, reality is people having faith and religion in their life doesn't offend me. Yeah, you know, that particular one was just like, I was just kind of like, I had to like, Are you kidding me? response.

Scott Benner 1:11:05
So I don't remember the context of it. But I'm going to read you something that is going to just, I assume crack you up. And I hope give everybody a lot of respect for people who do this thing of helping people online and moderating spaces. Let me see if I can follow me. And if I don't find this, I'm going to be embarrassed Hold on a second. I got yelled at pretty good online the other day privately. It's more fun when they yell at me privately. I'm super excited about that when that happened. And DM Oh, yeah, yeah. So hold on. A roll. No, do you? Oh, here it is. Okay. So a person doesn't matter what the context was online, was being an asshole. Now I can see, they don't think they're being alright. And that's fine. But they are they're picking through a thread and jabbing at people and trying to cause problems. And I let them be themselves. But when they were unkind, I took out their phrase. So their their comment, honestly, there's a ton of rules on the Facebook group, because people's behavior precipitates them being necessary. But if it was up to me, the only rule on the group would say be kind, because I think I think I think it covers everything. Yeah. So I get a note from this person that says, I want to tell you that I was being nice. And I was being exactly how I would like to be treated. If I said something that was getting ignorant. Oh,

Dana 1:12:45
I just lost your nice,

Scott Benner 1:12:47
because then I meant to be called out. Just because culture is this way for this person doesn't mean that the rest of us have to believe it. Or that it's right. But also don't generalize and but and it goes online. And then at the end, this is really my favorite thing. Except Hold on. There's a thing going by my house is gonna be the end of the world. What in the hell?

Dana 1:13:11
No flying your plane.

Scott Benner 1:13:12
This is the last recording of Scott Benner. I want to say goodbye to everybody. I love cheese house. Thank you all for coming. Okay, so but at the end, I won't be recommending anyone else to this group. I'll let them know that they don't have freedom of speech. So anyway, I could pick through this if you want me to people don't understand what freedom is. There's a lot going on here. Right? So I respond back. And I say first of all the same thing. I always say when somebody DMS me now let's be clear, other people would block you. And that would be the end of it. Not me. I feel like I can get you back. I don't have these conversations in private, because in the past, people will screenshot what I've said and change it and then reshare it. I understand you don't agree. I am moderating a large group. It is a job you don't want trust me. I removed a few of your posts and simply asked you to be nice. Two hours later, I came back and you're telling someone that anyway, then she did it again. I don't want to be too specific. Yeah, I said, so. Two things. I have a life and can't do this all day long. And what you just did is under no interpretation. Nice. So I asked you to be nice. And then you came back and you did it again. Your account was suspended for three days. I hope you come back when this is over. Have a good evening. I want to be done. But I can't be done. Because I get a response. Well, well, you stopped me from posting. So I can't post it there, which is why I'm sending this to you. And I said well, yes I did that because you continue to be unkind. I was trying to be kind by explaining to you that I don't normally talk privately, but then I went on to explain anyway. All right. I hope you have a good night. I also have a king right to say something that Ticknor. But it's okay that your admins continue to comment on my stuff, and will not. So by the way, there are other people trying to stop her from being a lunatic, like, kindly and she sees us as being attacked. Now, I say those people are not admins. They're just lovely people who lose links for people to try to help them find the podcast. I said, By the way, they're also people and they have their own opinions. I also deleted them, because when I deleted her thing, it all deleted out right away. I said, But now here we are in line and you're cursing at me. What should I do about that? Should I keep talking to a faceless person who is yelling at me about comments on a message? Right? Please just say goodnight. I think if time passes, this will all go away. And we'll be okay. Thank you. Now, here's where I feel amazing. Scott, I apologized for my actions to you. I apologize for cursing at you. And I'm like, I read those two sentences like I am making the world a better place. But I will. But I will not apologize for stating my opinion. Just say you're sorry, and good night, right? I will not tolerate being attacked because of my opinion. I apologize to you for your pod. Now, here's the part that starts freaking me out. Because your podcast has been a godsend. And I'm like, so for everybody listening. If you want to know what's really going through my head, while this is happening, I'm thinking one thing. Just say thank you. Leave me the fuck alone. Like, that's all I'm thinking. But

Dana 1:16:46
the content, be grateful and leave your drama at home.

Scott Benner 1:16:50
For me personally, but as a person who does this, honestly, this is terrific. It's a great back, she says the please have a wonderful and safe weekend. Thank you for your group and your podcasts. I really am sorry, again, this is not my character. And I said there's no need to apologize. But thank you. I also hope you have a terrific weekend. And that's going to it for that person hears this, please don't be embarrassed, like you're the only one who knows it's you. But don't be embarrassed. This is a great example of what we were talking about earlier, which is just you get into a bad spot, you don't realize you're in a bad spot. You start like lashing out at everybody looking for someone who's wronger than you are I know that's not English, right? So that you can feel better for a couple of minutes. And then you ran run into me, a person who doesn't want you to go, I know the podcast is valuable for you. And the space is valuable for you that you're going to get past this moment. And that we're going to all be okay again, because I've seen it happen over and over again. I don't want anybody to lose out on the podcast. So I try to work through these situations. But it's just, I could see how this was going the entire time. Like I've been through this so many times, I actually know where this is going to end. And they don't and that's fine. I was wondering. Anyway, I just thought that was interesting to bring up I hope that you find yourself in a similar situation with your problems at home. Because I think that if you stay on this path, I think you can get your daughter through all this. You know it you just have to be able to like, believe me that I've heard your story before and that people who who manage it and stay on top of it. You come out on the other side who usually sometimes end up coming out the other side. Okay, so yeah. Anyway, it's hard to see in the moment. It's one of those contextual things like you have to interview a bunch of 60 year old people who tell you horror stories from when they were teens to feel a little bit better. Yeah, yeah, to realize that there's no that it might be okay. Yeah, it could end up being okay. I'm not dismissing it to it. Also. You know, I'm not, I don't think I'd be blown sunshine up. Like this could go really bad too. But of course, yeah.

Dana 1:18:57
But I feel like, you know, there's, you know, some comfort in knowing that we're trying all the all the things that we're trying are the right things. Yeah.

Scott Benner 1:19:08
And it sounds like your husband is going to the therapy for the parents as well. Yes. Yeah. Oh, yeah. Yeah, yes. So he's getting it too. Yeah, it's tough with the voice because even as we get older, we're just like, 12 in our heads. So you're trying to get us to do stuff. And we're just like, I hope we can have sex and, and football starting again. Yeah. Like three thoughts.

Speaker 1 1:19:33
Anyway, is there anything that we didn't talk about that we should have? No, we did it actually covered it. Yeah, there's a lot of I let me just apologize to Rob who does the editing now about all the cursing?

Dana 1:19:44
Oh, yeah, I'm gonna put emails too but you were you were

Scott Benner 1:19:49
up upset going through this document for the new lead, because again, it's if you are in my position and And my position is a unique one, I guess for having had so many conversations with so many different age people who have been diagnosed and gone through so many different things, different ages, blah, blah, blah. Like it all, it's so obvious, so frustrating and frustrating. It's so frustrating that you left a children's hospital went to this thing that they have completely set up. And in minute one we're on are on the wrong direction. Like it's just that's so upsetting, you know? Well,

Dana 1:20:27
I hope the document that you create gets utilized. You know,

Scott Benner 1:20:31
it's gonna be a series that Jenny I make. Oh, awesome. Okay, good. That's right. geared towards providers. I saw your post. Yeah, I'm gonna call it grand rounds or something. I don't know exactly what it's called. Yeah, perfect. Yeah. But Jenny and I are gonna go through from people's, we're going to lay out our thoughts. We're going to use the feedback that we got from the Facebook group, which I guess after you just heard that story, you're probably like great lunatics, but they're not. They're all really lovely people who have great perspectives of their own. And I do think

Dana 1:21:03
I'll recommend, I'm going to recommend it to my Well,

Scott Benner 1:21:06
let me get it out first, and you listen to it. Yeah. Just think. And then, if you like it and tell people about that'd be terrific. All right. Dana, thank you so much. I really appreciate it. Thank you. Thanks. All righty. Hey, before I say goodbye. Are you really certain about having Sadie's name in this? You're okay with that?

Dana 1:21:22
Yeah, that's okay. There's not much to uncover or find there. Okay, fine. All right. Yeah, for me.

Scott Benner 1:21:36
Huge thank you to one of today's sponsors, G voc glucagon. Find out more about Chivo Capo pen at G voc glucagon.com. Forward slash juicebox. You spell that g v o OKEGLUC. Ag o n.com. Forward slash juicebox. A huge thanks to us Matt for sponsoring this episode of The Juicebox Podcast. Don't forget us med.com/juice box this is where we get our diabetes supplies from you can as well use the link or call 888-721-1514 Use the link or call the number get your free benefits check so that you can start getting your diabetes supplies the way we do from us med. If you're not already subscribed or following in your favorite audio app, please take the time now to do that. It really helps the show and get those automatic downloads set up so you never miss an episode. Thank you so much for listening. I'll be back very soon with another episode of The Juicebox Podcast. The episode you just heard was professionally edited by wrong way recording. Wrong way recording.com

#1141 DJ Eight Years

DJ was misdiagnosed with type 2 for eight years.

+ Click for EPISODE TRANSCRIPT

Scott Benner 0:00
Hello friends and welcome to episode 1141 of the Juicebox Podcast.

DJ is 52 years old he was originally diagnosed as a type two, and actually remained misdiagnosed for eight years. He's drastically changed his diet, his exercise, and this is his story. Nothing you hear on the Juicebox Podcast should be considered advice, medical or otherwise, always consult a physician before making any changes to your health care plan. Don't forget to save 40% off of your entire order at cozy earth.com All you have to do is use the offer code juice box at checkout that's juice box at checkout to save 40% at cosy earth.com. When you place your first order for ag one with my link, you'll get five free travel packs and a free year supply of vitamin D. Drink ag one.com/juice box. If you are a loved one has type one diabetes, please go to T one D exchange.org. Forward slash juicebox and complete the survey. That's all I need you to do. You will be helping immensely. US residents only takes fewer than 15 minutes to complete T one D exchange.org/juicebox. This episode of The Juicebox Podcast is sponsored by touched by type one touched by type one.org. And find them on Facebook and Instagram touched by type one is an organization dedicated to helping people living with type one diabetes. And they have so many different programs that are doing just that check them out at touched by type one.org. Today's episode of The Juicebox Podcast is sponsored by Dexcom, makers of the Dexcom G seven and G six continuous glucose monitoring systems. dexcom.com/juicebox This show is sponsored today by the glucagon that my daughter carries G voc hypo pen, find out more at G voc glucagon.com. Forward slash juicebox.

D.J. 2:21
My name is DJ. I am 52 years old. And I was diagnosed type one officially in November of this last year. So coming up on one year here in a couple of months.

Scott Benner 2:34
Type point. Okay, but you said officially. So November T one your mind? You're my age, I think you're probably the first guy I've ever talked to is my age. How long were you misdiagnosed

D.J. 2:47
eight years old? So yeah, I was diagnosed type two in 2015. And I'll kind of walk you through that we you you. I mean, there are a lot of people that are like, Oh, that's a lot, or you know, 1.5 or whatever. But, you know, when I went in to that appointment in 2015 I fully anticipate I mean, I had all the symptoms. Yeah. But I you know, I had lost so much weight and I was so frail that I thought I was getting diagnosed with cancer or something, you know, you well, you read the internet, it's always cancer or diabetes. So, you know, I knew it was one of the two. And so I went in I had I went in fasting, of course. And you know, I knew when the nurse did the fingers thick, like it wasn't good news. And then they ran my a one C It was 15.70.

Scott Benner 3:39
Yeah. And this is in 2015 2015.

D.J. 3:44
Okay. And they did a C peptide test. Alright, this is where it gets sort of, you know, confusing. I'm not a doctor, and I'm well aware that anything that you hear on the Juicebox Podcast, you know, but But I looked at the C peptide number, and I didn't know back then what I know now. And it was on the very low side of normal. So it was under two, right? Yeah. So at 15.7 A one C. You know, if I actually was a type two, I would have been making so much insulin with the insulin resistance that that would have been like, I think off the charts high, but that's where it stopped. We didn't do any more investigation. And because that number was like 1.8 It was like what your type two. So I did a full life change and started working out every day. I went extremely low carb and for a long time, seven and a half years. Got my A onesies down into you know 645554 And really just I can't I stopped testing my blood sugar because every time I would test it, it was fairly normal. And that's kind of how it started.

Scott Benner 5:08
How long were you testing for? About five, six years? Well, that's a lot of fun. You know, just I'm going to read this here for people, this is straight from the NIH. To interpret your seed peptide levels, a normal C peptide plasma concentration is in a fasted state point nine to 1.8. ng milliliters don't know what that is. A high level could indicate insulin resistance insulinoma, or kidney disease, a low C peptide is usually present in patients with type one or sometimes type two diabetes. So And where was yours again?

D.J. 5:45
It was under two it was like 117. Something like that?

Scott Benner 5:51
Insulin resistance. Yeah, I mean, so

D.J. 5:54
when I look at it now, I think I would have been much higher with a 15.7. Right. And they didn't do any antibody testing or anything.

Scott Benner 6:05
Yeah. And the reason that's still of interest to you all these years later, is because of the struggle you had, I would imagine, do you still? I would still be thinking about it, honestly. Yeah. So my gosh, so you do just diet and exercise? I mean, what were you eating?

D.J. 6:22
Mostly, you know, mostly proteins, fat, and veggies. And really nothing else. Which, you know, I, that sort of became a way of life for me. And I got so used to it. And I felt good. I felt like I had more energy than I had had. And I mean, that's because I was bringing down my, my agency and my, you know, my blood sugar was in, in a normal range. I understand that now. But you know, at, at the time, it was like, Well, this is really working, I feel great. I feel like I've got more energy than I've had since I was in college. And I was fit. And I wasn't, I for sure wasn't one of these people that is like out there preaching that you have to live your life low carb, but it worked for me. And, and it worked for me until it didn't work for me.

Scott Benner 7:24
The Dexcom g7 is sponsoring this episode of The Juicebox Podcast and it features a lightning fast 30 minute warmup time, that's right from the time you put on the Dexcom g7 Till the time you're getting readings, 30 minutes. That's pretty great. It also has a 12 hour grace period, so you can swap your sensor when it's convenient for you. All that on top of it being small, accurate, incredibly wearable and light. These things in my opinion, make the Dexcom g7. a no brainer. The Dexcom g7 comes with way more than just this. Up to 10 people can follow you you can use it with type one, type two or gestational diabetes, it's covered by all sorts of insurances. And this might be the best part. It might be the best part alerts and alarms that are customizable so that you can be alerted at the levels that make sense to you. dexcom.com/juice box links in the show notes links at juicebox podcast.com to Dexcom and all the sponsors when you use my links, you're supporting the production of the podcast and helping to keep it free and plentiful. If you take insulin or sulfonylureas you are at risk for your blood sugar going too low. You need a safety net when it matters most. Be ready with G voc hypo pen. My daughter carries G voc hypo pen everywhere she goes because it's a ready to use rescue pen for treating very low blood sugar and people with diabetes ages two and above that I trust. Low blood sugar emergencies can happen unexpectedly and they demand quick action. Luckily G voc hypo pen can be administered in two simple steps even by yourself in certain situations. Show those around you where you storage evoke hypo penne and how to use it. They need to know how to use Chivo Capo pen before an emergency situation happens. Learn more about why G voc hypo pen is in Ardens diabetes toolkit at G voc glucagon.com/juicebox. G voc shouldn't be used if you have a tumor in the gland on the top of your kidneys called a pheochromocytoma. Or if you have a tumor in your pancreas called an insulinoma visit G voc glucagon.com/risk For safety information. So do you think you were Lada Do you think you we're having a very slow onset?

D.J. 9:51
If I was it was because of the diet and exercise that elongated that yeah, that final onset.

Scott Benner 9:59
We You in hindsight, do you see any signs of decay during those times? Were you way too skinny? Anything like that? Okay, you are way too skinny, way

D.J. 10:10
too thin? Yes. Like I saw photos of myself, like, my wife would say, Are you losing weight again, and I'm like, I shouldn't be I eat like a horse, you know, I could go, I travel a lot, I have a couple of businesses that caused me to travel a lot. And, you know, I could go and eat dinner. And by the time I was finished eating dinner, be hungry for another dinner, and stop on my way back to the hotel for another dinner. And then when I would get to the hotel, I'd be like, there's got to be some like mixed nuts or something down here, like, and I would go and buy four bags of peanuts, or almonds or whatever. And I could not gain weight. Were you paying a lot as well? Well, at the initial diagnosis, for sure, but but then no, like, come November, it was starting to get back to I knew something was, you know, I mean, I knew what was up, I didn't know that I was type one. But I kept thinking in the back of my head, like, what I'm doing isn't working anymore. I'm going to end up while I went into this new Doctor thinking, hey, I'm gonna ask him to put me on Metformin again. That's what I thought.

Scott Benner 11:24
How long had you done Metformin in the past for

D.J. 11:28
one month?

Scott Benner 11:29
Why did you get off it so quickly?

D.J. 11:31
Because my a one C went from that 15, seven, down to six, four, and my doctor is like, you don't need Metformin anymore.

Scott Benner 11:38
So he thought you had an onset of type two diabetes that you so arrested with diet and exercise that, that there really wasn't any need to do anything else was the 100%.

D.J. 11:51
That's what I'm percent okay. Oh, wow.

Scott Benner 11:55
When so when you what makes you go to a new doctor.

D.J. 12:01
There were several things that Listen, my doctor, that particular doctor, the probably a lot of people would be like, I don't know how that's possible. He's still a friend of mine. He, he retired this past year, but that's not what made me switch. I knew he was getting ready to retire. You know, I've sort of had in the last seven to eight years of my life, really more of a focus on not just health, but more like Holistic Health. And so I was seeking out integrated health facilities, and instead of what I would call more traditional, and so that's what moved me into this new care that I'm in now. So actually, it's an integrated health facility here. It's a fairly large practice. But I walked in, I it takes months to get an appointment because they're so busy. And this guy, I probably won't say his name, although I know he's listening. He'll be listening, because he started listening to this now. I was his very first patient, actual patient. He had been a PA and training and all that, but I was his very first patient. And I went in just thinking, you know, well, I just need some Metformin. It's been a wild ride with him. And he's been fantastic for me. But he's now you know, he's listened to this podcast. And he's, he's learned a ton through this whole journey as well. But he knew that what I had been through before, you know, we didn't want to repeat.

Scott Benner 13:44
Plus, you probably had him on a good day. He's like, this, is it. My first one? I'm gonna do a good job. Really?

D.J. 13:50
Yeah, well, and the crazy thing was like, when I walked out of there, you know, he prescribed Metformin. And when I got to the pharmacy to pick it up, you know, I hadn't checked, you know, everything's on, you know, these, like, my chart kind of things and all that where it's all digital, well, I get to the pharmacy. And I said, Hey, you know, give my name, birthday. I'm here to pick up one prescription and she said, Oh, is it these two types of insulin? I think now, there's must be some mistake. And so I'm, I'm, I get out of line and I go and look. And there's this big long paragraph of I consulted with the two other founders of the practice. And we believe that based on the blood work that we got back and where you're at, we believe that you need to begin insulin immediately.

Scott Benner 14:47
Did they think you were they were giving you insulin as a type two still? No,

D.J. 14:51
they they, in that little email it? It was you're either type 1.5 Or one or they didn't know. But they knew I wasn't tied to.

Scott Benner 15:03
Is this a place where, if I'm prying, you'll stop me? But like, is it a cash pay that you turn into your insurance later? Really hard to get into that kind of doctor's office?

D.J. 15:14
It is, but at the time, my coverage worked there, it doesn't anymore. We switched. I own. I own these businesses, and we switched insurance companies and the new insurance company doesn't work there. But so yes, it's that type of place very hard to get in,

Scott Benner 15:29
I'm just going to like, to be clear with people, that's the kind of endocrinologist I send my daughter to now that she's not at a children's hospital anymore. My whole family has their thyroid managed that way. You know, we tried going through, you know, what you would consider like a classic practice and you just don't get you don't get enough attention, especially for these things that need to be adjusted now like this endo is not helping Arden with her insulin or anything like that, we're we're doing that. But even with just you know, Arden came home from school, Something seemed wrong, it didn't matter, you know, boom. And he's like, she hasn't been here in a while like she's been off at school, let's do bloodwork. He sent bloodwork out, comes back over, TSH is off, we'll do this, you know, we're gonna move her to, you know, we're gonna she's like, I don't think that she needs her tiersen put up, but I do think she kind of needs a blast of it. And so I want her to take, instead of point eight, eight every day, I want her to take one every day for 10 days. And switch back to point eight, eight. I don't want to switch your script because that'll be irritating. So I'll just mail you a sample. Like that's the kind of Mr. Boom, it's at your house. And you you have a phone call with them a follow up after you know your bloodwork. If there's somebody else in the house that she sees also, she'll talk to them to you don't get a different bill. Like it's all it's exactly the way you think healthcare should be. Yeah,

D.J. 16:55
it's and you're, you're describing something very similar took me took me a minute to get there. And once once we really finalized the the diagnosis. They, their first inclination was we're going to get you an endocrinology referral. And so I did, I went to a traditional endocrinologist. And we can dig into this further if you want to. But I had already been listening to the podcast, I had already done a consult with someone at Integrated diabetes. I was reading and consuming just loads of information, and I was on MDI, I went there thinking, hey, I need something that will be able to that I can, I don't want to use traditional needles that I'm pulling out of vials, I want to use pens. So maybe like I'll use the ink pen, or maybe I'll get like a junior pen, I need something I can give myself half doses because I was already I had gone for. So that second diagnosis, my agency was 13 Six. And I had already gotten it down to six for when I saw that endocrinologist and I knew there was room to go and he's like, You're being too hard on yourself. And I'm like, Well,

Scott Benner 18:15
you're not the right guy for me. Yeah.

D.J. 18:18
So I had that one meeting. And he kept saying, how do you know this? And I in my head? I did I I didn't say this to Him. But I kept thinking, How do you not know this? And then at the end, I actually did say this, because he kind of gave me the range. And he told me not to be so hard on myself. And you know, six, four is great. And by the way, six, four is great. But I knew it wasn't. I knew it wasn't my best. And, and so I just told him, I said, you know, I think you've misunderstood. I said this was an interview. And I'm not going this direction. And you know it, I haven't gone back there. I wrote a big long ladder to this integrated health facility where just my you know, that this brand new, this brand new doctor, along with the partners there and I said, Look, this is what I want to do. Will you support this? Will you write the scripts? Will you allow this to happen? And after about a week, they said, Yeah, we'll do it. And so I came in I told them and had sent them all of the info on looping Omnipod dash and the big six on on G seven now, but they went for it. And my last day once he was five, two, I think I'm I think I'm under five now but I'm due for another one here in the next several weeks.

Scott Benner 19:54
Once you got the insulin you started understanding how to use it. Did you adjust your diet or did you stick with what you were doing?

D.J. 20:00
Well, I've had more candy in the last nine months than I've had in the last eight years. But that's just to address little lows, I have sort of stuck with the kind of stuck with the low carb, just because it's, I didn't really miss anything from before. I'm all about people eating whatever they want. So, and whatever they feel good about, it feels healthy to me for my feelings, you know, plan, but it's not for everybody. So, you know, this morning, I had five eggs for breakfast, or a piece of cheese, and I'm very full. I don't need anything else. You know, if I get the, like, the need for a little something sweet. I'll, you know, in the afternoon, I'll have a coffee with, you know, a square of dark chocolate with some almonds in it or something. And, you know, that's plenty for me. I've had a couple of thing times where it's like I'm, well, you kind of feel like you, you get that feeling of you're going to eat everything in the kitchen or whatever. And you realize you don't need that many carbs to bring you up from 64. You know, in fact, if you cut your basil and wait 15 minutes, you might just be fine. You know, it's just been a huge learning curve. And I've put I put 80,000 miles on my car in the last two years. And so 40,000 of that has been listening to the Juicebox Podcast.

Scott Benner 21:32
Oh, thank you. I appreciate that. And all of you should be driving that much. Because that would really help me. How did you? How did you find the podcast?

D.J. 21:40
I kind of you know, it's one of those things where there's so much I don't want to say misinformation that sounds like, but I think you know, people don't understand and you can't expect them to understand if if you name some disease that I have only Ansel airily heard of, I'm not going to have an understanding of what it is. But, you know, you, you kind of, it's that whole, you see people with a pump, and you see people with the tubing and, and all of that works great for a lot of people. In fact, I have a young guy that works with me, and he's on he's on a pump, and he's got the tubing, and it has been like that since he was six years old. It works fine for him and, and wonderful. I just for my lifestyle. I I just Googled, I was like, there's gotta be a pump that doesn't have tubing. And so the first thing that came up was obviously Omni pod. And then there was a link to your podcast, and in some Google search. And so that's how I started listening to it. Wow,

Scott Benner 22:45
I have heard my SEO for Omni pod is strong, strong. Yeah, that's a that's good news. At this point, I've watched people find it in so many different ways. I couldn't have I couldn't have possibly set this up. It's one of those things like, you know, people are like, Well, how do I do a successful this or that? Like, what should I link to watch that? I'm like, I don't know, I really don't. I'm like, just put it out there. If it works for people, it'll, it'll grow. Yeah, like to know that you were basically saying to yourself, I'd like to get a pump that doesn't have tubes, but ended up finding the podcast as well as really interesting, though, I appreciate that. That's excellent.

D.J. 23:22
Yeah, absolutely. And, and, you know, it's so it's so interesting, because when I first started listening, I think my first episode, I can't remember which one it was, but it was an after dark. And because I just randomly I'm like, Oh, well, I'll just start wherever it is right now. And I can always go back and forth. And and, and so, you know, you pick up whatever the episode is you, you sort of pick up a useful tidbit of information somewhere in there, whether you know, whether 90% of it applies to you or not, you know, there's kind of that 10% or 20% or even just a tidbit where you're like, wow, I didn't think of that. And, and so I started picking up what I would call nuggets in some of those and I talked to my wife and and I was so frustrated with my well with myself at the time because I you know, I was having these highs and I couldn't bring them down. And you know, I kept saying, you know, I need to get something where I can do half dose or I need to split my my long term insulin and she's like, you know, maybe for your mental health. You should stop listening to this podcast. I think it's driving you crazy. It's like no, no, this is the thing that's helping me. I said it's all the other noise that's actually driving me crazy. I said it's just I said it feels like I'm drinking from a fire hydrant. And I just can't consume enough information. So I actually made a I made a couple of spreadsheets and started tracking in a In a notebook on my iPad, just the bits of information that I would want to go back and listen to. And then I started going through all of the all of the different series, you know, the bold beginnings, and the pro tips and all of those types of things. And it was like, once I got through that, and I felt like I kind of finally have understood these terms and know what's happening. That's when it just all started clicking. And I had heard you say that before? Like, I know, it sounds overwhelming. People are throwing, you know, terms and numbers and this and that around. Keep doing it. And it will come together. Yeah. And that happens.

Scott Benner 25:42
I'm glad. i That's really wonderful. i It makes me feel terrific, actually, because you experienced the podcast the way I mean for it to be taken in. Yeah. And it worked. Which was exciting. Because I always think, well, the first thing is that i is that I really believe that if you just stack all the information up in one place, it'll be overwhelming and boring. And most people won't be interested in it anyway. Right? You know, so you have these conversations with people, which you get the bonus of like, getting to listen to other type ones type twos live their lives. And and I think that's interesting. And then I try to blend in enough entertainment that you'll make it through so that the conversation can unfold in a way where that nugget comes out.

D.J. 26:28
Right? Yeah, it's fantastic. And I'm on not just your Facebook group, but I'm on a couple of other what I would say, our online type one communities, and I'm always putting links to, you know, I'll hear something and I'm like, Well, this, I know that this addresses that now, I'll put a link I'm sure people think I'm nuts. But I, you know, I I'll be clear that you're not paying me to say this, but the podcast is it truly did change the course of my life.

Scott Benner 27:02
I appreciate that the information, it changed my life, too. It's just yeah, I'm the one that pulled it all together into one place worse. I mean, we were really lost. And a lot of my life was like overwhelmed and crying when our son was young and had diabetes. And I didn't know what I was doing. I almost did it the same way. But mine was trial and error and the ability to not have to focus on much else because I was a I was a stay at home dad and I had a baby. So I didn't have much to do except look at her and wonder what the hell was happening to her? Yeah,

D.J. 27:34
I felt sort of paralyzed at first, because I've got I've got two businesses, and I've got, you know, 60 employees. And I mean, everybody, you know, everybody needs something at any second. And, you know, for about a month, it was I couldn't process what was going on. And there were times where I thought, you know, if I don't get this under control, this could change, you could really drastically change the course of my life.

Scott Benner 28:04
And I do see how so many people end up with good enough. Because there is there's too much going on. Like I'm trying to be honest and say that if I had a job, and Arden was diagnosed with diabetes, I don't think I would have figured it out. And I'm pretty, I'm pretty sure the doctors wouldn't have helped me get there. Right. And that that's it like I was able to stare and stare I was I was sharing with someone yesterday on an episode I was making, how when my son got Hashimotos his only symptom was these crazy hives from his waist to his neck. And they would come if his body heated up. So if he laughed, got angry, tried to lift something up, move too quickly. This is literally what would happen to him. And then the only way to make it stop is either have to run out into the freezer. It was luckily November, he'd have to run out into the cold until it went away. Now he wasn't warm. It's not like he was out there and like, Oh, this feels good. He was freezing. But he was outside freezing. And it would make the hives like dissipate. So this is going on for a month. And we're going through all the normal channels trying to figure out what's going on. And I just can't take seeing him like that. So I'm like living my life. I'm making this podcast I'm doing all the things I'm supposed to be doing. And then when everybody goes to bed, I would get online and just read and read and try to figure out what was happening. Yeah, and one day I found this NIH article that talked about hives as a very uncommon symptom of Hashimotos. And I sent an email at three o'clock in the morning to the endocrinologist who by the way, if you guys have heard the the episode about Hashimotos and hyperthyroidism, it's that doctor, she's the doctor that we use. I emailed her that night I sent her the article, I laid out what my thinking and she goes yeah, right like let's give them The Met and see what happens. And like a week later, it started to get better. And I felt so relieved. Like I don't I don't know how to tell people like when I was explaining this to the person yesterday that I was talking to, like, I was just saying it like it was a normal thing. Like, obviously, I would do this thing for my son. And she said, I don't think a lot of people would have done that. And I don't know that that's true or not, I guess I don't know myself that well, you know, and I try not to judge myself against other people. So I haven't really thought about it that way. But that's the only thing that saved him. Like, we were going down a completely different path with a regular doctor, they were getting ready to give him some like, once weekly injection of some new medication or something like that. And we were like, freaking out. Yeah. And when that helped them, like, that's the feeling I had, when I, the day that I said to my wife, like, I figured out how to take care of diabetes. I was like, if there's a system within all of this, and it's not that hard, it's kind of like easy, almost, if you can wrap your head around it and understand a couple of these ideas. And I said, by that I had told her I'm like, I'm gonna make a podcast about this. So it was just, it was that feeling that I had, the way I explained it with my son, when I started the podcast, blogging heads like died, like people just stop reading. And I thought, oh, all of this information I've put into this blog is going to disappear, like, no one's going to see it anymore. And I just felt like, it was unfair for me to know this. And for you not to know it. That seriously, it's just how it struck me.

D.J. 31:44
So I'm glad you I'm glad. I mean, obviously, there are 10s of 1000s. I don't know how many, but a ton of people that are that are grateful that you didn't keep it to yourself, I guess you maybe people would start to figure it out. If they just over time, it would take a lot longer, it would take a lot longer.

Scott Benner 32:04
The way I think of it is that I'm sure some people would, and some people wouldn't. And the ones who wouldn't, are going to suffer needlessly. And the ones that would eventually are going to end up with my memories of when my daughter was two. If that's something we can avoid, then I think that's terrific. But one way or the other. We live in a world where people get diabetes, they go to a doctor, and they fundamentally don't have any more information when they come back from the doctor than they did before they went. I don't even care why that is it's just the truth. So you know, if I can tell you something DJ, that you'll keep to yourself worse until this comes out. If I look over here at my whiteboard, the next thing for Jenny and I to do together, we're finishing up the MythBusters series right now. And then we are going to go into making a series of episodes that is directed specifically at doctors and clinicians. And we're gonna talk to them about how to do this thing and see if we can get that to catch on for people too.

D.J. 33:06
Yeah, that's, that's great. Yeah, we'll

Scott Benner 33:09
see what happens. I don't know how you run a business with 60 people, like I run a business. I'm the only person and I, some days I'm like, I don't know how you do it with employees. That seems like a lot of effort.

D.J. 33:23
I have a really good team. Really, really good team. Yeah. So blessed with that, for sure. We, we've grown a lot, you know, in the last several years, and I kind of look at I'm not a huge sports person, but I love using sports analogies. And I feel like we've put people on our team that we know are to the caliber of where the rest of the team is performing or beyond because when you kind of bring in talent that's beyond it pushes you to another place. And that's really what's happened with our team over the last couple of years. So they've, they've made it very easy on me.

Scott Benner 34:04
Excellent. Now I There are a number of really wonderful people that helped me online with the Facebook group. And as a matter of fact, I would say that a lot of the information that comes back from them, helps to shape the podcast as well. Because they have sort of their eye on what people are talking about, when I don't have that kind of time to like sit there and mine it and find out what's on people's minds. I don't mean to say that, uh, it's just the all the other stuff like, you know, there's yesterday at one point, I was an editor and an IT person and then somehow I got involved in billing. It was almost like same three and a half hours I would walk out of the room, use the bathroom walk back into a completely different thing. And change hands. Yeah, exactly. And then I and then I actually had that thought later. I was like if I tried to go get a job in the real world, no one would hire me. I have no discernible skills on paper whatsoever. It'd be like It'll be like, what do you do? And I, ah, so much, I don't know how to put it into words.

D.J. 35:03
I'm a unicorn,

Scott Benner 35:05
I had a meeting yesterday morning with three people where we were devising another series with on the pod about on a pod five. And like, there's this moment when you go, Oh, they want my opinion. Okay, I'm not used to being that person still. So like, Alright, so we talked about it, and it sounds like it's gonna work out really well. And just another step of trying to help people have better outcomes faster.

D.J. 35:31
Yeah, that's awesome. And their customer support has been phenomenal. That's good to hear me.

Scott Benner 35:38
Well, they'll hear this. So I'm sure there'll be happy. I have a couple of questions. Right. So what could have happened in those first years for you, when they thought you were type two, like now you have all this knowledge looking back? Like what needed to happen, that would have stopped all this from going on for so long?

D.J. 35:55
Well, I think if, if they would have done one more test, if they would have done a gad antibody test, that would have helped. I think that if you're going to get a diabetes diagnosis, whether it's type one or type two, I mean, it's, you're already getting a blood draw, why not just do that test, they did the C peptide. So why not do the antibody test? I think that would have helped. I do think that it was sort of I mean, it was sort of a blessing in disguise, because it did prompt me to get very healthy from a diet and exercise standpoint. So you know, I'm not I don't have like some deep seated bitterness. i But I, I definitely wish it would have gone down differently. It was more shocking when I got the actual diagnosis than anything. But I think to answer your question, one more test would have changed the course of what I would have done eight years ago.

Scott Benner 36:58
Okay. Do you think you wouldn't have found the the eating part, if they would have immediately said, Hey, you have type one? It could have been right, like it could have just sent you in a different direction? It's hard to

D.J. 37:09
know it of Yeah, it could have, you know, because I'm a foodie, I mean, I, I love food, travel, did a lot of food trips, you know, where my wife and I would go to LA and you go to 15 restaurants in two days, and you go in and get, you know, just, you don't eat a whole meal, but you know, you get whatever they're known for. And then, you know, you're gone and off to the next place. And we loved doing those kinds of things. Yeah. And, and so things just changed drastically for me. So maybe I would have continued to, and I just learned, you know, I could have learned how to Bolus for all of that.

Scott Benner 37:50
Right? Yeah, I mean, I take very seriously the conversations around diet. So I'm in a weird position, because it is my position as the person who makes this podcast and runs that group online, that I don't care how you eat, I want you to know how to use insulin for whatever it is you're going to eat. Now, that idea comes from my belief that I can't change that for people. I've thought about it long and hard. And I don't know how to do something that would make a person have that moment that you had, and just say, I'm going to completely fundamentally change how I eat. I don't know how to do that. I watched the whole world try it over and over again for decades of my life, I don't see a path to it. So I've decided in my mind that as a person who makes this podcast, I'm not really in charge of how people eat and eat and even like to say that even if there was a perfect way to eat. I don't I don't see a way to make somebody do it. So let's let that go. And let them save their health. Right from from diabetes, and then hopefully they'll make decisions about their food intake. That's good for them.

D.J. 39:01
Yeah, I think they're two separate issues. Yeah, I do. I think I think there's there's a health and nutrition side. And then there's a managing diabetes and understanding the way that insulin works and et cetera, et cetera. Yeah, I'm making sure that your carb ratios are right, and that, you know, all that stuff. Right. And so I think they're two separate issues. And I think that the nutrition part or the fueling plan, or whatever you want to call it is, it can make it easier on yourself, for sure. But there are complications in that. And, you know, this is a side note when I was in when I was in college, I used to smoke and I had a girlfriend at the time, who is now my wife that did not approve of that. And I littered Scott I threw a pack of cigarettes and a lighter out the window and never smoked again.

Scott Benner 39:55
To do that to try to prove to her you were going to listen to her. Yeah,

D.J. 40:00
And, but but the point is like some people have, and I'm not, I'm not patting myself on the back or I'm not. But I just I have a willpower, like if I say, I'm not going to do this, or I am going to do it. That's sort of the way that it goes, you know, for me, and that's not that's for sure. Not for everybody. It's for sure. Not for everyone

Scott Benner 40:20
I've learned over the last four months. That that is not how it works for me. I am. I'm talking to you today. Today. I am 30 pounds lighter than I was four months ago. Yeah, that's awesome. Yeah. And it's crazy, right? And it's because, and I'm telling you, I wasn't a crazy eater. Like I wasn't taking in, like, if you could see me eat during the day before this, you wouldn't have said like, wow, that's insane. Like, I wasn't a healthy eater, like most of the time, but I was supplementing with things and you know, being careful, but I just I don't know what the point I'm trying to make here is like, I wasn't like eat a half a pizza and a bag of Doritos person, you know what I mean? Like it, it just, my body just didn't want to lose weight, I'd have to do something incredibly drastic to lose 10 pounds. And then it wasn't sustainable. And this we go V which is, is basically ozempic rebranded for just for weight loss, it has given me the ability to not eat too much, or sometimes, you know, a lot, you know, today, I'll get done with you. I'm gonna go take an egg. And I will probably put it in a pan scrambled with a mushroom and maybe a piece of shrimp, or chicken maybe. And I'll put it in a small wrap, and I'll probably won't be able to finish it. Yeah, I don't know what I'll do for lunch today. I haven't even thought about it yet. But like last night, I went to a bar last night and had snow crab legs, so and a hunk of bread. So it's not like crazy, right? You can you can eat. But there's something about that GLP one that it just feels like it feels like it gave my body a tune up, like take away the the hunger part. Because there's no doubt like I don't get hungry very frequently. And yes, my stomach will feel full, faster. But that's not the whole story. Like I don't completely know how to explain it yet. But there's something about that GLP replacement, that is making my body go to the size that it looks like it was supposed to be is the only way I can think to say,

D.J. 42:30
Yeah, it's amazing. It's amazing. You

Scott Benner 42:33
could have four months ago before this medication told me, I think you could have told me I was gonna die. And I don't know that I could have achieved what I've done in the last four months. So I mean, that's I mean, my knee, I had a knee surgery, I couldn't have exercise, my knee got better. I ended up having to have a surgery on my toe of all the weird things, which I'm going to the doctor this afternoon for and hopefully can take this bandage off. And so that would have slowed me down from exercising and now and there wouldn't have been it just wouldn't happen. Like I know for sure it wouldn't happen without the medication. And it's not because I was just willfully out there like Double fisting marshmallows. Yeah. It's pretty much it. I have to ask you a different question before I get too far away from it. Your original doctor who it sounds like you're friendly with? Yes. You must have had personal conversations with him about Yes. How did those go?

D.J. 43:26
Well, I actually called him after I was re diagnosed. I'm not going to look for it now and waste time, but I actually I called him and then we texted back and forth. And his response was, oh, wow, that's a huge life change. That's pretty much it.

Scott Benner 43:47
Not I I really missed that one. Now. Is that disappointing to you? On a personal level? Maybe but but you don't seem like you're that person though.

D.J. 43:57
Yeah, not a grudge holder really that much? I, I think more so it's disappointing for going back to conversation from earlier and this isn't a slam on all medical professionals, but it's just disappointing to know that you sort of get run through this system, where, you know, it's a it's a big machine, it's owned by, you know, some huge company that, you know, now we have seven minutes to see a patient and you can't, you cannot possibly understand, you know, everything that you're going to see. And, you know, the one day that they spent talking about diabetes 50 years ago when he was in school, you know, yeah, granted, he should have seen things in his practice. You know, but, but I'm not convinced When you're just talking to even nurses, and they don't even understand the difference between type one and type two, sure. And, you know, there's been plenty of evidence of that on, you know, online in, you know, on the Facebook group on other podcasts. It's just, it's just, it's a little disheartening. And it's a little overwhelming, it's a little confusing. And, you know, everybody has advice of what to do and, and, and you just sort of have to wade through all of that. And go, Well, all I know, is I have to advocate for myself and I, that is a challenge for a lot of people. Ya

Scott Benner 45:50
know, some people don't have it in them to speak up. And I don't mean that from like, a fortitude standpoint, personality wise,

D.J. 45:58
not judgmental. Yeah. judgmental, personality wise,

Scott Benner 46:00
some people don't have that. I don't know why I do. You know what I mean, but I hear something that goes counterintuitive to me, my happiness, my success, my families, and you guys by extension, and I pushed back on it right away. But, you know, that's just a, I don't know, that's wiring and how I was brought up. And it's not a thing I can take credit for. Just like if I was a person who heard those things and kind of turtled up and went inside. I couldn't blame myself or give myself credit for that either. You know, it's just it. But with that being true. Listen, when this is true, I just interviewed somebody the other day, who told me that when their kid was diagnosed in the hospital, they came in, the nurse came in to give the kid their first injection. And the mom said that when the injection happened, something looked really strange. And she even said, after the nurse left, that didn't look right. And some time later, the nurse came back in and said, Hi, I have to do the injection again, because I didn't do it the first time because she didn't take the cap off the needle. Oh, now, how could that happen? to her credit, she did say I'm back, I made a mistake. We're going to do the right thing now. But how could that happen? But in a world where that did happen? How do we not say something about it? Like you said, like, you know, giant companies own hospitals, they're probably wealth management companies, some of them, like you have no idea how many, like at this point, wealth management companies owned businesses, they don't know anything about. Sure. Yeah. So yeah,

D.J. 47:46
well, and so I was in a, this just rein me in if this is totally off topic, but, you know, I was in a sales coaching meeting several months ago. And they happen to use the healthcare, you know, segment as an example. And there were probably 20 people sitting in this room, and they said, the guy said, Hey, do you did you graduate from college? Or did you graduate from high school? And you know, everybody's like, Oh, yeah. Did you get a diploma? Yeah. Do you know where it is? Oh, it's probably in a box, somewhere up in my parents, attic somewhere or whatever he goes yet. Yet, every doctor's office that you go into, not only do they have one copy of their diploma, it's an every examination room in the building. Now, is that because they don't remember that they graduated? And you know, you start to think about that, and you go, well, the whole thing is sort of theater. Right? It's to gain confidence that I know what I'm talking about. And that was sort of when I was going through the middle of all of this, and that that was the sort of tipping point for me of like, I'm gonna go to somebody that actually can spend an hour with me until I'm going to actually go somewhere where, you know, I know it's going to cost me some money. I know it's going to be a little bit more, but I've got to get out of this churn and burn system.

Scott Benner 49:16
Listen, I went to a good surgeon for my toe. And still, when the surgery was over, he called me that evening, how you feel? And I said, I'm doing alright, because good. I said, Hey, what ended up happening there. And what he described was, none of it was what he said before the surgery. Like before the surgery, he's like, here's what the problem is. You've got a bunch of arthritis in this knuckle in your toe. And I'm like, okay, and he said, we're gonna go in there, we're gonna clean it all out. And it's going to be terrific. And I was like, Oh, great. He goes now, don't you know, that could go this way. It could go that way. But this is the problem. I'm like, alright. He said, Yeah, there wasn't really any arthritis in the knuckle of your toe. He said there was a bunch of torn cartilage is really weird. And I'm like, okay, And he goes up. Have you ever heard of microfracture surgery? And I went, Yeah, that's the thing like athletes get he goes, Yeah, I did that for you. I went, Oh, okay. So like, you know, with his best diagnostics, and, by the way, a good surgeon, right, like, so. I mean, I hate to say it like this. I live in northeast, I've the choice of good doctors around here. And I went to a good practice. And still, he didn't know what he was doing until he got in there. And once he got in there, he just did it. And, you know, I said, Well, what's the deal? And he goes, well, hopefully, fibrous cartilage will grow back. And I was like, Yeah, okay. And I said, is that Cartledge? Because, no, it's different. Cartilage can't grow. And I'm like, Okay. And I said, it's definitely gonna grow back. You know, we hope it will. I said, what if it doesn't, and he said, oh, we'll just fuse the bone in your toe. And I'm like, that sounds horrible. And like, Wait, why? You know, and that's my, my toe just hurt. TJ just like it was, you know, you're talking about this big thing with insulin and carbs and, you know, exercise and sleep and hydration, and that I could probably stand here all day and say things like that, that would impact diabetes, I get that they can't just know the whole thing. And if they can't just tell you the whole thing. But I keep coming back to why do I know? And they don't?

D.J. 51:24
Yeah. Why that's, it goes back to what that endocrinologist that I went to, and he's like, how do you know this? Yeah. I found a way to tell people. Yeah, how do you know they're in one, Skittle is one carb?

Scott Benner 51:39
I think that's my sticking point, right there is. I put myself in that position. I make myself a physician. I know I'm not perfect. I know a little bit of this theater. That's fine. I know there's not enough time, because the system works the way it works. I don't understand how then the answer I give myself that I'm okay with it helps me sleep is well, that's the system we have to this is the best I can do. Because I don't think that's true. I just think somebody would just you need someone with vision to do something different that and try and let it fail and try something different. And I don't maybe the system doesn't allow for that. And that's why you ended up at a at a doctor the way you do and why I use one for my family's thyroid. But even that, like it's not like my insurance doesn't cover it. I just have to I pay her in cash. And then I take the bill and I send it to the doctor's office and they send me the money back. You know, it's not like, it's not like I'm paying out of my pocket. And I don't get it back. So there's a way, but you got to know that that exists. And that's absolutely right. Yeah. And the truth is, is that the only reason that my family is in that doctor's office is because I knew Arden was in trouble. And it wasn't working through the Children's Hospital. We were not getting answers. And there were a lot of try this. And then you try it and it didn't work. Then they go, oh, we'll try this. Let me wait. You didn't know the first time that that wasn't right. Like, you know, like, so you need a person that I'm an artist first appointment with Addy was an hour long. You went in, you sat down in a chair, like a person with your pants on and had a conversation explained everything that had ever happened to you in your entire life while this person takes wild notes and is paying attention to you, and then orders your problems and says let's start here. And we're going to do this. And after this amount of time. If this doesn't happen, we will do this. If that does work then great. And like there was a real plan. And I don't think people leave doctor's offices with plans.

D.J. 53:54
No, but that's the way it should happen. Yeah,

Scott Benner 53:56
it's just it's obvious, right? So I don't understand if doctors can do it and they can get paid. Why is that? Not what is happening? I don't know. It's upsetting to me. Listen, I have a whole life off of this podcast. Like this is what I do all day long. 6070 hours a week, right? It pays my bills. It helps people it's a job. I love it. All. That's terrific. That being said, it should not be necessary. It's It's upsetting and insulting that you helped your health with a podcast. That's my stance on it. So anyway, yeah, but

D.J. 54:35
but the good news is this. This integrated health. He's actually a PA. He listened to your podcast.

Scott Benner 54:44
Well, hello to him, of course. Thank you. Yeah, I'm not and by the way, I hear people sometimes say i Dr. Bash, listen, this is what's happening. I'm just saying it out loud. I'm not bashing you. You don't I'm saying like if you drop back on Sunday, and throw 34 My past isn't complete five, boom. If I point out you had a bad day, I'm not bashing you. I'm just reporting the news. Well, here's

D.J. 55:06
the deal. If you take your car to a repair facility, and they consistently Miss diagnose it and can't get it right, at some point you go, you know, I probably shouldn't go to this place anymore. Yeah,

Scott Benner 55:17
and by the way, telling a friend about that it's not bashing somebody bashing somebody, it's just buyer beware, yeah, if you hear this, and you're a physician, and you feel attacked, I'd say look in the mirror, you know, so don't blame me. For God's sakes, I didn't do it. I'm out here helping all the people you're not helping. And you know, and by the way, with with a sentence, nothing you hear other Juicebox Podcast should be considered advice, medical or otherwise, like that, like that's the only thing standing between me and not saying this out loud is that the world now accepts that as okay. Like, even 10 years ago, that was not a thing. There's something about how information is shared now, something about podcasting, and digitally, being able to record your voice or your your image, and sharing it with people. And being able to say like, this is just my, this is my experience. I'm sharing it with you. I don't know what's gonna happen. Like, it's, I'm not a doctor, like lead me out of this. But even that didn't exist 15 years ago, like, seriously, like, people wouldn't have talked like this 1015 years ago, 20 years ago, you wouldn't have told a person on the internet your name, right? Yeah. So things have shifted very quickly. And it's allows for this transfer of information. Anyway, I don't know what the hell we're talking about these. But you sound healthy as hell. Why are you on the road so much?

D.J. 56:50
Well, so I actually live in a town where I don't own a business. And so my, my, the first business that I bought, several years ago, was at the coast in North Carolina, which is three and a half hours from home. And then I bought another business that's halfway home. So about an hour and 30 minutes from home. And so I am usually at the coast, Mondays and Tuesdays and then this other spot on Wednesdays and Thursdays and then back home, on the weekends. And then sometimes we reverse it. And I actually was supposed to have a meeting with my bank this morning. And so I'm actually at home. And my family is all at the coast. And so when we finish, I'm going to drive down there and, and hang out for the weekend at the beach.

Scott Benner 57:45
DJ, you're what's known as a go getter.

D.J. 57:50
I try that's a hustle, man.

Scott Benner 57:51
You're hustling. It's hustle. Yeah, no kidding. Jeez, I either. That's terrific. I mean, just the idea that you saw a business, you're like, This is a good business for me to get involved in. But it's three and a half hours from my home. Like, that doesn't matter. Wow, you wouldn't have done well, not getting your diabetes in order.

D.J. 58:09
That's what I was saying. Yes. I mean, it it had the opportunity to crumble the whole thing. Yeah.

Scott Benner 58:14
Actually, when you said that at first, I thought you meant your health, but you meant you meant life in general my life. Yeah. Yeah, that's, that's, and I think that's happening to people, by the way. It

D.J. 58:26
is I see it online. I you know, and I don't have tons of time, and, you know, but But I, I respond to people in various groups. And, and, and like, you look at, after you sort of clicks for you, you know, like, I'll look at somebody's graph, and they're like, this happened to me for absolutely no reason. And it's like, that's not true. Everything happens for a reason. There's, you know, I mean, I had a situation last night I, I rarely, I rarely am over 130. My average for 90 days, I'm looking at the graph right now, my average for 90 days is 94. So I'm in range. My range is 65 to 125. And I'm in at 97% of the time, Wow, that's great. But, like last night, I totally missed, and I was eating dinner with my daughter. And I looked and I was like, I was already halfway through eating. And I was 64 arrow straight down. And I said can you I said I hate to ask you can you go get me half a glass of regular Coke. And by the time she got back, the numbers shifted again and it was 40 straight down. Wow. And, but I didn't feel it. You know like Normally, like my lips will tingle or something like that. And so, anyways, within 20 minutes, I just mismanaged it. I was 157 arrow up, straight up. And, you know, brought it in for landing, and kind of reflected back on what I had missed, once it finally leveled out. And, you know, I had just mostly what I was eating was protein. I've already told you that. And I just Bolus too soon. When it dropped, then I just my reaction, I didn't know how, you know, I was guessing that there were 60 grams of carbs in that coke. And, and then I just missed it on the way up. Yeah, you just over

Scott Benner 1:00:43
compensated? Yep. It absolutely happens. But like you said, that's a thing, where some people could see that and say, I don't know, it just happened. And you know, in their last I, I've gotten a couple of comments or questions recently from people online. And they are saying the same thing. No matter how far I Pre-Bolus my kid every time I Pre-Bolus them, their blood sugar shoots straight up. And you can tell by the way they're asking the question, they are positive, that giving the kid the insulin is making their blood sugar go up. They don't see the part where the kid might be nervous or anxious, or a bunch of adrenaline comes, or even they get super excited to eat and their blood sugar shooting up now for adrenaline. And I say to them, I think that's what you want to look at first here because giving yourself insulin doesn't make your blood sugar go up. Like that's but that's how they see it. They are sure that the introduction of the insulin is making the blood sugar go up like that is not what's happened. Yeah, that's not what happened. Yeah. And but, but I don't know, there's a lot of different ways to say it. But that's what they see. They can't see the forest for the trees without it right like that. Yeah, yeah, yeah. And so I've learned instead of telling them that because they'll push back, they'll go, no, no, that can't be it. Like, okay, my kids rock solid or something, you'll get something like that. I'm like, no. Okay. I've learned to just say that's not enough information to answer this question, right? Because I need to get them to pick through the information in their own head so they can start checking things off the list. Like, oh, it's not that it's not this, it's not that, then you can kind of like introduce the idea of maybe the kids just, like, doesn't like to get shot us? Yeah, doesn't like to get a shot. Yeah. And then they'll go, maybe that is it. So, you know, and there's an answer to that? And the answer is the answer I gave you through the podcast, which is after time and experience and repetition, that'll get better. It

D.J. 1:02:45
will Yeah, it definitely well, and there's, I think that's the big thing for me is the recognition that there's, there's a there's a hope out there for for it by trial and error. And if you can actually learn from the trial and error. And, you know, I mean, it's just one of those, it just takes time, and it takes time, it really just takes time. It's

Scott Benner 1:03:11
it's a thing you can't give up on right away. It's a thing you have to build on the take a little wind, and you're piled on top of another little win, and you take a minute to celebrate, and then you realize that's not the end and you keep going. It's yeah, it's what's

D.J. 1:03:26
that? What's that saying that like? The thing that people don't see about the overnight success is the 30 years of hard work that went in before it or something like that. I don't know what the exact quote is, I

Scott Benner 1:03:36
know that when I don't know exactly what it is either I got. So I do a really good job, I think give myself credit. And I'm giving myself credit, because you all didn't know me when I was 25 years old. But I didn't. I didn't I had a pretty short fuse. So when the other day someone comes on to the, onto the group. And I put up I forget what it was, I noticed people were asking questions about the eyelet pump. And they were all like, what is this? And I'm like, I just did an exhaustive interview about this like a month and a half ago, and it's irritating that they don't know. So I just put up a nice post. And I'm like, Hey, here's this I hear people talking about, you might have missed this, like all very nice, you know, like, you don't know, I'm irritated. And by the way, I'm not really irritated. It's, you make this thing and you put it out. And if you're not careful, you can get this unreasonable expectation that everybody knows it's there and that they've heard it. And so I just I know that's not true. So I'll put the information back up, hopefully find some people that missed it. In that thread. Some guy comes in and says, you know, some people don't have time to sit through all this, especially with all those ads. And I was like you Mother I am over here, make those ads, pay my bills. Without the ads. You don't get a podcast. And you know, or I charge you for it. And by the way A DJ between your business person between you and me if I charged $9 a month for this podcast, and everybody who listened to it, like paid it, I'd be sitting on a gold chair in a gold room right now. And I don't do that. So, in my mind, I think, just say thank you. Don't come at me go and I don't like it. Meanwhile, I went and looked at it. And I so I anyway, I held myself together. And I explained nicely online. And I said to the guy, I'm like, Look, man, there's about two minutes worth of ads at the beginning of the podcast. There's another ad in the middle. And there's a thank you at the end. That episode is two hours long, it has about seven minutes worth of ads in it. Like, if the ads aren't there, then here's the thing you don't know. It took me days to reach the company, like days to reach them to book that episode. Then once I booked it, they were uncomfortable. They didn't know what they were doing. I had to walk them through it. Then I had to spend an hour on the phone with somebody explaining microphones and getting them to buy a microphone. And then they came on. And I spent two hours recording the show. And by the way, all the questions I asked, there was prep time in there that I can't really quantify. Then the show had to be edited. It took two and a half or three hours to edit it. And then it has to be supported on social media. And then you bobble and I'm like going through it. I'm like, That's the effort that went into that episode.

D.J. 1:06:24
Yeah, that's just one episode out of where you're at. 1000. Yes,

Scott Benner 1:06:29
yes. What I ended up saying at the end, the only place I think I was a little snarky, is I said that. This is the equivalent of me showing up at your job on Pay Day opening the front door and yelling blank doesn't deserve to get paid. I don't like the way you went about it this week. What do you care man? Like, you know what I mean? Like, there's no one else delivering this information to no one. It just it doesn't exist the way I give it out. And it's because it's supported through this thing. How could you possibly not see that? And then I realized none of this matters. He doesn't know. Like you don't even but it got me for a second. I was like, What the hell? Yeah, leave me alone. So anyway,

D.J. 1:07:08
yeah. It's like, hey, you know what? We'll give you free fries with this. And then you're like, I don't really like those kinds of fries. Oh, yeah.

Scott Benner 1:07:17
Could I instead have the hashbrowns?

D.J. 1:07:18
Yeah, can I smash?

Scott Benner 1:07:21
Well, no. Because of 1000 things you don't know or understand that go in free podcasts, shut up and take it. Adult, what do I care? But then that that becomes the problem is that I actually, I do care. Like, I look at that person, I think that person has type one diabetes, I get it. Yeah, they need the info, right. And even if he doesn't know it, I'm doing something good for him. And listen, I'll make this point. And I'm gonna have to let you go. Because I, I actually have, this is the day from hell for me. So this is the first of my three recordings I'm doing today. But I won't give a lot of details. But a different person online, popped into this post and just started, what they call posting. And, you know, was just being difficult for the sake for just to be difficult, and kind of going back and forth with people. And I looked and I thought this person has been in this group for years, they've never been a problem like this is really strange, you know. And so I pulled their comment down. And I sent them a note that said, I really need you to be nicer than this. You know, now, my assumption was something was wrong. Because as a person who runs a big Facebook group DJ, what I can tell you is either somebody's having a bad day, or their blood sugar's high or low, or they're drunk. But that's pretty much what I've learned. And so are they just want to be, you know, for reasons I don't know. But I really, I just gave this person the benefit of doubt. I said, I can't leave your comment there. But like, what's going on? And I got this note back, and privately, and the person said, I'm sorry, I have multiple people in my family having medical issues right now. And one of them's out of state, and I can't be there. And it's an I need to deal with my frustration differently. I apologize. And so in my mind, EJ, everyone's got a story like that. Even though even the person who said to me like all the damn ads, just tell me what I need to know like, well, first of all, I'm not your mom. But secondly, like, you know, like, I even think that person is just having a bad moment. And so I don't want to ever get into a position where they get kicked out of a group because then they're going to come around and still need to know how to Pre-Bolus or something like that. And then I think they could be then on that path that you described that you possibly could have been on, of course, Yeah, everybody's got a backstory. Yeah. So I try really Hard not to have my own feelings that you don't mean like to be my own, like frustration. But they're like I said that one. That's the one time the only time I can really remember this year, I was just like, I am killing myself over here. And that's what you want to say to me. Like, please do not build, please don't say. So anyway, did we cover everything you want to talk about?

D.J. 1:10:22
I think so. Yeah, I think it's been great. I mean, well, I don't know if it's been great. But it's been great. Actually talking to you and, and getting a chance to do this. It's been a lot of fun.

Scott Benner 1:10:30
I appreciate that. It's terrific. It's great information. Like I said earlier, your microphone is so good. This is such a pleasure to record from just an audio standpoint, I really appreciate that. Are you? Do you want to tell people why you have the microphone? Like because i'll leave it in if you want to say, but if you don't, then it's okay with me as well.

D.J. 1:10:50
Yeah, I mean, my my daughter is a pop singer. That's sort of on the on the coming up. And I'm in her studio right now. This is actually her scratch vocal mic that she uses to track some of her scratch vocals. And then she's got a booth on the other side of the room. And she does. I think I said pop music and it's super exciting. Her name is Emerson as Aryan and you should check it out. It's everywhere where you can stream pop music, very

Scott Benner 1:11:25
nice. Excellent. Well, listen, you tell your daughter that if she wants to send me a song, I'll put it at the end of this episode.

D.J. 1:11:32
Oh, that'd be awesome. Yeah, I'll, I'll I'll definitely do that. I'll send you one. With her permission for sure.

Scott Benner 1:11:39
Oh, that's cool. Let me know. Okay. Okay. All right. Thanks, Scott. Of course, hold on one second for me.

Huge thanks to a longtime sponsor touched by type one, please check them out on Facebook, Instagram, and at touched by type one.org. If you're looking to support an organization that supporting people with type one diabetes, check out touched by type one. Today's episode of The Juicebox Podcast is sponsored by the Dexcom g7 Which now integrates with a tandem T slim x two system. Learn more and get started today at dexcom.com/juicebox. A huge thank you to one of today's sponsors, G voc glucagon find out more about Chivo Capo pen at G Vogue glucagon.com forward slash juicebox you spell that G VOKEGLUC AG o n.com forward slash juicebox. Here's a little treat for you for staying till the end. This is DJs daughter Emerson is Aryan and the song is called if it's all right

Unknown Speaker 1:13:07
I'm Bucha lipofilling.

Unknown Speaker 1:13:46
Good seven in the baggage.

Scott Benner 1:14:51
If you're looking for community around type one diabetes, check out the Juicebox Podcast private Facebook group Juicebox Podcast tie type one diabetes, but everybody is welcome type one type two gestational loved ones. It doesn't matter to me. If you're impacted by diabetes and you're looking for support, comfort or community, check out Juicebox Podcast type one diabetes on Facebook. If you're not already subscribed or following in your favorite audio app, please take the time now to do that. It really helps the show and get those automatic downloads set up so you never miss an episode. Thank you so much for listening. I'll be back very soon with another episode of The Juicebox Podcast. The episode you just heard was professionally edited by wrong way recording. Wrong way recording.com